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flamming_python
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    Decline of the western society #3

    kvs
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    Post  kvs Fri May 03, 2024 6:20 pm

    The settlement of the New World was by facilitated by the "quiet" genocide of over 90% of the indigenous population by more virulent diseases brought over by the
    first explorers and missionaries. For example the Amazon basin had millions of aboriginal people living in large cities (for the historical context). These
    settlements were observed by the first wave of conquistadors. But the next wave decades later found nobody there and concluded that the original
    accounts were exaggerated.

    Anyone who doubts that European diseases were more virulent is an idiot. Europeans lived in much more filthy conditions. The New World had similar species
    of viruses and bacteria but they were not as nasty. For example, the New World syphilis was very mild compared to the European strain. U-ropeans, being
    virulent racists, claimed that they got syphilis from the New World which is a total lie. There is obvious evidence of syphilis in bones found in Europe dating
    back to the Greek era over 2000 years ago.

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    Post  ALAMO Fri May 03, 2024 6:32 pm

    kvs wrote:The settlement of the New World was by facilitated by the "quiet" genocide of over 90% of the indigenous population by more virulent diseases brought over by the
    first explorers and missionaries.   For example the Amazon basin had millions of aboriginal people living in large cities (for the historical context).    These
    settlements were observed by the first wave of conquistadors.   But the next wave decades later found nobody there and concluded that the original
    accounts were exaggerated.  

    Anyone who doubts that European diseases were more virulent is an idiot.   Europeans lived in much more filthy conditions.   The New World had similar species
    of viruses and bacteria but they were not as nasty.   For example, the New World syphilis was very mild compared to the European strain.   U-ropeans, being
    virulent racists, claimed that they got syphilis from the New World which is a total lie.  There is obvious evidence of syphilis in bones found in Europe dating
    back to the Greek era over 2000 years ago.  

    It is quite easy case to fact-check.
    The gut who travelled Amazon as the first European was Francisco Orellana. He followed it's stream all the way from Peru to Atlantic and wrote a journey diary.
    He called multiple metropolises as big as 50k inhabitants - which was the size of London at the time.
    When the Europeans followed the stream years after - they have found nothing like that in real.
    He was called a thug and liar, which cooled a bit the gold heat of the time.
    Only now, when Amazonia is being cut out, it reveals the remains of cities he was describing back then.
    All were abandoned because of a plague.

    And I have even better question to the matter : where are the native Tasmanians? What a Face dunno affraid

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    Post  Hole Fri May 03, 2024 8:40 pm

     where are the native Tasmanians?
    He ate them.
    Decline of the western society #3 - Page 7 Dab98010
    Laughing

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    Post  ALAMO Fri May 03, 2024 9:39 pm

    Laughing
    Good one.
    Laughing
    Not "we" in detail, but yes, our superior morality Anglosaxon friends - indeed Laughing
    Those are those rare moments of my reflection ( Laughing ), when I remember the diaries of some British officers in Bure Wars, reporting how the smell of death and decomposing was feelable "miles" before they even saw the concentration camps.
    With women and kids in there.
    Sir Winston liked the solution, wondered about the effect, and was disgusted by the smell - all himself!

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    Post  higurashihougi Sat May 04, 2024 3:24 am

    Decline of the western society #3 - Page 7 440972068_832980538854217_8151693270978430860_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5f2048&_nc_ohc=HrFwelQT7ZsQ7kNvgEEQfca&_nc_ht=scontent.fsgn5-14

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    Post  GarryB Sat May 04, 2024 8:28 am

    I am a white european new zealander, there have been multiple waves of immigration to this country for over 1,000 years... there were two waves from the pacific islands, the first group we call the Moriori, but they were just Pacific Islanders like the next wave who called themselves Maori when they got here.

    Who is to say who owns the land... a white trick was to say the natives had no concept of personal property or land ownership... people are temporary and the land is forever... or close enough to forever to matter much.

    The white people arriving in Australia loved the idea that the Aborigines didn't understand the concept of land ownership.... you want to talk about racism... in Australia the aboriginies were not counted in the national census until 1967... not 1867... 1967... before that they were counted as Flora and Fauna... plants and animals...

    At least the South Africans admitted the natives were people.

    Of course as populations increase then people are going to spread and any gold rush is going to attract people...

    There were many fake gold rushes of course where people moved to a new country because their friends had already gone there and said it was amazing. They arrive and find out their friends are slave labour to some local criminal that happens to come from the same country they did so as you arrive he takes your passport and puts you to work in buildings with no windows working to pay your air tickets and your rent and your food... in 10 years time you wont have paid half of the bill... slave labour by your own people...

    Of course the locals are not above doing the same too...

    All cultures change... you can't tell me it is the same there where you are now as it was in the 1970s or 1980s... change happens all the time everywhere.

    All this working from home stuff and 3D printing and many other technologies might allow people to move to rural areas and live more comfortably without the congestion, but also without the nightlife of the big city. It all depends on what you want and what options you have... or what options you create for yourself.


    Last edited by GarryB on Sun May 05, 2024 12:51 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : changed walls to windows... makes more sense that way...)

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    Post  ahmedfire Sat May 04, 2024 9:22 am


    Indeed, slightly more - less than 50% of Africans are Christians, and 40+% Muslims.
    Still, it means that out of the most notorious criminal groups, 40+% will be Muslim, even if stated "black".
    We have not soaked into the details, like which countries are the spear of African migration.
    My educated guess would be a visible deviation to the Muslim side. Because those are the less developed and poorer countries in Africa.

    Top six highest population African countries (Egypt is not included ) has around 65% Christians & 30% Muslims .

    If we chooses the countries which have the most of African migration to EU , it would be around 66% Christians & 29% Muslims .

    But how can we know that the same percentage moved to Europe ? any side could be  more than the other one but wait Arabs has little arrest rate and this could answer my question .

    So be aware that the data you tried to use to defend your religion, can do more harm rather than good.

    The data shows exactly my point of blocking the propaganda and i'm not defending my religion , i even don't feel i have to do that .

    Actually i see some Muslims who make demonstrations after burning Quran as stupid because their response is what the little dump who burned the book needs .
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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Sat May 04, 2024 9:31 am

    higurashihougi wrote:
    ArgentinaGuard wrote:It's true, but my ancestors did not come to invade anyone or change customs.

    You may want to ask your ancestors about the massacre of 1000 Natives people and displacement 15000 more during the genocide (1870-1884) in Patagonia.

    That is a myth invented by the progressive left. There was no genocide. Patagonia is like Siberia for the Russians and the Far West for the USA. The country needed territory for its development. If I didn't take it today, it would be in the hands of Chile or England, surely with the complicity of those few indigenous people. You missed the part in which those indigenous populations attacked the country's populations. Also where many other indigenous people suffered attacks and displacement from other indigenous groups such as the Mapuches.

    Currently we have false indigenous people (white people who wear feathers and infiltrators from chile) who talk about genocide and claim national territories. All this with British support

    I thought it was a Russian forum of intelligent people who do not believe in the nonsense that can be heard in the West with wokism
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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Sat May 04, 2024 9:41 am

    kvs wrote:The settlement of the New World was by facilitated by the "quiet" genocide of over 90% of the indigenous population by more virulent diseases brought over by the
    first explorers and missionaries.   For example the Amazon basin had millions of aboriginal people living in large cities (for the historical context).    These
    settlements were observed by the first wave of conquistadors.   But the next wave decades later found nobody there and concluded that the original
    accounts were exaggerated.  

    Anyone who doubts that European diseases were more virulent is an idiot.   Europeans lived in much more filthy conditions.   The New World had similar species
    of viruses and bacteria but they were not as nasty.   For example, the New World syphilis was very mild compared to the European strain.   U-ropeans, being
    virulent racists, claimed that they got syphilis from the New World which is a total lie.  There is obvious evidence of syphilis in bones found in Europe dating
    back to the Greek era over 2000 years ago.  

    We must also mourn the Neanderthal man, annihilated by us Homo Sapiens. Joke.


    Do you seriously think that a few Spaniards could travel and take an American territory only with violence. It is clear that they had the support of many subject populations. The Aztecs were in a process of crisis. The Mayans had already left their great cities. It's not that the Spanish came and destroyed paradise. It's a British black legend (search about that).
    Dude, these people practiced cannibalism and mass human sacrifice. Give me Spanish Christianity and the protection of the king before anything else
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    Post  higurashihougi Sat May 04, 2024 11:24 am

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Patagonia is like Siberia for the Russians and the Far West for the USA. The country needed territory for its development.

    And so you invade the land of others to satisfy your so-called "development" at the expense of other people ?

    Are you seeing that you are extremely selfish who do not care of others ?

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Patagonia is like Siberia for the Russians and the Far West for the USA.

    Yes, and the Tsarist regime and capitalist USA invaded Siberia and invaded Far West. That is a fact.

    Just like our East Asian monarchs also invaded and destroyed many adjacent countries in the pasrt, too. Yes, although we know that the deed has been done and nothing can do about it but at least we acknowledged that was an invasion, we acknowledged that the kingdoms and empires in our past had a lot of bloods in their hand, we do not white-wash it into "civilizing" like you people do.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:If I didn't take it today, it would be in the hands of Chile or England, surely with the complicity of those few indigenous people.

    And so ?

    Is there any difference in such cases ?

    Why do you think that your White Argentine colonialist were any better than the Brits or the Chileans colonists ?

    I see no difference between a Chilean or British bayonet and a White Argentine bayonet.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:You missed the part in which those indigenous populations attacked the country's populations. Also where many other indigenous people suffered attacks and displacement from other indigenous groups such as the Mapuches.

    And does that deny the fact that you invade the Native land and commit massacre and crimes against humanity against the Native people ?

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Currently we have false indigenous people (white people who wear feathers and infiltrators from chile) who talk about genocide and claim national territories. All this with British support

    And does that deny the fact that you invade the Native land and commit massacre and crimes against humanity against the Native people ?

    Stop distract people from your crimes.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Dude, these people practiced cannibalism and mass human sacrifice. Give me Spanish Christianity and the protection of the king before anything else

    And what you did is enslaved them into menial labour in encomienda plantations, which lead to the dealth of millions of Natives and severe hardships of many others.

    Their human sarcrifices was nothing compared to countless numbers of wars, religious wars, and massacre of civillians that you "civillized" people committed.

    Jesus must have been vomiting as he know the henious crimes committed by the ones abusing His name.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:I thought it was a Russian forum of intelligent people who do not believe in the nonsense that can be heard in the West with wokism

    You have been using the very Western arguments that white-washing colonialism and genocide. Yeah right, there is no invasion, no genocide, only kind-heart Spaniards preachers that attempt to "civilizied" the savage "redskins".

    You should be lucky that you are not in Vietnam or other East Asian countries. And it is not a threat.
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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Sat May 04, 2024 12:26 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:
    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Patagonia is like Siberia for the Russians and the Far West for the USA. The country needed territory for its development.

    And so you invade the land of others to satisfy your so-called "development" at the expense of other people ?

    Are you seeing that you are extremely selfish who do not care of others ?

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Patagonia is like Siberia for the Russians and the Far West for the USA.

    Yes, and the Tsarist regime and capitalist USA invaded Siberia and invaded Far West. That is a fact.

    Just like our East Asian monarchs also invaded and destroyed many adjacent countries in the pasrt, too. Yes, although we know that the deed has been done and nothing can do about it but at least we acknowledged that was an invasion, we acknowledged that the kingdoms and empires in our past had a lot of bloods in their hand, we do not white-wash it into "civilizing" like you people do.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:If I didn't take it today, it would be in the hands of Chile or England, surely with the complicity of those few indigenous people.

    And so ?

    Is there any difference in such cases ?

    Why do you think that your White Argentine colonialist were any better than the Brits or the Chileans colonists ?

    I see no difference between a Chilean or British bayonet and a White Argentine bayonet.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:You missed the part in which those indigenous populations attacked the country's populations. Also where many other indigenous people suffered attacks and displacement from other indigenous groups such as the Mapuches.

    And does that deny the fact that you invade the Native land and commit massacre and crimes against humanity against the Native people ?

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Currently we have false indigenous people (white people who wear feathers and infiltrators from chile) who talk about genocide and claim national territories. All this with British support

    And does that deny the fact that you invade the Native land and commit massacre and crimes against humanity against the Native people ?

    Stop distract people from your crimes.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:Dude, these people practiced cannibalism and mass human sacrifice. Give me Spanish Christianity and the protection of the king before anything else

    And what you did is enslaved them into menial labour in encomienda plantations, which lead to the dealth of millions of Natives and severe hardships of many others.

    Their human sarcrifices was nothing compared to countless numbers of wars, religious wars, and massacre of civillians that you "civillized" people committed.

    Jesus must have been vomiting as he know the henious crimes committed by the ones abusing His name.

    ArgentinaGuard wrote:I thought it was a Russian forum of intelligent people who do not believe in the nonsense that can be heard in the West with wokism

    You have been using the very Western arguments that white-washing colonialism and genocide. Yeah right, there is no invasion, no genocide, only kind-heart Spaniards preachers that attempt to "civilizied" the savage "redskins".

    You should be lucky that you are not in Vietnam or other East Asian countries. And it is not a threat.
    You are from Vietnam and I think there are things you don't understand. Still, I have respect for your people who have fought wars and shown courage.
    Argentina is not a colonial country, we do not invade anyone, in any case they have occupied our lands such as the Malvinas Islands.
    We fight for our sovereignty and independence. Those Indians were not exterminated, it is not genocide either, we did not kill millions of people, they had the possibility of joining as citizens.


    Although it is not my case as a white Argentine (I am half Italian and German), why do you think that in so many Spanish American countries there are mixed-race people? They were not as racist and exterminating as the blond Anglo-Saxons who did not touch an Indian woman with a stick.

    The Spanish colonial labor regime was relatively good, there was even legal protection. You are following the British black legend, which portrays the Spanish as murderers when the regime was much more respectful and harmonious than the Anglo-Saxons. It's still an empire, but that's what you want. So the Egyptian, Roman, and Greek empires were all colonial garbage. History is made up of empires. Not everything is bad

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    Post  kvs Sat May 04, 2024 2:27 pm

    There is no symmetry between the Anglo conquest of the new world and Russian "conquest" of Siberia. Nowhere in Russia have the indigenous
    people been herded into reservation ghettos. The concept was "Czar of all the Russias" which includes all the non-Russian ethnic groups.
    Russia was a multi-ethnic society before it became popular in the west. People who try to equate the Nazis and the Soviets are full of shit
    since Russians would not go for any ethnic purity obsession. The western Ukrs are evidence of how corrupting is the influence of the
    west since they have bought into the ethnic purity BS and view other Ukrainians and Russians as untermenschen.

    I distinguish the Spanish-Portuguese conquest from the Anglo conquest because for the most part it was an assimilation process and not
    an ethnic cleansing process (*). Latin America is extensively populated by people of mixed race consisting of aboriginal and European blood.
    Of course, the conquest was not all roses. Brazil had not only black slavery but aboriginal slavery. But unlike the USA, it never developed
    an ideology that required apartheid (which existed in the US until the 1960s) after slavery was abolished. Argentina is an outlier in that
    it behaved more like the Anglo North Americans and organized punitive suppression campaigns against aboriginals.

    The latter is an interesting feature. It's as if there is a different historical evolution based on latitude with Argentina resembling the US and
    Canada in terms of climate and land vegetation. Aboriginals living in the extra-tropics had different cultures than the tropical ones and
    this contributed to their interaction with the white invaders. But obviously the behaviour of the white invaders is the primary driver.

    (*) The French behaviour in the new world was distinct from that of the British. They were more accommodating to the aboriginals. But
    they did not have the drive of the British. So in the late 1700s, after the British took over New France (now Quebec) they decided to trade
    it away for sugar islands in the Caribbean instead of getting it back in a peace deal.

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    Post  The-thing-next-door Sat May 04, 2024 2:33 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:Marxist trite

    What the hell do they teach you in Vietnam? Your country's sovereignty was backed by a nation buit upon the work of Russian imperialists. If you are taught to denounce Russia's conquest of the barbarians in Siberia then perhaps Russia needs to schedule a military operation in Vietnam after more pressing issues are dealt with.

    If what you express is any indication of Vietnamese opinion then perhaps Russia could do with an extra unpopulated island.
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    Post  higurashihougi Sat May 04, 2024 2:59 pm

    The-thing-next-door wrote:What the hell do they teach you in Vietnam?

    They tell me to never ever called the ethnic minorities such as Khmer, Champa, or Highland people, as "barbarian", and we must treat them as equal as the Kinh/Vietnamese.

    So I am extremely shocked when I see you called the ethnic groups in Siberia as "barbarians".

    And by the way who taught you that Siberian native people are "barbarians" ? Or may be it is something that is imported from the West to sabotage Russia from within ? As far as I know Russia at the moment is a civilized country, she respects the self-determination of other people and she does not have the tendency to call others as "barbarians" like the Western countries usually do.

    The-thing-next-door wrote:Your country's sovereignty was backed by a nation buit upon the work of Russian imperialists.

    Using your argument then the republican France are built upon the work of the reactionary French monarchy, the modern China are built upon the work of Imperial autocratic China, etc etc, so people should not criticize monarchy, autocracy, and imperialism ?

    You can see that I am being very specific here. I am saying "Tsarist regime", not Soviet Union, not Russia, not Russian people in general. And I hope you can see the difference as it is very essential.

    The-thing-next-door wrote:If you are taught to denounce Russia's conquest of the barbarians in Siberia

    I am just stating the fact.

    The conquest of Siberia by Tsarist monarchy, the conquest of the Central and Southern territories of Vietnamese monarchy, and many other conquest of historical countries, are in essence war of invasions. The ruling class of our ancestors destroyed the adjacent countries by force and incorporate their land and their people into their dominion.

    Is that really hard to understand that ?

    There are very good and solid reasons that the model of ethnic minorities coexist together under the current Russia state is the most reasonable choice for all of them, and any attempt that separate them from Russia are indeed the Western agenda to destroy the solidarity between ethnic groups in Russia.

    But at least, please be honest with ourselves.

    The-thing-next-door wrote:perhaps Russia needs to schedule a military operation in Vietnam

    In 1946 the French said this, in 1955 the USA said this, in 1979 the China said this.

    We are tired but if you want, we will bring our guns to the frontline.

    Although I suspect that the leadership of Russia do not consider your saying as a serious idea.

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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Sat May 04, 2024 5:26 pm

    kvs wrote:There is no symmetry between the Anglo conquest of the new world and Russian "conquest" of Siberia.   Nowhere in Russia have the indigenous
    people been herded into reservation ghettos.   The concept was "Czar of all the Russias" which includes all the non-Russian ethnic groups.
    Russia was a multi-ethnic society before it became popular in the west.   People who try to equate the Nazis and the Soviets are full of shit
    since Russians would not go for any ethnic purity obsession.    The western Ukrs are evidence of how corrupting is the influence of the
    west since they have bought into the ethnic purity BS and view other Ukrainians and Russians as untermenschen.    

    I distinguish the Spanish-Portuguese conquest from the Anglo conquest because for the most part it was an assimilation process and not
    an ethnic cleansing process (*).   Latin America is extensively populated by people of mixed race consisting of aboriginal and European blood.  
    Of course, the conquest was not all roses.   Brazil had not only black slavery but aboriginal slavery.   But unlike the USA, it never developed
    an ideology that required apartheid (which existed in the US until the 1960s) after slavery was abolished.   Argentina is an outlier in that
    it behaved more like the Anglo North Americans and organized punitive suppression campaigns against aboriginals.  

    The latter is an interesting feature.  It's as if there is a different historical evolution based on latitude with Argentina resembling the US and
    Canada in terms of climate and land vegetation.    Aboriginals living in the extra-tropics had different cultures than the tropical ones and
    this contributed to their interaction with the white invaders.    But obviously the behaviour of the white invaders is the primary driver.

    (*) The French behaviour in the new world was distinct from that of the British.   They were more accommodating to the aboriginals.   But
    they did not have the drive of the British.   So in the late 1700s, after the British took over New France (now Quebec) they decided to trade
    it away for sugar islands in the Caribbean instead of getting it back in a peace deal.  


    Russia carried out a forced process russification of many peoples. Many descendants of Argentine Germans did not come from European Germany but were Volga Germans. My ex-girlfriend's grandparents were from there lol. In many cases they left due to aggressive Russification in the 19th century and later communism in the first half of the 20th century.
    In general, empires are multiethnic. There are no purebred empires. The only ones who introduced that were the Anglo-Saxon racists influenced by social Darwinism. But it was just a utopia because in practice it is impossible to be pure.

    The problem is that here they talk as if all empires were bad. Guys, this is not the Star Wars empire. Empires are important, they can do good things, and that does not mean subjugating or destroying other peoples.


    Last edited by ArgentinaGuard on Sat May 04, 2024 5:29 pm; edited 2 times in total
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    Post  The-thing-next-door Sat May 04, 2024 5:27 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:

    They tell me to never ever called the ethnic minorities such as Khmer, Champa, or Highland people, as "barbarian", and we must treat them as equal as the Kinh/Vietnamese.

    So I am extremely shocked when I see you called the ethnic groups in Siberia as "barbarians".

    There was little, but tribes and warlords before the Russian Empire took over, and most of them were pagans.

    What the hell do they teach you in Russia ? Or may be it is something that is imported from the West to sabotage Russia ? As far as I know Russia at the moment is a civilized country, she respects the self-determination of other people and she does not have the tendency to call others as "barbarians" like the Western countries usually do.

    Those that were too stubborn to embrace the Russian ways are no longer with us, the rest were uplifted.

    Using your argument then the republican France are built upon the work of the reactionary French monarchy, the modern China are built upon the work of Imperial autocratic China, etc etc, so people should not criticize monarchy, autocracy, and imperialism ?

    Do you forget that it is the USSR denounced the Tsarist regime by a revolution ?

    If there were no Russian Empire or Russia never expanded, then the Soviets would have never been relevant, Those fools also squandered the advantages they had and now Russians want to build a new empire, not return to the rule of morons that give away thier land.


    It is the communist Lenin's thesis on the issue of nations and colonialism that elaborate the missions of Russian people to assist the national liberation of enslaved nations in the colonies in a mutual cooperation, win-win relationship. Such a vision will never be understood by the Tsarist regime, and by the ones who arbitarily condemned ethnic minorities as "barbarians".

    Lenin was a western backed traitor who lost Russia, poland and finland to name a few.


    I am just stating the fact.

    The conquest of Siberia by Tsarist monarchy, the conquest of the Central and Southern territories of Vietnamese monarchy, and many other conquest of historical countries, are in essence war of invasions. The ruling class of our ancestors destroyed the adjacents countries by force and incorporate their land and their people into their dominion.

    Is that really hard to understand that ?

    In most of the cases, as the deeds has been done long ago, the best solution is keep the status quo and the debt of the past is repaid by allow all the ethnic groups in the country to enjoy a true democracy based on mutual respect and shared opportunities. It is also meant to have a collective protection for all the ethnic groups in the countries, as staying in a union or united government they can fight against the external threats from Western imperialism that attempts to separated them apart according to the West's distinctive divide and conquer tactics.

    But at least, please be honest with ourselves.

    Well atleast you are not one of those fools who want land returned to its "original owners".

    In 1946 the French said this, in 1955 the USA said this, in 1979 the China said this.

    We are tired but if you want, we will bring our guns to the frontline.

    Although I suspect that the leadership of Russia do not consider your saying as a serious idea.

    Please elaborate as to how your country will defend itself against ICBM attack should the Russians ever deam there to be a need.

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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Sat May 04, 2024 5:56 pm

    Putin has a geopolitical conception that Russia should be an empire and I believe that this empire should exist. It does good for the world.

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    Post  flamming_python Sat May 04, 2024 6:22 pm

    kvs wrote:There is no symmetry between the Anglo conquest of the new world and Russian "conquest" of Siberia.   Nowhere in Russia have the indigenous
    people been herded into reservation ghettos.   The concept was "Czar of all the Russias" which includes all the non-Russian ethnic groups.
    Russia was a multi-ethnic society before it became popular in the west.   People who try to equate the Nazis and the Soviets are full of shit
    since Russians would not go for any ethnic purity obsession.    The western Ukrs are evidence of how corrupting is the influence of the
    west since they have bought into the ethnic purity BS and view other Ukrainians and Russians as untermenschen.

    It tended to depend. Many peoples such as the Kazakhs and some in the Caucasus were increasingly hemmed off from habitation and cultivation of their own land by Cossack colonizers, who would handle affairs not at all unlike the American frontiersmen or armed Israeli settlers of today - that's to say set up armed settlements, take over the land and shoot up anyone who turned up to protest. The Circassians of course were exiled from their land wholesale after losing the Caucasian War against the Kuban Cossacks and Russian army and refusing to recognize the Tsar's sovereignty over them. The Tatars in Kazan, Astrakhan and other places were initially conquered by Ivan the Terrible and underwent harsh religious prosecution and pressures for conversion for 2 centuries before Catherine the Great came to power and introduced much more tolerant policies towards Islam. The Bashkirs initially joined Russia willingly but after the Russian state overstepped its bounds, launched a series of rebellions against Russian rule over the span of a century. The Cossacks who mounted expeditions into Siberia and expanded Russian rule there were every bit as mercantile and ruthless as the American gold prospectors or the Spanish Conquistadors; exacting tribute from subjugated peoples in the form of furs and other goods. This system of Cossack exploitation was phased out with the imposition of more direct Russian rule over these areas, but the front of expansion continued on all the way until the Pacific. There were some very brutal wars against various pagan peoples such as the Chukchi. In Alaska, the Russians were playing divide and rule between the indigenous peoples there. While of course Siberia had seen most of the same diseases that Europe had on account of sharing the same landmass, there was some parallels here to European expansion in North America too as Russian settlers had brought with them smallpox, which impacted isolated populations in Siberia very significantly too. Then there were the policies of Russification enacted on a bunch of territories where Russia held suzerainty (but not uniformly). And I will not delve into here the Russian role in putting down the Boxer rebellion in China along with the other European powers, or the humiliation of Iran, partitions of Poland or many other episodes.

    Russia was a multi-ethnic society but even here you were required to be Russian Orthodox and speak Russian at a high level. If you were Muslim or Buddhist then you were well-tolerated, but you weren't a citizen. If you were a Jew you were tolerated less and less as the 19th century went on as the Tsars became more interested in scapegoating you for the cause of promoting Slavic unity. If you were Russian Orthodox and Russian then in all likelihood you were still probably just a serf, rather than a member of the gentry or high society or any sort of educated city-dweller; thus in practical terms your freedom was very limited, even after the serfs were emancipated in the 1860s.

    I distinguish the Spanish-Portuguese conquest from the Anglo conquest because for the most part it was an assimilation process and not
    an ethnic cleansing process (*).   Latin America is extensively populated by people of mixed race consisting of aboriginal and European blood.  
    Of course, the conquest was not all roses.   Brazil had not only black slavery but aboriginal slavery.   But unlike the USA, it never developed
    an ideology that required apartheid (which existed in the US until the 1960s) after slavery was abolished.   Argentina is an outlier in that
    it behaved more like the Anglo North Americans and organized punitive suppression campaigns against aboriginals.

    Indeed the Conquistadors were more interested in f*****g the natives rather than killing them and would move to integrate and assimilate various native peoples into their colonies and colonial administration structures, rather than segregate and drive them out from their own lands to make way for European settlements as what was going on in North America.

    Although to say that the Spanish and Portuguese were interested in slavery is to say nothing, as they had an immense hunger for gold, silver and anything grown on a plantation and would curtail their forced labour of indigenous peoples only when they had procured a sufficient quality of African slaves to substitute. The Spanish/Portuguese purges against indigenous cultures and religious rites were of course ruthless, although given the facts of Aztec human sacrifice one might counter that there was little worth preserving at least in Mexico's case. Then there were all sorts of massacres, ill-treatment, European diseases spreading and the standard colonial stuff essentially.


    Last edited by flamming_python on Sat May 04, 2024 6:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  flamming_python Sat May 04, 2024 6:43 pm


    What the hell do they teach you in Vietnam? Your country's sovereignty was backed by a nation buit upon the work of Russian imperialists. If you are taught to denounce Russia's conquest of the barbarians in Siberia then perhaps Russia needs to schedule a military operation in Vietnam after more pressing issues are dealt with.

    If what you express is any indication of Vietnamese opinion then perhaps Russia could do with an extra unpopulated island.

    What does Soviet assistance to the NVA have to do with Russia's conquest of Siberia?
    Military operation in Vietnam? You first.

    The-thing-next-door wrote:Please elaborate as to how your country will defend itself against ICBM attack should the Russians ever deam there to be a need.

    You seriously threatening a Russian ICBM attack on another country just because you got into an internet argument?

    You should take a nicotine patch or something, people in Russia don't need your defense of their honor online nor especially the alienation of others that you are provoking on Russia's behalf

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    Post  GarryB Sun May 05, 2024 12:57 pm


    Please elaborate as to how your country will defend itself against ICBM attack should the Russians ever deam there to be a need.

    I think you are confusing Russia with petty and childish and immature western countries.
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    Post  AlfaT8 Mon May 06, 2024 12:06 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Yea, the women taking the men's places in college are also wondering about that..

    You still have not answered the question why the west needs more children.

    With better healthcare and more automation, families don't really need the costs involved in having lots of children.

    Children are a burden and get in the way of enjoying all that life offers.

    Is there or is there not a fertility crisis going on Garry??....

    So you solution is more sovialism, also automation talk is about countries GDP and such, stabilizing you population so you don't need to mass import is another matter, which automation cannot solve.

    Is this what Nietzsche called the Last Man position?

    A yes the single mother pandemic , causing the crime wave pandemic, the problem is welfare again, without it they would think twice about divorce.

    Most divorces are for good reason and prevent murders.

    Many murders should be divorces buy clingy people can't see that as a better option, or understand they are the toxic one in the relationship.

    Oh come the hell on Garry, you and i both know that's nonsense, with all the cash and prizes easily available to the women after the divorce, and if there's a child involved, the man will legally become her slave for 18yr at least, among other things.
    The women benefits far too much in any divorce.

    This red herring you came up with is nonsensical.

    The West had this system for a while now Garry, where yo babies at, oh wright, they don't exists or got aborted, i wonder if these women full of "rights" have anything to do with it.

    You seem to think abortions are rampant and happen only because women got the vote.

    Honestly I would say before women were socially accepted as not being allowed into the work force and were economically dependent on men and with less education and less access to contraception it would be the men pushing for the inconvenient baby to be aborted rather than the mother wanting that.

    Yes, it's current rampancy is indeed thanks to women voting.

    To the same degree as today, not remotely likely.

    They "struggle to find someone" because they keep searching for Christian Grey, and that guy is nowhere near their zip code.

    Probably rather true, many women believe they deserve a 9 or a 10 with a huge salary and are prepared to give up their lives and devote all their waking hours to their devotion to their new love... the woman in question. One wonders how such a man could maintain such a salary and also commit the time needed to satisfy... but that is the advantage of fictional characters.

    Well Jeff Bezos's divorce was interesting too.

    You need to MAKE them settle down Garry, and the only way to do that is to eliminate their options and take their rights away.

    Of course... you are the man and what you say goes... soon followed by the comment that they are an independent woman... and they go.

    If you want to use force traditionally they let you because they are so in love... or they poison you and inherit all your stuff.

    Ok, then keep your status quo, circumstances or someone else will "MAKE" them settle regardless, you know, after everything comes crashing down.

    And i am telling you that world is soon coming to an end..... fall of empires bring great change.

    The world will only end once. This are going to change, the west is going to lose a lot of the influence it has enjoyed over the last few centuries, but it wont disappear.

    Its propaganda machine will keep pumping out shit for decades to come and it will trick any country it can, but countries are seeing through the shit and only the corrupt are drawn to that sort of BS in the hopes of swindling the old hustler, but that is easier said than done.

    Russia and China have played well and in the end it is the west pushing itself away from them which makes things so much easier.

    No, but it's power will, what??... did you actually believe countries giving women rights were independent decisions, think again.

    So to you, after the fall, the West's propaganda and NGO arms will still be active???.... how??.... with what money??
    They would be too busy sorting their own house (if they still have a house), to continue to project their influence globally would not be possible.

    True.

    The "birds and the bee's" Garry, you can't change that, so hard decisions are going to have to be made.

    You have been able to become a dad without ever seeing the mother for a very long time now, and mothers can be mothers without men too.

    There is no question raising a child is a two person job, but whether one is a man and one is a woman or both are men or both are women is not documented fact just yet.

    Used to be it took a whole village to raise children with women in the group working together to raise the children and men of the group working to improve things for everyone.

    But US consumerism and the me me me society means it is all about me and what I want, but of course they don't want to work and want things handed to them like people on the TV seem to have.

    Not without the man's money apparently.

    Actually single father households do just as well as 2 parent households, the Right in the West have been playing this "single parent household" game for a long time, because single mothers greatly outnumber single father household it completely skews the statistics in the Right's favor, but when you actually look into it, it tell another story.

    And why did the women stay in the village, because the men made them, they were dependent on the men, they wanted the men to be "responsible" for them, ergo the men wielded "authority" over them, but now all women need is the State.
    And once the State becomes powerful enough, it will also wield "absolute authority" over these women, there's always a price to pay.

    I remember Christchurch and your pathetic Prime minister in her Hijab, on her knees begging the Muslims not to burn it all down, what a joke.

    No, I am sure you would be celebrating the murder of non white non christians because it makes the population more pure... because abortion is murder but shooting someone is natural selection?

    Or is abortion OK if certain ethnic groups can have it?

    Its all natural selection, as in you are selecting yourself to either be replaced or purged, that's what you're voting for, well your women are anyway.

    My bet would be on the socialist take over of New Zealand, but the jury is still out, we gonna have to wait and see how you fall.

    Your bets mean nothing at all, if you think a government has no responsibility to protect and look after the people then you probably agree with Hitler... kill the retards and the cripples and the not quite white enough people and of course anyone who mentions communism... etc etc etc.

    The government is just a mafia with a fancy name, once they accrue enough power, they will send many to meet the wall, Australia already have their camps ready, and all i hear from the people their is that they are not getting killed, YET.
    I wouldn't hold out much hopes for NZ.

    Hahaha.... those stupid communist countries, both those countries were taken over by communists during their time of upheavals.

    The fact is that communism was an improvement for both countries except the implementation of communism was about as broken as the current implementation of democracy in the west currently is.

    Purges, Famines, mass destruction and deaths, sure, after all the killing, "The Party" would eventually have to accept that their ideological delusions would not work in reality and adjust to some extent.

    Well democracy was always meant to fail, that's why the founding fathers built a republic not a democracy, and also why the West kept promoting democracy, it was to keep everyone down so they could rule.

    What is happening today is people slowly voting themselves into communism thanks to the bribe of ever expanding welfare, ala Social Democracy.

    Every man for themselves consumerism and money worship over people and over values is the real problem with the west but you are blaming the fact that they are becoming communist.

    There is an african proverb, if you want go fast go by yourself, if you want to go far go with a group.

    The west is going fast but is not going very far.

    Cooperation and working together is the solution... BRICS is the solution.

    Ah yes, the man needs to do something for nothing and serve the State or the women, this rightwing meme again.
    Face it, no money, no service, its as simple as that.

    Not if that group is unwittingly marching into the Gulags, or as the redpill guys would say, bluepilled sheep proudly marching into the slaughter.

    So long the West loses its global influence, it will take feminism, progressivism and egalitarianism with it, it's all just western money and NGOs, its all astroturf, its all just the West shaping things into their own image.

    Yes, but BRICS is not about shaping the world into your image, quite the opposite.

    The Right usually say that "you can vote yourself into communism, but you are going to have to shoot your way out of it",

    Who the **** would listen to the right... those cunts think adolph had the right idea but didn't follow through properly...

    Not talking about the adolf right, but the tradcon cuckservative right.

    Like i said Garry, this b^tch is gonna crash and crash hard.

    There are likely plenty of women who have daddy issues who would love to take you home to meet daddy, western selfishness and propaganda is at the core of why they need to go, but the idea that a woman is an appendage for a man and has no more right to vote than a mans left foot is simply nonsense... under communism in the east and the west women get the vote and that is not going to change any time soon.

    Any political party you might want to start that says women wont get the vote will get no votes.

    Nonsense only to you i am afraid, in the past it was the norm.
    I already posted the Xi article and all other "votes" are pretty much show votes.
    Like i said, its going to be long and painful wait, because of how sacred this cow is to you and others like you, so "change" is going to happen the hard way.

    Then that political system is not fit for purpose and will also fall, than again you are just assuming they would get no votes, in S.Korea the anti-feminist candidate got a lot of votes and won, sadly like Trump, the rest of the political system crashed any hopes of getting anything done, so goodbye S.Korea, enjoy the decline.

    Aah yes, the "1%" shtick, when are socialists gonna get over that sh^t.

    Yes, you are being a good sheep... rich people don't exist in the west, they only exist in Russia because the word for them is oligarch. Rich people do not manipulate politicians by funding their campaigns to then use that leverage to then earn even more money or eliminate competition... because that would be undemocratic and in the US and the west it is your vote that matters... HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

    Have you ever thought that they have to pay-off the politicians, because if they don't they would have a litany of 3-letter agencies up their a$$.
    Yes, they also exchange favors too, but at the end of the day, they are simply paying off the Mafia, and the Mafia is the one that wields the real power.
    What is the Final Arbiter Garry, it is force, it is violence.
    Who has all the guns Garry, who has the military Garry, who has numerous agencies ready to breakdown your door and shoot you in the face Garry.

    I am tired of this socialist fearmongering of "the 1%".

    Well these are the last days of the empire, so they're just milking it for all its worth before they make a run it.

    They are not going to disappear, they will pick up and move or build big fences around their properties... sounds like the Rock and Oprah are already doing that in Hawaii...

    They certainly wont spend money helping the poor or the masses unless they get a bit of publicity doing that in the hopes of making even more money.

    Those 2 are gonna need to move way further than Hawaii

    Nah. nah, nah, they are just pillaging the treasury, before it all come crashing down.

    "The poor" need to get their sh^t together, not rely on government welfare and then voting for more.

    The poor often work three or four different jobs to pay the bills which just keep coming.

    You can't save them all Garry, especially if they don't wanna save themselves, just vote for more free gibs and rely on that, right?

    Aren't their more Chinese billionaires than Western ones these days??

    China has more of everything... except black people in jail...

    aren't their plenty of muslims in jail, can't remember what they're called there.

    Yes, that is their grand plan, but in Afghanistan's case, even if they wanted to salvage it, they simply didn't have the means to do so.
    It was a lost cause.

    Are you trying to say they wanted to help Afghanistan?

    The cause was to extract mineral wealth out of the country... as far as they are concerned they couldn't give a shit if the whole country collapsed on itself and everyone suffered horrible deaths.

    Help??... no, not have their illusion of empire be stripped by an embarrassing defeat.

    they simply didn't have the means anymore to prevent that, Iraq will be a similar story.

    The last dying gasp of an empire are somewhat dangerous, choosing instead to nuke it all instead of accepting the empire's end.

    The 1% are mobile and can move if they need to. Actually that would be funny if the US decided to have a tax on exporting money... quite a few American billionaires decided a while back to move to nice safe New Zealand... up Central Otago... I am sure the American government will be looking for ways to stop that or at least to make sure a lot of their money stays in the US.

    Yes the 1% again can move, but the Elites are a different story, although many are also planning to leave, there are a bunch of dementia ridden sore losers who would sooner burn it all than let it fall.

    Yes many did chose NZ as their escape plan, but they forgot to take into account of NZ turning into an authoritarian sideshow.

    They are already doing that, if you try to get rid of your citizenship and move to a more money friendly country, they take a massive amount of your money, sorta like divorce, as in a divorce from the U.S government.

    They're either going to get purged by the communists or die in the wars, they're soft, what do you expect was going to happen to them?

    It is the tough manly men that go to wars... and where are all these communists coming from?

    Colleges mostly.
    After all the fools are dead, The Party will focus on "stability", what do you think the party will do with collapsing birth rates, they are going to deal with the women problem and "solve" it.

    It was not the 1% that started this woke nonsense, it was the Obama administration, the progressive nonsense worked great to keep the right in check, so they liked using it, now it snowballed into our current situation.

    The 1% approve of anything that distracts others from the fact that they don't actually have a democracy when money can decide who gets elected it is not democracy.

    No, it was Obama, it happened around the same time he came to office and we know damn well who gives the media orders, remember Russiagate, all that nonsense, it was the Dems.
    Did money win Trump the Election, no it did not, but it does help.

    After all, the media only follows the Dems orders, not so much the 1%.

    Who do you think the 1% are? Most are likely dems, but of course some will be republicans, the point is that the media moguls are part of the 1% and it is not in their interests to bet on one side or the other... to ensure they get their way and remain untouched they need to bribe both sides which is what they do.

    Easy enough when there are only two options for America to choose each time.

    So the 1% need to bribe the 1%, what??
    They need to bribe, because that's the only way they remain untouched.

    Either women lose the vote or embrace something other than democracy, you can either have democracy without universal suffrage or universal suffrage without democracy.

    The only country that seems to have real democracy is Russia right now, all the senate and congress and the two party system in the US means they don't have democracy and never did.

    According to western values the west should be right behind BRICS and in face BRICS should not have been necessary because the west would not have been ripping off the rest of the world, it would have been cooperation and growth and development and lending a helping hand to other countries to help them develop and grow and in return they would help you grow and develop too, when it actual fact as we see with Russia and China and Iran and Cuba and North Korea and so many other countries any time they showed independence or growth the west has tried to cripple them and destroy their economies and damage them militarily.

    The west cannot be trusted... they will have your children digging in the dirt 16 hours a day finding gold and diamonds for which they will pay you a dollar a week and earn millions from what your children dig up.

    They are scum.

    Russia is in the early stages, sorta like a honeymoon period, mostly thanks to Putin holding the reins.
    Once we enter the post-Putin era, you will see women voting for stupid nonsense and politician expanding the welfare state to keep winning votes.
    Russia will suffer the same disease as the West.

    Values are whatever the hell serves their self-interest needs it to be.
    Such are empires, always paranoid and desperate to stop any rising competitor.

    True...., that's mostly Africa's fault.
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    Post  kvs Mon May 06, 2024 12:28 am

    A TFR of 1.x is terminal. It is not convergence to equilibrium, it is attenuation to nothing. Equilibrium requires a TFR of 2.1.

    The populations of the USA and EU are being propped up with migration.

    There is no question that the legal system in the USA, Canada, UK and the EU is deliberately configured against the family and males. There is no
    random process involved. Every freaking revision over the last 100 years is a one way street. This demonstrates that western democracy is a
    sham. Women voters have not driven the decisions of the courts which have systematically pushed absurdity. For example common law marriage
    went from 10 years of cohabitation to 6 months of simple association. No freaking female electorate can explain this.

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    Post  AlfaT8 Mon May 06, 2024 2:17 am

    kvs wrote:A TFR of 1.x is terminal.   It is not convergence to equilibrium, it is attenuation to nothing.    Equilibrium requires a TFR of 2.1.    

    The populations of the USA and EU are being propped up with migration.  

    There is no question that the legal system in the USA, Canada, UK and the EU is deliberately configured against the family and males.   There is no
    random process involved.   Every freaking revision over the last 100 years is a one way street.    This demonstrates that western democracy is a
    sham.   Women voters have not driven the decisions of the courts which have systematically pushed absurdity.   For example common law marriage
    went from 10 years of cohabitation to 6 months of simple association.   No freaking female electorate can explain this.  


    Yet all attempts to correct this are wholly blocked by said female electorate.
    The Cosby case in particular, highlighted the absolute obsession of re-election driving court decisions.
    No doubt politicians even more so, and this is to say nothing of the MeToo storm that redpilled so many.
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    Post  GarryB Mon May 06, 2024 7:39 am

    Is there or is there not a fertility crisis going on Garry??....

    No there is not.


    So you solution is more sovialism, also automation talk is about countries GDP and such, stabilizing you population so you don't need to mass import is another matter, which automation cannot solve.

    My solution does not seem relevant, the solution Russia seems to be going with is to create a family oriented society where having children and doing a good job at parenting is respected rather than just expected.

    Oh come the hell on Garry, you and i both know that's nonsense, with all the cash and prizes easily available to the women after the divorce, and if there's a child involved, the man will legally become her slave for 18yr at least, among other things.
    The women benefits far too much in any divorce.

    Because of laws made up by men who felt they needed to protect women because women are weak and need men to protect them.

    We need for women to have more power to say that these current laws as they are written are not fair and certainly the equality that women have struggled to achieve for themselves and a more equal arrangement needs to be created.


    Yes, it's current rampancy is indeed thanks to women voting.

    To the same degree as today, not remotely likely.

    So you say.


    Ok, then keep your status quo, circumstances or someone else will "MAKE" them settle regardless, you know, after everything comes crashing down.

    By then too late.

    No, but it's power will, what??... did you actually believe countries giving women rights were independent decisions, think again.

    Like all laws in the west a small interest group who don't give a **** about anyone else expended time and money and effort to piss off the people who make the decisions and eventually those people made the decision. Whether it is women voting or rights for sexual deviants to demand pronouns.


    So to you, after the fall, the West's propaganda and NGO arms will still be active???.... how??.... with what money??

    Even if their money becomes a fiat currency they still have enormous military resources and can get their way with violence...

    The west could turn off GPS and demand users all pay a monthly fee of $100 to use it... same with communications satellites etc etc.

    You think the Somali pirates were a problem... the US navy and Royal navy and French navy will become a problem for most countries.

    They would be too busy sorting their own house (if they still have a house), to continue to project their influence globally would not be possible.

    Their house has always relied on controlling other houses... that wont change.


    Not without the man's money apparently.

    The day an age of the man being the sole bread winner are over... these days often women earn more than men.

    Actually single father households do just as well as 2 parent households,

    You have been complaining that women get all the government support and public sympathy but now you say the father can do it easy on his own as well as a two parent house hold can?

    Really?

    He must have an amazing boss who will let him stay home from work if his kid gets sick and releases him to collect the kid from school at 3 o'clock etc etc... not to mention after school activities and sports practises and the weekend is the games themselves...

    over them, but now all women need is the State.

    Till they decide that they want a kid...

    And once the State becomes powerful enough, it will also wield "absolute authority" over these women, there's always a price to pay.

    When did the state not wield power over everyone... except of course criminals who ignore their rules and laws.

    Its all natural selection, as in you are selecting yourself to either be replaced or purged, that's what you're voting for, well your women are anyway.

    Don't confuse natural selection with intelligence... sometimes it is the strongest that lose... there is no way the tiny mammal that became human beings would have a chance against even quite small dinosaurs, but fortunately for us something happened and the earth cooled down and the dinosaurs mostly died out.

    We have been dominant for a few hundred thousand years while dinosaurs were roaming the place for a hundred million years... (about 225million years ago to about 65 million years ago....)


    The government is just a mafia with a fancy name, once they accrue enough power, they will send many to meet the wall, Australia already have their camps ready, and all i hear from the people their is that they are not getting killed, YET.

    The government changes every 5 years or so... that is the only thing in the west that stops hitlers... they don't get long enough to do any real damage or make any real changes... which is why the US is so screwed, they don't even have a democracy... there are only two parties that have any chance of getting into any real power and they hate each other so much they would rather Americans die than to vote for something seen as the opposition parties policy. They will only get change with a civil war... so Biden stealing the election again and a ban on gun sales would probably do it...

    I wouldn't hold out much hopes for NZ.

    We will keep following the US and UK till they break and then we will likely find a bit of real independence we pretend we have now.

    Or not.

    Purges, Famines, mass destruction and deaths, sure, after all the killing, "The Party" would eventually have to accept that their ideological delusions would not work in reality and adjust to some extent.

    That sort of cultural upheaval will always cause problems... in Zimbabwe there was a dramatic change in food production when massive white owned farms producing food to feed the country and to export to other countries were broken up and given to black people who were interested in feeding themselves and making a little money selling food at the local market and no capacity to feed a country. Purges are always exaggerated by ideological enemies and the mass destruction was nothing like the wars the west have started over the last few centuries.

    And they are not learning the lesson... WWII happened because the west punished Germany for WWI when they were as much to blame for that war as Germany was, but they used the opportunity to crush a rival colonial power.

    This led directly to WWII which they hoped could be directed to destroy Russia, but that failed too.

    Now they are essentially blaming Russia for the Cold War and trying to crush them again...

    Play stupid games and win stupid prizes.

    They are destroying their own power over the worlds economy and political structures.

    I say let it burn.

    Well democracy was always meant to fail, that's why the founding fathers built a republic not a democracy, and also why the West kept promoting democracy, it was to keep everyone down so they could rule.

    Democracy in Russia seems to be working just fine... I suspect the real secret is getting people into power who can't be bought and care about their own country more than gold.


    Ah yes, the man needs to do something for nothing and serve the State or the women, this rightwing meme again.

    I must be special... one person calls me right wing and another calls me a liberal... those words are meaningless... the real world is more complicated than that.

    I support the death penalty and think women should have the right to choose regarding abortions. I don't care if the death penalty does not stop crimes of passion committed in the heat of the moment... it might not deter people who don't expect to get caught but it sure stops reoffending rates.

    I am pro gun and pro womens rights in the sense that they should have the same rights everyone else has... ie equal rights for everyone.

    Gun control is about hitting your target with the first shot that gives you a clean kill with no suffering.

    Yes, but BRICS is not about shaping the world into your image, quite the opposite.

    BRICS is about everybody cooperating and trading and not telling each other what religion or culture they should practise or what language they should speak... no sanctions... no bullying.

    An anti west collective because the west are colonial bullies.

    I am tired of this socialist fearmongering of "the 1%".

    Nothing to do with socialism... most westerners don't even understand what socialism even is.

    Good sheep... deny deny deny.


    Those 2 are gonna need to move way further than Hawaii

    Nah. nah, nah, they are just pillaging the treasury, before it all come crashing down.

    They have money... what they want is land because when the US dollar goes tits up it will be worthless... it will all be about things of value like metals and land and resources...

    You can't save them all Garry, especially if they don't wanna save themselves, just vote for more free gibs and rely on that, right?

    We are all stuck in the same trap... of course they want a way out but there is no way out for them... except a lotto ticket which drains their pockets even faster... and then some rich censored wins it... Lotto is a random redistribution of wealth to give hope to the hopeless.


    aren't their plenty of muslims in jail, can't remember what they're called there.

    CNN will tell you they are all in jail because China is communist.

    Help??... no, not have their illusion of empire be stripped by an embarrassing defeat.

    they simply didn't have the means anymore to prevent that, Iraq will be a similar story.

    All they had to do was declare victory when they murdered OBL and leave... but the US never leaves... it is still in Germany for fucks sake.

    Yes many did chose NZ as their escape plan, but they forgot to take into account of NZ turning into an authoritarian sideshow.

    They would love that. Flashing a few billion in little NZ would be like having a few trillion in the bank and wanting to live in London... free pass buddy.

    They are already doing that, if you try to get rid of your citizenship and move to a more money friendly country, they take a massive amount of your money, sorta like divorce, as in a divorce from the U.S government.

    That is what accountants are for... they aren't moving money, they are investing in American companies in NZ.

    Kiko
    Kiko


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    Decline of the western society #3 - Page 7 Empty Re: Decline of the western society #3

    Post  Kiko Tue May 07, 2024 4:59 pm

    Russian philosopher explained to Tucker Carlson the self-destruction of the West, by Vladimir Mozhegov for VZGLYAD. 05.07.2024.

    Tucker Carlson's main question to Alexander Dugin was formulated very clearly: why did Western civilization suddenly turn against itself and engage in self-destruction? Dugin's answer was equally clear.

    The interview of the philosopher Alexander Dugin with Tucker Carlson was watched by 5.5 million people in the first 24 hours, and thousands of comments under it testify to the keen interest of Americans in the real background of the Ukrainian events, today's Russia as a “stronghold of traditionalism” (this was the pathos of this interview) and, of course, to what is happening today directly in America itself and what millions of ordinary Americans are sincerely outraged and truly frightened. Tucker Carlson turned to Dugin as an ultra-conservative Russian philosopher, breaking out of the liberal agenda as much as possible.

    What we see is, although rather concise, a vivid manifesto of the new Russian traditionalism. Moreover, the very form of the manifesto cannot but arouse keen interest among Western audiences.

    Carlson portrayed Dugin as an academic philosopher with "very offensive ideas" to "a number of people." Moreover, Dugin himself, Carlson emphasizes, is not a political figure, he is “just a writer who writes about global ideas.” But it was precisely these ideas that turned out to be so dangerous that his books were banned in the United States, and in August 2022, an attempt was made on his life and his daughter Daria Dugina was killed.

    Of course, such an introduction could not fail to attract attention. Moreover, Dugin personally polemicized with such pillars of the modern liberal agenda as the same Fukuyama. That is, for Western audiences, Dugin is not just a prohibited person, but also a very high-status person.

    But the main thing, of course, is not this (Tucker Carlson knows his job, knows how to effectively present his counterpart), the main thing is what did Dugin say? And the main question was formulated very clearly: why did Western civilization (mainly English-speaking) suddenly turn against itself and engage in self-destruction? (By the latter, Carlson means the anarchy that has reigned today in the place of traditional Western values ​​- Christianity, family, white tradition and culture - and, moreover, is supported in every possible way by the authorities.)

    Dugin's answer was equally crystal clear: the culprit is the ideology of individualism that has captured the West since the Reformation. With this – and, above all, the victory of the philosophy of “nominalism” (which denies the existence of everything that exceeds the individual) – the West’s rejection of any collective identity began. First it was a rejection of the Catholic Church and the Western empire, then a rebellion against nation states in favor of a purely civil society... When, after the great battle of three modernist ideologies: communism, fascism and liberalism, the latter triumphed as the only permitted ideology, he naturally went the path of totalitarianism to its logical conclusion: the rejection of the last remaining identities: gender and human. (For the logical end of liberalism is the disintegration of all connections to the state of elementary particles).

    Liberation from gender identity (gender became optional) led to today's cult of LGBT (the LGBT movement is considered extremist and banned in Russia), transgender people, and other forms of sexual individualism. The last step should be liberation from human identity, which is what transhumanism, posthumanism, singularity, and artificial intelligence lead to. This is the “inevitable future of humanity” that Klaus Schwab, Kurzweil and Harari declare – not necessarily being human.

    Thus, the train on which we boarded five centuries ago is approaching the historical final station, where man as such must disappear.

    What will happen when the individual no longer has anything to free himself from, and he ceases to be a person? All this is shown in American films. There is nothing more realistic than science fiction: “The Matrix”, “Terminator” or AI are more or less realistic versions of the future post-humanity. Moreover, films that would describe the traditional future with the prosperity of families with many children are fundamentally absent, says Dugin. But if you always paint the future exclusively as black, then it will inevitably come one day; you simply have no other options. Thus, the creators of the new reality leave us a choice only beyond the human. And this is not just a fantasy, this is a political project.

    This is the main thing that Dugin said in twenty minutes.

    So, let's summarize. The modern post-West, actively destroying not only itself, but also everything that surrounds it, is leading the world into a post-humanistic hell. The only alternative to this is today’s Russia, which is actually the only one standing up for the defense of not just “traditional values,” but, above all, the traditional understanding of man. Not that atomized, and therefore doomed to decay, person whom neoliberalism protects, but a person who has not lost his highest identities. A person turned to someone else: another person, God, the cosmos as his home, as his habitat. Or, more precisely, as his native and beloved land, for which he is responsible. This is the biblical command to cultivate paradise, to “be fruitful and multiply,” or as the wisdom of all traditional peoples says: build a house, raise a son, plant a tree. That is, something without which a person truly ceases to be a person. And that is what its “collective identity” lies in the first place.

    However, today’s post-West has its own perverted forms of “collective identity” - a kind of anti-family or pseudo-collectives, like a gang or mafia, whose goal is to undermine tradition and any traditional forms of being. In English there are words for this phenomenon - wokeism, canceling, progressivism. Conservatives even coined a word to emphasize the kinship of this reality with the old Bolshevism: Bolshevouk (that is, Bolshevik + Wouk).

    These phenomena were mentioned in the interview very briefly, since Westerners know what they are talking about, and it would take a long time for us to explain. But in his Telegram channel, Dugin explains in more detail: woke is an “awakened left-liberal”, a left-liberal fanatic, wokeism is a requirement for these new religious fanatics to write denunciations against everyone who is against the LGBT agenda (the LGBT movement is recognized as extremist and is banned in Russia ), anti-white racism, globalism and migration, as well as the vicious defamation of all patriots and conservatives and accusations of “fascism”.

    Then “canceling” comes into play - checks of all unreliable people who received denunciations at their place of work, followed by measures: dismissal, ostracism, financial checks, a ban on loans, shutdown of accounts on social networks, up to the final “cancellation” - prison or murder of the person involved or his relative.

    In essence, this is the reality of Jacobin (or, as we would be more accustomed to say, Trotskyist) terror in which the modern United States finds itself. The term “progressive” or “progressist” refers to those “commissars” and “revolutionary sailors” - “Bolshevouks” and their ideology who are waging a mortal war with traditionalists and conservatives.

    Judging by the reaction of the Americans, Dugin’s interview really turned out to be a powerful projectile, punching a hole in the ideology of these neo-Bolsheviks. This is also evidenced by the comments of ordinary Americans: “This interview is another nail in the coffin of Western media propaganda. They turned into the old Soviet Pravda; “Why are Dugin’s books banned in the USA, but not gay porn in children’s libraries?”; “Now it’s clear why conservatives are hated so much. We stand in their way!” etc.

    Indeed, millions of ordinary Americans (and Europeans) still stand in the way of this new terrible totalitarianism, which in its cruelty promises to surpass all the horrors of Bolshevism as we know it.

    https://vz.ru/opinions/2024/5/7/1266227.html

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