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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

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    Arrow


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    Post  Arrow Tue May 23, 2023 11:50 pm



    Prigozhin overestimates the army of Ukraine but makes a good publicity for himself.

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    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Wed May 24, 2023 12:09 am

    A wise man never underestimates his enemy, only a fool does.

    He is right to respect their capacity, it shows he understands his enemy, where as your bias is blinding you

    If you where in a command position with that attitude you'd get men needlessly killed

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Wed May 24, 2023 12:47 am

    Prigozin is a businessman, first of all.
    He runs a private company dealing with military business.
    Lots of drama, lots of noise - is what he needs for running his business.
    He is a notorious liar, known for that on multiple cases and occasions.
    And that is not a negative considering the situation, actually!
    His own numbers do not add up, and it is enough to combine them.

    Just for his latest entry, he claims to recruit 50 000 prisoners, and 20% of them died in the Artemovsk operation.
    Well, first of all, the whole number of imprisoned in Russia is about 450 000, declining steadily. That accounts all of them, men&women, all age, all shape, all crimes.
    It is impossible to recruit more than 10% of them, considering that they required good physical shape, age <50, male, and excluded multiple crimes etc.
    He states 20% casualties, while Mediazone accounted for not more than 4000 KIA prisoners, and some 1600 regular Wagner troopers, for the whole period of military operation.
    And that would add up, the number of about 15-20k recruited inmates was called multiple times.

    The picture he paints overstates the power of the enemy and understates his own.
    Tons of his claims about lacking the fire support or ammunition were proven wrong, only by watching the scale of artillery barrage.

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    Post  Podlodka77 Wed May 24, 2023 1:15 am

    The worst two APC vehicles currently have Russia and the USA because both the BTR-82 and the Stryker are nothing but the worst piece of junk. I don't understand why the Russians are testing the APC Boomerang so much because it's a freaking armored personnel carrier - not a spaceship. You need to increase the armor protection and decide on either a 30mm or a 57mm gun - at the price of a much smaller battle kit.
    Any APC is just that and nothing more because on the front it will surely be destroyed before a tank.

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Wed May 24, 2023 2:14 am

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 15 Fw4h7h10
    Taken form Geroman on Twitter
    Left: What people think how border defence works
    Right: How border defence works in real life
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 15 Fw31gs10


    Last edited by Hole on Wed May 24, 2023 2:59 am; edited 1 time in total

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    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Wed May 24, 2023 2:17 am

    Your are only accounting for people in the prisons themselves, not the inflow those awaiting trail but not cages, if you add the inflow plus the other area's in the Russians prison system, the numbers are over 600k which is quite feasible, and there is no evidence the Russians weren't withholding ammo, and he really has no reason to lie about that, unless he was playing mind games with ukies

    When determining what is a lie one must ask what point does the lie serve, who benefits from it.

    You merely don't like the man because he dared to rightfully criticize Russian brass, and it's good he does. Someone who doesn't tolerate BS or incompetence gets the job done.

    Wagner gets the job done,

    Btw your being dishonest when you say 50k it wasn't 50k all at once but overtime and again when you account for inflow figures that number is very realistic

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    Post  Regular Wed May 24, 2023 2:53 am

    Nothing that Prigozhin says adds up. He lies not for domestic audiences. He even contradics himself many times. Modern maskirovka.

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    Post  Hole Wed May 24, 2023 3:01 am

    When I see or hear Prigozhin this guy comes to my mind:
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 15 R22

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 15 Scree707
    Comment from a resident

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Wed May 24, 2023 4:13 am

    I don't have criticism for Lapin, he did a good job

    Although I think it is ridiculous that a Colonel General would have to resolve this situation

    I'd want competent leadership of the border guards and Rosgvardiya to deal with these incursions

    Lapin should have more important things to deal with, hopefully
    Mir
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    Post  Mir Wed May 24, 2023 5:01 am

    Podlodka77 wrote:The worst two APC vehicles currently have Russia and the USA because both the BTR-82 and the Stryker are nothing but the worst piece of junk. I don't understand why the Russians are testing the APC Boomerang so much because it's a freaking armored personnel carrier - not a spaceship. You need to increase the armor protection and decide on either a 30mm or a 57mm gun - at the price of a much smaller battle kit.
    Any APC is just that and nothing more because on the front it will surely be destroyed before a tank.

    The general idea of an APC is more like a battlefield taxi. It supposed to deliver troop fairly close to the action but at a safe distance. The disembarked troops are then supposed to follow and cover the advancing tank units and the APC in turn covers the troops advance with it's machine gun or cannon. Very old school but this is the general idea of the BTR.

    Much the same goes for Infantry Combat vehicles like the BMP but with their heavier weapons they can engage armoured and fortified targets - but the main fighting unit remains the tank. To use APC's and IFV's as the main strike units is suicidal - unless the enemy is just light infantry, but even then they can easily be destroyed.

    Depending on the weapons fit the Boomerang is no longer and APC - it is a fully fledged IFV or a BMP.

    Btw - considering your strong anti-communist stance I presume you would rather keep the name Bakhmut than Artemovsk? Wink Laughing

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    Post  franco Wed May 24, 2023 5:05 am

    Arkanghelsk wrote:I don't have criticism for Lapin, he did a good job

    Although I think it is ridiculous that a Colonel General would have to resolve this situation

    I'd want competent leadership of the border guards and Rosgvardiya to deal with these incursions

    Lapin should have more important things to deal with, hopefully

    Believe his present role is to co-ordinate the forces in the bordering Russian regions so it would fall under his job.

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    Post  ALAMO Wed May 24, 2023 5:12 am

    Repelling direct Ukro intrusion into the core Russian Federation was a too tasty occasion to show himself to miss Laughing
    Is there anyone who really considers that it is a general rank to give a direct orders to some troopers to cross the road or form a column? Laughing Laughing
    A show - that is what it was.

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Wed May 24, 2023 5:55 am

    I agree, and it's fine to rehabilitate this guy's reputation after it was tarnished by Kadyrov,

    But nonetheless this guy spends time in the general staff with Gerasimov and Surovikin, he should not be on the streets doing traffic duty and taking point

    Just seems ridiculous, rosgvardiya should be the primary force responsible for this, it is literally their job description, not storming cities like Kharkov

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    Post  GarryB Wed May 24, 2023 6:34 am

    The worst two APC vehicles currently have Russia and the USA because both the BTR-82 and the Stryker are nothing but the worst piece of junk.

    That is a ridiculous thing to say.

    The Americans use Humvees for jobs the Russians use BTR-82s for... the Russian vehicle has armour protection from small arms fire and a stabilised cannon and machine gun and has very good mobility... the small trench that stopped those Humvees would not have stopped a BTR-82 and the BTR-82 would have been able to return fire with a decent calibre gun unlike the Humvee.

    The BTR only has problems when you treat it like a BMP-3 because it is not that well protected and its fire power is not that good.

    The Stryker replaces the M113 essentially which was a cheap aluminium box with an exposed guy hanging on to a 50 cal HMG... the Stryker has a better gun and is slightly better armed and has better mobility... hand grenade fragments could penetrate an M113 in Vietnam... it was troop transport and basic protection... you don't stay inside them when the enemy is shooting at you.

    I don't understand why the Russians are testing the APC Boomerang so much because it's a freaking armored personnel carrier - not a spaceship.

    The Boomerang is a vehicle family that includes a BTR but also a BMP and a tank and every other vehicle in an armoured division... they are getting the design right before they start making them and being a wheeled vehicle they are likely going to make a lot of them because wheeled vehicles are cheaper to buy and cheaper to operate than any tracked equivalent... so they are likely going to make a lot of them when they are ready.

    You merely don't like the man because he dared to rightfully criticize Russian brass, and it's good he does. Someone who doesn't tolerate BS or incompetence gets the job done.

    All fine and good, but when Rogozin does the same thing some people seem to rather want to hate him for it too.

    We don't object to him solving his problems but doing it in public looks rather bad unless it is PR to fool the Orcs into thinking there is a gap in the Russian armour... in which case that is fine.

    Comment from a resident

    The plus markings almost as if they want the pictures of the destroyed vehicles to be proof the Russians are destroying Medical vehicles...

    The general idea of an APC is more like a battlefield taxi. It supposed to deliver troop fairly close to the action but at a safe distance. The disembarked troops are then supposed to follow and cover the advancing tank units and the APC in turn covers the troops advance with it's machine gun or cannon. Very old school but this is the general idea of the BTR.

    Exactly, it is low cost mobility that gets you to the fight and then recovers you to move you somewhere else when needed... it can retire and direct heavy fire on enemy positions but it is not intended to fight from it through enemy positions.

    Not even BMPs are for that.... they just have better protection and can provide rather more powerful fire support to their disembarked troops.

    The T-15 might be used to roll through enemy positions with its tank level armour but that has never really been tested yet.

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    Arrow


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    Post  Arrow Wed May 24, 2023 7:39 am

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    Post  mnztr Wed May 24, 2023 8:16 am

    holy shit, what projectile hit that boat? it effin vaporized!!! Was it an explosives drone


    Last edited by mnztr on Wed May 24, 2023 8:17 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Wed May 24, 2023 8:16 am

    Good gunner. Very Happy

    what projectile hit that boat?
    The thing carried a lot of explosives.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 15 Fw5k5n10
    lol1


    Last edited by Hole on Wed May 24, 2023 9:09 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Arrow Wed May 24, 2023 8:24 am

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Wed May 24, 2023 8:41 am

    Zaluzhny lost his head figuratively and literally seems like

    Good job hitting one of the decision making centers

    More need to come

    But leave Syrsky , the clown of bakhmut

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    Post  flamming_python Wed May 24, 2023 8:45 am

    Arrow wrote:Prigozhin overestimates the army of Ukraine but makes a good publicity for himself.

    Maybe he's planning to run for president of the Ukraine?

    Who knows with that guy


    Last edited by flamming_python on Wed May 24, 2023 8:48 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Belisarius Wed May 24, 2023 8:46 am

    According to a source, Zaluzhny, the AFU chief, has suffered head injuries and shrapnel wounds as a result of a Russian missile strike on a command post near Kherson in early May.

    Zaluzhny underwent a skull operation after his injury - the AFU chief is expected to live, but will not be able to do his job.

    On the same time, ukrainian channel Legitimny states the following:

    There is renewed information about Commander-in-Chief Zaluzhny that he has been seriously injured, allegedly undergoing surgery. This was reported by the Russian media.
    One may be sceptical about this information, but Zaluzhny has not been in public for a long time, which only reinforces the rumours that he is not all right.

    A video with the Commander-in-Chief can be recorded by any neural network and other "Hollywood" tricks used by the Office of the President (remember how Zelensky was filmed against a green background and passed off as different locations to enhance the image of Ze-hero).
    So the recorded videos are not believable in the 21st century.

    To dispel all the rumours and throw-ins, you just need to appear in public. For example, to walk on the Maidan in Kiev. If this is not done in the coming weeks, the rumour that something is wrong with Zaluzhny will be indirectly confirmed.

    https://t.me/Slavyangrad/47564

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    Post  Odin of Ossetia Wed May 24, 2023 9:05 am

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:A wise man never underestimates his enemy, only a fool does.

    He is right to respect their capacity, it shows he understands his enemy, where as your bias is blinding you

    If you where in a command position with that attitude you'd get men needlessly killed




    Only that Prigozhin is not wise, he is a fool.


    It is he who freed 100 Ukrainian prisoners-of-war as a goodwill gesture for the Eastern Orthodox Easter, only to shortly afterwards have his own captured troops killed by their Ukrainian captors.


    Ukraine is so powerful because they have been massively gifted with a huge array of weapons by other countries, have the best NATO military advisers helping them, have a Russian leadership that is easy on them, have the backing of majority of the most influential countries in the world, have for decades enjoyed a preferential treatment from Russia, even have their past war crimes either entirely covered up or "watered down" by a really stupid Czech president and the Western propaganda and mass media establishment.

    I could go on and on.



    http://michalw.narod.ru/index-Truth.html


    http://asaland.proboards.com/thread/460/land-zamosc-zamojszczyzna-1942-1944




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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 24, 2023 10:40 am

    A very good thread on the experiences of a top level ex US F-16 maintainer and the implications for Ukraine from that perspective.

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1659757656997871619.html

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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 24, 2023 10:46 am

    It looks like they took artillery (admittedly only 100mm) with them on their raid. Unless it was Russian!



    Spriter
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    EU countries delivered 220,000 artillery shells and 1,300 missiles to Ukraine over the past month

    At the moment, the EU has trained up to 20,000 Ukrainian soldiers, by the end of the year this number will grow to 30,000 people

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    Post  Sprut-B Wed May 24, 2023 10:52 am



    Indian mainstream media on Zaluzhnyi

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