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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    Arkanghelsk
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    Post  Arkanghelsk Tue May 23, 2023 5:20 pm

    The border should be protected, and the case for bigger drones with better optics and better targeting is made

    If no buffer zone, then increase patrols, equip border guards and police with heavier weapons

    And get Sirius or Orion drones active along the border ,

    I think Sirius is perfect, have 10 of them loitering over the border patrolling,  and equipped with KAB250

    When you see a DRG, drop bombs on them and alert other forces about the saboteur groups

    This I think is best if they don't want to establish a buffer

    Something like Sirius can carry better surveillance equipment, and conduct round the clock patrols

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Russia12


    With a border this big, you can't skimp on equipment like this

    People argue these drones are not needed, because they're not useful for wars, but for counter terror they are great

    And that's exactly what this situation would have called for,

    You can get a ZALA, but I doubt ZALA can orbit around a village for 10 + hours and maintain visual on terrorists


    Last edited by Arkanghelsk on Tue May 23, 2023 5:25 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Hole Tue May 23, 2023 5:24 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Fwz4aj10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Fwz4bu10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Fw0ov_10
    So that´s what a successful PR operation looks like. Suspect

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Tue May 23, 2023 5:45 pm

    Hole wrote:

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Fw0ov_10




    so they all are deep in the ass where the sun doesn't rise...


    Last edited by GunshipDemocracy on Tue May 23, 2023 5:51 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Belisarius Tue May 23, 2023 5:47 pm

    Leveling fixed targets is not the same as providing CAS support,

    CAS is when aviation attacks enemy positions close to your allies, if Russian artillery and aviation bombed Ugledar before and during the Russian assault then yes, they had artillery and CAS support.

    20+ vehicles lost in one failed attack IIRC. The videos are out there Champ.

    The videos out there are of low resolution, recorded at a long distance, heavily edited, without context, without any indication of the date and place where they were recorded.
    The video of the loss of over 20 vehicles in a single attack is the best example of this, a bunch of frames conveniently selected, and taken out of context, from a much larger video that shows that the majority of the vehicles were intact and not destroyed.

    Bytheway, the Russian units on the flanks of Bakhmut that ran away after making contact with the Ukrainians stated the same: lack of ammo, lack of shells.

    Could you show me the officer of this Russian unit stating such a thing?
    Considering that everything you write is completely disconnected from reality, I give myself the right to question the veracity of your statement, as so far Russian forces, under attack, have retreated about 1 or 2 kilometers from fields that are difficult to defend to places better suited to defend after Ukrainian forces wasted 1,725 men, 9 tanks and 55 armored fighting vehicles in less than 24 hours. The lines on Bakhmut's flanks have since stabilized.

    Will be interesting to see how you're gonna cope your way out of this.


    Will be interesting to see how you're gonna cope your way out of the fact that:

    -The "utterly incompetent imbeciles" Shoigu and Gerasimov are leading a war where they have already killed 8 times more enemy soldiers than they have lost.

    -Prigozhin's claims about the lack of ammunition are always followed by videos of Wagner's massive bombing against the AFU.

    -Why would the Russian MoD sabotage the supply of munitions to the wagner while providing them with their best MBTs and kamikaze drones?

    And yet you accuse me of "moving the goalposts"...

    The 155th got decimated at Hostomel Airport, was withdrawn and replenished

    How were they decimated, withdrawn and replenished after Gostomel if they never fought there?
    VDV fought there, and similar claims against them are just as silly.

    then participated in the suicidal attack on Pavliivka in which Russia lost 600+ men, got reinforced, then did the human wave things around Vuhledar and is now probably somewhere in the ropes hiding from embarrassment.

    As true as their presence in gostomel...

    Being under the nominal command is something very different from being part of the same structure.

    Stop coping, Wagner is under a chain of command and obeys the Russian MoD, so much so that the order to withdraw on the day 10 from its "owner" never materialized.
    Not to mention that all air support, anti-air support, logistics, intelligence and reconnaissance come from forces that are also under the command of the Russian MoD.
    The notion that Russian forces do not do what Wagner did is absurd.

    you absolute tard, dimwit, dumb

    I couldn't find a better definition for a person who claims that a troop has been decimated in a place it has never been...

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    Post  Regular Tue May 23, 2023 6:08 pm

    These attacks on Russian soil still remind me more of chechen insurgent raids on Nalchik, but with some MRAPs

    Reports are that there are still some fighting and some rumours have it that UA inserted more DRGs too. I guess they have too much vehicles and manpower

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    Post  Lapain Tue May 23, 2023 6:23 pm

    Arkanghelsk wrote:Why is Artemovsk So Important?

    What is it about Artemovsk that led both sides to dig in so deeply and commit such immense human and material resources to fighting for the city? Russian military observer Alexey Leonkov says the city’s significance in the broader Russia-NATO proxy war in Ukraine can be divided into three parts: military operational-tactical, military strategic, and political.

    In the operational-tactical sense, the battle for Artemovsk led to the loss of large numbers of Ukrainian troops and vast quantities of military equipment, and cracked open one of Kiev’s major fortified stronghold in Donbass, with others including the Avdeevka-Mariinsk-Gorlovka grouping and the Severodonetsk-Kramatorsk grouping of forces.
    "These two groupings, against which even more concentrated hostilities will be waged, will open [Russian forces' path] to Pavlograd, after which the expanses of the so-called operational steppe begin, where camouflage will become an issue, and where the concentration of enemy forces will become a very difficult and costly undertaking," Leonkov said.

    Military Strategic Significance

    At the strategic level, Leonkov noted, the concentration of fighting in and around Artemovsk over these past months gave the Russian side time to train its mobilized troops and to recruit additional contract fighters, while Russia’s military-industrial complex received time to mobilize its resources and ramp up production to wartime levels.

    "That is, the amount of ammunition we're producing now is much higher than it was at the start of the special military operation," the observer said. "Besides this, the production of weapons which at the start…numbered in the single digits were increased. Take for example the Tornado-S high-precision rocket artillery system, a direct competitor to the HIMARS and which surpasses the US system in many technical characteristics. At the start of the special military operation there were only about 20 units of this system, while now there are over 100, and this number is growing."

    Political Significance

    The third significant component of Artemovsk’s liberation is its political symbolism, and has to do with NATO’s support for Kiev in the proxy war against Russia, according to Leonkov.
    "The supply of weapons and military equipment in Artemovsk was mainly assigned to the European countries, with systems from their arsenals becoming the main ones. Precisely when we began to work effectively in the use of air-dropped glide bombs, the burden of supplying weapons and military equipment had fallen on the Europeans, who managed to crush voices of dissent demanding a halt to the supply of weapons to Ukraine. The weapons were delivered on the expectation that they would be needed to help Ukraine hold on to this territory. But the city was lost, and with great losses," both among Ukrainians and foreign mercenaries – "possibly including even professional [NATO] soldiers," the observer noted.



    The SMO is basically reproducing the island hopping strategy devised by the US in the Pacific 1942-45. The Battle of Bakhmut wasn't exactly Verdun or Stalingrad, but Guadalcanal. And with this, the initiative is firmly in the Russian side which will emerge out of this conflict looking more like the US in 1945 than the USSR of 1989...

    Oh and the "liberation of Bilhorod". That's all Folks!

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Image11

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    Post  sepheronx Tue May 23, 2023 7:25 pm

    Regular wrote:These attacks on Russian soil still remind me more of chechen insurgent raids on Nalchik, but with some MRAPs

    Reports are that there are still some fighting and some rumours have it that UA inserted more DRGs too. I guess they have too much vehicles and manpower

    https://t.me/intelslava/47996

    So the fighting may be right exactly at the border.

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    Post  owais.usmani Tue May 23, 2023 7:48 pm

    https://twitter.com/imetatronink/status/1661059852897259521

    Can F-16s Fly Combat Sorties Over Ukraine?

    — A discussion of some of the most relevant considerations —

    It is effectively impossible to base F-16s in Ukraine. The available runways are woefully deficient, and any aircraft remaining at one base for more than a single sortie are going to become a target of Russian strikes, along with the base infrastructure.

    The Ukrainian air force has only managed to retain a handful of airframes to this point in time by assiduously hiding them, and constantly moving them around, using improvised airfields much of the time (highways, grass fields, etc.) The sortie rate of the remaining UAF aircraft is so small as to be nearly invisible. Indeed, with few exceptions, if they fly, they die.

    But at least Soviet-era jets were designed and constructed to fly out of "guerrilla airfields". F-16s are not. F-16s require pristine runways and intensive maintenance after each sortie — almost 20 hours of maintenance for each hour of flight time!!!

    This means highly trained / exceedingly experienced NATO ground crews and fully equipped maintenance hangars would need to be available anywhere the F-16 seeks to fly — along with an abundant supply of spare parts, spare engines, etc.

    That simply is not going to happen in Ukraine.

    ‼ This means the only plausible basing option will be at NATO facilities in Poland and/or Romania. And anyone attempting to argue against this reality is engaging in pure fantasy.

    And, of course, flying F-16s against Russia from bases in Poland and/or Romania is tantamount to a formal declaration of WAR.

    But let's assume NATO chooses that option ...

    First, we need to consider what the mission of these F-16s will be. Is it to launch with long-range cruise missiles, rise to high altitude, and fire them from distant stand-off range? Because, as I understand it, the F-16 cannot carry, for example, a British Storm Shadow missile. The F-16 is not well-suited for the long-range stand-off role.

    Furthermore, an F-16 at altitude over Ukraine is going to be seen by Russian AD assets from hundreds of miles away, and Russian air to air missiles and S-400 SAMs will outrange the F-16s capability to defend itself in almost any scenario.

    Additionally, the Russians have clearly demonstrated the capability to routinely shoot down any stand-off munition NATO has launched against them.

    I don't see how an F-16 mission to launch long-range stand-off strikes against Russian targets is going to produce any meaningful tactical successes, let along appreciable strategic effects. And I am certain it would only take the Russians a day or two to formulate highly effective ambushes against this tactic. Each subsequent F-16 sortie would then become a one-way kamikaze attack.

    As for close-air support (CAS) of ground troops or combat air patrol (CAP) against Russian attack aircraft, there is simply no way the F-16 can accomplish either of those missions without readily available in-air refueling! And that is simply not going to happen over Ukraine. NATO's big, fat, slow tankers will be shot out of the sky at will by the Russians! There is no way of getting around that reality.

    Moreover, from the moment the first F-16 commences an attack sortie from a NATO airfield, all NATO ISR assets in the theater will become targets. They will either cease to fly, or cease to exist. And, without them, the F-16 is no longer a useful tool.

    Neither F-16s, nor any variety of NATO strike aircraft, are made to function in isolation from the huge logistical infrastructure that supports them. Therefore, the very sentence "Send F-16s to Ukraine" is a logically nonsensical statement.

    Simply put, I cannot conceive of ANY way F-16s can be used against Russian forces in Ukraine, even if the latest generation of F-16 Vipers were being flown by experienced NATO pilots.

    And, quite frankly, the same limitations would apply to ANY variety of NATO strike aircraft attempting to fly against the Russian military in its own backyard.

    If the policy makers of the #EmpireAtAllCosts cult succeed in initiating an air war against Russia in eastern Europe, it will result in catastrophic losses for US/NATO air power and the comprehensive destruction of the myth of US military supremacy.

    /end

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    Post  flamming_python Tue May 23, 2023 7:49 pm

    Rodion_Romanovic wrote:By the way, this attack in Belgorod was of course of no significance from a military point of view.

    However the weapons used were mainly western provided. Previously America and its puppets said that the weapons delivered would not be used against russian territory.

    Will there be consequences for this?

    The point of them saying that was an attempt to absolve themselves of responsibility in advance

    Now whether Russia wants to do something specifically in retaliation so then they can go ahead, but I don't see why. I think what Russia is doing already, destroying the Ukrainian army, its munitions, and foreign mercs - is more than enough; and all these stunts are just acts of desperation done in a bid to cause panic or somehow upturn the situation, or whatever. It's all futile.

    Moreover enacting specific consequences in retaliation for this attack will in fact serve to underwrite the Western claim that the Belgorod region is Russia but the Donbass and Crimea aren't. Which I imagine the Kremlin wants to avoid.

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    Post  kvs Tue May 23, 2023 7:56 pm

    It seems the current population of Kiev regime run Ukria is 18 million. I don't have a link to an article, but the analysis I heard is
    plausible. The migration before and especially after 2014 and 2022 has been massive.

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    Post  Odin of Ossetia Tue May 23, 2023 8:02 pm

    limb wrote:It seems like in order to take belogorovka maryinka and possibly ugledar, the russians will need to mobilize an additional 150000 people, and produce hundreds of thousands of ATGMs, quadcopters, hundreds more artillery tubes, and up to 6-20 million 100-152mm artillery shells.

    2 weeks ago, The MoD made A HUGE DEAL that a "large offensive" 22(!) chechens from the supposedly 10000 strong ahmat took one warehouse in Belogorovka outskirts. Celebrating for ONE FUCKING HOUSE. Wagner needs some well deserved rest, so the offensive capability of russia is gone. Muradov squandered 50+ AFVs in no man's land, so ugledar is out of the question.

    AVdeevka will never be taken without a 2nd wave of mobilization, since the local DPR and MoD forces are completely outnumbered. This has me extremely worried. The best the MoD can do is hyper limited trench raids of less than 20 soldiers aimed at taking a single trench line or destroyed dacha, then retreating. The umpk glide kits translated to 0 ABATION OF CIVILIAN MURDERING ARTY STRIKES FROM AVDEEVKA. AFter 3 months of "attacking", 0 progress north of vodyanoe.

    Hopefully once wagner takes a rest, we'll see an Artyomovsk flower that flanks Belogorovka and spornoye which the MoD has UTTERLY FAILED TO RECAPTURE IN 7 FUCKING MONTHS, WHILE BRAGGING THAT "ADVANCES" ARE BEING MADE THERE.

    ALso, belgorod raids are irrelevant. Russia needs to respond by doing special forces raids in sumy and chernigov that aim to terrorize. How about sending DRGs to Volyn and ZHitomir through the swamps, which are aimed at doing potshots at western svidomites.



    And hardly any partisan activity, it appears, in the New Serbia/Odessa  & Yedisan & Budziaki. There was some partisan activity there during 2014-2015 and possibly later.


    http://michalw.narod.ru/index-GL42.html



    Putin gave plenty of time to the Ukrainians to deal with the resistance forces present there.




    Last edited by Odin of Ossetia on Tue May 23, 2023 8:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Regular Tue May 23, 2023 8:05 pm

    From UA point of view, these raids make perfect sense. Russian will have to strengthen their garrison and reinforce border-guards, maybe even employ more UAVs to monitor the vast border. 

    And Ukrainians gained PR victory and lost what? Bunch of kamikazes and some handover equipment. More of this to come until Russians will respond with cauterisation

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    Post  0nillie0 Tue May 23, 2023 8:12 pm

    owais.usmani wrote:https://twitter.com/imetatronink/status/1661059852897259521

    [b]Can F-16s Fly Combat Sorties Over Ukraine?

    — A discussion of some of the most relevant considerations —

    The F-16s would be set up for failure anyway. Speaking for my own country, our F-16s are in miserable shape and in desperate need for replacement. We are left with only the choice for American shit anyway, and it would just force more spending on F-35's or UCAV's and all the stuff that has to come with that. This will all be happily sold by the US MIC in exchange for unspeakable amounts of taxpayer money, of which our corrupt politicians will pocket a nice amount. Getting rid of the only excuse not to buy more US garbage ASAP seems like a good move to these individuals, who cares what happens to the airframes, or to Ukraine for that matter.

    Its a shortsighted decision based only on greed.

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    Post  Odin of Ossetia Tue May 23, 2023 8:17 pm




    I find it a bit surprising that Belgium purchased the F-16 instead of some fighter jets from nearby France.





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    Post  zare Tue May 23, 2023 8:32 pm

    0nillie0 wrote:and it would just force more spending on F-35's or UCAV's

    Just wait for 6th gen American, then you'll have to spend for both F-something and his buddy UCAVs.

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    Post  Isos Tue May 23, 2023 8:33 pm

    Regular wrote:From UA point of view, these raids make perfect sense. Russian will have to strengthen their garrison and reinforce border-guards, maybe even employ more UAVs to monitor the vast border. 

    And Ukrainians gained PR victory and lost what? Bunch of kamikazes and some handover equipment. More of this to come until Russians will respond with cauterisation

    I don't know where I saw this but someone said something not dumb.

    US goal right now is to oblige Russia to use its modern missiles to dicrease their stocks.

    This dumb attack was probably made in order to make Russia fire its kalibr as a punishement.

    It's hard to know how the production rate and the stocks but one thing is sure, they used many kalibrs and kh-101. They can be thankfull to Iran for Geran-2 because they would have had hard time destroying all those targets with cruise missiles.

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    Post  Isos Tue May 23, 2023 8:34 pm

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    I find it a bit surprising that Belgium purchased the F-16 instead of some fighter jets from nearby France.

    They don't really like French people and their economy is so shitty they better not angry the USA.

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    Post  ahmedfire Tue May 23, 2023 8:35 pm

    @WarMonitors

    AFU Losses so far as a result of the capturing of Belgorod villages:

    - 2 American armored vehicles M1224 MaxxPro (both captured)
    - 2 American armored vehicles HMMWV M1151A1 (both damaged and abandoned)
    - 1 American cargo armored car HMMWV M1152A1 (destroyed)
    - 1 Ukrainian armored car KRAZ COBRA (destroyed)
    - 1 Polish armored car AMZ Dzik-2 (destroyed)

    https://twitter.com/WarMonitors/status/1661065269282848783

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    Post  0nillie0 Tue May 23, 2023 8:36 pm

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:


    I find it a bit surprising that Belgium purchased the F-16 instead of some fighter jets from nearby France.






    The French tried hard, and by all rights should have won, but as usual, the politcians we didnt vote for make the decision our military does not approve and our economy can not support...
    But hey, i am sure GD & Lockeed Martin had the best food at their presentations.

    It was the same for the F-35 (should have gone with Rafale).

    But the US Wunderwaffes will save us from the likes of big bad Putin and Xi when they come for our innocent little souls..... right?!


    Last edited by 0nillie0 on Tue May 23, 2023 8:46 pm; edited 2 times in total

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    Post  ludovicense Tue May 23, 2023 8:42 pm

    Regular wrote:From UA point of view, these raids make perfect sense. Russian will have to strengthen their garrison and reinforce border-guards, maybe even employ more UAVs to monitor the vast border. 

    And Ukrainians gained PR victory and lost what? Bunch of kamikazes and some handover equipment. More of this to come until Russians will respond with cauterisation

    Russia is not going to change its tactic of war of attrition that aims at the destruction of manpower and equipment, which is working so far because of a bunch of clueless people at the behest of Zelensky, whose attack has no relevance. The sole purpose of this attack is to divert focus from the Berkhmut disaster.
    The West knows that Ukraine cannot directly attack Russian cities because there will be a reaction, so much so that Ukraine's biggest concern was to say that it had nothing to do with the attack. Habitual hypocrisy.
    By the way, this was not an attack, it was a suicide mission. Traffickers from Rio's hills and Mexican cartels would do better.

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    Post  Scorpius Tue May 23, 2023 8:43 pm

    Warning dead body visible in this video, viewer discretion advised...

    https://idiod.video/9fdpri.mp4

    Oh, definitely, the raid on the territory of Russia ended with complete success Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    Post  zare Tue May 23, 2023 8:52 pm

    [quote="Isos"]
    Regular wrote:
    This dumb attack was probably made in order to make Russia fire its kalibr as a punishement.

    I don't think Kalibr is used as punishment, the concept doesn't work against AFU at all and Russians know it. They are not going to get PR points for just bombing random targets not at home and certainly not in Ukraine. We're years past the point where Ukrainians get intimidated by some big strike. Even if they do such things it's a Geran-2 task.

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    PapaDragon
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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    Post  PapaDragon Tue May 23, 2023 8:55 pm

    Hole wrote:........Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Fw0ov_10

    So that´s what a successful PR operation looks like. Suspect

    NOW Russians can claim that they neutralized the enemies

    Words are BS, evidence is everything

    Still need faces and IDs

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    Odin of Ossetia
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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    Post  Odin of Ossetia Tue May 23, 2023 8:59 pm

    Isos wrote:
    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    I find it a bit surprising that Belgium purchased the F-16 instead of some fighter jets from nearby France.

    They don't really like French people and their economy is so shitty they better not angry the USA.



    I heard a while ago that in France people often make fun of Belgium and its inhabitants. Can anyone confirm it? Question


    Perhaps it is similar to the Polish jokes in the U.S.A.?


    "Polish" government itself rejected the French Mirage jets in favor of the F-16.



    Mir
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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 13 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    Post  Mir Tue May 23, 2023 9:08 pm

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    I find it a bit surprising that Belgium purchased the F-16 instead of some fighter jets from nearby France.

    Well Belgium made an equally stupid choice with the predecessor when the purchased the Mirage 5 in a country where sunshine is a rarity.

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