Russian special military operation in Ukraine #25

TMA1 wrote:

zorobabel wrote:Belogorovka is under Ukrainian control: https://t.me/Slavyangrad/9185

This means the Luhansk People's Republic is no longer fully liberated.

Indeed things are fluid and Russia has to whack-a-mole the Ukrainian attacks via help to LPR fighters.

One would think this would be the most heavily defended part of the front.

Also opens up the encirclement of Krasny Liman in the DPR.

Big_Gazza wrote:

Backman wrote:According to the order of battle Wikipedia page,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Initial_groupings:_February_2022 if you add up all the BTGs from the order of battle, you get between 39,000 to 52,000 troops.

Wikipedia?    /facepalm

You might as well just read BBC and CNN, or the US Dept of State.  Heck, you might as well believe anything the Ukropi regime says...

But Wiki  BBC ect have an interest in overstating the number of Russian troops in Ukraine. Not understating it.

I wasn't trying to make any specific point. I just thought the numbers were curious. Russia's troops are over achieving. That doesnt necessarily mean there is enough of them

mnztr wrote:....
Lets face it, even people that feel Russia is justified feel sad for the Ukrainians being forced to go to the front to get torn to pieces. its sad and ugly...

Bullshit

Only complaint I (and many others) have is that Ukrainians are not being torn to pieces in much larger numbers and at much faster pace

It's a long overdue necessary process that Russia is still dragging it's feet about



And numbers are definitely way too low, at this pace it will take at least another year before they reach 100k dead Ukrainians and they will still have half a dozen more rounds to go after that at least, it will take forever at this pace

To say nothing of the fact that only evidence of any killed Ukrainians is Konashenkov pinky promise and nothing else

No photos or videos of corpses, no funerals, no contacts with relatives of the stiffs, nothing

Not good enough

thegopnik wrote:

Heard Zelensky and his general are Jewish, Zelensky wants a 2nd israel so no idea why Putin would opposte him and most of Bidens cabinet is Jewish lets say worse case scenario that Russia lets Ukraine win. Would this entire board be pro-chinese instead since the Chinese dont have jews in goverment positions?

Surfing 4chan again ?

Its an ongoing argument. Putin and the JQ. There's something for everyone it seems

Putin Is Reviving Soviet-era Antisemitism to Crush Opposition to His War on Ukraine

In his recent address on Russian TV about Ukraine, where he red-flagged "fifth columnists" who are "traitors to the nation," Putin did not explicitly say the words "Jews," "Zionists" or "cosmopolitans." He didn't need to

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/2022-03-24/ty-article-opinion/.premium/putin-revives-soviet-era-antisemitism-to-crush-opposition-to-his-war-on-ukraine/00000180-5bb3-d615-a9bf-dff3f6d70000

Backman wrote:

Big_Gazza wrote:

Backman wrote:According to the order of battle Wikipedia page,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Initial_groupings:_February_2022 if you add up all the BTGs from the order of battle, you get between 39,000 to 52,000 troops.

Wikipedia?    /facepalm

You might as well just read BBC and CNN, or the US Dept of State.  Heck, you might as well believe anything the Ukropi regime says...

But Wiki  BBC ect have an interest in overstating the number of Russian troops in Ukraine. Not understating it.

I wasn't trying to make any specific point. I just thought the numbers were curious. Russia's troops are over achieving. That doesnt necessarily mean there is enough of them

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-says-russia-has-nearly-100000-troops-near-its-border-2021-11-13/

Ukies saying 90K in Nov 2021.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-europe-russia-united-states-vladimir-putin-534fb1c355ff5f135ba0261cb1448c3c

"Western estimates" @ 150K on 2/16/22

https://www.voanews.com/a/europe_blinken-heads-ukraine-after-russia-sends-150k-troops-border/6205257.html

"Senior American and European Union officials" said roughly 150K Russian troops massed along the border

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60158694

100-190K including "air and naval support"

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/16/nato-says-russia-is-increasing-troop-count-at-ukrainian-border.html

Biden claiming 150K on Feb 16, 2022

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Russian_and_other_forces

Ukrainian military commentator Yuri Butusov presented the following initial February 2022 deployment of the Russian forces @ 64-69 BTGs = 51,200 - 55,200 men if 800 per BTG

Deputy of the National Assembly of the DPR Elena Shishkina commented on today's shelling of the square. Baku Commissars in the Kuibyshevsky district of Donetsk:

“Today is another black day in the life of the Donetsk People's Republic, in the life of the entire Donbass. 13 civilians have just died, including two children. A direct hit to the Central Republican Bank, a store, a public transport stop nearby, there have never been any military facilities and there are none today.

Let's change the format of the SVO, let's call a spade a spade, and let's stop using the civilian population of Donbass as human shields."

dionis wrote:

Backman wrote:

Big_Gazza wrote:

Backman wrote:According to the order of battle Wikipedia page,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Initial_groupings:_February_2022 if you add up all the BTGs from the order of battle, you get between 39,000 to 52,000 troops.

Wikipedia?    /facepalm

You might as well just read BBC and CNN, or the US Dept of State.  Heck, you might as well believe anything the Ukropi regime says...

But Wiki  BBC ect have an interest in overstating the number of Russian troops in Ukraine. Not understating it.

I wasn't trying to make any specific point. I just thought the numbers were curious. Russia's troops are over achieving. That doesnt necessarily mean there is enough of them

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-says-russia-has-nearly-100000-troops-near-its-border-2021-11-13/

Ukies saying 90K in Nov 2021.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-europe-russia-united-states-vladimir-putin-534fb1c355ff5f135ba0261cb1448c3c

"Western estimates" @ 150K on 2/16/22

https://www.voanews.com/a/europe_blinken-heads-ukraine-after-russia-sends-150k-troops-border/6205257.html

"Senior American and European Union officials" said roughly 150K Russian troops massed along the border

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60158694

100-190K including "air and naval support"

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/16/nato-says-russia-is-increasing-troop-count-at-ukrainian-border.html

Biden claiming 150K on Feb 16, 2022

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Russian_and_other_forces

Ukrainian military commentator Yuri Butusov presented the following initial February 2022 deployment of the Russian forces @ 64-69 BTGs = 51,200 - 55,200 men if 800 per BTG

The US and its coalition invaded Iraq with 180k troops. That was a desperately poor country of 30 million under UN sanctions and a No Fly Zone for more than a decade. 1/3 of the country was outside Baghdad control. Eventual surge of 'coalition' forces reached 300k. In the initial stage of the war (the first 6 weeks), the US flew 2,750 sorties per day, for a total of 116,000 sorties, plus thousands of cruise missiles.

Russia invaded Ukraine, a nation of 44 million, with perhaps 100k soldiers and probably 50k LNR & DNR conscripts. Kiev has an unlimited supply of weaponry from the West since its western border with NATO is completely unfettered. Sorties per day from Russia have averaged less than 100.

"Yeah, the US is more brutal." Hundreds of allies in Kharkov are getting tortured to death right now because Russia is too nice? Miss me with this 80 IQ nonsense.

"A lot of AFU fighters are dying."

Yeah, they are. But Ukraine has 20 million men and, conservatively, 5 million men fit for duty. They keep sending human waves. They can easily recruit 500k, and they have proven the human wave strategy works. And now their morale is up.

What's the plan?

Feels almost certain that we will wake up in a few days to hear Krasny Liman, DNR, had fallen. All according to plan, the propagandists bark.

Wonder if they are actually going to take a strike on Donbass serious or not? I dont see how ukraine striking Donbass is going to be any different than these passed 200 days, maybe we might be surprised this time? Anyone want to make a poll out of this can lol?



Anyone got a date yet when that referendum will be held?

PapaDragon wrote:

mnztr wrote:....
Lets face it, even people that feel Russia is justified feel sad for the Ukrainians being forced to go to the front to get torn to pieces. its sad and ugly...

Bullshit

Only complaint I (and many others) have is that Ukrainians are not being torn to pieces in much larger numbers and at much faster pace

It's a long overdue necessary process that Russia is still dragging it's feet about



And numbers are definitely way too low, at this pace it will take at least another year before they reach 100k dead Ukrainians and they will still have half a dozen more rounds to go after that at least, it will take forever at this pace

To say nothing of the fact that only evidence of any killed Ukrainians is Konashenkov pinky promise and nothing else

No photos or videos of corpses, no funerals, no contacts with relatives of the stiffs, nothing

Not good enough

There are a lot of join Russian/ukrainian families. Other then the Azovs they see the conscripts as as victims as well. Cannon fodder

zorobabel wrote:

"Yeah, the US is more brutal." Hundreds of allies in Kharkov are getting tortured to death right now because Russia is too nice? Miss me with this 80 IQ nonsense.

How many allies did NATO abandon in Afghanistan?

Sufficient conditions for peace in Ukraine are ultimately the removal of Nazis and defeat of NATO ( by stopping supplies into Ukraine ) . The Nazis are a proxy force of NATO and the MIC in the West . A fuel embargo that targets the poor in Europe ( The wealthy can afford high prices ) or destroying civilian infrastructure in Ukraine and hoping for a social reaction against the war in either places , is wrong and targets the wrong people . The proxy Nazi force and MIC that back it are on a separate social and economic train . Only by targeting and removing the Nazis and closing border in Ukraine or targeting the interests of MIC , can minimal sufficient conditions be brought about for peace . Slow , yet methodical targeting of the Ukrainian army or then targeting of civilians is missing the target . The interests and activities of the MIC in Europe and America are legitimate targets . Investors loosing profits , when factories are smoked . People loosing fear of the Nazis, when they are smoked .

Backman wrote:

thegopnik wrote:

Heard Zelensky and his general are Jewish, Zelensky wants a 2nd israel so no idea why Putin would opposte him and most of Bidens cabinet is Jewish lets say worse case scenario that Russia lets Ukraine win. Would this entire board be pro-chinese instead since the Chinese dont have jews in goverment positions?

Surfing 4chan again ?

Its an ongoing argument. Putin and the JQ. There's something for everyone it seems

Putin Is Reviving Soviet-era Antisemitism to Crush Opposition to His War on Ukraine

In his recent address on Russian TV about Ukraine, where he red-flagged "fifth columnists" who are "traitors to the nation," Putin did not explicitly say the words "Jews," "Zionists" or "cosmopolitans." He didn't need to

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/2022-03-24/ty-article-opinion/.premium/putin-revives-soviet-era-antisemitism-to-crush-opposition-to-his-war-on-ukraine/00000180-5bb3-d615-a9bf-dff3f6d70000

That article really stretching things. Probably a Ukrainian-sponsored one.

Putin is quite obviously refering to the Navalnites in whatever it was that he said

ALAMO wrote:
That is why there are serious concerns about the forceful repatriation of working-age male Ukrainians, the only real reason why it has not been done yet is a fact that they form a huge workforce for the EU.
Without that, we will soon see the 50y/o Volksstuhrm armed with new NATO supplies, hardly knowing how to use it.

Well the EU might end up with a huge surplus workforce sooner rather than later, if they don't think of something soon to reduce inflation and lower burgeoning energy prices. Many employers will simply go out of business, and the native citizens of these countries will have to be prioritized to lap up the work that is left available.

And hence forth the Ukrainian refugees and economic migrants become expendable.

If I were a male Ukrainian in Europe between 18-50 years of age, South America would be looking pretty enticing right about now. To work and live in until this situation blows over. And I would advice them to not put the matter off, but start researching things now.

flamming_python wrote:

ALAMO wrote:
That is why there are serious concerns about the forceful repatriation of working-age male Ukrainians, the only real reason why it has not been done yet is a fact that they form a huge workforce for the EU.
Without that, we will soon see the 50y/o Volksstuhrm armed with new NATO supplies, hardly knowing how to use it.

Well the EU might end up with a huge surplus workforce sooner rather than later, if they don't think of something soon to reduce inflation and lower burgeoning energy prices. Many employers will simply go out of business, and the native citizens of these countries will have to be prioritized to lap up the work that is left available.

And hence forth the Ukrainian refugees and economic migrants become expendable.

It's a carefully engineered collapse of the EU, I presume by some bunch of oligarchs.
I am expecting some EU countries wanting to leave, and do their own thing like the UK Brexit did. Except without the song and dance.
Hungary might be the next if the EU keep trying to hurt them.

Before that, protest riots should become more frequent, and we might see a Euromaidan uprising or some other orchestrated color revolutions.
It's a good time to move to the global south.

"Iranian Shahed-136 drones delivered to Russia carried out several devastating strikes on the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the Kharkov region," writes the Wall Street Journal, citing Ukrainian commanders..

Was probably a swarm attack and hit US mercenaries in particular. This is the only way to explain why it is whined so loudly here. Two weeks earlier, the United States has made fun of non -functioning Iranian drones. Now it is howled. Are easy victims for modern Iranian drones including experienced operators. The videos of the Iranian drones were probably not taken seriously.

Backman wrote:

thegopnik wrote:

Heard Zelensky and his general are Jewish, Zelensky wants a 2nd israel so no idea why Putin would opposte him and most of Bidens cabinet is Jewish lets say worse case scenario that Russia lets Ukraine win. Would this entire board be pro-chinese instead since the Chinese dont have jews in goverment positions?

Surfing 4chan again ?

Its an ongoing argument. Putin and the JQ. There's something for everyone it seems

Putin Is Reviving Soviet-era Antisemitism to Crush Opposition to His War on Ukraine

In his recent address on Russian TV about Ukraine, where he red-flagged "fifth columnists" who are "traitors to the nation," Putin did not explicitly say the words "Jews," "Zionists" or "cosmopolitans." He didn't need to

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/2022-03-24/ty-article-opinion/.premium/putin-revives-soviet-era-antisemitism-to-crush-opposition-to-his-war-on-ukraine/00000180-5bb3-d615-a9bf-dff3f6d70000

Haaretz can go and eat swine shit. It is making the absurd logical inference that any reference to 5th columnists is always
about Jews as if only Jews are 5th columnists. I guess Lavrov and Mishustin must be 100% Slavs according to Shitretz.
Clearly Shitretz is a Washington mouthpiece propaganda organ.

Anyone who points out Nuland's criminal activity must be an anti-Semite according to Shitretz. But only Shitretz sees the
halo and angelic wings sprouting out of Nuland's back.

dionis wrote:

franco wrote:

Backman wrote:According to the order of battle Wikipedia page,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Initial_groupings:_February_2022 if you add up all the BTGs from the order of battle, you get between 39,000 to 52,000 troops.

How do you figure the number of troops out of curiosity?

800 troops per BTG... I think per Western sources.

Once you add all the other support troops, you are probably looking at double that. I use the figure of "for every 3 BTG's = 5,000 troops."

It seems the referendums are coming to Donbass, Kherson and maybe Zaporizhia too in the shortest time. Maybe the political signal to justify some fall offensive and eliminate the ukie forces that left defensive positions in those regions, we will see

Today's piece by Larry Johnson, worth reading

Did You Know that Ukrainian soldiers are “routing Russian forces and collapsing Russia’s northern Donbas axis?”

19 September 2022 by Larry Johnson 53 Comments

Nope, I did not know that. But thank God we have retired General Dave Petraeus to clue us in. He wrote the following 10 days ago:

A successful encirclement of Russian forces fleeing Izyum would result in the destruction or capture of significant Russian forces and exacerbate Russian manpower and morale issues.
The Russian MoD’s inability to admit Russian failures in Kharkiv Oblast and effectively set information conditions is collapsing the Russian information space. Kremlin-sponsored TV propagandists offered a wide range of confused explanations for Ukrainian successes ranging from justifications that Russian forces are fighting against the entire Western Bloc, to downplaying the importance of Russian ground lines of communication (GLOCS) in Kupyansk.
The withdrawal announcement further alienated the Russian milblogger and Russian nationalist communities that support the Kremlin’s grandiose vision for capturing the entirety of Ukraine. Russian milbloggers condemned the Russian MoD for remaining quiet, choosing self-isolation, and distorting situational awareness in Russia.

Turns out that General Dave experienced premature military orgasm. It is true that the Russians retreated from Izyum, but they were not surrounded. Putin has never claimed the “grandiose vision for capturing the entirety of Ukraine.” He has been quite clear–as recently as the press conference this week at the SCO–Russia is going to secure the Donbas. What about growing dissent in Russia about the SMO? Putin, based on his recent news conference at the Shanghai Cooperation Organization, could give two shits about the feelings of “the Russian milblogger and Russian nationalist communities.”

I am citing Petraeus not because I respect his alleged military “genius.” I do not not. General Dave had the reputation at West Point as the consummate sychophant. The other cadets said he would marry the Commandant’s homely daughter just to get ahead. Guess what? He did. I cite Petraeus because his views are emblematic of the Washington national security establishment who are totally committed to lying about the reality in Ukraine. No matter what the actual situation is on the ground, Ukraine is winning, Russia is losing and it is just a matter of time before Russia implodes. This theme has been trotted out and paraded around the internet almost every month since March by Ukraine’s western enablers.

The Hill just published another installment of this delusional analysis by Mark Toth and Jonathan Sweet. Let’s meet the boys:

Mark Toth is a retired economist, historian and entrepreneur who has worked in banking, insurance, publishing and global commerce. He is a former board member of the World Trade Center, St. Louis, and has lived in U.S. diplomatic and military communities around the world, including London, Tel Aviv, Augsburg and Nagoya.
https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2752375324738/hey-russia-it-s-putin-stupid?noAds=1&_f=app_share&s=i3

Jonathan Sweet, a retired Army colonel, served 30 years as a military intelligence officer. His background includes tours of duty with the 101st Airborne Division and the Intelligence and Security Command. He led the U.S. European Command Intelligence Engagement Division from 2012-14, working with NATO partners in the Black Sea and Baltics.
https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2752375324738/hey-russia-it-s-putin-stupid?noAds=1&_f=app_share&s=i3

I do not know if their article is the result of ignorance, willful blindness or if they were paid to push propaganda. Regardless of the motive, Toth and Sweet join the Petraeus club and push the objective lie that the tenacious Ukrainians are defeating the Russian army:

it is Ukrainian soldiers, equipped and trained by English-speaking countries, alongside their allies who have opened fresh cans of whoop-ass and are inflicting a beatdown of Putin’s military forces in the Donbas. . . .

There has been one constant since Putin’s illegal invasion began in February: Russia’s military forces have been forced to retreat and regroup, time and time again. . . .

Putin has been exposed as an “emperor with no clothes,” forced to rely upon haggling with Iranian and North Korean surrogates to purchase drones and, according to the New York Times, “millions of artillery shells and rockets.” Saturating social media with disinformation and excuses about why Russian ground forces are failing cannot mask the images of abandoned equipment and reports of Russian soldiers surrendering.
https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2752375324738/hey-russia-it-s-putin-stupid?noAds=1&_f=app_share&s=i3

Do you remember that incredible defeat of the Russian army in Mariupol when the Ukrainians surrounded the Russian troops and forced the surrender of 2500 combatants? Neither do I. That is what Russia did to the Ukrainian AZOV battalion.

How about the Russians fleeing in terror ahead of the Ukrainian blitzkrieg around Kherson? Nope. Another dry hole. The Russians pushed that attack back and inflicted catastrophic casualties on the Ukrainians.

What about the Luhansk People’s Republic? Ukraine held on to that and crushed the Russian backed militia. Right? Wrong!! Luhansk was secured and the same process is underway now in the Donetsk People’s Republic.

Why do western political, military and media leaders embrace demonstrable lies? I think it reflects a deeper sickness that afflicts the west. This self-delusion is not an isolated phenomena. Biden, his military commanders and the mainstream media also insist that men can be women and become pregnant, that inflation is zero, that Biden is popular, and that pedophiles are not bad people. Oh yeah, one more–the southern border of the United States is secure.

The time is coming when reality will intrude and destroy the fantasies. It happened to Baghdad Bob, who insisted there were no U.S. tanks in Baghdad in March 2003, and will happen to General Dave, Mark Toth and Jonathan Sweet. Seven months into the Russian “Special Military Operation,” Putin and his Generals have committed only a small fraction of their military forces to the conflict. They seem content to destroy Ukrainian units and equipment with artillery, missiles and mortars and force NATO to keep supplying Ukraine so that it can send its troops, armed with new equipment, to the front to be destroyed.

Yet NATO’s European members do not have the industrial capacity to replace the donated military equipment and are facing a bleak winter with scant energy resources needed to power manufacturing plants. The United States also is depleting its stockpile of weapons. Raheem Kassam has provided a very useful summary of what the United States has sent to Ukraine (read here). For example, the United States has provided Ukraine in six months more Javelins than it can produce in one year. So far the number stands at more than 8500, which is more than one-third of the U.S. total arsenal.

And how many Russian tanks have the Ukrainians destroyed with these Javelins? We do not know. The U.S. intelligence community does not know. U.S. intelligence is relying on Ukraine to report the good news and the Ukrainians simply say, “lots.” In theory, U.S. intelligence analysts have the ability to use satellite imagery to count disabled and destroyed tanks. But I am told that has not happened.

What we do have is a lot of social media video showing the Russians capturing hundreds, if not thousands, of javelin ATGMs. And we have videos of Russian tanks being hit with a javelin but continuing to operate. The javelin is not turning out to be the wonder weapon it was promised to be.

Let me reiterate one very important point–the so-called intelligence on Russian casualties in terms of personnel and equipment, is being provided solely by the Ukrainians. The United States has not taken any steps to independently verify the Ukrainian “intelligence.” That is a recipe for disappointment once the truth comes out that Ukraine is guilty of exaggerating.

https://sonar21.com/did-you-know-that-ukrainian-soldiers-are-routing-russian-forces-and-collapsing-russias-northern-donbas-axis/

LMFS wrote:It seems the referendums are coming to Donbass, Kherson and maybe Zaporizhia too in the shortest time. Maybe the political signal to justify some fall offensive and eliminate the ukie forces that left defensive positions in those regions, we will see

Yep, things seem to be in motion now.

Medvedev has already responded to the news:
"Referendums in Donbass are of great importance not only for the systemic protection of residents of the LPR, DPR and other liberated territories, but also for the restoration of historical justice"

Here in western Europe:
Zombie co-workers: "If putin is gone, everything will go back to normal"
Me: "you ever heard of Medvedev?"
Coworkers: "....who?".



We will see how this thing develops with the referendums.

Edit: Kherson and Melitopol are also going for the Referendum.

kvs wrote:

Haaretz can go and eat swine shit.   It is making the absurd logical inference that any reference to 5th columnists is always
about Jews as if only Jews are 5th columnists.    I guess Lavrov and Mishustin must be 100% Slavs according to Shitretz.  
Clearly Shitretz is a Washington mouthpiece propaganda organ.  

Anyone who points out Nuland's criminal activity must be an anti-Semite according to Shitretz.   But only Shitretz sees the
halo and angelic wings sprouting out of Nuland's back.

They are also outing themselves, since many 5th columnists are indeed jewish oligarchs. There are plenty Russians being the same kind of people who have only one nation and that is big money.
The filth from the 90's still exists and not all of them have either pledged their alliance to Russia and some are just under the coat of pseudo-patriots. You will see them showing their true face once another inside Anti-Putin/Russia demo will start.

During the 90's so many people disappeared who have been in some parties or questioned the abuse of power by oligarchs. Now, it is rather clear about who the 5th column is but time will show more and it is interesting to see that this 5th columnists even support Lebensraum 2.0 plans. No mercy upon them. They should be purged ASAP.

What is nonsense about it? Ukraine has a shit-ton of troops ready to storm Donetsk, Russia is undermanned right now and losing territory by the day.

Russia being undermanned to do what the Ukraine is doing (blindly throwing men and resources at an enemy force largely holding strong) would be the dumbest thing Russia could do... why do you think the west are speculating Putin will call a mobilisation or Putin is now defeated... neither of which reflect what is happening on the ground.

The west is desperate for Putin to leave office or for the Russians to think they have failed, which is why your bullshit is exactly what they want to hear from all of us... but even if we did and started supporting baby killing nazis... that wouldn't make any difference.

Putin will not fall no matter what the opinions shared on Russiadefence.net say...

Bozos like you who are trying to act all cool, calm and collected are the problem.

Yeah, because bleating like a goat and crying that the sky is falling is the best way to react to any problem... professional hint for you dude... when the west is encouraging panic and for Putin to be replaced that is a serious indication that they are panicking and someone is going to get replaced next election time unless they can spin this as a victory...

This is how Russian leadership is acting right now. They, along with you all, don't understand the urgency of the situation apparently.

Only the west are desperate about time... western people are more interested in the Queen being buried than the state of some nazis they are funding and supporting, which makes continuing to fund and support them harder as the price of fuel and milk and everything else goes up.

It is the west that is running out of time... winter is coming.

Easy for Europe to support Kiev against Russia because it is Russia and trillions of dollars and euros have been spent for the last 300 years painting Russia as being the bad guys... even when they were saving our asses.... against Germany twice and Japan etc etc.

But when the temperature drops and gas costs 10 times more than it did 2 years ago, then rich fat white leaders in heated and air conditioned expensive vehicles and houses who never miss a meal or a pay increase are going to be asking the general public to pay a huge price... and will be desperate for all video footage of parties the rich have over the next few years never get out... especially the nazi themed parties.

Now is not the time to think everything will magically work out in the end with the current half-assed approach. That's not how this works.

For the millionth time... the plan was never to take and hold territory, the current approach is grinding them up nicely... they worked very very hard drawing blood from stones that should not have blood to create the forces they just practically used up... if you think they will be able to do that all the time then I have a nice bridge to sell you.

Even if they could do that once a month... Russian forces didn't suffer... they manouvered and they butchered their enemy... they could do that for a long time no problems.

If Russia doesn't do what it's supposed to in time, they will lose this war and lose all credibility and legitimacy as a country along with it.

Demilitarise and denazify both means kill Orc soldiers and that is exactly what they are doing.

This is a war of hegemonic survival for the US. How do we know that the US isn't emptying prisons across the EU and US , shipping them to Ramstein and then bringing them to the front ?
There is already lots of Polish speaking fighters , English speakers and African American ppl spotted on the battlefield.

So what if they are?

What sort of training allows you to defeat Russian artillery and air power?

Yeah....let Ukraine take Mariupol and try to retake it back? Are you fucking serious? How fucking moronic can you be lol?

Nobody said let them take anything of value.

They wont let them take the nuclear power plant.

So donbass is going to be annexed to lol. NovoRussia is no longer a joke I guess.

Annexed? No. That would be the islands of Guam, or Golan heights in Syria or Kosovo... you know.... where the people do not get a referendum or vote on the matter and some other power just seizes it.

Its an illusion to think time is on your side in any war. You have no control as to what the other side is up to or what weapons NATO is providing them.

Do you honestly believe there is a HATO weapon that will defeat Russian forces and make them retreat to the borders?

The decision to surrender is for Kiev and Kiev alone, Russia has no control of that and bombing the shit out of the country and murdering lots of civilians will just make them move their government to Poland officially and then push their own people to fight to the death.

What if Ukraine with the help of the USA develops longer range cruise missiles and starts hitting cities in Russia. Its really not that hard. A Turkish drone can go 4000 km, what the Ukrainians modify it and send it on autonomous bombing missions in Russia? Yeah pinpricks I know, but politically?

Putin has already said an escalation into Russia like that using long range weapons would be a problem... I would say HATO sources of support would become legitimate targets, but that is my opinion... but do you appreciate if Putin already mobilised and stepped shit up there would be nothing more he could do if they did start supplying tomahawks etc.

Ukraine believes they are in a full scale war already.

For them it is, but their allies it is a nice proxy war where they lend lease shit they will end up demanding payment for from someone... making this free for them... except as energy prices and food prices go up it is not free at all.

The west provoked this whole war to give them to room to sanction Russia and it failed. Russia mobilizing another 100,000 troops is not going to tank the economy either.

With the planned tactics they are using 100K more troops make no sense at all, you don't mobilise troops and have them sitting doing nothing.

The west started all this because they want Putin gone and Russia made weak and open to being exploited by their big companies... well notice the west keeps mentioning there is no end to the sanctions till the war ends... most western companies made good money in Russia... they were not there to help Russia by spreading western culture... they were there to make money and when this conflict ends they will mostly want to go back in and recover some of their losses... they make more money in Russia than in the west.

They failed to get Putin removed and to destroy the Russian economy and their sanctions are damaging their own economies... food, fertiliser... cheap energy is critical to German industry... what happens to the EU if Germany gets broken?

This isn't a spat or a disagreement... it is the west that is keeping this war going, extending the agony of the people of the Ukraine funding nazis who are so keen to kill any pro Russian of any nationality or race...

This is a war with the west, and Putin needs to avoid it becoming nuclear... which means only escalating when needed and when useful... otherwise the minimum force that gets the job done minimises Russian losses.

The US thinks that shelling civilians if it gets bad enough, will bring Russia to the negotiating table (to neg Minsk 3 so that they can build another army and try to take everything back including Crimea in the future)

Russia knows negotiations with Kiev are pointless and useless... as Minsk 1 and Minsk 2 show very clearly... Zelensky is not going to survive the war... but Ukrainians have to remove him... not Russia.

The only thing that will stop it is pushing the Nazi regime 300 kilometers west. And snuffing it out in Kiev.

Ironically that is the beauty... the longer the range missiles the west gives the Ukraine the further Orc forces have to be pushed back from friendly territories to achieve safety.

The longer this takes the worse the deal Russia will offer Kiev.

Heard Zelensky and his general are Jewish, Zelensky wants a 2nd israel so no idea why Putin would opposte him and most of Bidens cabinet is Jewish lets say worse case scenario that Russia lets Ukraine win. Would this entire board be pro-chinese instead since the Chinese dont have jews in goverment positions?

Someone with a Jewish name does not make them Jewish, and Zelensky was selected because he is a trained entertainer... some of the scripts he gets from Washington need real talent to read out publicly, and of course he is Jewish so the west can claim there can't be nazis in the Ukrainian military or government because their president is jewish... that is like suggesting any black people got shot or any racism happened in the US during Obamas time as president... never happened.

But Wiki BBC ect have an interest in overstating the number of Russian troops in Ukraine. Not understating it.

Over stated or under stated... what makes you think they even know... or care?

In his recent address on Russian TV about Ukraine, where he red-flagged "fifth columnists" who are "traitors to the nation," Putin did not explicitly say the words "Jews," "Zionists" or "cosmopolitans." He didn't need to

He didn't need to because we are making this shit up... it is like Henry Kissenger never said.... the US is evil and make her your friend at your peril...

How many allies did NATO abandon in Afghanistan?

They used murder bots to kill a man and his children who worked for them in an over reaction to an attack by ISIS... a group they support in Syria...

We will see how this thing develops with the referendums.

Edit: Kherson and Melitopol are also going for the Referendum.

Zelensky has said no negotiations are possible if regions hold referendums and decide to join the RF... so this is good.