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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sat Jun 03, 2023 7:31 am

    Example is AC-130 which is such a stupid concept that works because its used inside a doctrine. If there is any sort of normal AA around, AC-130 is parked 5000 miles away.

    Quite a few AC-130s and older versions of the gunship type have been shot down with MANPADS... they are horribly vulnerable...

    The potential skirmish with NATO is going to look way different than this Russo-Ukrainian land war.

    Russia needs a zero tolerance policy against HATO because they ignore red lines and escalate as a natural response to anything and nothing.

    Russia won't need tactical nukes against NATO

    Ukraine has much greater manpower, and Russia is handling Ukraine with a fraction of the force size it would use against NATO

    What I am saying is that if Poland enters the Ukraine or threatens Kaliningrad... if Russia tries a balanced and measured response the US and other HATO countries will see that as weakness and send in other military forces into the Ukraine to protect the western parts of the country, perhaps including British troops or French or US or German or a mixed force... Russia could demand they leave or be attacked directly, but nuking them would send a clearer message... who cares about the west of the Ukraine?

    It is probably going to be the neutral broken portion... I suspect the west continues to support Kiev expecting Russia would never try to occupy that area so either Poland or Romania is going to get a piece of it.

    Russia has no need for nukes, NATO if anything would resort to first nuclear use after losing planes as S400 kills those f16, f18, and f35

    Well someone is going to use them, and it might as well be Russia...

    If Russia had done nothing at all and let Kiev attack on the 8th of March 2022 who knows what sort of damage they might have inflicted.... they might have launched an all out strike on the Black Sea fleet and actually done some real damage.

    Don't hold back and wait for an attack... if you know it is coming eventually then hitting them first and hard might mean the future attack might never come or be greatly weakened from the damage you did.

    Best to be prepared for doomsday scenarios, but I don’t see why NATO would involve themselves directly at this point.

    They have told their people that Russia is weak and is losing... what happens when they are wrong... because they are never wrong.

    It will take a change in government in the US to end this conflict... it is Bidens war... he has been driving it for a decade... look at the footprints:

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 16624110

    Nato aircraft will probably fire at Russia and use the alleged Ukraine F-16's as an excuse. But if Russia attacks anything in Poland in return , they will enact article 5 and jump into the war.

    They will try to shoot at Russians but they are not looking for any excuse to get directly involved... if that was the case they would already have engineered that.

    The US embassy and everything. Hitting the US embassy inside Ukraine is still not the act of war that hitting anything in Poland is.

    The US embassy is patently not an embassy... and because of this is a legitimate target that should have been hit a long time ago.

    Russia can say they were using old maps and thought it was something else because of all the communications and other things that would not be expected at a legitimate embassy...

    That has been the story of the whole war and because of Putins lack of response, he is basically getting the Nato war to take Crimea that he wanted to avoid 10 years from now, today. This war was started to avoid that scenario and he's basically getting that today.

    This conflict is bleeding the west dry and the US is so keen to shift focus to Taiwan and China... if it wasn't costing Russian soldiers and civilians their lives it would be genius, but as it is it is probably still the best course of action to take for the moment.

    Doing the counter offensive during the Nato exercise has probably been the plan all along.

    At the end of the day for Russia it does not really matter... when the counter offensive starts... crush it as brutally and quickly as possible and then decide whether to go on the offensive yourself or try something different.

    Give him some space, one does not become a drama queen with no practice, you know.

    Everyone should be allowed to give their opinion and discuss with others... who can honestly say they know exactly what is going to happen... because I doubt even Zelensky or Biden or Putin even know.

    People, if you think that the Russians will allow the demolition of buildings in Moscow or St. Peterburg, then you are very ridiculous.

    The video evidence is buildings being demolished in the US of A...

    Poland has decided to back down from supplying Ukraine F-16s

    They decided they don't have enough but other F-16 users should donate theirs they say.... hahaha...

    Just curious, what does hitting the US embassy in Kiev achieve for the Russians?

    They have several thousand people working there... it is probably the Kiev government in exile in a place they think the Russians wont attack and is probably what is actually running the country and the war.

    Has nothing to do with being a pussy, and rather not wishing nuclear death upon the world but hey.....you know, I guess if the lives of billions of innocents of civilians mean nothing for you to make a "statement" well sure go ahead.

    The wests policy of continual escalation can only lead to the eventual use of nuclear weapons because the west is too powerful and too dominant according to all the western news media to lose or to even back down.

    Thousands of innocent people have been getting killed in that place for the best part of the last decade and the west didn't give a shit so why should they care about the use of nuclear weapons?

    Frankly, Russia will never ever ever ever ever ever attack NATO directly, it because that would force wartime economies and direct conflict and russia doesn't have the manpower for that period.

    And that is why they have to, because the west thinks they never will and can just escalate forever till Russia gives up... you know... like they did at Stalingrad and Leningrad and Kursk...


    Attacking NATO would be an absolutely idiotic thing to do, better for the russians if they just keep it how it is, let NATO supply keiv with peacetime economies that aren't meant to build up massive quantities of weapons quickly and simply never pull nato forces into the fight.

    Yes, wait for the killer bees to come to you and don't go looking for the hives... that would suit the west just perfectly... but why would Russia want to play that stupid game?

    The country has been run out of the US embassy since 2014. If you really want to throw a wrench into the daily goings of the regime in Kiev, you vaporize the US and British embassies

    They probably are the government and be running the war too...

    You have been obsessed with the destruction of the American embassy in Kiev for months.... Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
    If by any chance there is a terrorist attack on the American embassy in Kiev, we will know that Backman is involved...

    He is not wrong... if Russia eventually decides to decapitate the Kiev government a couple of Kh-32s and Kinzhals hitting the US embassy would probably get the job done... for the same reason Orc HQs are so often found in schools and hospitals and Churches.

    hmm attacking US embassy could be in Libya but then whos to bomb? as for Kiev's embassy - yes country is run bey US but bombing "edge server" doesn't kill cloud. I mean decision makers on local level perhaps are in Kiev, surely not most important tones and giving "go". That's why bombing intel or AAD bunkers is much better strategy.

    They will think the US embassy is the only safe place in Kiev, which is why Russia should hit it hard.

    All weapons systems designed to target and destroy enemy nuclear and command capability in a massive first strike.

    Actually Poseidon and Thunderbird are designed to hit after both sides have attacked each other.... it is the west that plans for a first strike with the hope they get most f their nuclear weapon potential and can use ABM systems to survive the reduced response attack.

    Um buddy, I guess you do not know this but attacks on an Embassy are considered attacks on the country itself and it is legally recognized any attack on an Embassy is a defacto declaration of war.

    Except when you claim you are using old maps...

    Granted the country attacked can decide what to do from that point but there is a reason countries do not attack each other embassies.

    Your country does attack embassies...

    I think they would almost have to pull at least 2 or 3 Gs to assure a clean release at M2.6. But yeah it could have tiny pop out wings and it should fly a loooong way. quite cheap and v accurate. 1.5T would be utterly devastating and the MIG 31 could deliver 6 hammer blows per flight.

    The wing and belly weapon points on the MiG-31 contain pneumatic arms for the R-33 heavy missiles they normally carry and those arms throw the weapon down away from the aircraft to ensure they get clear before their rocket motors light up and accelerate the missiles away from the aircraft.

    Most likely they would try a zoom climb to toss release the bombs for max reach and speed, but a glide kit modified for such conditions could remain folded and low drag for the initial portion of the flight and then the wings could deploy in a swept form for the supersonic portion of the flight at very high altitude and high speed to maintain altitude and speed as much as possible and as it slows down the wings could sweep further to be less swept and more straight for better lift to maximise flight speed and delivery range.

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    ALAMO


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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43

    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 03, 2023 9:13 am

    d_taddei2 wrote:
    Arming the general civilian population and arming volunteer territorial defense battalions are two different things the former is a state of panic that's exactly what they did in Ukraine and it was a disaster. I see nothing wrong with arming such volunteer forces it's not a sign of weakness but rather sign of pride and wanting to protect their region from Nazi scumbags. It's far better this being organized at government level with government support than civilians taking matters into their own hands and walking around thinking they are John Rambo with a shotgun or hunting rifle. This force they have created of 3,100 should be good enough for any Ukrainian incursion into Russia normally in numbers a 10th of this force. I do see any panic in Russia they are certainly not desperate. Ukraine on the other hand is in fullscale panic mode.
    Might I add these volunteer forces are more like security forces protecting the region if any serious forces came into Russia they would alert the military. But small incursions can be dealt with small arms, mortars, Rpg, KPV, spg-9, ATGW. I am pretty sure you could train a volunteer force to operate older artillery pieces D-20, T-12 and other 122mm pieces. A good mine field and tank obstacles alone with some drones and that would be sufficient.

    I guess you are missing some important points here.
    First, voluntary battalions of self-defence exists in Russia for at least two decades. Organized and paid by local authorities.
    Second, there are tons of paramilitary organizations there, you can join at any single moment.
    Third, you have a Rosgvardia, formed back in 2016 and replacing the MVD troops - you can enlist any single moment.
    Fourth, you have hunting assemblies with armed people - actually individual weapon in Russia is quite common. what is a joke is a fact, that it is easier to have a shotgun or magazine fed "hunting rifle" rather than a pistol Laughing
    My only guess is, that people who are talking about "arming civilians" have no single idea how those structures are constructed.
    Only Rosgvardia's size now is about 400 000 people.
    You have a dedicated, FSB-organized Border Service with close to 200 000 personnel.

    There is no case of Russia lacking manpower to deal with anything like that, and we have not considered a regular army yet Laughing

    That reminded me of an answer that Hitler gave to The Times correspondent once.

    Sir, what would you do, if the British would send a landing forces?
    I would ask the police to arrest them.


    Again, all the people who are whining about arming the civilians, are nothing more than panickers and panic mongers.
    Or have no idea how complex are the Russian internal forces build to deal with this kind of danger.

    Ukroisis is staging psyops, because they can't do anything else.
    This psyops hits the fertile wombs of some useful idiots, who spread the panic further.

    And no, no nukes. Sorry.

    GarryB wrote:
    It will take a change in government in the US to end this conflict... it is Bidens war... he has been driving it for a decade... look at the footprints:
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 16624110

    It is much more than that, and Biden, along with all those monsters, is only a tool in a hands of bigger fishes.
    You can start with all the shell gas studies carried in Ukraine 20 years ago.
    Donbas has great deposits of it, but there is only one problem.
    It is heavily urbanized, and occupied by millions of people who needs an access to the fresh water etc.
    The very first leaks how the local population is irrelevant assisted the Orange Revolution already - we are in the second half of the 00s.
    It was nobody else than Tymoshenko, taped by discussing of how to "get rid off" the unnecessary local population.

    Every single event in Ukraine is getting more and more clear if we follow the money.

    For example, years of anti-Polish de facto politics that was part of the agenda for almost two decades.
    It is getting much easier to understand, if we know that Mr. Kwasniewski was born&breed in Bialogard - a huge accumulation of the Vistula Plan core Ukrainian repatriates.
    And how he became a board member of Burisma shortly after ending his second presidential term.

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    Post  Arrow Sat Jun 03, 2023 9:59 am

    Su-24 armed with two British Storm Shadow.


    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 Fxq-CIVWXw-AYf0c-T

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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Jun 03, 2023 10:15 am

    After this picture posted by ARROW with a Su-24 aircraft and two Storm Shadow missiles I remembered that the Poles have Su-22 aircraft and I am convinced that the Poles will hand over those aircraft to the Ukroshitstan AF.
    I'm sure Ukroshitstan AF doesn't have many Su-24s left.

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sat Jun 03, 2023 1:08 pm

    Rybar on his TG was speculating about Kiev intel arrival. 2 missiles one hit building to block entrances the second near river to flood underground part...
    pretty cruel Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil





    GarryB wrote:
    GD wrote:
    hmm attacking US embassy could be in Libya but then whos to bomb? as for Kiev's embassy - yes country is run bey US but bombing "edge server" doesn't kill cloud. I mean decision makers on local level perhaps are in Kiev, surely not most important tones and giving "go". That's why bombing intel or AAD bunkers is much better strategy.

    They will think the US embassy is the only safe place in Kiev, which is why Russia should hit it hard.


    morally I agree with you, luckily Russian leadership calculates cold headed their decisions Smile







    mnztr wrote:
    GarryB wrote:

    A toss release from 18km altitude at mach 2.6 would be interesting, but I doubt existing glide kits could be used at such speeds and at such altitudes...

    [

    I think they would almost have to pull at least 2 or 3 Gs  to assure a clean release at M2.6. But yeah it could have tiny pop out wings and it should fly a loooong way. quite cheap and v accurate. 1.5T would be utterly devastating and the MIG 31 could deliver 6 hammer blows per flight.

    but why to even consider MiG-25?! spare parts, life cycle over or almost over , lack of mechanics or pilots? Su-34 is in serial production and there are mechanics and pilots trained, a modern plane. 8tons of payload.

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 03, 2023 1:21 pm

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:Rybar on his TG  was speculating about Kiev intel arrival. 2 missiles one hit building to block entrances the second near river to flood underground part...
    pretty cruel  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil

    The one that hit the river next to the bridge was a falling Patriot actually.

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    Post  Big_Gazza Sat Jun 03, 2023 1:36 pm

    Kiev air defenses getting a nice big smack down, which then responds by hitting its own buildings with a failed response Razz

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Jun 03, 2023 1:55 pm

    Not a smile today but a bloody good laugh Laughing Laughing

    Imagine the potential ear damage from firing from this position.

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    Post  VARGR198 Sat Jun 03, 2023 2:21 pm

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    Post  GarryB Sat Jun 03, 2023 4:06 pm

    morally I agree with you, luckily Russian leadership calculates cold headed their decisions

    My real point is that those complaining that this war will go on for ten years and become a terrorist war that Russia can never win, well they have options they have not used yet to break the other side that they can use if things start to go bad for them... there will be plenty of targets they have not gone after because they are not evil like the west who would have gone full retard on the first night.

    but why to even consider MiG-25?! spare parts, life cycle over or almost over , lack of mechanics or pilots? Su-34 is in serial production and there are mechanics and pilots trained, a modern plane. 8tons of payload.

    The MiG-25RB was a high speed high altitude bomber and the MiG-31BM had tests in that direction too where high speed high altitude release of bombs specially designed to be released at mach 2 plus speeds and high altitudes to cover large distances and hit area targets... to be clear they weren't that accurate, so targets like Oil storage sites and fuel dumps and ammo dumps and large warehouses and factories would be targets but certainly not bridges or point targets... but now with modern glide kits adding guidance with modifications for height and speed of release could make it an excellent stand off weapon system, but the MiG-25RBs are gone... and are not coming back... their engines are no longer in production... you would need to use MiG-31s instead.

    Imagine the potential ear damage from firing from this position

    And two targets overlapping so a good burst of fire could kill both of them...

    If he is really sick of the terrorism BS from Zelensky maybe he thinks it is time to change... get rid of Zelensky and also the US embassy all at once... they have the weapons proven able to get through and penetrate deeply buried defences... and they don't seem to be running out of such weapons any time soon.


    Last edited by GarryB on Sat Jun 03, 2023 4:33 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Belisarius Sat Jun 03, 2023 4:21 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 Img_2295
    Russia is spending surprisingly little on its war on Ukraine

    The direct fiscal cost of the war — spending on soldiers and machines — is estimated to be about 3% of Russia's GDP, or roughly $67 billion a year, according to the report mentioned in Business Insider.

    This is about a quarter of what the West is throwing at Russia.

    So who can last longer in this conflict?

    @DDGeopolitics

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sat Jun 03, 2023 4:24 pm

    GarryB wrote:My real point is that those complaining that this war will go on for ten years and become a terrorist war that Russia can never win, well they have options they have not used yet to break the other side that they can use if things start to go bad for them... there will be plenty of targets they have not gone after because they are not evil like the west who would have gone full retard on the first night.


    Terrorist war you win beheading regime first. You cannot do it without bombing Washington nor London or New Zealand (where US oligarchs prepared bunkers to survive nuclear war lol1 lol1 lol1 Smile . So there will be no bombing. Bombing embassy is PR action nothing really changing military situation.


    However bombing Kiev intel bunker or Lvov aad coordination bunker actually eliminated a great deal embassy workers anyway



    GB wrote:
    but why to even consider MiG-25?! spare parts, life cycle over or almost over , lack of mechanics or pilots? Su-34 is in serial production and there are mechanics and pilots trained, a modern plane. 8tons of payload.

    The MiG-25RB was a high speed high altitude bomber and the MiG-31BM had tests in that direction too where high speed high altitude release of bombs specially designed to be released at mach 2 plus speeds and high altitudes to cover large distances and hit area targets... with modern glide kits adding guidance with modifications for height and speed of release could make it an excellent stand off weapon system, but the MiG-25RBs are gone... you would need to use MiG-31s instead.

    again but why Russian's should invest in old tech when there is Grom with up to 100km range?! if you need something longer then CM would be better or Iskander (or Iranian missile) . Both Groms and Su-34 are in mass production.





    GB wrote: If he is really sick of the terrorism BS from Zelensky maybe he thinks it is time to change... get rid of Zelensky and also the US embassy all at once...

    wait for Hunter crackhead to be there ok?

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sat Jun 03, 2023 4:27 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Not a smile today but a bloody good laugh Laughing Laughing

    Imagine the potential ear damage from firing from this position.

    stop with this homophobic remarks, will ya? dont you see this is Ukro Pride Parade preparation? lol1 lol1 lol1

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    Post  GarryB Sat Jun 03, 2023 5:08 pm

    Terrorist war you win beheading regime first.

    Killing off the primary politicians in Kiev is step one... it is OK because anyone Russia could deal with has already been banned from elections so the guys they kill are nazis or work with nazis.

    You cannot do it without bombing Washington nor London or New Zealand

    Biden wont get reelected and London is irrelevant.

    (where US oligarchs prepared bunkers to survive nuclear war

    The ones coming here didn't do their homework properly.... if they did their due dilligence and watched a documentary about the locals called "Once were Warriors" they would find somewhere else to hide... some of the locals would like white meat in WWIII...

    Bombing embassy is PR action nothing really changing military situation.

    The US embassy has thousands of employees and is probably running the country... taking it out would cripple Kievs war effort and decentralise it to the point where the Ukrainian forces would collapse and the Russians could send in a mopping up force to deal with most of them.

    However bombing Kiev intel bunker or Lvov aad coordination bunker actually eliminated a great deal embassy workers anyway

    Other similar targets remain and require being hit.

    again but why Russian's should invest in old tech when there is Grom with up to 100km range?! if you need something longer then CM would be better or Iskander (or Iranian missile) . Both Groms and Su-34 are in mass production.

    Grom has a less than 500kg warhead in the 120km range version and about a 700kg warhead in the 60km all bomb model... the MiG-31 can deliver 1.5 ton bombs from altitudes and speeds that Groms are not released from and probably couldn't handle being released from, which suggests they could reach much greater ranges while being unpowered but also guided... and the kinetic energy of such bombs would be multiplied several times because of the speed and altitude of release when stand off range is not so critical.

    It would be a relatively cheap way to hit 6 strong targets or one strong target multiple times with a very powerful munition.

    wait for Hunter crackhead to be there ok?

    Call a meeting 3 stories down where it is "safe" and invite all the American politicians kids and also Boris Johnson and the whole Rada because it is such an important occasion...

    stop with this homophobic remarks, will ya? dont you see this is Ukro Pride Parade preparation?

    Actually it reminded me of Lord Blackadder when he was insulting Lord Percy... "he rides a horse rather less well than another horse would..."

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Jun 03, 2023 6:06 pm

    I've been wondering about this for a few days now as another very senior Kiev military man, so often on social media, suddenly goes AWOL.

    Was he in his office in his bunker when the roof fell in?

    Theresa 🇷🇺 🇳🇬
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    An intriguing post has surfaced online. Perhaps in this way readers are being prepared for a massive campaign against Budanov?  

    Ukrainian media burying Budanov


    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 Fxs_0jDXgAEIxcB?format=jpg&name=small

    Meanwhile the other one also gets 'minimised', was he in his 'office' too?.

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    Yermak belittled the importance of Zaluzhny.

    Yermak said in an interview that all military decisions are made at headquarters, and Zaluzhny has only one vote. That is, it is just a statistical unit

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    Post  mnztr Sat Jun 03, 2023 6:21 pm

    Godric wrote:

    Poland has decided to back down from supplying Ukraine F-16s

    Polands F-16s are C/D which is somewhat viable. The ones the others want to give are clapped out ancient F-16s that are much older versions. The last one was delivered in 1992. Probably cheaper then dismantling them. Better to spread F-16 fragments all over Ukraine.

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Sat Jun 03, 2023 6:46 pm

    gunship democracy wrote:yes they can but I don't think there will be any non nuclear confrontation between NATO and Russia. There simply wont be time to switch to war economy like in wwII

    not sure where you are taking your data from? FIRE based economy doesn't mean there are no industrial base or specialists. Are you suggesting that there are no cars, ships, machine tooling or robots manufactured? compare to Russian output.

    not yet but as covid proved this can be overcomed.

    if population will be mobilized then who is going to produce equipment? Mind NATO population si 3-4times size of Russia's one...

    not sure how long have you been living in the USA but do you have any numbers ?

    Unlike you (being too optimistic to see) I believe that NATO is a serious threat to Russia otherwise why Russian govt were so prudent and cautious with actions? Russian army never said to my knowledge that NATO is no danger.

    There is time to switch to war economy, in fact Russia is doing so already ramping production of all weapons across the board, while maintain low inflation for civilian life - it means nuclear war will not be a first resort, a conventional war is very possible

    A FIRE based economy like the US has, means major loss of industrial production, we talk about Norfolk and Huntington Ingalls being the last vestiges of the industrial powerhouse the US was in ww2, they have no way to regain this capability in the next 20 years without reforming the economy, and moving 70% of the service based economy (waiters, salespeople, white collar , back into manufacturing) -

    military recruiting is low , you cannot teach welders, fitters, CNC operators, painters, electricians in 10 years, on an industrial scale, you need will and desire of the populace to do this, you cannot do it when your elite is pushing transhuman agenda either, as a whole its beyond reform, it's a top down change of politics, mentality and culture, the west undergoes this process since 1970s/80s , you cannot reverse 40 years of liberalization and demoralization in 10 or even 20 years, the cultural state of Russia on the other hand, breeds a whole other approach to mobilization -

    case in point Russia mobilized 300,000 men in less than 6 months, with barely any oppostion, the population will go to war without a question asked and with rigid social structure, it's a different mindset

    So Russians have more people who are willing to tolerate what a total war means, then the west has

    Look at LIMA tank factory, the loss of personnel means loss in production, building a tesla or a hyundai is not the same as assembling complex transmissions, engines, armor, chassis and suspensions, this knowledge is gone, the young guys in USA can barely perform oil changes on LAV-25, let alone operate a steel plant

    -----

    Russian mobilization resulted not only in military personnel, but all factories are swelling with workers,

    You think EU or US civilians receiving stipends and welfare will go work for a sweatshop? They barely have people signing up for white collar jobs with 60+ hour work weeks, and you think they will stand in a tank factory , for 12 hour shifts?

    NATO population is mostly services based, liberal, and opposed to meaningfully taking any action to stop the decline of their states

    They are not ready for a war with Russia

    As I said, Poland and Ukraine represent the states most akin to a 1940s western state, and Ukraine was devastated in total war, against a peacetime Russia

    A NATO - Russia war would result in catastrophy for the west, our guys who are 20-30 years of age, would eat an American 20 year old, or a European one

    It's mindset, culture, and mobilization potential

    Which neither US, french, Canada, Germans, Swedes, Italians, or any other western state in NATO have

    Their soldiers mourn 1 guy lost in a Platoon and go into PTSD mode, ours lose whole Squads and companies and are barely moved

    The Ukrainians are like us, and thats why mobilization in both countries was possible - look at western mercenaries , they rotate after 1 month in Kharkov

    Russian and Ukrainian troops are serving upwards of 6 months without rotation in Bakhmut, Ugledar, Mariupol, and other battles

    There is no comparison, and that is why Poland and Ukraine are the real fighting core of NATO

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    Post  sepheronx Sat Jun 03, 2023 6:58 pm

    The push for also automation in Russian MIC has resulted in less need for tons of people to do same job. So they are able to churn out more without hurting civil economy as the Civil economy is still rather strong in manpower and able to produce the Civil goods that's needed.

    I guess what also helps is that the defense companies have expanded into Civil industry so they get even more money.

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    Post  Broski Sat Jun 03, 2023 7:00 pm

    Arkanghelsk wrote:There is no comparison, and that is why Poland and Ukraine are the real fighting core of NATO
    Before this war is over, Poland is going to cross a big, fat, red line (attacking Russian troops, dropping B61's on Russian positions) and Russia is going to completely destroy their country in retaliation. They don't yet realize that the Ukro-retards have been handled with kid gloves but there's no ethnic Russians for the poles to hide behind in Poland. Article 5 sure as shit won't save them either, they'll learn the hard way.

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    Post  Sujoy Sat Jun 03, 2023 7:31 pm

    The regular drone strikes in Moscow/Russia are a major concern because the targets seem to be innocent citizens and not the Russian military.

    Russian authorities need to investigate the role played by any foreign reporter based in Russia in facilitating these strikes. During Gulf War I & II, reporters from CNN and BBBC used to laze targets that allowed US warplanes to hit those targets

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    Post  Odin of Ossetia Sat Jun 03, 2023 8:09 pm

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:A wise man never underestimates his enemy, only a fool does.

    He is right to respect their capacity, it shows he understands his enemy, where as your bias is blinding you

    If you where in a command position with that attitude you'd get men needlessly killed




    Only that Prigozhin is not wise, he is a fool.


    It is he who freed 100 Ukrainian prisoners-of-war as a goodwill gesture for the Eastern Orthodox Easter, only to shortly afterwards have his own captured troops killed by their Ukrainian captors.


    Ukraine is so powerful because they have been massively gifted with a huge array of weapons by other countries, have the best NATO military advisers helping them, have a Russian leadership that is easy on them, have the backing of majority of the most influential countries in the world, have for decades enjoyed a preferential treatment from Russia, even have their past war crimes either entirely covered up or "watered down" by a really stupid Czech president and the Western propaganda and mass media establishment.

    I could go on and on.



    http://michalw.narod.ru/index-Truth.html


    http://asaland.proboards.com/thread/460/land-zamosc-zamojszczyzna-1942-1944






    And also ethnic Ukrainian sabotage and fifth column activity in the Russian armed forces and government.




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    Post  Arkanghelsk Sat Jun 03, 2023 8:46 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    The push for also automation in Russian MIC has resulted in less need for tons of people to do same job. So they are able to churn out more without hurting civil economy as the Civil economy is still rather strong in manpower and able to produce the Civil goods that's needed.

    I guess what also helps is that the defense companies have expanded into Civil industry so they get even more money

    Automation plays a big role, but there are guys coming into the workforce who are able to obtain trade jobs out of school and get paid well and who are working long shifts

    The naval sector leaves a lot to be desired, but the willingness of the population to get to work is there, and the naval sector will improve when the circumstance demands it, just like tanks, missiles, drones, jets are demanded now and are pumped out same as Agricultural products, and civilian replacements for western business demanded it

    And not only, if your name is called in a draft, it is a duty which must be performed - the number of guys who fled to Georgia or Turkey are there, but I doubt any other state with the exception of middle eastern cultures , would be able to mobilize on the scale of Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Kazakhs and other states is very different

    Indians, Chinese,  Pakistanis would also do so, and those cultures have vertical hierarchies with rigid social structures as well, and the liberal ideology does not have fertile ground to spread there

    But I am happy Russia has rejected it, and come together as a stronger society

    Russians harness slowly, but drive fast

    Or slowly, then suddenly

    As for the EU Or US? good luck getting those kids to work at Raytheon, Boeing, or Norfolk, or to sign up for the military - there's no patriotism there, and the elite is so disconnected from the average person, they still think that sex changes and black representation is more important than Mechanical Engineering, Physics, or Math

    Actually , it's not a lack of interest, it is that those things are racist , those countries have a lot to solve before going to war with Russia

    I think the Swedes are figuring out if it is okay to have 2 dads

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Jun 03, 2023 9:56 pm

    Broski wrote:
    Before this war is over, Poland is going to cross a big, fat, red line (attacking Russian troops, dropping B61's on Russian positions)

    Stupid comment. How will they do that? You are aware that they need modified aircraft and access to B-61, neither of which they have? So steal German Tornadoes, or Dutch/Belgium/Italian/Turkish upgraded F-16? Then how do they get the launch/arm codes from the US?

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    Post  Regular Sat Jun 03, 2023 10:03 pm

    Because Poland is suicidal. Because Poland totally didn’t shit their pants when 2 farmers got killed and Ukraine started pointing fingers to Russia. 

    Poland has government that is using Russia as a threat to consolidate the power and some political independence in EU while still getting German and US money. They might act like rabid dogs, but they are pragmatic (unlike Baltic countries)

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    Post  Hole Sat Jun 03, 2023 10:24 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #43 - Page 34 Fxts_z10
    Totchka with cluster warhead was shot down over Berdyansk.

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