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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #11

    Erk
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    Post  Erk 11/04/22, 07:10 pm

    Looks like the chemical weapons false flags have started.

    https://www.rt.com/russia/553716-ukraine-chemical-weapons-azov/

    Ukraine's neo-Nazi Azov Battalion has accused Russian forces of deploying a chemical weapon against its fighters during the siege on Mariupol, potentially creating a pretext for the US and its Western allies to step up efforts to punish Moscow over the conflict.

    An unidentified chemical agent was dropped from a drone on Monday, leaving several Ukrainian fighters in the area struggling to breathe, according to unverified accusations posted on Telegram by the ultranationalist Azov Battalion.

    “A poisonous substance of unknown origin” was used, the militants claimed, allegedly leaving three fighters suffering mild respiratory issues, dizziness and headaches.

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    Post  ATLASCUB 11/04/22, 07:22 pm

    Link to Zelensky's order?
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    Post  Arkanghelsk 11/04/22, 07:39 pm

    Python I do get the feeling that mobilization is coming

    Austrian Chancellor Karl Nehammer walked away from his meeting on Monday with Russian President Vladimir Putin convinced that sanctions aren’t weakening the Kremlin’s determination to resolve the Donbass crisis before ending the military offensive in Ukraine.

    “He clearly confirmed that the sanctions are tough for Russia but the situation in Donbass, as he said, must be, so to say, resolved, despite the sanctions – even if they are quite tangible,” Nehammer told reporters following the meeting at Putin’s residence outside Moscow, as cited by Tass.

    The talks marked Putin’s first in-person meeting with an EU leader since the Russian attack on Ukraine began in February. While Nehammer had said he hoped to “build bridges” by traveling to Moscow, he told reporters afterward that “I generally have no optimistic impression that I can report to you from this conversation with President Putin.”

    After pulling back its forces from around Kiev, Russia is preparing an offensive in eastern Ukraine “on a massive scale,” Nehammer claimed. Putin sees the war as necessary to defend Russian national security and mistrusts an international community that he considers “one-sided,” the chancellor said.

    The commander in chief has the final say

    Wel see where it goes , but I do feel with the Ukrainian problem, and the attacks they plan that there will be an escalation , Russia has no choice now


    Last edited by Arkanghelsk on 11/04/22, 07:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Erk 11/04/22, 07:41 pm

    ATLASCUB wrote:Link to Zelensky's order?

    https://tass.com/society/1436119

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    Post  sepheronx 11/04/22, 07:43 pm

    In order for Ukraine to attack Belgorod, it has to have an army first.  And to be frank, they already have attacked.

    I'm kind of surprised so many people on this forums fall for these simple proclamations.  The point of it is to make it look like Ukraine is winning this battle and has a force to be able to attack. It's a game to the politicians in the west and to Zelensky. The borders have been recently reinforced with the national guard whom is better trained and equipped than what Ukraine has.

    But they (Ukraine) doesn't have a force in the east that can attack. Best they got is some missiles to lob or a helicopter or two to attempt second attack like before.

    Anyway, the battle still rages on and Russia still gaining positions.  The rest are words from politicians.


    Last edited by sepheronx on 11/04/22, 07:44 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  PapaDragon 11/04/22, 07:43 pm

    Arkanghelsk wrote:Python I do get the feeling that mobilization is coming

    You don't need mobilization, you need to let the airforce and missile units do their job

    Current number of troops would have been sufficient if someone would finally just let the VKS off the leash

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    Post  sepheronx 11/04/22, 07:46 pm

    Erk wrote:
    ATLASCUB wrote:Link to Zelensky's order?

    https://tass.com/society/1436119


    Like I said. Thank you.
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    Post  Regular 11/04/22, 07:47 pm

    Strategic bombers were used in both Chechen wars, I don't see why not to use them now?

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    Post  sepheronx 11/04/22, 07:49 pm

    Regular wrote:Strategic bombers were used in both Chechen wars, I don't see why not to use them now?

    And hit what exactly?

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy 11/04/22, 07:55 pm

    https://t.me/intelslava/24384


    Orc saying Slava Rosij, Akhmat Sila lol1 lol1 lol1



    Erk wrote:Looks like the chemical weapons false flags have started.

    https://www.rt.com/russia/553716-ukraine-chemical-weapons-azov/

    Ukraine's neo-Nazi Azov Battalion has accused Russian forces of deploying a chemical weapon against its fighters during the siege on Mariupol, potentially creating a pretext for the US and its Western allies to step up efforts to punish Moscow over the conflict.

    An unidentified chemical agent was dropped from a drone on Monday, leaving several Ukrainian fighters in the area struggling to breathe, according to unverified accusations posted on Telegram by the ultranationalist Azov Battalion.

    “A poisonous substance of unknown origin” was used, the militants claimed, allegedly leaving three fighters suffering mild respiratory issues, dizziness and headaches.


    AFAIK Basurin . LNR was saying something thet there is gonna be no assault on underground bunkers but they shall contact chemical troops. BUT imho the easiest way would be just CO2. Cheap and does the work.

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy 11/04/22, 08:15 pm

    BTW what was there? Kh-22? MOAB? ammo depot? Nikolayev


    https://t.me/intelslava/24930
    +

    https://t.me/intelslava/24931




    sepheronx wrote:
    Regular wrote:Strategic bombers were used in both Chechen wars, I don't see why not to use them now?

    And hit what exactly?

    They did, but with missiles. Why Putin "upgraded" the Tu-160 regiment to guards one?




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    Post  GunshipDemocracy 11/04/22, 08:17 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Arkanghelsk wrote:Python I do get the feeling that mobilization is coming

    You don't need mobilization, you need to let the airforce and missile units do their job

    Current number of troops would have been sufficient if someone would finally just let the VKS off the leash


    Currently 8-10 cargo airplanes daily is landing in Poland to unload arms for orcs. Including AAD systems. Im not sure if ever aviation will be unleashed.
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    Post  LMFS 11/04/22, 08:20 pm

    Hinex1988 wrote:🇷🇺🇺🇦 Briefing by Russian Defence Ministry

    ▫The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue the special military operation in Ukraine.

    💥On April 11, buried, well-protected command post of a group of Ukrainian troops in Donbass was destroyed by Kinzhal air missile system near Chasov Yar, Donetsk Region.

    💥High-precision air-based missiles near Selidovo, Donetsk Region, destroyed 1 Ukrainian Tochka-U tactical missile launcher,
    2 multiple rocket launchers in 1 underground shelter, 2 camouflaged concentration of weapons and military equipment and up to 40 Ukrainian nationalists.

    💥A base camp of the Right Sector terrorist organization has been destroyed near Novogrodovka, Donetsk Region.

    💥During the day, high-precision ground-based missiles in Popasnaya, Novozvanovka and Zolotoe, Donetsk Region, destroyed 1 battalion command and observation post, 3 company strong points, 2 company tactical groups of the Ukrainian 24th Mechanized Brigade and Territorial Defence Brigade, as well as 2 areas of military equipment concentration.  

    📊In total, up to 300 Ukrainian fighters, over 50 armoured fighting vehicles and up to 25 vehicles of various purposes were destroyed as a result of the strikes in these areas.

    💥Russian air defence means shot down 1 Ukrainian Su-27 aircraft in the air near Sinelnikovo, Dnepropetrovsk region.

    ✈💥Operational-tactical aviation hit 42 military assets of Ukraine. Among them: 3 command posts, 2 radars for illumination and guidance, 1 fuel depot, as well as 35 strong points and areas of Ukrainian military equipment concentration.

    📊In total, 130 aircfaft and 99 helicopters, 243 anti-aircraft missile systems S-300, Buk-M1, Osa AKM, 441 unmanned aerial vehicles, 2,132 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 241 multiple launch rocket systems, 913 field artillery and mortars, as well as 2,028 units of special military vehicles of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were destroyed during the operation.

    The MASSIVE beating of the ukie army concentrated in Donbass has just started it seems...

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    Post  Arkanghelsk 11/04/22, 08:28 pm

    Everything is depending on next days, especially the offensive in Donetsk

    And if Ukros are capable to stage more propaganda victories

    Yes they are only propaganda, but one must realize how sinister this war has become

    Why would Zelensky make a declaration like this a day after Boris landed in Kiev?

    We know that Boris wanted the VSU to attack

    Maybe that's what this is

    And just because some Ukrainian called it a fake doesn't mean shit

    They bombed the fuel depot and zelensky said that Ukraine had nothing to do with it

    So you better believe 404 has an order from the west to carry out a provocation on the border and tries to cover it up

    But you must understand how Ukraine carries out the orders of the West and an attack is definitely something they want to celebrate a victory even if it's fake like the one in Kiev

    It discredits Russia to their own population and thats the goal , to break Russia and to raise its own civilian morale in war against Russia

    Nehammer didn't stop in Moscow for no reason

    Supposedly he met Putin behind closed doors, where Putin said he would resolve the war no matter what

    Something is brewing for sure

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    Post  Arkanghelsk 11/04/22, 08:40 pm

    https://t.me/intelslava/24964?single

    Has anyone seen the size of this column?

    WTF

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    Post  kvs 11/04/22, 09:28 pm

    The visit by the Austrian stooge to Moscow was another lecture fest against Russia. He demanded an investigation of the
    Bucha "war crime" (as if he knows the objective facts before the investigation) and was offended that Putin called it a
    Ukr regime smear operation. According to NATzO bodies can lie for weeks on the street and not even develop cadaver
    spots.

    NATzO is under the terminal delusion that Russia is about to capitulate.

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    Post  ALAMO 11/04/22, 10:18 pm

    flamming_python wrote:Strelkov doesn't lie. Although I don't believe him when he said going to h Donbass was his own initiative. Did the border guards let him and his band through to the territory of another state also on their own initiative.

    But Strelkov is cynical and pessimistic down to a fault. He states facts, but uses them to construct and argue the most depressing conclusions.
    His political analysis of anything is bunk. I remember during the protests in Bashkiria, he was trying to put an accent on them as if a separatist conflict would start any day now. When there was a big protest in Ingushetia as a result of territorial swaps with Chechnya, he was also talking about blood being spilt any day now and the necessity of urgent measures

    Well neither situation went that way

    This is fukin unbelievable Laughing
    A guy who orchestrated the failure of both Slavyansk and Kramatorsk back there, now posing as an ultimate strategist and second-to-Zhukov only Laughing Laughing Laughing
    It was his incompetence, big mouth he could not keep shut back there, and inability to cooperate with other warlords that cost half of Donbas, and put it's people on the 8 years of harsh occupation. And Russkies were forced to intervene directly to cover that and save the republics.

    Ukros are done.

    Understand that finally.

    The whole operation is a bloody marvel of military planning&execution. They strike in a week as deep as 300 km inside a well-prepared territory against the opponent having double the numbers on the ground, achieving an advance ratio on pair with Bagration only.
    The Kiev operation probably failed on political background, still worked just fine as classic maskirovka that the Russkies were known for ever.
    Still, it had to be performed anyway, just in case of altering the political situation.
    The operational withdrawal was executed in a way that opposing forces needed 3 days to realize it was done.
    Ukros has no heavy gear. They can't move other way than using civilian cars and ambulances, they can relocate the warehouses using red cross trucks and regular civilian transport only. They have no fuel, no lubricants, hardly any ammo. There is almost no artillery left, and we don't hear about artillery duels anymore, because there are none.
    There is no navy.
    There is no airforces. Some single survivors are assigned to one way suicide missions and end up in a field as scrap metal.
    There are no tanks left, and when propaganda in EU is telling the stories of how they have more tanks than at the beginning, because they "lost 100 but took 150 on the enemy", they seriously consider a deliveries of scrap metal on pair with T-55. Who will operate it, where are the spares, ammo supply etc, is irrelevant. Only the gesture matters Laughing
    Take a look at the bodies. Yes, it is not a pleasant job, but very informative.
    Those are old guys dying.
    Ukro army runs on reserves.
    Those soldiers are unequipped, unsupplied, undressed and lack of any training. Stories that they have fired twice on the "training" are common, some of them didn't train at all.
    Morale is getting lower and lower each hour.

    The only question is, how the Russkies will proceed now on, and how much time it will take them to finish that.

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    Post  magnumcromagnon 11/04/22, 10:35 pm

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    Post  Serberus 11/04/22, 10:56 pm

    I sincerely hope the Nazis are delusional enough to try and attack Belgorod or Russia in general, that would require a large army and it would expose them to the air force , artillery and missile strikes out in the open before they even reached the border. It would actually suit Russia, much better option than having to storm urban areas while the Wehrmacht cower behind civilians.

    But its most likely just another pathetic propaganda attempt to try and keep the illusion of winning alive.


    Last edited by Serberus on 11/04/22, 11:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  GarryB 11/04/22, 11:08 pm

    100% true. The commies had to fight the US (CIA) backed resistance in West Ukraine until the early 50s, but they didn't proceed to then rip out every last damned fascist by the roots???? By contrast, the West has hounded and persecuted the nazis and their followers, even to the point of jailing private citizens for questioning the orthodox holohoax narrative and defaming notable historians and academics who dare to cite the physical historical record and challenge the obvious fallacies.

    Not sure if you are talking the piss or  not, but the west supported the pro bandera nazis just after WWII and again now more recently... not a lot has really changed... the west still supports any threat to Russia in the hopes of damaging Russia.

    The US found in Vietnam and the Soviets found in Afghanistan that fighting an enemy supported by the other superpower means while you can't properly win, that they wont lose either so eventually you leave.

    In this case however the US is supporting nazis on the doorstep of Russia, so Russia really needs to make the US pay or it wont stop.

    The point is that the British and French might have been happy to shoot all the nazis, but there were probably more nazis in the US than in Germany in the 1920s an 1930s, so it is not a goal they could possibly have achieved in their subservient position to the US at that time and since.

    Again I assume that they are using mortar rounds due to the possible near vertical drop and relative small size, 10% of an Iskander warhead for example, both attributes needed to keep collateral damage of the site itself to a minimum.

    Relatively small size?

    The standard HE round is about 120kgs of HE and metal, while the Smelchak is the laser guided missile that is about 130kgs...

    Compared with 50kg 152mm rounds these are quite heavy and rather powerful.

    Seriously the rest of the world needs to get its shit in order and stand up for their own sovereignty. Russia will fight its battle but it can't fight everyone's battle.

    When their dollars are no longer accepted they will struggle to get support, but honestly support would mean more before that so you know it is not just about money.

    Russia wants trade partners.... they don't want slaves to be kept...

    What 'hand-to-hand' combat is possible? Hope not all the rank and file are such fanatics

    Very costly when one side still has ammo...

    And Putin's fault, to be honest. Putin and all his people who planned this fk-up of an operation, and didn't manage to avoid this war in the first place

    The problems in this conflict are caused by the US and HATO and EU and of course the whole western media making everyone think Russia are the bad guys and are losing.

    This is beyond Putins control and certainly not a good reason to not attack the way they did.

    A good article on the UK supplying Ukraine anti ship missile issue. As previously mentioned by myself its very unlikely to happen. This article explains why and the various option UK could choose but end result is very unlikely

    But that would make Bojo a liar.... I can't believe that is true...  Twisted Evil

    The largest German defense concern Rheinmetall plans to supply Ukraine with up to 50 used Leopard 1 battle tanks and up to 60 decommissioned Marder infantry fighting vehicles, said the head of the company, Armin Papperger.

    Leopard 1 tanks.... are they taking the piss... the Marders probably have heavier armour than the Leopard 1s.

    No it's Putin's fault that he didn't outsmart them

    And that when he couldn't, he wasn't smart enough to figure out and counter their strategies. Instead now we get all this.

    He is outsmarting them... they are cutting all ties with Russia, which makes things easier for Russia to then pivot to Asia and Africa and central and south America and not have to worry about the west.

    is what Kiev did to the people of Donbas, with full support from majority of Ukrainians.

    They literally justified murdering those Ukrainian civilians by saying they spoke Russian and were supported by Russia and therefore they were Russia so the west and the Ukraine said it was OK to keep shelling those civilians...

    It was OK because they were Russians.

    Are you getting that FP?

    he feels that this could have been prevented much earlier in the situation - back in 2014/2015. And I honestly agree. This was a tactical blunder for Russia since at the time they could have nipped this in the bud. But Russia didn't act then so it had to act now. Many good guys were lost back then too from the DNR and LPR side that if were alive today, could have been very valuable assets in these battles.

    They helped negotiate the Minsk agreement to sort everything out... everyone agreed at the time... there was nothing left for Russia to do.... Kiev was going to sort this out by the numbers peacefully and to everyones satisfaction.

    They didn't. Therefore it is their fault. They didn't because the US probably told them not to. Therefore it is their fault too.

    What is this blaming Putin Shit.

    Maybe it fooled enough people in 2014-2015 and silenced others, but even Zelensky was elected on a platform of ending the war and improving ties with Russia.

    And he did the exact opposite, and the people could care less.

    Only who's this someone

    It's someone who looks like you, talks like you, can't be differentiated from you - but is not you, because they are a Ukrainian nationalist who hates your guts and wants to murder civilians.
    And they may well have all the Russian passports which were handed out like candy over the last 30 years, be born in Russia, and whatever else.

    How do you guard against something like that?

    Wasn't Navalny born in Russia?

    Great idea. Nobody trained to use the stuff. No trained mechanics. No spare parts.

    HATO standard ammo too... I am sure there will be crates of it lying around the battlefield...

    And the equivalent of T-55 at the end Laughing Laughing I must admit that this devils plan is something that only a real genie could figured out

    Ironically they would have ammo for that still... including machine guns...

    As expected the Russia strong crowd of this forum believes that NATO is not sending MBTs to Ukraine because they can be targeted by ATGMs apart from Russian tanks. It's not that easy.

    Rheinmetall's ADS can be fitted on any Western tanks, IFVs. ADS works by having a series of modules mounted around the vehicle. Each has a prewarner (PW) that detects a threat, an EO sensor that times the initiation, and an explosive countermeasure (CM) that fires into the path of the threat and destroys it.

    They are sending Leopard 1s... their frontal armour is less than the side armour of contemporary tanks because it was a light tank. Its 105mm gun  would struggle to penetrate Russian tanks from many angles especially ERA equipped vehicles, and you think they will be fitting APS equipment for the Russians to capture and examine?

    Hahahaha.

    They don't have any fuel or ammo for these vehicles... whether we are talking about main gun 105mm ammo or machine gun 7.62 x 51mm HATO calibre or 12.7 x 99mm Browning calibre, or even the smoke grenades the vehicle uses...

    Anyway, since Mariupol is a done deal, it has to be Kharkov these are meant for.

    Also a firepower support vehicle used for convoy escort for detecting and dealing with ambushes...

    Pretty sure USSR used some in Afghanistan already back in the 80's, retrofitted to otherwise more vulnerable T-54/55s, but am no expert.

    The Drozd system was tested there on T-55s of the Naval infantry forces, and it was quite successful... led to the Drozd 2 being developed and also the first generation ARENA system.

    Putin did make some mistakes, in 2014 he shoulda completely wiped out the Ukraine military sent to the Donbass.

    That was Ukrainians killing Ukrainians... Putin had Crimea and he thought Minsk would sort out the rest with those separatist regions getting what they wanted too, which at the time was just to speak Russian...

    Russia needs to outsource the production of the Arena and some other last-gen tech to China

    They can produce it quick

    Russia can make it just fine... but they need the orders first.

    Having said all that, it is weird they are bringing those in IMHO. They dont have them in great numbers and have already tested the platform in combat conditions. So leadership must really think the Terminators can be valuable in the upcomming offensive. Another, somewhat disturbing possibility, is that they need fresh equipment due to attrition setting in, But in this case it would make more sense to just bring in more T-72's from the garbage heap, so that is unlikely IMHO.

    I would expect its fire power and ability to deal with drones would make it an excellent convoy support vehicle to protect support convoys.

    In a situation where the primary target is enemy infantry 125mm guns are not ideal for enemy troops dispersed around the place, while 30mm grenade and 30mm cannon shells would be ideal for targets on the ground and drones in the air.

    The Pro-Combat consensus in the West was apparently confirmed last week by European Union (EU) foreign policy chief Josep Borrell, who said on Saturday that the "war will be won on the battlefield" as he was also visiting Kiev.

    Well the west has already won every day of the fight in the media, but it does not seem to have changed anything on the ground, so now after a month they realise perhaps winning in the media means nothing if it is your own media and the other guys media has already been banned.

    Problem is... there is no military hardware they can send to change the balance on the ground or in the air.

    1) Kh-15 was fully withdrawn? or Russia can still use kh-15P or kh-15S ?

    Only version of Kh-15 has a 350Kt nuclear warhead and no conventional alternative.

    It is for a strategic cruise missile carrier and is intended to clear its way though SAM and airfields filled regions with a nuclear explosion.

    But.
    That doesn't mean it shouldn't be made ready. Not at hand, but just, not too far away.

    The Kh-15 could be carried by the Tu-22M3, it could carry four externally and 6 internally on a revolving launcher, so the aircraft could carry 10 at a time...

    The Blackjack could carry 12 per rotary launcher in tandem so with both rotary launchers filled it could carry up to 24.

    The Kh-22 is a liquid propellant rocket. Liquid-fueled missiles can't be stored for too long in a ready to fire state; the propellant is often corrosive or spoils in some way or the other. However they can always be emptied, and then refueled later with fuel and oxidizer when you do need them; provided you have the facilities to do so.
    So the Kh-22 should in theory be good if they've been stored empty. However in practice, they are mostly getting upgraded to the Kh-32 anyway; keeping the case but with a smaller warhead, new seeker, engine and different propellant mix

    The Kh-22M were very unpopular because their fuel is really really nasty, but it is not fuelled up until it is loaded onto the aircraft so they are not stored fuelled.

    The Kh-32 would be the same but with even more volatile fuel.

    They would not just be safe but also quite light until they are fuelled up for takeoff.

    The Kh-55 is a jet-powered missile. All you need is to add fuel to it ahead of employment as you would to a jet-powered aircraft. If the fuel is good, and the engine, electronics haven't corroded out due to bad storage practice - the missile will work

    Quick and easy to fuel up... main issues would be any batteries in the missile. Leaking batteries would be a common problem, but replacement batteries should not be that hard.

    Ukrainian forces likely still have some Buks; they can hit high, up to 20km potentially. Although their range envelope won't be big at such a high altitude

    Unless they upgraded them altitude limits should be about 15km, but still a bit high for a bomber to fly over.

    Perhaps dedicated Wild Weasel types armed with ARMs to swat targets as they appear.

    The nazis feel like they are doing a good job

    The ones on the ground are the ones that matter and they know the cold hard truth...

    Nazis in Washington really don't matter in this equation.

    he EU is like a communist creation, only the orders do not come from the Central Committee but from Brussels.

    Washington it seems to me...

    Zelensky has ordered an attack on Belgorod

    Massing a force to attack something makes defeating them very easy with air power and artillery... that would be a great way to group a lot of nazis together so they can be eliminated from the game.

    “A poisonous substance of unknown origin” was used, the militants claimed, allegedly leaving three fighters suffering mild respiratory issues, dizziness and headaches.

    Dizziness and headaches... my god... Putin is clearly going all out with a full scale attack with Novachok...

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO 11/04/22, 11:33 pm

    An interesting story from the ground.

    Having friends who are Ukrainians, and whose families live on both sides of the border, I can give you some first eye observations.

    Well, to begin with ... all the "Russian propaganda" is actually true.
    The first wave of refugees that passed through the Polish border in Bieszczady used to be visible wealthy people. Caravans of Lexus, BMW, Mercedes and Bentleys passed the Krościenko border point, and none of those even stopped. All traveled south-west.
    On the Ukrainian side of the border, refugees just rent the houses and stay there, having prolonged Spring holidays. Grilling. Still, the renting prices skyrocketed.
    Later on, the refugee status and structure changed the visible way. Most of them are women with kids, obviously not wealthy. Cars are old, torn off, breaking. Those women don't know how to handle it, can't afford repairs, and cars are being abandoned.
    As I have said, the last wave will be the people who will need the biggest support and attention, but the deposits of it will be already depleted on those who consider themselves better.
    Sad.

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    Post  mavaff 11/04/22, 11:33 pm

    Rus Navy shutting down a BT2.

    https://t.me/intelslava/24991

    What is this AD missile they fired?

    On propaganda: I believe propaganda has now got to a point where it does not matter anymore, even in the West. I mean it is so blatantly false that even if most of the people in the west still buy it, it cannot change at all the course of the conflict (It did not before, but now even less) because west has drained all their options, no more room for sanctions (useless anyway for Russia, good just to destroy EU).
    The only one left is straight confrontation (war) to Russia, which will never happen because west has no balls to do it.

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    Post  nomadski 11/04/22, 11:37 pm

    Some comments :

    ( 1 )  Some still say that " the LDPR are separatists backed by Russia , " has negative connotations . One should not normally support " separatism " . I would agree that  under normal conditions , where a conflict is low level , and political solutions are possible , then " separatism ,  " has regressive connotations . However in high level conflict , where populations are subject to genocide and long term diminishment , without recovery ( as was the case prior to special military operation , with hundreds of thousands of potential Refugees from Donbas ) , that intervention is justified .

    ( 2 ) The sooner the operations end and bring a solution , the better . For this reason a great irresistible force , greater than needed , must be used . Even if this force leaves little or no reserves , to confront NATO , along some other front of border , such as Poland or Finland . The forces in Donbas , then counter- strike against NATO using conventional weapons , after liberating the Ukraine . A Swiss army knife of tactics . A concentrated force . Before Nuclear escalation .

    ( 3 ) Placing the Army kitchen next to encircled Nazi in steel plant in Mariupol , fresh smell of baked Bread , will be good idea . They will soon give up after this " chemical attack " . LOL .


    Last edited by nomadski on 11/04/22, 11:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  mavaff 11/04/22, 11:38 pm

    ALAMO wrote:An interesting story from the ground.

    Having friends who are Ukrainians, and whose families live on both sides of the border, I can give you some first eye observations.

    Well, to begin with ... all the "Russian propaganda" is actually true.
    The first wave of refugees that passed through the Polish border in Bieszczady used to be visible wealthy people. Caravans of Lexus, BMW, Mercedes and Bentleys passed the Krościenko border


    I can say something here.

    In my neighbourhood a few weeks ago some Ukr refugees arrived, big Toyota Land Cruiser and Lexus, they seem wealthy. I can see them from my window, they just spent their day doing nothing in the garden, they are hosted by an Italian family (actually I saw the very moment of their arrival, they were very warmly welcomed, maybe they are relatives, siblings, I do not know...but for sure not really unknown to the host family).

    Where my sister lives (big city in Northern Italy) also they have got some refugees, again they came with high-end cars, not really cheap skodas or zavas.

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    Post  ALAMO 11/04/22, 11:39 pm

    Shtil, as they said Laughing

    And west going to war with Russia is not a matter of having balls or not, but being physically capable.
    We are not, and that is the point.
    Big mouth and loud shouts won't cover that, at least to anyone who has eyes, ears, and brain to process the pictures.

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