Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues
GarryB, Broski and Belisarius like this post
Go check pro russian accounts. All are criticizing the air force being non existant in ukraine since the begining.
Su-34 footages over ukraine doesn't exist despite all the ukrainians filming everything related to the war. They even filmed fucking cruise missiles and tactical supersonic missiles few days ago. If su-34 was there thry would film it.
So yeah it is not used. It launches some missiles missiles from stand off position but that's nothing impressive.
Ukraine uses unupgarded first versions of soviet SAM. Forget about modern upgrades with optical guidance. Their S-300 doesn't even work. Buks are stand alone with 0 integration into a proper IADS yet they pose a huge problem to the russian air force.
RCS matter since radars are everywhere and ARH missiles are mostly used.
So how do you know this is fake ? It doesn't suits you so it's fake ? Nice world you live in.
Guess what it is a true map and iskanders missed all the target. Some times it is very precise sometimes it is not. Which is bad when you sell it as the best ballistic missile in the world. Frankly I've more impressed by Iranian BM that attack an US base. And they are cheaper with the same result at the end and same precision.
Either ukrainian air force is mighty or russian air force is bad. Ukrainian outdated migs and sukhois aren't mighty.
If we were to beleive some people here, Garry in particular, russian OTH radar can track tomahawks launched in france
And S-400 can destroy b2 400km away.
Yet they can't track mig-29 and destroy them 200km from their border that easily with all the stuff they have.
8 months and they are still surviving in the air even if they are totally blind.
So yeah russian overhyped their weapon by a great margin. Su-34 in particular is total junk.
Their situation would have been far better if mig made a single enging 5th gen fighter in the 00s.
zardof, Broski, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
What is even your source that those were potholes created by Iskander?
Show me the source and claims that those little holes were from a PGM with a 500kg warhead.
lancelot, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
when there is not a single day without some footage with those being used on a mass scale, by the infantry, armored vehicles, choppers, whatever. Werewolf, Mir and Broski like this post
I understand the panic... 8 months and the Ukraines air defence vehicles can survive by using optical mode and moving a lot like the Russians do with their air defence systems... so how long will HATO last against Russian AD... and the answer is not very long at all.
You are still trying to convince someone, who does not want to be convinced Laughing Laughing
This is an absolute example of idee fix.
He does not care about the facts, any of them
Mir, Broski and Podlodka77 like this post
ALAMO wrote:Yes, yes, all is just fine.
Take the piles. All of them, this time. The blue one too!
ALAMO wrote:Yes, yes, all is just fine.
Take the piles. All of them, this time. The blue one too!
As we are saying here, sometimes it is much better to just stay quiet, and let people consider you an idiot, rather than opening your mouth and making them sure of it.
Your chance is long gone.
Broski and Podlodka77 like this post
And just take a look, at how declarative he is while claiming that bullshit in open Laughing Laughing
Department Of Defense likes this post
Werewolf, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises and Indian Mig 21 was shot down in a real conflict by a combination of Errie Eye and F-16 of the Pakistani Air Force.Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
Department Of Defense wrote:The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises and Indian Mig 21 was shot down in a real conflict by a combination of Errie Eye and F-16 of the Pakistani Air Force.Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
Mir wrote:Department Of Defense wrote:The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises and Indian Mig 21 was shot down in a real conflict by a combination of Errie Eye and F-16 of the Pakistani Air Force.Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
You mean Chinese and Israeli electronics?
Werewolf, Hole, Mir, Broski and Belisarius like this post
Mir wrote:He sounds very important though!
France has 2,500 gas stations without fuel, and almost 2,000 gas stations with a partial shortage
Mir, Broski and Belisarius like this post
Podlodka77 wrote:Mir wrote:He sounds very important though!
He's just as important as this budding French moron, but at least the French is far more active. He is starting to look more and more like RTN.
But is there fuel in France ?
Map of the Rafale superstate with locations where there are fuel shortages....
Department Of Defense wrote:The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercisesIsos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
sepheronx, GarryB, Hole, lyle6, Mir, Broski and Belisarius like this post
GarryB, ALAMO and Podlodka77 like this post
Belisarius wrote:Although videos of Su-34 flying and attacking at high altitude have already been shown here, Isos persists in stating that the Su-34 only flies low
Mir is right, it is better not to invest the time and knowledge in responding, all we will get in return is pure unadulterated BS.
GarryB, ALAMO, lancelot, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
The Su-34s r being used mostly as stand-off missile trucks- no need to repeat that Syrian shootdown; the 2 Mi-24s raid was an act of desperation & propaganda stunt, as they don't have long range MLRS to strike far from inside Ukraine w/o being wiped out 1st or retaliated against. Let's see if they can repeat it again.Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod a russian city.
GarryB, Werewolf and Belisarius like this post
If the 50 migs that ukraine had could survive for more than 8 months and if the ukro mi-24 could make a bomb run behind russian lines in a city, nato doesn't need to worry at all.
Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod a russian city.
On the ground the numerical advantage is in favour of ukraine so the slow advance is understandable
But in the air russia should have had a totally free sky. It's almost 1 year they fight systems they designed and operate. They should know how to hunt them.
They should ask israel for help. They are the vest when it comes to use effectively their air force.
Go cry a little. It helps facing reality. Your mighty army is still fighting inside Donbass that they still have liberated.
Su-34 doesn't go for deep strike. That's true.
Su-34 flying very low and only on the front because ukro SAMs too dangerous. True.
Su-34 getting shot down even with jammers on by soviet old systems. It's true so there is no chance it pass accross NATO or Chinese defenses since they are way better than ukrainian defenses and in greater numbers.
Iskander missed targets. It's true as shown. Not a bad system but not as good as advertized. Iranian BM can also do the same job and they have greater range.
Ukro air force still flying. It's true.
Mighty S-400 and pantsir and tors not intercepting two mi-24 that bomb a city accross the frontline, not just the border but the frontline that is covered with radar and SAMs AND protected by sukhois. It's also true which suggests nuclear tomahawks can go bomb Moscow easily.
Rafale jammed a S-300.
Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
Russian army can't take a city accross the border. True again. See kharkov. And they prepared for this war since 2014.
Broski, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
Mir wrote:He sounds very important though!
Mir wrote:
The most interesting aspect is that the Su-34 only makes attacks at low altitude to avoid being targeted by BUK missiles BUT at the same time it never enters Ukrainian airspace whilst doing so
Mir, Broski, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
GarryB wrote:If the 50 migs that ukraine had could survive for more than 8 months and if the ukro mi-24 could make a bomb run behind russian lines in a city, nato doesn't need to worry at all.
Actually that is not true in many ways.
First of all the MiGs and Hinds that the Ukraine are using now were either kept hidden away and not flown all this time, or are recent imports from east european countries sending them their old stocks, which are presumably fixed up and send in and set up at some dispersed site and the first time they take off they get shot down.
HATO needs to worry because they are an air power based military force... they can't bury their aircraft in the sand and then dig them up 8 months later when they think they might need them.
Worse for HATO, they have minimum AD because their air power is both their air defence and their attack method so all losses are multiplied because when they use their air power for attack or defence any aircraft lost will weaken both their attack strength and their ability to defend themselves... which means they probably don't have enough aircraft right now because during normal operations they are going to lose a lot of aircraft very very quickly.
They have HATO C4IR planning so a sneak attack could be mounted, but how often have they continued that method of attack?
Could it be because they are losing helicopters so quickly that they could not afford to use that as a regular thing and as a one off it is impressive in terms of bravery, but it is not going to continue to get results over and over because next time they will just get shot down.
Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod a russian city.
They flew one sneaky mission and all of a sudden the Mi-24 is better than the Su-34 that has been hammering them for 8 months?
On the ground the numerical advantage is in favour of ukraine so the slow advance is understandable
You might be watching a different conflict... the orcs didn't advance anywhere in the first part of this conflict. Later on, like around Kiev and Snake island they withdrew because they had achieved their goals and were becoming vulnerable to enemy artillery... when they withdrew the Orcs tried to sneak in in both cases and declare victory... around Kiev that seemed to work because the Russians withdrew, but with Snake Island those orcs got hammered a few times after the Russians left which was amusing.
The point is that apart from those instances the only advances the Orcs have made have been over the last month or so with overwhelming numbers of cannon fodder with foreign mercs in control, but recently even that has been stopped and is in the process of being reversed if you are paying attention... even before the extra Russian troops arrive to the front line.
But in the air russia should have had a totally free sky. It's almost 1 year they fight systems they designed and operate. They should know how to hunt them.
Really? After almost 80 days... nearly three months the Serb air defence was largely still intact after HATO did their best...
Almost like Soviet based air defences are something HATO can't deal with either.
They should ask israel for help. They are the vest when it comes to use effectively their air force.
Israel can't even fly over Syria... what would their advice be.... shoot the teenagers holding rocks?
Go cry a little. It helps facing reality. Your mighty army is still fighting inside Donbass that they still have liberated.
Ironic coming from someone who is French... most of your colonies in Africa want you to leave these days because you have more criminal ties to the local terrorists than to the local army and police... you are not interested in peace or law and order... it is war that fills your coffers... which is why you worship the US... the warmonger supreme.
Su-34 doesn't go for deep strike. That's true.
Su-34 flying very low and only on the front because ukro SAMs too dangerous. True.
Saying something is true does not make it so.
Su-34 getting shot down even with jammers on by soviet old systems. It's true so there is no chance it pass accross NATO or Chinese defenses since they are way better than ukrainian defenses and in greater numbers.
You are right, Russia should start using cruise missiles against radar and intel assets in HATO to prevent them detecting and tracking their aircraft in Ukrainian airspace.
Iskander missed targets. It's true as shown. Not a bad system but not as good as advertized. Iranian BM can also do the same job and they have greater range.
Your opinion only and likely wrong.
Ukro air force still flying. It's true.
But now Polish and Georgian airframes.... it is not a question of the ability of the Russian air defence to shoot them down, but their ability to be supplied by HATO.
Mighty S-400 and pantsir and tors not intercepting two mi-24 that bomb a city accross the frontline, not just the border but the frontline that is covered with radar and SAMs AND protected by sukhois. It's also true which suggests nuclear tomahawks can go bomb Moscow easily.
Desperate much... perhaps flying over a french fishing boat means the CdG is vulnerable to being destroyed too?
Because obviously the air defences near some small border area are exactly the same as a countries capital city... still the only city on the planet with its own dedicated ABM defence system.
Rafale jammed a S-300.
But can it shoot down a spitfire, and you do understand that Russian S-300s have home on jam capacity if you want to try to jam the radar of the S-300 or S-400 for that matter.
Russia has tens of thousands of AD vehicles....
Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
Even assuming that is true that logic does not prove the Rafale would survive operating over BUK systems either.
So the result is that air power is useless over a Russian air defence network.
Russian army can't take a city accross the border. True again. See kharkov. And they prepared for this war since 2014.
The orcs were preparing in 2014, the Russians prepared for this war for perhaps a month at best.
Isos wrote:
Seriously ?! You are just like Alamo. Even when I provide proof you close your eyes and say "your opinion". lol1
GarryB, Broski, Belisarius and Podlodka77 like this post
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