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    Su-34 Tactical Bomber: News #2

    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 Fri Oct 14, 2022 11:21 am

    Werewolf, we in Serbia have a saying when someone is unproven "it's easier to put it in his ass than in his head". Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
    He is simply NOT WORTH talking because only his "sources" are reliable and he has really become ignorant and rude.



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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Oct 14, 2022 11:34 am

    Go check pro russian accounts. All are criticizing the air force being non existant in ukraine since the begining.

    Well if they are pro Russia then they must be right... but what sources do they give for their information?

    Perhaps the stick in their butts is that they have been worshipping things all these years assuming they are invincible only to find in a real combat situation against a country fully supported by the US and HATO and the EU that they are not invincible... and a serious problem with most such fanboys is that if something isn't perfect it is shit.

    The fact that they haven't been banned from Twitter suggests they are pretending to be pro Russian and are just western paid for bots with their Bot ID keeping them from being removed from social media.

    Su-34 footages over ukraine doesn't exist despite all the ukrainians filming everything related to the war. They even filmed fucking cruise missiles and tactical supersonic missiles few days ago. If su-34 was there thry would film it.

    That proves nothing at all.

    So yeah it is not used. It launches some missiles missiles from stand off position but that's nothing impressive.

    You got quotes of the Su-34 performing bombing missions with guided bombs but you ignore that.

    Which means you are getting all emotional and childish, so continue to say it is shit, but don't expect any sensible conversations in future because everything must therefore be shit because nothing is perfect.

    Ukraine uses unupgarded first versions of soviet SAM. Forget about modern upgrades with optical guidance. Their S-300 doesn't even work. Buks are stand alone with 0 integration into a proper IADS yet they pose a huge problem to the russian air force.

    Which would make them up to date for Desert Storm... how many western aircraft were shot down in Desert Storm?

    Why do you think they have not upgraded anything?

    The Ukrainians upgraded Georgian BUKs for use in the conflict in 2008.

    RCS matter since radars are everywhere and ARH missiles are mostly used.

    So which Ukrainian SAM uses ARH?

    Not S-300, not BUK, not Tunguska, not TOR, not OSA...

    So how do you know this is fake ? It doesn't suits you so it's fake ? Nice world you live in.

    Because being launched at an airfield the only targets they would be pointed at would be parked aircraft... they are not designed for anti runway use in the single warhead version... they would use the cluster munition warhead version for the job of cratering a runway.

    How do you know each of those impact points didn't destroy an aircraft sitting there?

    Assuming Iskanders were even used in the first place... western sources are reliably unreliable.

    Guess what it is a true map and iskanders missed all the target. Some times it is very precise sometimes it is not. Which is bad when you sell it as the best ballistic missile in the world. Frankly I've more impressed by Iranian BM that attack an US base. And they are cheaper with the same result at the end and same precision.

    The whole concept is suspicious, but the fact that western sources released that photo and made that claim suggests they are scared and it is fake because they really have nothing that can shoot them down so they would be horribly vulnerable to such an attack and now the INF treaty is gone there are no limits on its flight range now.

    Either ukrainian air force is mighty or russian air force is bad. Ukrainian outdated migs and sukhois aren't mighty.

    Every time a Ukrainian aircraft takes off it gets shot down... there are no accounts of Ukrainian air force success or Zelensky would be telling us all about their amazing victories.

    They are being trickle fed new old aircraft from former Warsaw Pact stocks and when they get airborne they get shot down.

    Doesn't mean either side is mighty and either side is bad.


    If we were to beleive some people here, Garry in particular, russian OTH radar can track tomahawks launched in france

    Detecting a target operating at over 600km/h at low altitude means it is not a car or a truck on a motorway... in that respect low flying cruise missiles are easy to detect.

    Drones on the other hand could only be detected and tracked if you reduce the flight speed parameters so you would be detecting cars and bikes and birds...

    And S-400 can destroy b2 400km away.

    You will notice the total lack of B2s and F-35s and F-22s and other amazing stealth aircraft the US has at its command being used anywhere near Russia... surely that is exactly where it should all be to take advantage of its amazing stealth performance... the Russians wont even know they are there...

    Yet they can't track mig-29 and destroy them 200km from their border that easily with all the stuff they have.

    But they are. When they take off they get shot down.

    8 months and they are still surviving in the air even if they are totally blind.

    The ones shot down this week have likely not even been in the Ukraine for more than a week and when they are shot down it is likely their first flight in Ukrainian airspace.

    So yeah russian overhyped their weapon by a great margin. Su-34 in particular is total junk.

    I understand the panic... 8 months and the Ukraines air defence vehicles can survive by using optical mode and moving a lot like the Russians do with their air defence systems... so how long will HATO last against Russian AD... and the answer is not very long at all.

    Their situation would have been far better if mig made a single enging 5th gen fighter in the 00s.

    Rather doubt it would have made any difference at all, stealth would not be that game changing against the Orcs and would make even less difference against the Russians from a HATO perspective.

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Oct 14, 2022 11:38 am

    What is even your source that those were potholes created by Iskander?
    Show me the source and claims that those little holes were from a PGM with a 500kg warhead.

    Iskanders can use submunition warheads and one of the submunition warhead options is a cratering munition for use against an airfield...

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    Post  ALAMO Fri Oct 14, 2022 11:51 am

    You are still trying to convince someone, who does not want to be convinced Laughing Laughing
    This is an absolute example of idee fix.
    He does not care about the facts, any of them.
    One of his last declarations I noticed was about Russkie not using the ATGMs Laughing Laughing Laughing when there is not a single day without some footage with those being used on a mass scale, by the infantry, armored vehicles, choppers, whatever.
    He does not want to see and will deny everything presented. He gives a fuk about facts, documents, and everything.
    There is no point in discussing with him, his theories are getting too ridiculous to be answered.
    He crossed the Rubicon, a point with no return.

    Russkie made close to 70 000 sorties in this war so far.
    That is 300 a day, on average.
    The Internet is full of movies made from both the ground and cockpits.
    Multiple materials where soldiers cheer the aviation, tons of footage of how they bomb the shit out of the Ukrs.
    Hundreds of materials where struck the targets using precision-guided ammo, let it be Ch-29, 59, 101, 555, Izd. 305, ATGMs ...
    We witness a mass usage of R-77, R-33/37 ...
    One must be VERY stubborn not to see them, while there are overwhelming in numbers.
    That reminds me a 5y/o, who covers his head with a blanket being sure that nobody sees him.
    Let him be. It is a mental thing I suppose.

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    Isos
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    Post  Isos Fri Oct 14, 2022 11:59 am

    I understand the panic... 8 months and the Ukraines air defence vehicles can survive by using optical mode and moving a lot like the Russians do with their air defence systems... so how long will HATO last against Russian AD... and the answer is not very long at all.

    If the 50 migs that ukraine had could survive for more than 8 months and if the ukro mi-24 could make a bomb run behind russian lines in a city, nato doesn't need to worry at all.

    You are still trying to convince someone, who does not want to be convinced Laughing Laughing
    This is an absolute example of idee fix.
    He does not care about the facts, any of them

    This war showed that the russian army and their weapons are not as good as they thought.

    Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod  a russian city.

    On the ground the numerical advantage is in favour of ukraine so the slow advance is understandable. But in the air russia should have had a totally free sky. It's almost 1 year they fight systems they designed and operate. They should know how to hunt them.

    Making loops with 3d thrust vectoring su-35 isn't a good training. They should have trained how to work in team and create tactics.

    They should ask israel for help. They are the vest when it comes to use effectively their air force.

    So it's you who doesn't want to see the reality.
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    Post  ALAMO Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:01 pm

    Yes, yes, all is just fine.
    Take the piles. All of them, this time. The blue one too!

    As we are saying here, sometimes it is much better to just stay quiet, and let people consider you an idiot, rather than opening your mouth and making them sure of it.
    Your chance is long gone.

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    Post  Isos Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:04 pm

    ALAMO wrote:Yes, yes, all is just fine.
    Take the piles. All of them, this time. The blue one too!

    Go cry a little. It helps facing reality. Your mighty army is still fighting inside Donbass that they still have liberated.
    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:05 pm

    ALAMO wrote:Yes, yes, all is just fine.
    Take the piles. All of them, this time. The blue one too!

    As we are saying here, sometimes it is much better to just stay quiet, and let people consider you an idiot, rather than opening your mouth and making them sure of it.
    Your chance is long gone.  

    Do you have a free place in the zoo, it's obvious that there are more endangered species ?

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    Post  ALAMO Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:10 pm

    Nah, he is funny.
    Laughing Laughing Laughing
    One day he figures out a river canoe with a barrage of cruise missiles, and on the other day, claiming things you can just watch as non existing.

    And just take a look, at how declarative he is while claiming that bullshit in open Laughing Laughing

    That must be some mental issue, no other way would one make himself an idiot in front of a wide audience. Voluntarily!

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    Isos
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    Post  Isos Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:25 pm


    And just take a look, at how declarative he is while claiming that bullshit in open Laughing Laughing

    Again I'm still waiting you to tell me which thing I said is wrong.

    Su-34 doesn't go for deep strike. That's true.

    Su-34 flying very low and only on the front because ukro SAMs too dangerous. True.

    Su-34 getting shot down even with jammers on by soviet old systems. It's true so there is no chance it pass accross NATO or Chinese defenses since they are way better than ukrainian defenses and in greater numbers.

    Iskander missed targets. It's true as shown. Not a bad system but not as good as advertized. Iranian BM can also do the same job and they have greater range.

    Ukro air force still flying. It's true.

    Mighty S-400 and pantsir and tors not intercepting two mi-24 that bomb a city accross the frontline, not just the border but the frontline that is covered with radar and SAMs AND protected by sukhois. It's also true which suggests nuclear tomahawks can go bomb Moscow easily.

    Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.

    Russian army can't take a city accross the border. True again. See kharkov. And they prepared for this war since 2014.

    This is real. But you don't want to see it. You just keep repeating russians are best and that I'm a fool. I know it hurts your feelings tp read this but this is reality.

    Like we say in french "only truth hurt". Now have fun replying if you want I'm leaving this thread.

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    Post  ALAMO Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:34 pm

    Oh, you took the blue one as I see! Good boy!
    The potency is back, while the mind is gone.
    Enjoy!

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    Post  Department Of Defense Fri Oct 14, 2022 1:13 pm

    Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
    The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises and Indian Mig 21 was shot down in a real conflict by a combination of Errie Eye and F-16 of the Pakistani Air Force.
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    Post  Mir Fri Oct 14, 2022 1:25 pm

    Department Of Defense wrote:
    Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
    The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises and Indian Mig 21 was shot down in a real conflict by a combination of Errie Eye and F-16 of the Pakistani Air Force.

    You mean Chinese and Israeli electronics?
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    Post  Podlodka77 Fri Oct 14, 2022 1:30 pm

    Mir wrote:
    Department Of Defense wrote:
    Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
    The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises and Indian Mig 21 was shot down in a real conflict by a combination of Errie Eye and F-16 of the Pakistani Air Force.

    You mean Chinese and Israeli electronics?


    ALAMO had more posts yesterday than the idiot you reply to in 9 years... Laughing  Laughing  Laughing

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    Post  Mir Fri Oct 14, 2022 1:37 pm

    He sounds very important though! What a Face
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    Post  Podlodka77 Fri Oct 14, 2022 1:42 pm

    Mir wrote:He sounds very important though! What a Face


    He's just as important as this budding French moron, but at least the French is far more active. He is starting to look more and more like RTN.
    But is there fuel in France ?

    🇫🇷⚡France has 2,500 gas stations without fuel, and almost 2,000 gas stations with a partial shortage

    Su-34 Tactical Bomber: News #2 - Page 11 Photo_17
    Map of the Rafale superstate with locations where there are fuel shortages....

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    Post  Isos Fri Oct 14, 2022 1:52 pm

    Podlodka77 wrote:
    Mir wrote:He sounds very important though! What a Face


    He's just as important as this budding French moron, but at least the French is far more active. He is starting to look more and more like RTN.
    But is there fuel in France ?

    🇫🇷⚡France has 2,500 gas stations without fuel, and almost 2,000 gas stations with a partial shortage

    Su-34 Tactical Bomber: News #2 - Page 11 Photo_17
    Map of the Rafale superstate with locations where there are fuel shortages....

    Another lie and fake news.

    There is no shortage of fuel. It's just worker on strike that want salary rises.

    I guess lying to not face the hard rdality is one of your hobbies. lol1
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    Post  zepia Fri Oct 14, 2022 5:30 pm

    Department Of Defense wrote:
    Isos wrote:Rafale jammed a S-300. Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.
    The Russian electronics industry is at least two generation behind the West. Chinese Su 35s were jammed, outgunned by Thailand's Gripens during exercises


    Chinese Su-35S never been here.
    That famous (propagandized) exercise was between some version of J-11 vs Gripen C/D.

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    Post  Belisarius Fri Oct 14, 2022 7:10 pm

    Although videos of Su-34 flying and attacking at high altitude have already been shown here, Isos persists in stating that the Su-34 only flies low dunno
    Mir is right, it is better not to invest the time and knowledge in responding, all we will get in return is pure unadulterated BS.

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    Post  Mir Fri Oct 14, 2022 8:28 pm

    Belisarius wrote:Although videos of Su-34 flying and attacking at high altitude have already been shown here, Isos persists in stating that the Su-34 only flies low dunno
    Mir is right, it is better not to invest the time and knowledge in responding, all we will get in return is pure unadulterated BS.

    The most interesting aspect is that the Su-34 only makes attacks at low altitude to avoid being targeted by BUK missiles BUT at the same time it never enters Ukrainian airspace whilst doing so dunno Neutral

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    Post  Tsavo Lion Fri Oct 14, 2022 8:31 pm

    Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod a russian city.
    The Su-34s r being used mostly as stand-off missile trucks- no need to repeat that Syrian shootdown; the 2 Mi-24s raid was an act of desperation & propaganda stunt, as they don't have long range MLRS to strike far from inside Ukraine w/o being wiped out 1st or retaliated against. Let's see if they can repeat it again.

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    Post  GarryB Sat Oct 15, 2022 4:27 am

    If the 50 migs that ukraine had could survive for more than 8 months and if the ukro mi-24 could make a bomb run behind russian lines in a city, nato doesn't need to worry at all.

    Actually that is not true in many ways.

    First of all the MiGs and Hinds that the Ukraine are using now were either kept hidden away and not flown all this time, or are recent imports from east european countries sending them their old stocks, which are presumably fixed up and send in and set up at some dispersed site and the first time they take off they get shot down.

    HATO needs to worry because they are an air power based military force... they can't bury their aircraft in the sand and then dig them up 8 months later when they think they might need them.

    Worse for HATO, they have minimum AD because their air power is both their air defence and their attack method so all losses are multiplied because when they use their air power for attack or defence any aircraft lost will weaken both their attack strength and their ability to defend themselves... which means they probably don't have enough aircraft right now because during normal operations they are going to lose a lot of aircraft very very quickly.

    They have HATO C4IR planning so a sneak attack could be mounted, but how often have they continued that method of attack?

    Could it be because they are losing helicopters so quickly that they could not afford to use that as a regular thing and as a one off it is impressive in terms of bravery, but it is not going to continue to get results over and over because next time they will just get shot down.

    Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod a russian city.

    They flew one sneaky mission and all of a sudden the Mi-24 is better than the Su-34 that has been hammering them for 8 months?

    On the ground the numerical advantage is in favour of ukraine so the slow advance is understandable

    You might be watching a different conflict... the orcs didn't advance anywhere in the first part of this conflict. Later on, like around Kiev and Snake island they withdrew because they had achieved their goals and were becoming vulnerable to enemy artillery... when they withdrew the Orcs tried to sneak in in both cases and declare victory... around Kiev that seemed to work because the Russians withdrew, but with Snake Island those orcs got hammered a few times after the Russians left which was amusing.

    The point is that apart from those instances the only advances the Orcs have made have been over the last month or so with overwhelming numbers of cannon fodder with foreign mercs in control, but recently even that has been stopped and is in the process of being reversed if you are paying attention... even before the extra Russian troops arrive to the front line.

    But in the air russia should have had a totally free sky. It's almost 1 year they fight systems they designed and operate. They should know how to hunt them.

    Really? After almost 80 days... nearly three months the Serb air defence was largely still intact after HATO did their best...

    Almost like Soviet based air defences are something HATO can't deal with either.

    They should ask israel for help. They are the vest when it comes to use effectively their air force.

    Israel can't even fly over Syria... what would their advice be.... shoot the teenagers holding rocks?

    Go cry a little. It helps facing reality. Your mighty army is still fighting inside Donbass that they still have liberated.

    Ironic coming from someone who is French... most of your colonies in Africa want you to leave these days because you have more criminal ties to the local terrorists than to the local army and police... you are not interested in peace or law and order... it is war that fills your coffers... which is why you worship the US... the warmonger supreme.

    Su-34 doesn't go for deep strike. That's true.

    Su-34 flying very low and only on the front because ukro SAMs too dangerous. True.

    Saying something is true does not make it so.

    Su-34 getting shot down even with jammers on by soviet old systems. It's true so there is no chance it pass accross NATO or Chinese defenses since they are way better than ukrainian defenses and in greater numbers.

    You are right, Russia should start using cruise missiles against radar and intel assets in HATO to prevent them detecting and tracking their aircraft in Ukrainian airspace.


    Iskander missed targets. It's true as shown. Not a bad system but not as good as advertized. Iranian BM can also do the same job and they have greater range.

    Your opinion only and likely wrong.


    Ukro air force still flying. It's true.

    But now Polish and Georgian airframes.... it is not a question of the ability of the Russian air defence to shoot them down, but their ability to be supplied by HATO.

    Mighty S-400 and pantsir and tors not intercepting two mi-24 that bomb a city accross the frontline, not just the border but the frontline that is covered with radar and SAMs AND protected by sukhois. It's also true which suggests nuclear tomahawks can go bomb Moscow easily.

    Desperate much... perhaps flying over a french fishing boat means the CdG is vulnerable to being destroyed too?

    Because obviously the air defences near some small border area are exactly the same as a countries capital city... still the only city on the planet with its own dedicated ABM defence system.


    Rafale jammed a S-300.

    But can it shoot down a spitfire, and you do understand that Russian S-300s have home on jam capacity if you want to try to jam the radar of the S-300 or S-400 for that matter.

    Russia has tens of thousands of AD vehicles....

    Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.

    Even assuming that is true that logic does not prove the Rafale would survive operating over BUK systems either.

    So the result is that air power is useless over a Russian air defence network.

    Russian army can't take a city accross the border. True again. See kharkov. And they prepared for this war since 2014.

    The orcs were preparing in 2014, the Russians prepared for this war for perhaps a month at best.

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Sat Oct 15, 2022 9:21 am

    Mir wrote:He sounds very important though! What a Face

    At this rate, my zoo cages will be overcrowded soon!
    Good that I can weld, will make some rearrangements Laughing Laughing

    Mir wrote:
    The most interesting aspect is that the Su-34 only makes attacks at low altitude to avoid being targeted by BUK missiles BUT at the same time it never enters Ukrainian airspace whilst doing so dunno Neutral

    There are tons of materials with 34s dropping FABs, ODABs, all you want. I remember even footage of it releasing S-24.
    One must be simply blind or retarded in some other way to deny that.
    But what would one expect from someone who is making claims taken straight from the arse, and being obviously wrong just from the beginning?
    It is a mental issue as I said, and Podlodka had a good observation - he is really closing in on being dumb to the RTN level.
    That is an impressive achievement.

    By the way, I am not sure what do you Garry even try to discuss with him. The arrivals on the airfield are obviously made by artillery and considering the size of blast zone I would bet Uragan or Smerch. It has nothing to do with Iskander, while we have tens of materials where the Iskanders are targeting with enormous precision.
    Hell, I would say that ALL Russkie missiles present the precision that even I was not expecting from those, especially for the old-generation pieces like Ch-22.

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    Isos
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    Post  Isos Sat Oct 15, 2022 10:13 am

    GarryB wrote:
    If the 50 migs that ukraine had could survive for more than 8 months and if the ukro mi-24 could make a bomb run behind russian lines in a city, nato doesn't need to worry at all.

    Actually that is not true in many ways.

    First of all the MiGs and Hinds that the Ukraine are using now were either kept hidden away and not flown all this time, or are recent imports from east european countries sending them their old stocks, which are presumably fixed up and send in and set up at some dispersed site and the first time they take off they get shot down.

    HATO needs to worry because they are an air power based military force... they can't bury their aircraft in the sand and then dig them up 8 months later when they think they might need them.

    Worse for HATO, they have minimum AD because their air power is both their air defence and their attack method so all losses are multiplied because when they use their air power for attack or defence any aircraft lost will weaken both their attack strength and their ability to defend themselves... which means they probably don't have enough aircraft right now because during normal operations they are going to lose a lot of aircraft very very quickly.

    They have HATO C4IR planning so a sneak attack could be mounted, but how often have they continued that method of attack?

    Could it be because they are losing helicopters so quickly that they could not afford to use that as a regular thing and as a one off it is impressive in terms of bravery, but it is not going to continue to get results over and over because next time they will just get shot down.

    Instead of su-34 flying above Kharkiv, a city accross the border, it's ukro mi-24 that bomb Belgrod  a russian city.

    They flew one sneaky mission and all of a sudden the Mi-24 is better than the Su-34 that has been hammering them for 8 months?

    On the ground the numerical advantage is in favour of ukraine so the slow advance is understandable

    You might be watching a different conflict... the orcs didn't advance anywhere in the first part of this conflict. Later on, like around Kiev and Snake island they withdrew because they had achieved their goals and were becoming vulnerable to enemy artillery... when they withdrew the Orcs tried to sneak in in both cases and declare victory... around Kiev that seemed to work because the Russians withdrew, but with Snake Island those orcs got hammered a few times after the Russians left which was amusing.

    The point is that apart from those instances the only advances the Orcs have made have been over the last month or so with overwhelming numbers of cannon fodder with foreign mercs in control, but recently even that has been stopped and is in the process of being reversed if you are paying attention... even before the extra Russian troops arrive to the front line.

    But in the air russia should have had a totally free sky. It's almost 1 year they fight systems they designed and operate. They should know how to hunt them.

    Really?  After almost 80 days... nearly three months the Serb air defence was largely still intact after HATO did their best...

    Almost like Soviet based air defences are something HATO can't deal with either.

    They should ask israel for help. They are the vest when it comes to use effectively their air force.

    Israel can't even fly over Syria... what would their advice be.... shoot the teenagers holding rocks?

    Go cry a little. It helps facing reality. Your mighty army is still fighting inside Donbass that they still have liberated.

    Ironic coming from someone who is French... most of your colonies in Africa want you to leave these days because you have more criminal ties to the local terrorists than to the local army and police... you are not interested in peace or law and order... it is war that fills your coffers... which is why you worship the US... the warmonger supreme.

    Su-34 doesn't go for deep strike. That's true.

    Su-34 flying very low and only on the front because ukro SAMs too dangerous. True.

    Saying something is true does not make it so.

    Su-34 getting shot down even with jammers on by soviet old systems. It's true so there is no chance it pass accross NATO or Chinese defenses since they are way better than ukrainian defenses and in greater numbers.

    You are right, Russia should start using cruise missiles against radar and intel assets in HATO to prevent them detecting and tracking their aircraft in Ukrainian airspace.


    Iskander missed targets. It's true as shown. Not a bad system but not as good as advertized. Iranian BM can also do the same job and they have greater range.

    Your opinion only and likely wrong.


    Ukro air force still flying. It's true.

    But now Polish and Georgian airframes.... it is not a question of the ability of the Russian air defence to shoot them down, but their ability to be supplied by HATO.

    Mighty S-400 and pantsir and tors not intercepting two mi-24 that bomb a city accross the frontline, not just the border but the frontline that is covered with radar and SAMs AND protected by sukhois. It's also true which suggests nuclear tomahawks can go bomb Moscow easily.

    Desperate much... perhaps flying over a french fishing boat means the CdG is vulnerable to being destroyed too?

    Because obviously the air defences near some small border area are exactly the same as a countries capital city... still the only city on the planet with its own dedicated ABM defence system.


    Rafale jammed a S-300.

    But can it shoot down a spitfire, and you do understand that Russian S-300s have home on jam capacity if you want to try to jam the radar of the S-300 or S-400 for that matter.

    Russia has tens of thousands of AD vehicles....

    Su-34 getting shot down by old soviet buk despit having jammers. Rafale tech superior to su-34. Rafale > su-34. True again.

    Even assuming that is true that logic does not prove the Rafale would survive operating over BUK systems either.

    So the result is that air power is useless over a Russian air defence network.

    Russian army can't take a city accross the border. True again. See kharkov. And they prepared for this war since 2014.

    The orcs were preparing in 2014, the Russians prepared for this war for perhaps a month at best.



    lol1

    Seriously ?! You are just like Alamo. Even when I provide proof you close your eyes and say "your opinion". lol1
    Werewolf
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    Post  Werewolf Sat Oct 15, 2022 12:49 pm

    Isos wrote:
    Seriously ?! You are just like Alamo. Even when I provide proof you close your eyes and say "your opinion". lol1

    Proof requires evidence backed up by source on which you rely on to make claims.

    I haven't seen a single source you have posted to backup your claims, yet, you constantly rely on RCS as one of your main argumentative points. A marketing point I might add.

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