Russian special military operation in Ukraine #27

ALAMO wrote:

Hm.
I have heard once quite an interesting opinion.
American war for independence was carried out while the Brits were starting to reach an apogee of the imperial status and might.
Industrial revolution was already going on, bringing wealth, mass production, and lowering the cost of mobilization&equipment of both army and navy.
On the other side, it brought some instability and social disorders, as the rural population structure was twisted.
That made just a perfect occasion to increase the army ranks, while the cannon fodder was served cold, and the equipment was much less expensive than a decade earlier.
England was humiliated by the oversea defeat, which increased the position of France on the same wave.
How was that possible, that the war was carried careless, without placing much attention to it, and - what is most bizarre - how the empire was not trying to make a second attempt, this time seriously?
Maybe it has a second ground there? Like making an overseas beachhead that can be used for other purposes later? Far away from the European bulldog fights? Objectively safe, with waste resources and landmass to subdue?

I think Britain lost America for a few reasons. America wasn't just British. It was French, Dutch and various others. The original breakaway part was only a small part of what is the USA now. A separate Establishment had developed so Britain couldn't control it. They also saw much ripe to pillage in the 3rd World - where they had a technological advantage.

The English language meant that the US and British Establishment have/had some common links. But America planned to destroy the British Empire in the 1920s - but Hitler did that for them. America destroyed Europe and came to dominate the World by 1945.

Both scummy empires, run by absolute cocksuckers. They don't even respect their own people let alone other countries.

People think Britain is prosperous. Well "average" income are good. But the average is distorted by a very small number of VERY well off silverspoon wankers who have no talent but big inheritance and lots of cronyism. There are vast numbers of very poor people in Britain. Very different to say Germany or Holland as I see it.

The overprivileged Establishment is one reason why its overseas policy is so toxic and scummy. America has many similarities. Hence the label "Anglo" cultures.

Mir wrote:

ALAMO wrote:
Ukro army consists of light forces driving pickups. ISIS-style at its best.
Transport of troops on the battlefield is being carried by civilian buses. Taxis. Ambulances. Bloody school buses
They are advancing in the M113 remembering 70s, hoping not to meet anything on the way.

Well they do have this you know!
A game changer for sure!

That "car" is even more moronic than the "catapult" the vermin made in "Eurogayden Square" in 2014. A pathetic subspecies indeed.I used to call them "the Welsh of the USSR". In retrospect, that would be unkind on the Welsh.. : /

JohninMK wrote:The optimist in me sees these advances as Pyrrhic victories.

All these territories the AFU are capturing are soon going to become a trap for them. Once captured, the burden will be on the AFU to supply and defend these territories at all costs.

Unlike the Russians who simply get out of the way, the AFU will probably stand and die. These AFU propaganda victories, gained at high cost.

In a few weeks the RF could be moving back in, encircling the AFU and wiping them out.

EDIT

This is one of the best background explanations I have read on why things are being driven intentionally slowly by the Russians.

"The way I keep looking at the Russia SMO in Ukraine is as part of the bigger civilization war going on and how the timing of activity in Ukraine has to fit in with the financial component of the war.

I see the Russia/China axis as trying to not let empire have its war as cover as its financial system collapses.....timing is important and so keeping the Ukraine game going at a lower level gives time for financial collapse.

I have no doubt that Russia has the ability to secure the regions it is operating in if it wanted to. But a bigger war is going on and the Ukraine SMO is just the most public facing part."

I could be wrong here, but isnt the brilliant NATO tactic we are seeing the last few weeks simply a copy of the "poor Russian strategy" they where mocking at the start of the SMO? They are just rushing in mobile groups from village to village as fast as they can in whatever they have on wheels. They main difference obviously beeing they dont have to worry as much about heavy equipment because they simply dont have much of that left anyway. And obviously they have a vast numerical advantage, which was not the case when the Russians did it.

Should not be too hard for the Russians to figure out how to counter this then.

It seems to me the Russians are having a harder time taking out the fuel and the fodder as it accumulates and before it attacks. Would be a good place to start i think.

Mir wrote:

ALAMO wrote:
Ukro army consists of light forces driving pickups. ISIS-style at its best.
Transport of troops on the battlefield is being carried by civilian buses. Taxis. Ambulances. Bloody school buses
They are advancing in the M113 remembering 70s, hoping not to meet anything on the way.

Well they do have this you know!
A game changer for sure!

I wouldnt find this funny if they are advancing in russian territory with those contraptions.

flamming_python wrote:

AlfaT8 wrote:I know this isnt a football game, the strategy is clearly comes from the Syrian war, that being said.
Continuosly losing ground, over and over again, is going to bring many to question this one note strategy, as well as the competance of the MoD and the kremlin in general.

Why allow the opponent to continue to recieve commands to do this.

Your enemy is being well drawn in, now decapitate their command and control, blind them,surround them and slaugther them.

When will the order be given i wonder?

The Russian counter-advance will begin when the enemy has lost all capacity to advance further themselves. Or they have got to somewhere which Russia does not feel like giving up.
Why interrupt them?
The present strategy of allowing them to come to you and out of their fortifications is working perfectly well to minimize own losses while increasing enemy losses

There is more to it.
Because the districts under attack, are now considered part of the Russian Federation by Moscow, the correct thing to do is hold a UNSC meeting and submit a resolution that the Russian Federation is under attack from Ukraine. Of course the west will veto any such resolution, but then Russia has the right to go ahead and defend itself.

There are no rules in war.
I think that Russia may not be planning to immediately retake Izyum or Liman, but may be planning to attack in other directions. The liberation of the Donetsk region is certainly a priority.
Why should Russia limit itself to Donetsk, Lugansk, Kherson or Zaporozhye, because I don't think they will do that either. I think it is best to hit the areas bordering Russia.
I strongly doubt that Russia will go only for the immediate liberation of those small towns like Izyum or Liman, but that they will expand and enlarge the front. So yes, the second largest city Kharkov must fall.

Arrow wrote:I wonder what it is? Could Peresvet in action?

https://twitter.com/nft47/status/1577344472702238730?s=20&t=lSZZsKarOnIqlwcXLBQBbA

They said one was visible in Moscow as well. I assume they shoot up light that scatters in the upper atmosphere, reducing the effectiveness of foreign spy satellites, or possibly they target foreign satellites and over-saturate their cameras. Not sure, however. They're definitely not high energy lasers for melting metal.

Podlodka77 wrote:There are no rules in war.
I think that Russia may not be planning to immediately retake Izyum or Liman, but may be planning to attack in other directions. The liberation of the Donetsk region is certainly a priority.
Why should Russia limit itself to Donetsk, Lugansk, Kherson or Zaporozhye, because I don't think they will do that either. I think it is best to hit the areas bordering Russia.
I strongly doubt that Russia will go only for the immediate liberation of those small towns like Izyum or Liman, but that they will expand and enlarge the front.  So yes, the second largest city Kharkov must fall.

The UkroNazis around Liman have no 2nd echelon. Their lines are thinner then the deliberatly thin russian lines were. Now there are rumours about some counter-offensive (or is it a counter-counter-offensive?) mounting from Belgorod. 

I hope they permanently blind a bunch of NATO spy satellites with it in retaliation for the NS1+2 sabotage.

More than 70 thousand people decided to sign up to volunteer through the "State Services".
This was stated by Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Chernyshenko.

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/status/1577353045884674048/photo/1

So seems those lights are to blind spy satelites

Does it mean Russian is moving massive armament around borders, and doent want spy satelytes to notice it, for a massive counterattack?

If the Ukro Nazis are getting slaughtered, why are they able to advance and overun Russian territories? Something here doesn't add up..

Because there are a lot of them?

If Russia has 500 troops defending somewhere who then manage to retreat without getting captured or ambushed, while the other side is even admitting over having 20k casualties over the past month from its offensives - so then do the maths yourself. Who is going to run out of troops first?

More important, the next battle one side starts with new troops, while for the other side their troops now know what they were taught and what they are doing works.

If the HATO trained side are relying on cannon fodder charges what level of training are they trying to achieve... sounds to me like they train them up to a certain level and then give them drugs and get them to march towards the Russian positions and when they get to saturation point and start to fall back they send more cannon fodder for them to shell and shoot and then the HATO trained forces come up behind to occupy these now empty positions... seems these rear guys are the ones they should be trying to kill the most... but by all means clean up the easy stuff first.

Not heard of the balls before, steel shards yes.

TASS - Ukrainian army uses outlawed US weapons - on Monday Ukrainian forces attacked the city of Starobelsk with a US-made HIMARS multiple launch rocket system. The rocket was filled with shrapnel - tungsten balls.
The rocket that hit a childcare center in Starobelsk was made in 2017.

This is a confirmation that in defiance of all conventions the Americans continue to produce and use ammunition that is prohibited by international law.

Technically any weapon used against a childcare centre is a war crime if there are children there and it is a child care centre and not an HQ.

Ball fragments are widely used... Claymore mines use steel balls pressed into a sheet of plastic explosive... some attack hand grenades use very small steel balls for close range lethality.

Continuosly losing ground, over and over again, is going to bring many to question this one note strategy, as well as the competance of the MoD and the kremlin in general.

Why allow the opponent to continue to recieve commands to do this.

Your enemy is being well drawn in, now decapitate their command and control, blind them,surround them and slaugther them.

When will the order be given i wonder?

The Orcs changed tactics by digging in and using static defences, all the while building up troop numbers and equipment levels... so the Russians adopted a mobile defence to entice the enemy to come out of their prepared positions to fight out in the open which was very effective because their artillery and air power was very effective against troops in the open.

The Orcs shifted to sending in their reserves and overwhelming the Russian defences... but even then the Russian forces are maintaining order and withdrawing at complete units now, not leaving things behind and not losing soldiers either dead or as POWs.

If they decapitate the Orcs now they will have some time to recover and then when the Russian reinforcements arrive and it is Russian forces overwhelming the enemy forces and pushing them backwards they might have restored some order to their chain of command.

If they synchronise it properly it will be rather more effective.

The present strategy of allowing them to come to you and out of their fortifications is working perfectly well to minimize own losses while increasing enemy losses

Not to mention it also strips them of their meatshields to hide behind...

Of course the west will veto any such resolution, but then Russia has the right to go ahead and defend itself.

But Russia has the right to defend itself... UNSC resolutions are written on two ply.

I think that Russia may not be planning to immediately retake Izyum or Liman, but may be planning to attack in other directions.

If the enemy are light mobile forces then an encirclement and cutting off supplies and resources and support would be a very good start, with armoured formations smashing them like a tank will smash a Humvee any day of the week.

Does it mean Russian is moving massive armament around borders, and doent want spy satelytes to notice it, for a massive counterattack?

They don't want the US to see what they are doing... whether that is a massive counterattack or if it is to give the impression of a massive counter attack remains to be seen.

VARGR198 wrote:

https://twitter.com/DagnyTaggart963/status/1577401137074180096

So seems those lights are to blind spy satelites

ghost of kherson also tweeted, 1500km range, wonder if the sources about that were stated before

flamming_python wrote:

Big_Gazza wrote:IMHO the very fact that Russia is going to adopt the 4 regions into the Federation is clear evidence that the Kremlin and the general staff is fully confident that Russian forces will fully triumph over the Ukrops, reagrdless of its troop levels and NATO support.  Otherwise, if the Ukrops continued to advance into newly-ascended Russian territory then Russia would suffer a crushing political defeat and a loss of face, and the Kremlin isn't about to risk any such thing.

I hate seeing the orcs take any territory, and knowing that they are losing equipment and bleeding out into dirt isn't much of a salve, but its a temporary aberration, and once the Russian army finally takes off the gloves and gets stuck in, these Ukro trash will be simply eradicated.  Once Russian armoured columns are cutting through Ukro territory, peeps are gonna quickly forget the current reversals, and the Twattersphere will be full of wailing hysterical bandera morons crying in despair and disbelief.

A little patience is all that is needed.  All good things come to those who wait...  

The gloves are off

This is the way the war is being fought. And the tactics against the latest Ukrainian/NATO offensive mirror those of Kutuzov and Barclay de Tolly. And these tactics weren't popular amongst the troops and presumably the population during the war against Napoleon either. But all that was forgotten when they worked and Napoleon was defeated.

You guys are just going to have to get used to that. Whether doomer or 'gloves will come off any minute now!' guy. Russia will roll with the punches and then roll the Ukrainian forces up like a rug once they fully exhaust and over-extend themselves.
While the 'gloves', as mentioned previously, are already fully off and the Ukrainian forces are suffering large attritional damage at every turn

Allow me to clarify that by "gloves are coming of" I mean that troop levels are finally being boosted to parity with the orcs, thereby taking away the enemies sole advantage. I also expect that the targetting restrictions within the SMO defintion will be loosened and the army can now start striking the heart of the regime (its a limited sort of war where you're not levelling the enemies telecommunications, ministry buildings, armed forces and intel HQs, presidential office, as well as vital civilian services). In general, I have no doubt that the front line commanders and their troops are giving it their all, and no mercy is being shown to the nazi filth and their western merc trash.

Other than that, yeah I fully agree.

AFU captured Snigiryovka, one of the cities that voted to join the Russian Federation in the referendum.

VARGR198 wrote:

https://twitter.com/DagnyTaggart963/status/1577401137074180096

So seems those lights are to blind spy satelites

Or it's not.

https://twitter.com/RWApodcast/status/1577401237661749279

It's Sputnik day guys

flamming_python wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

kvs wrote:The chicken little hysterics have no clue about the resource effort to secure every km of a 1200 km front.   They expect Russia to be exerting
the same effort all along this line.  Instead Russian forces are doing the appropriate thing and controlling relevant territory while waves
of Ukr cannon fodder expend themselves in PR "victories".   The armchair generals make up their own metrics of success and fail Russia
for not meeting them.  

I wonder what kind of fanboy remark you would make if the russians lost Kherson, not that I think they will but it would be funny to see the fanboys try to defend that one

The largest settlement the Ukrainians have recaptured so far is Krasnyj Liman. Pre-war population - 20,000. And just a short advance from the front-line back in September.

Quite a leap to go from that to Kherson, population nearly 300,000 and a regional capital.

Why not suppose the Ukrainians will capture Donetsk, or hell Belgorod next?

Largest settlement so far was Izyum with 50000 pre-war population!

Belgorod or Donetsk is realistic! Thank God Russia has mobilized a few man, without an incursion would be highly likely.

You think I'm crazy??? Then please explaine to me what is the difference between the new Russian territories and Belgorod? I don't get it! Are the new Russian territories not Russian enough? Only 2nd class citizens and 2nd class territory? So the life of someone in Liman is less worth than the life of a Russian in Belgorod?

Where are the red lines? Moscow?

Arrow wrote:It looks impressive.

Clearly there is a shadow war going on that we are not remotely aware of, Putin not only bring the heavy artillery, but also the scifi weaponry.
Shits getting real down there.