The Su 34 cost $36MM according to Western media. Take a 50% haircut and call it $18MM. You could buy 900 Iranian attack drones for that price. Guess which will have a bigger impact on the battlefield. Best $20k the Russian MOD ever spent.
For a weak nation drones are fantastic, but those drones can't fly 4,000km and hit targets with 1,500kg bombs... an Su-34M probably costs a little more but is vastly more versatile than a small suicide drone.
The best solution is of course to use both, but drones are popular in the west because they are visual... they are excellent propaganda devices sending back video of their kills to a public who want to see blood.
In many ways it started with US video of cruise missiles flying into windows in buildings... it is very much entertaining the blood thirsty masses by throwing the Christians to the lions.
Most important when the reason for the conflict is to make some rich
Russia has all the reasons in the world to do what it is doing...
I will go apeshit if I ever see a T-14 in ukraines hands.
Makes it pretty damn useless if it cannot be used for fear of failure or capture or compromise...
Why on earth would a 500cc 2 stroke air cooled engine that has to last for less then 5 hours cost 20K? That is ABSURD. I would estimate manufacturing cost in high volume to be around $3-500. A V12 Mercury outboard with 600 hp is only 77K retail. That is a gem of an engine that will last for thousands of hours.
Indeed... it is a 50hp engine that does not even have to run for one day, it is ridiculous... I suspect China charges that because that is what Iran had to pay for it.
I would expect if Russia is buying them and producing them themselves perhaps they are making their own engines and that might be part of the deal... Russia makes their own version of Irans drone and they replace a lot of the pieces with their own equipment where it is currently better, and perhaps make their own engine... where Iran makes money on each one they make and also have the opportunity of buying Russian components that will probably be much cheaper than components they are buying from the rest of the world.
That Chinese engine that is a copy likely costs much less to make but they charge that because of the risk of breaking US sanctions and the effect that would have for them selling products to the US which is a much larger market for such engines.
No need to worry as come winter the Russians, armed with new strategy, tactics, training, and technology from the lessons of the SMO will be attacking exhausted and battered Ukrainians at a mere 1:3 numerical disadvantage instead of the 10:1 they have been laboring under.
AFAIK there are no new troops on the front line yet and they have already pushed the Orcs back in a lot of places.
I demand FOABs to be dropped now
They have been trying to do this for years.
In many ways this will be useful. It also explains a few things too like threats to use nuclear weapons... all the BS in the west trying to get Russia to say it wont use them... infrastructure attacks on Russia are a condition for nuclear retaliation. Also US senator demands to call Russia a terrorist state when they are clearly assisting a terrorist state themselves...
Now all those members who complained that bridges and rail links and major roads on supply lines into Ukraine had not been hit.... well if they were already down how would Russia escalate now?
There is a big fat whole in the car section of that bridge.
This sounds like it was a coordinated attack where a truck was detonated as a train carrying fuel was passing... you would need a suicide driver, or remote driving vehicle (Musk?) and you would need a satellite view that is live so you can set off the truck remotely as it drew level with the train.
That suggests a couple of things... firstly Harpoon is shit and so is Neptune because they would be the obvious way of attacking the bridge.
Secondly it makes the west complicit in attacking Russia in a terrorist act, Russia is now free to attack bridges and rail lines and infrastructure in the Ukraine... they could burn fields and destroy crops and food storage... all of which would be rather more devastating to the west and north of the Ukraine than blowing up some military targets with big bombs.
Of course many military targets they should be hitting hard too and perhaps now that they have crossed the red line and become a terrorist state Zelensky and his crew are now valid targets I would say... certainly their Rada should be targeted too.
The automobile section of the bridge is destroyed.
Two sections have dropped into the sea... they could fix that fairly quickly.
I never thought Russia would be dumb enough to allow the Kerch Strait Bridge to be destroyed. Well, it happened.
What's the response? A few more Kalibr and Iskander strikes tonight? Lol. It's a freaking joke.
The only way to prevent this is to have a border security search at each end of the bridge, which would have massively increased the time it takes to cross...
Escalation is certainly something that NATO and the Kiev terrorists desire at any cost. Pushing Russia into doing something real stupid, I mean dumber that what some of the things it has done so far Wink .
So far their escalations have been to Russias benefit because they don't instantly react... they find out what happened and then react in a measured way to cause least damage to themselves.
Something the EU could learn from really.
Ukraine has been calling Russia's bluff for 8 months and nothing has happened.
Actually the Ukraine has been desperately trying to do this for 8 months... it took this long.
But then terrorist activities is a forte of the west and HATO, they are working with consummate experts...
Every bridge, raill tunnel, airport, train station, power plant, government building in Ukraine needs to disappear. If Zelensky's toilet has a window in it he should fear taking a dump lest a missile fly through his window. Enough of this shit.
They need to take their time, work out exactly what happened and who precisely was needed to do this and then respond.
The interesting part about the video is that it makes it clear it was not any sort of IED. This was obviously a missile attack. The US media telegraphed this morning it would not supply Ukraine with ATACMS. Hopefully no one here was dumb enough to believe or spread that propaganda, and if they posted such nonsense, they should be banned for being a conspirator. This is clearly the work of such a weapon.
It makes it pretty clear that sitting on that section of road was probably a truck sized bomb that was blown up at the same time that that train came passed carrying fuel which was ignited by the explosion of the truck.
Lets see how Ukropi cities like having no water, gas, electricity, telecommunications...
For this attack to work they either needed a suicide driver or a remote control truck and a satellite view in real time.
Kiev cannot have done this on their own...
Any type of missile means that Russian AD around bridge fucked up. I believe that sea-skimming missiles were better choice than ATACMS.
If a missile could get through they would have done it months ago...
Not convinced it was a missile. I think that sabotage is more likely. If I had to guess I'd say demo charges were placed on both the road & rail bridge, and detonated when the fuel trucks of the goods train passed by.
If so, how did saboteurs operate undetected?
A truck full of explosive remote driven with live satellite link looking for the train and boom.
They actually destroyed the Kerch Strait Bridge entirely.
Don't you know? This was all according to plan.
A couple of spans of a road bridge... don't get so dramatic.
Why do they even make such retarded statements?
Because they don't have the luxury of speculating and making shit up and suggesting WWIII should now begin.
Pillars are still standing. Hence repair is not too hard, but will take probably months.
Why would it take months?
Those bridge sections were taken down precisely, not as a result of any general blast damage. Planted explosives on key structural items.
I would say the opposite.... if the explosives were placed they would not attack the pavement, they would attack the supports.... the pavement is easy to replace... supports not so much.
Ball is now in Russias court. Are they ready to move? I don't want them to act prematurely until the strike forces are ready to go, but this shit needs to be answered. Taking down Kievs civilian infrastucture would be a proper response.
Zelensky must have approved this act of terrorism... it explains all the talk about declaring Russia a terrorist state and also claiming Russia was going to use nukes... that was part of the propaganda that we should have seen as hinting an attack was imminent... of course so many potential targets...
Yep, and then they release false statements about 'fires' which becomes more ridiculous.
The fire is visible in the photo. You can assume the explosion that took out the road sections started the fire on the train but they are just reporting the facts.
Though the focus has to be now that Ukraine has ATACMS.
No, because ATACMs or Neptunes or Harpoons would have been shot down... or if they launched them in enormous numbers they wouldn't be wondering what happened.
Perhaps this will enrage the Russian population and increase the support for TOTAL WAR against NATzO
It already is total war against HATO... the question is, do you want to take more of the Ukraine or leave it for these animals?
I hope so, if the Russian leadership still continues to treat Pukrain with kids glove it will be the end of Russia,
People keep saying that but they are killing enemy troops in enormous numbers... you idiots wanting them to go harder essentially are saying you want them to kill more civilians... how American of you.
The student is now the teacher.
Does anyone ever wonder why the Russian MoD continues to downplay these obvious attacks?
Calling it a "fire" is the dumbest crap I have ever heard.
They said they are dealing with a fire.
They kept telling me the territorial losses were part of a plan, so I'm interested to understand their perspective on the latest developments.
If you were actually paying attention some of those territorial losses have been regained in the last week or so.
Yes this was done by remote charges as I said when taking down bridges you use explosives on the supports
Placed explosives would be used to bring down the supports and probably would not have set the passing train on fire.
An - emotional response - escalation is exactly what they want. Putin and his team are way too smart too fall for that trap. Ratheon and co. are already salivating at the prospect of escalation.
The other issue is that you factually need to know who to reliate against.
They want a panicked stupid response... they want Russia to lash out and prove they are the bad guys... you know... the sort of thing Putin never does... it shows how smart and gifted the west and HATO really is.
Thats just insanity, Ukraine carried out the attack. If I was Russia, I'd now be smashing every single power station in ukraine and keep things off.
I would be looking at the bridges and rail lines into Ukraine from Poland and the west and thinking about which to level and hit them every week or two so they can't be repaired or rebuilt.
Meanwhile trains in Ukraine continue to run bringing fuel, ammo and weapons from the west to kill Russian boys. I have said this so many times. The failure of interdiction kills Russians daily and it just gets worse. Why those rail lines, bridges and highways are allowed to run unmolested in the west is a big question.
Would be a good time to start hitting their supplies... just before winter... and any social impact could now be justified by they started it by trying to do the same to the Crimea.
Maybe next time Ukraine will take out some of the supports
A special forces team or a missile would normally be the preferred method, but they were clearly not an option because this bridge is protected from air attack and divers, so the truck was their only choice...
surprised it took them this long to make a terrorist move like this.
They are getting desperate... more and more foreigners being killed and captured on the front lines.... it sounds like it is not as much fun as fighting against lessor enemies in poorer countries... though most third world countries like Ukraine are resource rich but politically and economically and morally bankrupt...
Or did they plant the explosives and have some bugger unknowingly drive it across and detonated remotely by a following car?
Maybe Musk gave them an automatic driverless truck... a ground based drone...
Russia has so little deterrence that they (one of Zelensky's advisors) are literally telling you that yes, it was them who crossed your red lines.
An admission of guilt is always good in a court case and lack of remorse and a promise to do it again and more besides will be taken into account when the sentence is decided.
Incoming cope about how it's a plan to bait Putin into making emotion-based decisions. No, it's much simpler than that and can be explained by observing a simple kindergarten for 30 minutes. It's pure power play and Ukraine's brazen behaviour reflects a (perceived?) tipping point in the power dynamics.
I would say this regime has crossed a line... wonder what the next regime will do...
First, the U.S blew up Nord Stream pipeline and blamed Russia for this crime. Now the U.S is ratcheting up the nuclear attack threat.
Quite possible that the U.S will nuke a major European city and shift the blame to Russia.
Almost like testing the waters though... the attacks on gas to Europe is terrorism... like this attack on a bridge.... economic values rather than military purpose... calls by US senators to designate Russia a terrorist state and claiming Russia will use nuclear weapons in the Ukraine... no doubt they had lawyers pour over comments by Putin to see if that would mean they would use nukes if the US attacked the gas pipes or helped Ukraine damage the bridge in Crimea and they have clearly decided he wouldn't use nukes... but what will he do.
Million dollar question.
Personally I would go for decapitation strikes against Kiev... nothing he will sign is worth anything and if he is prepared to order terrorist attacks then he is more dangerous than useful.
Tough guy talk follows tough guy action - it's rather easy to sniff out fakers babbling about red lines but never following up on the threats.
This is not the battle of the bullies to see who is the most evil... the west won that prize years ago... that is why the rest of the world don't support them.
This is about a big country (Russia) dealing with a small bully (Ukraine) that was killing their own people for being too Russian.
Wiping out a larger percentage of civilians in the Ukraine by bombing them and cutting off their supplies does not help... cutting off the head of the person who is becoming less and less reasonable... he is mirroring Putin except without the dealt hand to do so.
Putin has said the longer this goes on the worse the options for Kiev will be, while Zelensky is saying Russia needs to retreat and give up everything including the Crimea before he will even talk.
One of them is never going to get their way.
What did I say about psychiatric wards the other day? Man it's a hard landing. Especially when you've structured your whole (online) identity around the imaginary greatness of some state halfway across the globe.
This incident is just further proof that one side is a terrorist side with support from terrorist enablers (they have a long history) and the other side reacts and for the last 8 years has wanted diplomacy to sort this out.
And yes it looks like a missile strike and the type that the US publicly declared that it won't supply the Ukraine with just 2 days ago
A missile would not have gotten through.
If it was planted explosives then why is the train on fire on the other bridge?
Looks like the missile hit one and clipped the other
But I do agree the damage on the automobile bridge looks rather clean
It was a truck bomb that was detonated as the train passed carrying fuel... the explosion was timed to set off the fuel which suggests remote detonation perhaps with a live satellite video feed.
Seems to be that the hands of Kremlin occupants have gotten a little soft over the last 20 years. We will find out soon whether they have what it takes, I personally am very skeptical
The west confuse intelligence with weakness... if Putin had over reacted to everything the west has done over the last 20 years Russia would not be in the position it is currently in at the moment.
The Russian response will be carefully considered.
Spread some missile debris around, hold them accountable anyway, and use it as a way to motivate the Russian population
I would say go to the UN and claim the truck was remote driven and supplied by Musk, the attack was coordinated in real time by satellite video links and the detonation command came from a western source... all supported by HATO to destroy civilian infrastructure to hurt a region of Russia... the Crimea...
The only question I have is, was it a suicide attack, or they have blown up some poor soul who was just driving his truck with cargo scratch
Anyway, ISIS roots are more and more obvious, so the antiterror operation is a clear solution
If there was anyone on board the truck they would have manually set the explosives off as the train was passing to try to ignite the fuel tanks on the train... which seems to have worked.
BTW millions of trains in Europe and the US carrying fuel and dangerous chemicals that could be targeted in a similar sort of attack.
Hopefully they had a dozen ISIS fighters for this attack all in the truck...
So does that mean Russia has or had about 1,200 - 1,600 of these things? Who woulda-thunk-it that these were ground mode capable, too, without radar targets? Well, not pro-Western forum experts - I remember such comments from 20 years ago.
Many in the west see the Kh-22 and the Tu-22M3 as being navy aircraft for sinking carriers, but actually they are land based strike aircraft that use bombs and also Kh-22s as heavy ARMs and land attack roles including bridges and buildings and storage sites, as well as major SAMs by destroying search and tracking radars with their rather large HE warheads.
All their anti ship missiles have been given land attack upgrades... most have radars the size of those fitted in modern fighters, though they are generally not expensive multimode sets they do have nice wide dishes for good discrimination and can see large buildings and bridges and the like and should be able to detect moving targets on the ground.
What we see is a clean cut section of Road , like It was cut by a knife ! An explosive knife .
Explosions often break things at their weakest points... a heavy explosion on a bridge creates a powerful down force that normally breaks the road surface near the supports and the fact that they are so thick means they come down in one piece.
The Russians , have only themselves to blame . The enemy is not to blame .
First of all this is a terrorist attack, and you blame the victim?
If Kiev could manage an attack with divers they would have blown up this bridge in a dozen places and instead of bringing down the paved sections they would be destroying the supports which would bring down the paved sections on both sides of it.
You know they can be secretly upgraded ? They worked on kh-32 and probably upgraded the electronic of some kh--22 to test it in Ukraine.
The difference between the Kh-22M and the Kh-32 is mostly fuel.... the latter having rather more powerful and energetic fuel and more powerful rocket motors.
The first kh-22 weren't made for precision stfikes. Maybe nuclear strike against a town was possible.
They can hit a ship or a building or a bridge or a large radar and have a warhead of almost 1 ton to get the job done. (930kgs)
.. And the Kremlin trolls immediately start damage controlling the situation by flipping the script and saying that Ukraine f-ed up because they didn't bomb the bridge along the entire 19km. And not a word about the massive L taken by Russia.
When Saudi and Paki nationals flew planes into WTC and the Pentagon the US reacted by invading Iraq and Afghanistan... so maybe Russia should attack Laos and perhaps Peru?
Nobody buys the fake bravado anymore. Get out of the echo chamber every now and then. It's time to either step up or shut up.
That is why the rest of the world sees the west as psychotic and Russia sensible and reasonable.
Actually surprising a car bomb was able to deliver this damage. I mean, the energy can be dispersed in free air and generally moves across the flat tarmac supported with a concrete layer capable withstanding huge (vertical) linear pressure.
A Truck bomb can carry a big bomb.... and the west has probably analysed VBIEDs... probably even blew up a few of their own bridges just to test it first.
That struck me too, the site of the damage. It is close to land at the Russian end. Why not out at sea?
The location of the explosion was probably determined by when the truck passed the train with fuel carriages on it in a bid (successful) to set those on fire too.
As a retaliation for the attack on the Crimea bridge what if Russia takes out one Starlink satellite in space, as a legit war target? Will that get construed as Pearl Harbour in space? Or will Starlink's investors weigh in on Musk to stay out of conflict zones?
Good question... such an attack wont cause unnecessary amongst the civilian population, but will very much damage the communication for enemy forces.
And the Russians comply : The pipeline can be repaired ! The Bridge can be repaired !
Don't worry about the pipeline... Russia is likely to cut Europe off from their gas at some point anyway, and all bridges can be repaired.
It's exactly what Russia needs to do, blow up twice as many infrastructures in NATzO proper, particularly in the US and UK. Then, it will be up to NATzO whether they will escalate to nuclear war. This is a simple matter. I really do hope that Russia hits back on NATzO and level as much critical infrastructure as possible.
Too much escalation because the west don't know how to back down.
What Russia needs to do is look at all their problems in the Ukraine and use this as an excuse to deal with it... whether it is burn crops to damage the income of some oligarch, or hit some power stations or bridges to reduce transport of HATO equipment to the Ukraine... they are free to decide.
Personally I think Sujoys idea of hitting Musks satellites sounds pretty good, or hack the network and start interfering and even listening in...
The Ukrainians are saying that the SBU did it on the illegally built bridge.
Who would believe them?
If they sank the Moskva with Neptunes why have they not used them for anything else... they could have launched a dozen neptunes to hit the bridge along its length...
Biden even mentioning nukes proves he is a f*cking retarded moron.
When your country is as fucked up as his is, in total denial and their solution is to print their own money despite being 31 trillion in debt... then suicide becomes a viable option for many... especially religious nutters hoping for the rapture or whatever they call it...
Let us clear the two things.
It was not Russia who started the nuke narrative, but the moron Kokainsky back in January.
And Mrs Untrust ... oh I mean Truss, as she started a chest-beating how she won't be afraid of pushing the button.
Russia not only never threatened the usage of nuclear weapons, but several times underlined that it is strictly regulated in the military doctrine of the Russian Federation, and the situation is not even close to that status.
But that is interesting because the Russian laws regarding using nuclear weapons include in response to enemy attacks on important Russian infrastructure... does this qualify... I am guessing the west certainly thinks it might so they start talking about Russia using nukes in the Ukraine to test the waters to see if they might respond with nukes...
Well that's because the blood thirsty moth foaming fanboys think Russia will "win" and in a reality it would be rendered a lifeless barren land with perhaps five percent remaining population if things went to all out Nuclear war
So it would turn Russia into Chicago?
It was unthinkiable on February 24 that Ukraine would ever be able to touch the Kerch bridge, but now due to Russia's continous pussyfooting, it has finally happened.
It was unthinkable in 2013 that Sevastopols lease would ever get cheaper... you are upset about a bridge that can be fixed?
If Russia still does not nuke the living hell out of entire Ukraine, then they should just abandon those nuclear weapons altogether, they don't really deserve to have them when they are too afraid to use them on an enemy that is contantly giving them a bloody nose day after day and then brag about it as well.
The nukes are the only things stopping HATO nations rushing HATO troops into the Ukraine to defend their nazis.