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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21

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    limb


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    Post  limb Sat Jul 23, 2022 2:39 am

    Airbornewolf wrote:
    Hole wrote:https://smoothiex12.blogspot.com/2022/07/a-peculiar-math.html

    Western (NATO) propaganda told us that the M777 and HIMASS would be used to destroy Russian artillery. In reality 99% of the attacks are against civilian targets,
    because they tried to use the M777 in counter-battery fire and received a bloody nose. Now you can watch NATO mercenaries driving around in HIMASS panicly trying
    to avoid being hit by russian high-precision weapons. They can´t be used to support military actions. This are not Wunderwaffen but Vergeltungswaffen (retaliatory weapons)
    like V-1 and V-2. This proves that there is no VSU left, even with NATO help they´re just a bunch of single units fighting for themselves.

    The best NATO can come up with in a fight against Russia are ISIS-style terror attacks. That´s what you get for 1,4 Trill. $.  Laughing Laughing Laughing

    Some people still have trouble to believe that an millitary organization like NATO, comprising several nations and that sinks ridiculous amounts of money into its "millitary" cant handle Russia.

    Too long NATO rant here....

    [One reason is that NATO is rife with absolute corruption when it comes to Defense spending.

    massive NATO incompetency Rant here....

    Arms manufacturers pay politicians to get premium deals trough their respective governments.
    The weapon does not even have to match basic requirements. They just corrupt the field tests and push trough the paperworks.

    One example is the Gill ATGM we procured. We took it to Afghanistan for actual field testing.
    its an top-attack weapon, the versions we had in 2006 lost momentary contact with its target.
    We fired three times, and every time we missed the target. this empty shipping container on the firing range by several meters.

    The lock went fine, but every time the weapon was fired it slammed in an random position near the container.
    Turned out, the Weapon could not re-acquire the shipping container as it was the same temperature as the surrounding desert.

    it got worse than that, right after infantry used the heavy weapon range after sundown. The system was tested again, the container still retained heat. missile was locked on and fired again.
    Instead of going for the container, it went for the still smoldering wreck that was hit by several AT weapons and was hotter than the container itself.

    This weapon was not safe to operate, what would it do when one of our APC's was nearby in combat?. guns and engine glowing hot?.
    We send this weapon home, nobody wanted to blow up one of our own APC's with guys inside.

    3 years later in the bar, doing my above story with some troops. A few clarified what really happened during weapon trials.
    The tests where done during autumn in Germany, They set up several heaters up on an firing range for the government officials and weapon manufacturer's representatives.
    They encountered the exact same issue with the weapon deviating from its original target. Saying to the government officials witnessing the pre-demonstration test that this weapon was untrustworthy and an threat to own forces if they where nearby.

    Their opinion was disregarded, they where to remove all heaters to just the one for the Demonstration.
    The Deal was already approved, this was just all a show.

    I got similar story's for several other recent NATO procurements.
    one of my favorites is how we took the Fennek Recon to Afghanistan, got guys driving on IED's that got spread all over the vehicles interiors where you at best could scrape 25KG's of human remains from the walls.
    All these IED incidents had the armor plating weld break right under the driver.
    you know what the manufacturers said to us when we enquired about this issue to their Mechanics in Afghanistan?.
    "your government opted out of the IED package for the vehicles, we knew, we offered it. they declined. Pricetag was "just" 30.000".
    this led to an serious incident with Fennek operators and the Government back home.
    The government explained eventually: "better 3000 euro for an funeral, than 30.000 and still have the vehicle wrecked just the same and paying for revalidation/compensation".
    the entire unit quit, refusing to go to Afghanistan driving an casket on wheels.

    NATO is just an heroine addict to the MIC. their own personal Dealer.
    Nobody cares if the Weapon is suitable for War. Shit, most is not even suitable for peacetime training.
    Its an miracle not more NATO troops die because of malfunctioning "new" weaponry.
    Some of these things just blow their breach, sending the 50MM main gun breach out of the rear door of an IFV.

    a handful of weapons are okay, the majority is just overpriced crap made for window-dressing.

    Then there is the absolute incompetency in Leadership.
    Nowadays, NATO is full of Yes men, and every adversary is an idiot.

    it was not always like it is now, The great exodus of Good soldiers, sergeants, and officers came with Afghanistan and Iraq.
    what led to everyone capable leaving was our own side just fed bullshit to the people back home like it was an "reconstruction mission, while some provinces where akin to open warfare.
    everyone with criticism or guts to defy the command for their idiotic idea's either left themselves or where forced to leave.

    you know with what you have left?.
    Idiots that you hand over an pallet full boxes with propaganda flyers, saying "drop these over an town"
    They dropped them allright, still in their boxes, strapped to the box pallet from the rear of an C-130 and the entire thing came down straight trough some poor afghan's roof.

    Some guy responsible for ordering Fuel for the entire main ISAF base in the province reaches end of tour, and goes home.
    Not finding it strange he has no replacement, and the new unit's command never notices the fuel bladder decreasing over the weeks.
    Fuel ran out, and they where limited to foot patrols only without vehicle support. Villages at medium to long range where fucked and Taliban went to town on there.

    Some absolutely backwards ass plan gets cooked up by command. Some new lieutenant looking for an career thinks its awesome and tells the men to grow some balls.
    It pretty much went along the lines as we would expect. His unit over-extended, Taliban sprung the trap and his unit got isolated for an while.
    Engaged 360 and taking some casualties, the Lieutenant froze. He was relieved of command by his senior sargeant mid-battle by yelling over the radio he'd took control witch his experienced troops followed.
    The unit organized and held out until they could be reached by nearby units and QRF.
    You know the current NATO culture and what happened here?.

    The lieutenant had a "tactical freeze" , and the senior sergeant defied his authority and promptly was kicked out of the army.
    His own unit protested, stating they probably where still alive because of him.

    The Lieutenant should have been court-marshalled and the senior sergeant decorated and promoted for doing what he did.

    Courage and self-initiative is strongly discouraged.
    Doing exactly as you are told without question and aspiring to become some Drone in Brussels NATO HQ is desired.
    Accept your orders that come trough NATO HQ and your own government, but are actually from your U.S Overlords.

    And each and everyone of these officers are absolutely full of themselves.
    In 2014 they where collectively wanking off how they would seize Crimea and its black sea port right from under Russia.
    Those upstarts in Eastern Ukraine?. pffff.....no match for the superior leadership and training from NATO.
    After that, station "missile shields" that in reality would have nuclear-tipped warheads for quick reload/replacement.
    similar to the site in Romania and under construction in Poland.

    There where still guys out there in NATO army's that warned what NATO/We where doing is unacceptable to the Russians.
    That every single one of them was an reason for Russia to Respond. I was one of them.

    The "anti terror" operation in eastern Ukraine supported by NATO.
    Trying to seize Crimea and its black sea ports.
    Ukraine being seized by Nazi's we openly supported.
    etcetera etcetera

    They all laughed, they all think there are no consequences.

    Lower ranks just the same, My army used to pick from "hardened" recruits.
    Kids that grew up with hardships in their lives. Poverty, meaning no luxury growing up.
    Divorced parents, because it meant mental resilience.
    Kids that had it tough. They where the most likely to make it trough Boot and survive traumatic encounters relatively unscathed.

    Nowadays, the snowflakes are the ones.
    Preferably the ones that check the most boxes: LGBTQ+++, Immigrant, alternative religions, Left leaning, because god forbid you feel your something for you national identity and your flag. social activists and etc etc.
    Indeed they are usually the whiney scrawny ones.
    And no...they can not meet the old military standards so we lower those too.
    Because hauling around your own munitions, body armor and radio's is too tiring.
    "its not service, i go on an Adventure Teehee!".

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 The_re11

    I can already see such cannon-fodder storming the Iranian beaches with their purple dyed hair and pulling out the phone to twitter they are winning while the Republican Gaurd are handing their asses to them...

    Now realize I'm just one guy, with about 10 years wandering in random locations where NATO operates.
    How big do you think this iceberg of incompetence and corruption in NATO really is?.

    NATO is already logistically broken by Russia and the LPR and DPR.
    Now its just trading its own last remaining pockets of equipment to extend the war.
    They can F-16's, A-10s, HIMARS, PZH-2000's or whatever.
    But it does not matter.
    Like other users here mentioned way before me.
    These "wunderwaffe" will not change the war.

    It did not save the Nazi's in World war 2.
    It will not save them now in the 2022 Denazification of Ukraine.

    NATO will not save Ukraine,
    It can not even save itself.
    And i can not wait to see it choke to death on its own incompetence.

    I assume youre talking about the spike er and nlos. Theyre excellent weapons. You guys were using it against ambiet temperature cans. The spike is used against hot AFVs. How tf would it acquire a friendly APC when its warhead has limited FOV that can only acquire targets in front of it? Only a retard would shoot an IR gyided F&F weapon at a friendly AFV. What do you expext an F&F IR guided ATGM go do? Lock lnto a cold target? Tell me how its bad for such an ATGM to lock on to a hot tank.
    Tanks simplyy cannot be made ambient temperature. Its a matter of physics,which the spike exploits.
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    Post  Backman Sat Jul 23, 2022 7:11 am

    calripson wrote:
    ATLASCUB wrote:.

    You are correct on most your points. At the end of the day, getting Russians and Ukrainians to kill each other while the real powers that be sit back in comfortable lounge chairs in private clubs in London or Zurich is such an epic fail as to be almost beyond comprehension.

    Giving Russia the excuse to take Crimea for free and then giving them the excuse to take the whole Black sea coast is the biggest geopolitical own goal in generations.

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    Post  billybatts91 Sat Jul 23, 2022 8:50 am

    "U.S. discussing America-made fighter jets for Ukraine"

    The West is continuing to escalate the situation. Russia better hit these guys hard and go all the way to Odessa. Anything less will be a failure in the current situation.


    Last edited by billybatts91 on Sat Jul 23, 2022 11:28 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Arrow Sat Jul 23, 2022 9:04 am

    The agreement concluded yesterday in Turkey regarding the export of Ukrainian grain will block the offensive on Odessa in the near future. Donbas is now the priority, and then maybe Kharkiv.
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    Post  Erk Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:17 am

    Arrow wrote:The agreement concluded yesterday in Turkey regarding the export of Ukrainian grain will block the offensive on Odessa in the near future. Donbas is now the priority, and then maybe Kharkiv.

    How will it will block the offensive on Odessa ?
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    Post  sepheronx Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:21 am

    Erk wrote:
    Arrow wrote:The agreement concluded yesterday in Turkey regarding the export of Ukrainian grain will block the offensive on Odessa in the near future. Donbas is now the priority, and then maybe Kharkiv.

    How will it will block the offensive on Odessa ?

    He isn't telling the whole story.

    It will prevent Navy strikes in Odessa. Not so much an offensive on Odessa.

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    Post  Arrow Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:28 am

    The US will not send ATACM ammunition to Ukraine.

    What about buying drones from Iran?
    https://twitter.com/spriteer_774400/status/1550462636126621698?s=20&t=N_eydYlakI9tX4swHxFWjA
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    Post  Hole Sat Jul 23, 2022 12:11 pm

    DerWolf wrote:https://mailbd.net/news/odessa-brigade-of-ukrainian-volunteers-formed-in-kherson-50041/

    Odessa brigade of Ukrainian volunteers formed in Kherson

    In the near future, the formed military unit will begin offensive operations in the directions of Nikolaev and Odessa

    Important story. Some people always state that Russia needs more troops if it wants to liberate more regions. But Russia doesn´t need troops to guard Donetsk and Lugansk and Kherson. Contrary to that the fighters of that regions will help restore order in other regions. And after the Nazis are "evicted" from Zaporoshyie and Dnepropetrovsk and Nikolaev additional unites will be formed there. There will be a need for FSP specialists to counter terror attacks but not large troop presence to keep order.

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    Post  Isos Sat Jul 23, 2022 12:12 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    Erk wrote:
    Arrow wrote:The agreement concluded yesterday in Turkey regarding the export of Ukrainian grain will block the offensive on Odessa in the near future. Donbas is now the priority, and then maybe Kharkiv.

    How will it will block the offensive on Odessa ?

    He isn't telling the whole story.

    It will prevent Navy strikes in Odessa.  Not so much an offensive on Odessa.

    They just attack it with cruise missiles. lol1

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    Post  nomadski Sat Jul 23, 2022 12:33 pm

    It is like going to a Japanese restaurant , for a ten course meal , consisting of very small and tasty portions . By the time the meal ends , it is an orgasmic experience !

    LOL .


    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tut48hR3mxk


    LOL


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    Post  Isos Sat Jul 23, 2022 12:55 pm

    Russian EW jamming ukrainian AD that keep intercepting the air. Again it seems it's kh-101's built-in jammers.

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    Post  LMFS Sat Jul 23, 2022 12:58 pm

    DerWolf wrote:https://mailbd.net/news/odessa-brigade-of-ukrainian-volunteers-formed-in-kherson-50041/

    Odessa brigade of Ukrainian volunteers formed in Kherson

    It seems indeed that Russia will let native ukranians take care of cleaning up the country of nazis. Militias seem to be already the vast majority of the ground forces fighting in Donbass and they have confirmed they will fight beyond the borders of the republics. If further units are created, like the one in these news, a serious fighting force could be created (it would grow with each newly liberated region) capable of liberating the rest of the country and guaranteeing peace in the future. Meanwhile Russia will be enabled to deploy less and less troops, providing those force multipliers like aviation, AD, EW, precision ammunition and so on, going progressively into the Syrian scenario. On the one hand it would ensure the legitimacy of the regime change operation in 404, on the other it would minimize the resources and loss of life needed. A geopolitical masterpiece.

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    Post  d_taddei2 Sat Jul 23, 2022 1:01 pm

    The grain agreement is only in place for 120 days (roughly 4 months) this I would imagine also mean Ukraine won't be allowed to fire brimstones missiles into naval waters in these areas, so this can work in favour of Russian navy. We have already seen cruise missile attacks in Odessa. And Odessa is more than just the port area. It's a large region and before they even get there they still have to liberate Nikolaev. Between Donbass, Kherson, zaporozhye and Nikolaev it's still going to be sometime before Odessa region is fully liberated. They got four months to achieve the other areas Very Happy

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    Post  d_taddei2 Sat Jul 23, 2022 1:05 pm

    Any map updates for Donbass? Or any good websites for such
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    Post  LMFS Sat Jul 23, 2022 1:05 pm

    Pepe Escobar
    Forwarded from
    Intel Slava Z
    🇺🇲🇷🇺🇺🇦 The US is preparing for a compromise?

    Today, Russia has given guarantees that it will not attack Odessa from the sea for 120 days, so that Ukraine can sell its grain and other goods by sea.

    And here is the news that appeared immediately after that:

    - The United States did not transfer aircraft to Ukraine, but only helps with spare parts for existing aviation - Pentagon

    - The United States does not intend to provide Ukraine with ATACMS missiles (range up to 300 km), Biden's national security aide said.

    - Possible supply of US fighter jets to Ukraine is not considered in the near future - White House

    — The United States and allies need Russian oil supplies to world markets, otherwise prices for it will rise again

    — Lithuania resumed transit between Russia and the Kaliningrad region

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    Post  Isos Sat Jul 23, 2022 1:13 pm

    Talibans with Russia. They want to join the party.

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    Post  PapaDragon Sat Jul 23, 2022 3:17 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    Erk wrote:
    Arrow wrote:The agreement concluded yesterday in Turkey regarding the export of Ukrainian grain will block the offensive on Odessa in the near future. Donbas is now the priority, and then maybe Kharkiv.
    How will it will block the offensive on Odessa ?
    He isn't telling the whole story.

    It will prevent Navy strikes in Odessa. Not so much an offensive on Odessa.

    Odessa is not on the menu before winter, plenty of other stuff to do before then




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    Post  Belisarius Sat Jul 23, 2022 3:47 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Img_2029
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Img_2028
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Img_2027
    🇷🇺🇺🇦 At night, in the Kharkiv region, the air defense forces of the Russian Armed Forces shot down another "Bayraktar" of the Ukrainian Air Force, flying in the direction of the Russian border.
    https://t.me/intelslava/33753?single

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Sat Jul 23, 2022 3:55 pm

    Odessa cruise missiles and hits.

    The pro-Ukrainian telegrams are saying that the strike was on grain storage directly after the agreement was signed. The locals in the area report that the strike hit the area of air defense.

    -------

    The grain agreement doesn't mean anything about attacks on Odessa

    The grain agreement just says, civilian exports of grain are fine

    But Odessa will still be liberated, strikes continue

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Sat Jul 23, 2022 3:57 pm

    https://t.me/DonbassDevushka/15508

    Odessa is on fire, anyone who thinks the agreement somehow changed the endgame is wrong

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Sat Jul 23, 2022 4:08 pm

    https://t.me/swodki/137673?single

    Here the problem of the antonovsky bridge shelling is explained

    The bridge must be preserved or else resupply must go through Kakhovskaya power station dam, which will take 120km to get from M17 highway to Kherson from Dzhankoy

    It is necessary to push these forces to Nikolayev and maneuver north of Nikolayev

    Here is a good diagram of what that would look like:

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Img_2143

    Then you can cut off both Odessa and Nikolayev as well as reach Pridnestrovie

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    Post  Hole Sat Jul 23, 2022 4:34 pm

    Arkanghelsk wrote:https://t.me/DonbassDevushka/15508

    Odessa is on fire, anyone who thinks the agreement somehow changed the endgame is wrong

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Scree414
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Scree415
    According to RWA some Centaur boat was hit. Maybe AD system. But no grain depot. Message to the regime: No, you can´t hide weapons inside the harbor.  No

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    Post  limb Sat Jul 23, 2022 4:35 pm

    Im sick and tired of claims that Russian cant do SEAD. Its concerning that the vast majority of even official air force analysts, who should know better, just use explanations like "Russians have no wild weasel so they cant do sead" or "NATO has trained more for sead so its better at it".

    It seems like the vast majority of commenters see NATO air forces as having some abstract pool of SEAD mana.

    Im saying this because of the NASAMs hype. Theyre active radar guided, so can be jammed. Theyre not better than Buk M1s which have optical guidance, but they dont.

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    Post  limb Sat Jul 23, 2022 4:37 pm

    Arkanghelsk wrote:https://t.me/swodki/137673?single

    Here the problem of the antonovsky bridge shelling is explained

    The bridge must be preserved or else resupply must go through Kakhovskaya power station dam, which will take 120km to get from M17 highway to Kherson from Dzhankoy

    It is necessary to push these forces to Nikolayev and maneuver north of Nikolayev

    Here is a good diagram of what that would look like:

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Img_2143

    Then you can cut off both Odessa and Nikolayev as well as reach Pridnestrovie

    Any civil engineers here who can explain how much time would ut take to fix the bridge so tanks can go through it?

    How deep is the dniepr there? Can tanks snorkel through some points.
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    SolidarityWithRussia


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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21

    Post  SolidarityWithRussia Sat Jul 23, 2022 4:43 pm

    It's about time for Odessa's liberation. Transnistria should not be forced to wait too long for Russia's protection from the increasingly aggressive moves of the Western bloc.

    About the HIMARS: According to Sputnik News they are now operated by Nato staff members, because Nato does not trust Ukrainians any more. If that is true, then the rumors are true that Nato is stupid enough to start escalating this conflict to a direct war with Russia instead of accepting their own failure to establish a useful Ukrainian puppet. One can only hope for the sake of humanity that Russia's strength and the growing weakness of the West will deter them.

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21

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