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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #19

    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:29 am

    Arkanghelsk wrote:https://t.me/istorijaoruzijaZ/12543

    HEROES OF RUSSIA

    This is very nice

    Still, we need to always remember that at any point in time Kremlin can decide to just give up and run away under excuse of diplomacy

    It could be happening as we speak, it might have already happened



    How do I know this? Because I have seen this crap myself

    I remember how we used to welcome the troops from Croatia and Bosnia in 94 and 95 while being completely oblivious that our own politicians will sell us all off in order to save their own asses and money while bullshitting everyone about peace and diplomacy


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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:33 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Arkanghelsk wrote:https://t.me/istorijaoruzijaZ/12543

    HEROES OF RUSSIA

    This is very nice

    Still, we need to always remember that at any point in time Kremlin can decide to just give up and run away under excuse of diplomacy

    It could be happening as we speak, it might have already happened



    How do I know this? Because I have seen this crap myself

    I remember how we used to welcome the troops from Croatia and Bosnia in 94 and 95 while being completely oblivious that our own politicians will sell us all off in order to save their own asses and money while bullshitting everyone about peace and diplomacy



    But they aren't. Remember, Putin recently said they are not interested in negotiations and rather play hockey as he said to Macron.

    If the Russians wanted to leave because of diplomacy, they would have already. Doesn't seem to be the case. Reality dictates Russia still moving forward. So instead of assuming, it's best to wait for the finale.

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    Post  caveat emptor Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:45 am

    PapaDragon wrote:

    This is very nice

    Still, we need to always remember that at any point in time Kremlin can decide to just give up and run away under excuse of diplomacy

    It could be happening as we speak, it might have already happened
    How do I know this? Because I have seen this crap myself
    I remember how we used to welcome the troops from Croatia and Bosnia in 94 and 95 while being completely oblivious that our own politicians will sell us all off in order to save their own asses and money while bullshitting everyone about peace and diplomacy
    Exactly. We were already bitten by the snake. Always be wary of the politicians.

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    Post  Werewolf Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:45 am

    PapaDragon wrote:

    This is complete horseshit, what relevance does Russian retreat from that island have with transportation of agricultural goods?

    Ships won't be travelling over that island

    If they wanted to move agricultural good by sea all they had to do was to move them, status of the island is irrelevant
    Looks to me like another pathetic attempt by Russia to win PR cookie points which as everyone could have told them failed immediately:
    Russian Forces Have Been Driven From Snake Island
    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russian-forces-have-finally-been-driven-from-snake-island
    I am sure that families of all those Russian grunts who died there are super happy about their boys giving their lives for futile PR stunt



    It is just said and stupid to waste that much time for a useless piece of rock in a puddle that has no tactical or strategic value, whatsover.


    Just send two iskander and it will create a hole big enough that it will be filled with water and nobody will set a foot on it anymore.

    Waste of resources and lifes for nothing.

    Create a crater and let it fill with water, period.

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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:47 am

    Werewolf wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:

    This is complete horseshit, what relevance does Russian retreat from that island have with transportation of agricultural goods?

    Ships won't be travelling over that island

    If they wanted to move agricultural good by sea all they had to do was to move them, status of the island is irrelevant
    Looks to me like another pathetic attempt by Russia to win PR cookie points which as everyone could have told them failed immediately:
    Russian Forces Have Been Driven From Snake Island
    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russian-forces-have-finally-been-driven-from-snake-island
    I am sure that families of all those Russian grunts who died there are super happy about their boys giving their lives for futile PR stunt



    It is just said and stupid to waste that much time for a useless piece of rock in a puddle that has no tactical or strategic value, whatsover.


    Just send two iskander and it will create a hole big enough that it will be filled with water and nobody will set a foot on it anymore.

    Waste of resources and lifes for nothing.

    Create a crater and let it fill with water, period.

    During peace time it may be good as an observation post to monitor Romania.

    But yeah, during war time it's useless.

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    Post  caveat emptor Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:51 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    But they aren't. Remember, Putin recently said they are not interested in negotiations and rather play hockey as he said to Macron.

    If the Russians wanted to leave because of diplomacy, they would have already.  Doesn't seem to be the case.  Reality dictates Russia still moving forward.  So instead of assuming, it's best to wait for the finale.

    Important thing to remember. This should be done in a way that you solve this conflict for foreseeable time. Meaning, you don't take LDNR and suddenly Ukrainians want to negotiate and you stop there. Finish the job, take whole East and South and completely wipe out their army. By doing that, you will send message to US that Russia will not allow to be fucked with, in its own backyard. If you get another war in 5 years or a decade, you failed.

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    Post  Werewolf Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:54 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    During peace time it may be good as an observation post to monitor Romania.

    But yeah, during war time it's useless.

    When that shit is over you can fill it up with dirt and use it again.

    That would be a lot cheaper and no waste of precious human life.

    It's useless now.

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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:55 am

    caveat emptor wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    But they aren't. Remember, Putin recently said they are not interested in negotiations and rather play hockey as he said to Macron.

    If the Russians wanted to leave because of diplomacy, they would have already.  Doesn't seem to be the case.  Reality dictates Russia still moving forward.  So instead of assuming, it's best to wait for the finale.

    Important thing to remember. This should be done in a way that you solve this conflict for foreseeable time. Meaning, you don't take LDNR and suddenly Ukrainians want to negotiate and you stop there. Finish the job, take whole East and South and completely wipe out their army. By doing that, you will send message to US that Russia will not allow to be fucked with, in its  own backyard. If you get another war in 5 years or a decade, you failed.

    No one seems to know what the plan is. It's a war without calling it a war. Russia is slowly gaining territory not just in LDNR but also Kherson as well, with potential to move east. I think it was already hinted multiple times that they plan for Odessa. Western Ukraine is the odd one that does Russia plan to take it or let it be removed from Ukraine? Someone in Duma said they won't allow Poland into Lviv so that may be indication they want all of Ukraine. To me it's pointless to take anything west of Kiev and say let Poland have it.

    None of us know the plan yet.

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    Post  kvs Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:58 am

    The reaction to Snake Island is the same inane BS as the reaction to Kiev and Kharkov. Not worth the time of day and easily
    debunked by the actual progress of the campaign.

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    Post  caveat emptor Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:00 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    You're right, it was thatcher who lost multiple of warships.

    For a small island(s).

    Compared to what Russia has captured now.  I rather have the donbass, Kherson, Lhugansk than Falklands.

    Russia didn't need navy to take any of the aforementioned. Lets just say that performance of Black Fleet was less than stellar, considering that Ukraine doesn't have any Navy worth mentioning.
    Also, i am very sorry for the lives lost on Moskva. Hopefully, Moskva sinking will show to Russian command that keeping huge outdated ships that don't have any place in modern battle is wrong. Not to mention how much money is wasted to just keep them floating.
    I believe that Kuznetsov ate few billion $ in last 20 years with very little to show for. It was maybe operational for 4 or 5 in all that time. They are just vanity projects, not battle worth ships.

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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:05 am

    caveat emptor wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    You're right, it was thatcher who lost multiple of warships.

    For a small island(s).

    Compared to what Russia has captured now.  I rather have the donbass, Kherson, Lhugansk than Falklands.

    Russia didn't need navy to take any of the aforementioned. Lets just say that performance of Black Fleet was less than stellar, considering that Ukraine doesn't have any Navy worth mentioning.
    Also, i am very sorry for the lives lost on Moskva. Hopefully, Moskva sinking will show to Russian command that keeping huge outdated ships that don't have any place in modern battle is wrong. Not to mention how much money is wasted to just keep them floating.
    I believe that Kuznetsov ate few billion $ in last 20 years with very little to show for. It was maybe operational for 4 or 5 in all that time. They are just vanity projects, not battle worth ships.

    No but black sea isn't necessarily large and having a surface ship in the area is open target anyway. So Ukraine having anti ship missiles is of no surprise.

    It wasn't sunk by a ship either but anti ship missiles launched from the land. Wouldn't have mattered if a Russian ship or American or whatever. The problem of the black sea or Caspian sea or any sea for that matter. Having a large ship in black sea made no sense either imo. So the large ship is now gone. Too bad, maybe better suited for up north. Leave Black Sea to Kilo's and Corvettes.
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    Post  Arkanghelsk Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:07 am

    https://t.me/istorijaoruzijaZ/12560

    Hahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahhhhahahahahhhhahahahahahahahahahhhahahahahahahhhhahahahaha
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    Post  Regular Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:34 am

    Don't care about the island. Both sides lost way too many lives for these rocks.

    All the talks about Azov being nazis, then releasing 50 of them...

    What the **** is going on, I hope they screen who they are letting go.

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    Post  Dr.Snufflebug Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:40 am

    Regular wrote:Don't care about the island. Both sides lost way too many lives for these rocks.

    All the talks about Azov being nazis, then releasing 50 of them...

    What the **** is going on, I hope they screen who they are letting go.

    Several sources mentioned that the captive Azovites that were exchanged were cripples. Arms, legs missing, some even blind.
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    Post  Regular Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:01 am

    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:
    Regular wrote:Don't care about the island. Both sides lost way too many lives for these rocks.

    All the talks about Azov being nazis, then releasing 50 of them...

    What the **** is going on, I hope they screen who they are letting go.

    Several sources mentioned that the captive Azovites that were exchanged were cripples. Arms, legs missing, some even blind.

    In the pictures, they do look ok, but who knows. I mean, I don't think that most of these men will fight again as they look broken and old, but Azov is Azov, they said they won't release anyone belonging to them. Not even a little jail time or rebuilding effort. What example is this?

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    Post  Backman Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:17 am

    Russia can just take it back when the war ends.

    They took it because they could. And the Ukrops figured out that they could make a propaganda win by constantly shelling it. Russia cares more about the lives of their soldeirs than propaganda wins on Twitter. I dont oppose leaving it but it could have been done differently

    If anything this just shows one of the negatives about the SMO instead of a mobilization. In a mobilization they would have taken Odessa and this petty crap wouldn't happen. Im getting pretty cold on the SMO idea. Its taking too long. F*cking mobilize.

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    Post  kvs Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:53 am

    Every Nazi is not equivalent to the worst Nazi. Exchanging 40 of them out of 800+ in captivity to get high value (pilot) POWs
    and even regular Russian POWs is justified and smart. All the f*cking purists should go and jump in a lake. Maybe you will find
    "purity" at the bottom.

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    Post  kvs Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:57 am

    What is the point of grabbing Odessa if the Donbas is still the main resistance point? Mobilize how many?

    What's the hurry? It looks to me like part of the plan was to have NATzO break its teeth with hopeless
    sanctions. All the military aid to the Kiev regime from NATzO is also pushing its members to the limit and
    exposing just how weak this rotten facade alliance really is.

    I am glad that the decision makers in Russia are not pandering to internet "experts".

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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:04 am

    Backman wrote:Russia can just take it back when the war ends.

    They took it because they could. And the Ukrops figured out that they could make a propaganda win by constantly shelling it. Russia cares more about the lives of their soldeirs than propaganda wins on Twitter. I dont oppose leaving it but it could have been done differently

    If anything this just shows one of the negatives about the SMO instead of a mobilization. In a mobilization they would have taken Odessa and this petty crap wouldn't happen. Im getting pretty cold on the SMO idea. Its taking too long. F*cking mobilize.


    What is the rush?

    Regular wrote:
    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:
    Regular wrote:Don't care about the island. Both sides lost way too many lives for these rocks.

    All the talks about Azov being nazis, then releasing 50 of them...

    What the **** is going on, I hope they screen who they are letting go.

    Several sources mentioned that the captive Azovites that were exchanged were cripples. Arms, legs missing, some even blind.

    In the pictures, they do look ok, but who knows. I mean, I don't think that most of these men will fight again as they look broken and old, but Azov is Azov, they said they won't release anyone belonging to them. Not even a little jail time or rebuilding effort. What example is this?

    Would you rather the captured Russian Pilots and others just die in Ukrainian grips? Or would it be better to exchange 40 - 50 idiots who may or may not pick a rifle back up again to die or get captured another day?

    One thing I give Israel for is that they will trade 1000 jihadists for 1 of their own. It shows they value the life of their own way more.

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    Post  kvs Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:16 am

    Backman wrote:Russia can just take it back when the war ends.

    They took it because they could. And the Ukrops figured out that they could make a propaganda win by constantly shelling it. Russia cares more about the lives of their soldeirs than propaganda wins on Twitter. I dont oppose leaving it but it could have been done differently

    If anything this just shows one of the negatives about the SMO instead of a mobilization. In a mobilization they would have taken Odessa and this petty crap wouldn't happen. Im getting pretty cold on the SMO idea. Its taking too long. F*cking mobilize.

    YHW4_cdxKmk

    Mercouris jumped the shark in another video where he stated outright that Kiev and Moscow put out similar levels of propaganda. What f*cking
    planet is he on? I know, he is being "objective". Anyone who says anything that is not frothing at the mouth Russia hate is treated as a traitor
    in the precious NATzO west.

    In the above media he is spouting more of the same BS when he asserts that the Kiev line on Snake Island is more plausible than the Russian version.
    LOL. Yeah, mighty Kiev forces forced Russians to retreat. To people with a clue, such claims are pure cringe. None of Kiev's attempts to grab the
    island ever succeeded. That Russia withdrew at its leisure is not a retreat.

    Snake Island has been a success for the Russian campaign. Russia managed to bait the idiots in Kiev to blow dozens of men, several helicopters and
    some ships in failed attempts to retake the island. Russia has not suffered similar losses. The Moskva has nothing to do with Snake Island.

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    Post  Regular Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:37 am

    sepheronx wrote:

    One thing I give Israel for is that they will trade 1000 jihadists for 1 of their own.  It shows they value the life of their own way more.

    It seems that the pilots and sentenced soldiers are still there. I've checked the interviews with Russian POWs. So far, Ukrainians treat them ok in captivity, unlike poor DNR/LNR guys who go through torture.


    But I was more addressing saying one thing and doing the opposite. If they said they won't exchange any Azov members as they consider them nazis, but now they do. Their word carries no meaning then. I will stay with my opinion that Russia needs to show no exceptions to the rule.


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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:39 am

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:I mean sure what Boris said was stupid but Putin's response wasn't any better, He worded it like Thatcher started the war when it was Argentina who seized the islands prompting the British response.

    I am sure some fanboy will try to react with one of two points.

    1. The British stole those lands from Agrentina first!

    Answer: Yeah they seized it via military conquest but Russia has also seized lands via Military conquest coughvladivostokcough and I don't imagine you'd support russia handing it over to China so that solves that.

    2. The people wanted to rejoin their homeland!

    Answer: Nope the brit held a vote where if the majority wanted to, they would hand the lands over to Argentina but the Majority choose to stay with the UK coughcrimeacough

    Do you want a class on the Malvinas War and its reasons?
    Putin referred to Tachter's decision to go to war and abandon any diplomatic opportunity. Remember that at that time the United States did not want the conflict and Argentina was a regional ally due to the anti-subversive war against the left. The United States wanted to be a diplomatic mediator and for the British to agree to shared sovereignty.
    For Tachter to accept that would have been a defeat, added to the economic crisis in which he was. To bury any negotiation, he ordered a ship to be sunk outside the radius with 300 lives. A war crime. From that moment the war was inevitable. All decision of Tachter.

    You are ignorant enough to believe that Argentina wanted to recover the islands for their population. Do you have history classes in your country?
    Argentina claims an illegally usurped territory. It is a colonial enclave. No one cares what the 1,500 people decide, several hundred of whom are Chilean and mestizo servants of whites (anti-argentines). We claim the territory, we don't give a shit about the people of the islands. They (Kelpers) can be Argentinian and join our culture (which has many English descendants), they can go to Europe or can go live in your house.
    The islands will sooner or later return to Argentina, by force or diplomacy. The British will not be able to hold a territory on the other side of the world forever.


    Last edited by ArgentinaGuard on Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:00 am; edited 5 times in total

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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:40 am

    Regular wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:

    One thing I give Israel for is that they will trade 1000 jihadists for 1 of their own.  It shows they value the life of their own way more.

    It seems that the pilots and sentenced soldiers are still there. I've checked the interviews with Russian POWs. So far, Ukrainians treat them ok in captivity, unlike poor DNR/LNR guys who go through torture.


    But I was more addressing saying one thing and doing the opposite. If they said they won't exchange any Azov members as they consider them nazis, but now they do. Their word carries no meaning then. I will stay with my opinion that Russia needs to show no exceptions to the rule.



    Circumstances change.  Maybe Russia decided it was better to hand them over to get their people back.

    Plus, that isn't exactly what Russian POW's were saying:

    https://t.me/DonbassDevushka/13163

    Maybe you don't care for Russians or their people but the government does.

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    Post  Big_Gazza Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:53 am

    Werewolf wrote:
    ATLASCUB wrote:Usual suspects desperately trying to keep the sheep in check... it's hilarious how blatant it's. There is no way no how any of the clowns here will be able to damage control a half-assed deal after the Donbass is liberated... they'll definitely try, orders will come down from the top hard and fast... but no matter how much you try to dress and beautify a pig, it's still a pig. Better hope that day doesn't come cause, for at least a week, the sheep won't be controllable and it's gonna be a wasteland thrashing of glorious magnitude. If I were the clowns, I would start by creating effigies with which to pray to Boris Johnson so that he continues to egg Zelensky to resist negotiations. It's the only way to keep "victory" away from jaws of defeat. It's comically sad. One thing is for certain, the online persona management business in Russia will experience a serious funding increase. At least someone's gonna be eating well.  lol1

    You have reduced yourself to just obvious low level trolling and add nothing to the forum or any conversation.

    Just saying trolls see only one thing its the door.

    Can we pls just stop responding to this fecking clown?  Banishing him to the Vann-Crazy-Compound doesn't work if forum masochists (no disrespect Werewolf)  insist on dipping their toes into his hate-spew retardation.  He can't be redeemed, so just ignore him as he publicly masturbates to zero audience.

    GarryB, Werewolf, JohninMK, Sprut-B, Hole, Backman, Mir and like this post

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #19 - Page 31 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #19

    Post  Backman Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:18 am

    kvs wrote:
    Backman wrote:
    he stated outright that Kiev and Moscow put out similar levels of propaganda.  

    the Kiev line on Snake Island is more plausible than the Russian version.

     

    I interpreted that differently. I probably wouldn't have posted the video if he said something that dumb.

    Russia shouldn't have said anything about snake island at all. They should have left some decoys there and pretended that they were still there. Then Ukraine would have had to claim that Russia left.

    The whole western media and Ukro retard complex have been bigging up this snake island story for awhile now. Just a few days ago, the Wall Street Journal ran a story about how Snake island was the key to Russia's war strategy.

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