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    US-Iran standoff 2019- #2

    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:24 pm

    They should have taken out the helicopters with one missile. I wonder if russia provided real time satelitte images.
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:38 pm

    US was supported by no one. No NATO forces were put on alert. No US ally send a warship there. Noone condamns the iranian attack... big political defeat for Trump. Even Netanyahou said it was a US problem, not Israeli. They are alone.

    First Squawk
    @FirstSquawk
    ·
    3 min
    TRUMP SAYS WILL ASK NATO TO GET MORE INVOLVED IN MIDDLE EAST PROCESS


    First Squawk
    @FirstSquawk
    ·
    49s
    TRUMP SAYS EUROPE, CHINA, RUSSIA AND OTHER COUNTRIES MUST BREAK AWAY FROM IRAN NUCLEAR DEAL



    ELINT News
    @ELINTNews
    ·
    2 min
    #BREAKING: President Trump confirms new economic sanctions to be imposed on Iran
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:43 pm

    lol1 lol1 lol1


    Lucas Tomlinson
    @LucasFoxNews
    ·
    2 min
    President Trump says U.S. and Iran have a "natural enemy" in ISIS says both countries can "work together on this and other shared priorities" in the future
    medo
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    Post  medo on Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:49 pm

    US-Iran standoff 2019- #2 - Page 3 33766410

    US air defense failed again. They were inefficient against drones, inefficient against cruise missiles in Abqaiq and now inefficient against ballistic missiles in Iraq.


    US-Iran standoff 2019- #2 - Page 3 Enxm1t10

    US-Iran standoff 2019- #2 - Page 3 Enxrus10

    Iranian missile strike on Al Assad US air base was quite precise.


    Last edited by medo on Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:54 pm

    Isos wrote:US was supported by no one. No NATO forces were put on alert. No US ally send a warship there. Noone condamns the iranian attack...


    Why would they bother?

    US troops were never in any real danger and everything went according to plan

    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:01 pm

    Time to coordinate propaganda.


    Feras Kilani فراس كيلاني
    @FerasKilaniBBC
    ·
    5 min
    A senior official in the prime minister's office said that the U.S. military was notified about the impending strikes because they were in the same command centre as the #Iraq-I JOC who got the call. But "it was a very short time" between the notification and the strike.


    But also ...




    Hamdi
    @HamdiAlkhshali
    ·
    38 min
    The US military and intelligence community had early hi-tech warning that #Iran had launched short range ballistic missiles according to a US official with direct knowledge of the information.
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    Post  nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:03 pm

    I agree with papadragon. The reason I have, is from the nature of political class in Iran. Not the people. There is a great difference. This appeasement and inaction is  evident in the misguided policies in various areas. Starting as I said from the beginning of the revolution. With number of revolutionary forces, excluded from politics by the right wing. But later, by Iran not developing nukes. This being covered up by religious fatwa. No doubt made by pressure from the same circles. But later by misdirecting foreign policy, by extending useless talks, to sabotage Iran defence needs. Also by not funding missile ICBM programme. And not retaliating and reacting against sanctions. To a point where national security is compromised. But now, by not doing what is necessary to secure Iran physically from attack. And pushing back against Yanks to break sanctions. This they can do easily and they have the forces necessary. But lack political will and leadership. They have compromised Iran national security. And are bringing Iran to a point of starvation, humiliation and defeat. I will not say anything here about their fail in bringing in  a democratic Republic. So the revolution has failed. And Iran faces capitulation. Because of political weakness. And betrayal.


    Last edited by nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  Vann7 on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:05 pm

    flamming_python wrote:Impressive accuracy

    But what matters are the cojones, more than anything else.

    If Iran is going to lie down and pretend to be dead over this affair, it's done in the region. The Middle East respects strength. No matter what atrocities or violations the US carries out, it will get away with them and continue to dominate the politics of other countries, so long as it continues to prove that it wears the trousers in any relationship with anyone.

    this is NOT the last attack of Iran.. but the start... they are officially now in a skirmish war vs US..
    that is one step away of a full scale one..  so this means that iranians will strike at americans in iraq ,
    using guerrilla warfare and in combination with from time to time similar ballistic missiles strikes on
    american assets in the zone.. . if iran target us military airport runways... and radars and intelligence
    buildings it could significantly for us to leave the zone..  in syria is even easier.. because iranians
    can move to strike distance with artillery from american bases..  

    so US troops should expect a much worse resistance ,and attacks.. than when US invaded iraq..
    iran have pretty capable weapons ,russian manpads and anti tank rockets to annoy the hell of us troops in the zone..

    the first strike was with a warning.. the next ones will not.. this is not the end of the conflict.. the interesting
    question will be what will happen when american warships enter in the hormus straight so close to iran..iran could also target us satellites in space... sooner or later.. that will be a huge pain for them..

    what is important to know is that iran have proven is not afraid to strike american bases.. if they allowed
    to strike american bases one time.. it means they will continue doing it.. more times..
    so i think iran have , imposed a new set of rules of engagements. Now is official that iran will strike
    american bases ,whenever US strike iran..
    so now contrary to putin ,polite strategy , iran had actually strike
    at american bases.. and this is not a small thing.. and next time ,trump and pentagon will be more worried to do another adventure like that .of striking an iranian general... because the next time ,the attack could happen without a warning or aim at US warships.. not to sink them.. but to kill a dozen of sailors and burn the warship a bit..  that will be enough for sending a strong message that iran will fight back.. the symbolical message of iran , was powerful enough to cause major concern of us military.. they know a war with iran ,can't be won.. with russia ,china ,syria ,turkey ,iraq suppoting iran..and they don't want a major scalation in a war they can't win..



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    Post  nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:25 pm

    There are many problems with this theory of effective counter - strike :

    ( 1.)  The strikes in no way push the Yanks out of bases. They caused minimal damage. Easily repaired.

    ( 2 )  Many bases in region, North of PG region were untouched. These pose a barrier to trade to China. Russia.

    (  3 )  There was no ground offensive to take these positions. After  " Bombardment".

    ( 4.)  The declaration of concluded attack by ministry, for retaliation of  soliemani. Inadequate response.

    ( 5) Statement by leader of a " slap", for domestic consumption contradicts ministry statement.

    ( 6 ) Humiliating false info put out by Iran media about non - existent yank casualties.



    They must first remove all the Liberal elements from government. Then put some revolutionary people in power. Build the ICBM and Nukes. At the same time attack and remove all American bases from region. By Army. A large ground offensive. Then Fuck the Yanks, south of PG.  Do you see what is needed to save Iran?  A couple of missile is not going to do it. Hundreds and thousands taking part in war effort is needed. Now. Now. Or they will be totally defeated. That is why Trump is happy. They know they are winning........

    To win, material conditions must be changed. The map of the Earth. Iranians must sacrifice in thousands. Great destruction and killing is needed. You talk of ........ Sending a message?  Are we having a chat in Instagram or twitter............ Or diplomatic  niceties?


    Last edited by nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  medo on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:34 pm

    Iranians are not mad as Trump or Netanyahu. They are smart and reasnoable people. This was warning strike with no intention to kill people. Iran didn't strike on US bases in Qatar or in KSA, only on two in Iraq, where general Soleimani was killed. They didn't want to stop negotiation between Iran and KSA to end the war in Yemen and thay want to give Russian diplomacy a chance to prevent a nuclear war between superpowers. Putin was yesterday in Syria, today in Turkey and is doing his job to cull down this very hot situation. Now they all count on Russian diplomacy to prevent nuclear WW3 like in 2015, when they made a deal for Syrian chemical weapons and Iranian nuclear program.
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    Post  Viktor on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:37 pm

    No need to rush with war. You can always start one. It seems that the purpose of the attack was to strike on US decision making head with fear not casualties.

    Where casualties made Trump would have gotten his instant "I told you so moment" and proceed with his plan from the position of the righteous person while now

    he stands accused from much broader number of different people in the world than before not as a man that is a bastard but as nothing.

    Alexander the Great once told "Im not afraid of an army of lions led by a sheep; Im afraid of an army of sheep led by a lion."

    Last night Trump show itself as person who while up to that moment confidently taunted his 2 trillion shiny new army

    instead has no confidence while succumbing to fear and panic on what will happen when Iran replay started.

    Last night the world and Trumps own Army saw Trump ate his own cravat with his "all is well" relief statement.

    As for Iran now it has mobilized actions of "zillions" of Iranians and Iraq and other nation man and woman warmly from the ideologically position of righteousness.

    A potential whose zeal and fury can unleash at moment and place of need.
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    Post  nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:43 pm

    I am not agent of any fucking government. I hate all governments. Including Iran government. I am revolutionary. I support Iran people.  Iran faces defeat, by inaction of weak and traitor government. National security is put at risk. Domestic peace is put at risk. Because the traitor liberals are hiding under a fucking beard.  And not ruling Iran properly. Now medo, you can not say this. Can you? But you did not have to live in exile, like me for past thirty years and have my life destroyed, because I am socialist or democrat. I dream of going back. Maybe my children can. There will be a place for them. But not now. There will be nothing left. Welcome Iraq mark II.


    Last edited by nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  kvs on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:46 pm

    Given the international reaction it looks like Trumpy and the yanqui hegemon is isolated and will do sweet f*ck all to punish
    the Iranians. Sanctions are weak and lame. So I would call this strike to be a win for Iran. The chatter in this thread about
    how "weak" the Iranian strike was is clearly disjoint from the actual Iranian action and the room Iran has to slap around
    Uncle Scumbag. This strike will likely guarantee an exit of US troops from Iraq. Even after the Iraqi parliament voted to
    kick them and their allies out, we had US generals asserting that no exit would occur. I expect this arrogant tone to change.
    This will be a real victory for Iran, but we will have to wait and see.

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    Post  par far on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:48 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Dima wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:....

    ...What a moron!...

    Fuck off fanboy

    Your jihadi clowns pussied out and agreed to do a song and dance routine to Uncle Sam's music and now whole world knows about it

    They might as well had "Donnie Entertainment Production" stenciled on those rockets



    USA stays in charge while sheep in Iran get to have some cheap entertainment to make them think they aren't property of both USA and Ayatollah and his crew

    Show goes on, 40 years and counting







    You can fuck off fake Serb, the Jihadis are in Saudi Arabia and western countries, not in Iran.

    US is in charge of shit, they got their asses beaten in Afghanistan, their plans in Syria and Iraq are ruined, while the US dollar is slowly going down the drain.

    Uncle Scumbag will have nothing but a finger up his ass because Uncle Scumbag is dancing to the tunes of the Zionists.

    These Zionists bastards have not been able break Iran for 40 years, they threw everything at Iran, Sanctions, War, Sabotage, threats, surrounded Iran with bases but Uncle Scumbag could not do shit.
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    Post  nomadski on Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:50 pm


    You can wait. I can wait. You are not hungry. I am not hungry. Iranians are hungry............ Wait for what.?
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    Post  par far on Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:01 pm

    kvs wrote:Given the international reaction it looks like Trumpy and the yanqui hegemon is isolated and will do sweet f*ck all to punish
    the Iranians.   Sanctions are weak and lame.   So I would call this strike to be a win for Iran.   The chatter in this thread about
    how "weak" the Iranian strike was is clearly disjoint from the actual Iranian action and the room Iran has to slap around
    Uncle Scumbag.   This strike will likely guarantee an exit of US troops from Iraq.   Even after the Iraqi parliament voted to
    kick them and their allies out, we had US generals asserting that no exit would occur.   I expect this arrogant tone to change.
    This will be a real victory for Iran, but we will have to wait and see.



    I disagree with you here kvs, I think the response from Iran was not strong enough, Iran should have hit US troops.

    This response does nothing, if Iran had hit US troops, it would have sent a message to NATO and Arab countries that Iran is not scared. If Iran had hit the US troops, than the US would not have any option and the US would have needed to go to war and Iran could have used it's proxies.

    Iran is not in the position of Russia where they have the soft power, when the Su 24 was shot down, Russia used it's soft power and diplomatic powers and it worked, it led Turkey into Russia sphere of influence, Iran does not have these powers.  

    Iran needed to respond with absolute vengeance and they did not do that and it will probably cost them.
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    Post  par far on Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:16 pm

    nomadski wrote:There are many problems with this theory of effective counter - strike :

    ( 1.)  The strikes in no way push the Yanks out of bases. They caused minimal damage. Easily repaired.

    ( 2 )  Many bases in region, North of PG region were untouched. These pose a barrier to trade to China. Russia.

    (  3 )  There was no ground offensive to take these positions. After  " Bombardment".

    ( 4.)  The declaration of concluded attack by ministry, for retaliation of  soliemani. Inadequate response.

    ( 5) Statement by leader of a " slap", for domestic consumption contradicts ministry statement.

    ( 6 )  Humiliating false info put out by Iran media about non - existent yank casualties.



    They must first remove all the Liberal elements from government. Then put some revolutionary people in power. Build the ICBM and Nukes. At the same time attack and remove all American bases from region. By Army. A large ground offensive. Then Fuck the Yanks, south of PG.  Do you see what is needed to save Iran?  A couple of missile is not going to do it. Hundreds and thousands taking part in war effort is needed. Now. Now. Or they will be totally defeated. That is why Trump is happy. They know they are winning........

    To win, material conditions must be changed. The map of the Earth. Iranians must sacrifice in thousands. Great destruction and killing is needed. You talk of ........ Sending a message?  Are we having a chat in Instagram or twitter............ Or diplomatic  niceties?


    Agree with the highlighted parts nomadski but kicking the Americans out by force is not going to work.

    Iran does need to take out the liberal elements from the government, had someone from the IRGC had been in charge, the response would have been way more severe but the current government is worried about the nuclear deal, a deal that won't happen.
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:32 pm

    nomadski wrote:Disagree. Iran did not show resolve by this symbolic strike.
    Striking the most powerful military in the world currently needs a strong resolve, thats what Iran showed with these missile strikes. Most of the people actually thought that Iran won't even dare to strike at any US bases.
    As I said in another post, regardless of the losses, this strike carried with it a deterrent value and that everyone in the middle east have noted.

    DTs press brief of around 6 minutes says it all.... Iran for now have deterred the murican military machine....

    But that said, Iran needs more air defence and ships to effectively counter the murican military might and evict them from the region. No two thoughts about it.

    flamming_python wrote:There’s a sort of dark comedy to the entire Iranian response. After much shaking of fists & promises of dire revenge...they’ve killed 40 or so of their own people at the general’s funeral and shot down a commercial airliner carrying their own people. US dead: 0.
    As someone mentioned earlier in the thread, the Iranians already said that the the real revenge for QS assassination would be to evict the muricans from the region.
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:37 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Fuck off fanboy

    Your jihadi clowns pussied out and agreed to do a song and dance routine to Uncle Sam's music and now whole world knows about it

    They might as well had "Donnie Entertainment Production" stenciled on those rockets



    USA stays in charge while sheep in Iran get to have some cheap entertainment to make them think they aren't property of both USA and Ayatollah and his crew

    Show goes on, 40 years and counting
    Once a moron, always a moron!
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:07 pm

    par far wrote:I disagree with you here kvs, I think the response from Iran was not strong enough, Iran should have hit US troops.
    We can say that as well, but the strike on the murican base itself, against the backdrop of the most vicious and threatening tone over the past week and more, has shaken the dubious advisors themselves which was visible in todays DT's press brief.

    This response does nothing, if Iran had hit US troops, it would have sent a message to NATO and Arab countries that Iran is not scared. If Iran had hit the US troops, than the US would not have any option and the US would have needed to go to war and Iran could have used it's proxies.
    The missile strike has already send two clear message to all those in the region.
    1) Iranian resolve to strike anyone who harms the Iranian nation.
    2) Lethality/Accuracy of the Iranian missiles.
    And these two facts about recent events carry a good deterrent value, regardless of the casualties in the recent strike.

    Iran is not in the position of Russia where they have the soft power, when the Su 24 was shot down, Russia used it's soft power and diplomatic powers and it worked, it led Turkey into Russia sphere of influence, Iran does not have these powers.
    I'm not saying Russian responses are not matured/measured, but soft power of Russia in that circumstances was out of compulsion rather than from a position of strength.  

    Iran needed to respond with absolute vengeance and they did not do that and it will probably cost them.
    Would like to disagree
    Because that time has not yet come....i.e the existential battle for Iran....not yet.
    But such a situation could have come, if US choose to open a new cycle and Iran starts by hitting targets across the middle east....and the escalation cycle gets out of hand.


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    Post  Dima on Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:11 pm

    kvs wrote:I think there is too much macho posturing in this thread.   The mere act of attacking a US base in Iraq by Iran is unprecedented.   Posters here make it look like
    no big deal.  So list all the other such cases over the last 100 years.    I am waiting to see what the US response will be.   That is the real event we should
    be waiting to see develop.  Being an empire it needs to enforce the obedience of the world and thus it will either act or won't.    Maybe all the posters who
    are fixated on who "little" Iran did should instead focus on how "much" the yanquis will do.  
    +1

    nomadski wrote:
    You can wait. I can wait. You are not hungry. I am not hungry. Iranians are hungry............ Wait for what.?
    Where did you get that Iranians are hungry?

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    Post  par far on Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:15 pm

    flamming_python wrote:There’s a sort of dark comedy to the entire Iranian response. After much shaking of fists & promises of dire revenge...they’ve killed 40 or so of their own people at the general’s funeral and shot down a commercial airliner carrying their own people. US dead: 0.
    Quote Tweet
    The Spectator Index
    @spectatorindex
    · 8h
    BREAKING: Iranian news agency says no signs of any survivors after Ukraine International Flight 752, carrying over 170 people, crashed outside Tehran.

    ------------

    Ouch

    Anyway, while Occam's Razor applies, and we know neither country wants full-scale war, one must never forget that deception is a key part of any military planning

    I see a couple of extra possibilities here

    1. The strike did cause US casualties. In this case, the US is trying to get the Iranians to lower their guard, by demonstrating that they do not acknowledge those deaths and all's good, when Iran in fact knows that it has caused them. In this case a US retaliation will happen very soon. Of course the deception in this case is unlikely to work.

    2. The US is telling the truth and no US troops were killed. In this case both Iran's and the US's statements may just be words, designed to lull the other side into a false sense of security. Iran's revenge isn't done yet and the real damage will be made by pro-Iranian militias in Iran despite what they say about de-escalation, while the US in turn knows this and also has plans to strike Iran anyway, not willing to turn the other cheek on Iran's attack on its military bases. Again, neither side is likely to fall for the other's talk of peace in any case.

    Now on the other hand if everything is as it appears on face value, Iran and the US are both willing to deescalate, and the Iranian attack was all smoke and mirrors agreed upon or otherwise given notice of via some mediator like Oman or Qatar or whatever, then this presents a problem.
    Not because it didn't cause a huge war in the Middle East of course. But simply the fact that this will only strengthen the US's sense of impunity and invincibility. And sooner or later they may try to pull some such stunt with a nation whose missiles do the job or otherwise have the resolve to use them to inflict maximum damage.
    Iran's people will also realize this stunt for what it was and it will cause a lot instability inside Iran.
    The only thing that can save this situation is if the US now withdraws from Iraq as part of whatever secret deal they brokered.

    Isos wrote:
    Aldin 🇧🇦
    @aldin_ww
    ·
    33 min
    Iraqis confirming that they were notified before Iranian missile strikes and they were informed that strikes will be limited to US bases.

    In other words the US was informed in advance too by the Iranians.


    Agree with your statement but not the commercial airline part, I don't think that Iran has anything to gain by doing that.
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:25 pm

    kvs wrote:Given the international reaction it looks like Trumpy and the yanqui hegemon is isolated and will do sweet f*ck all to punish
    the Iranians.   Sanctions are weak and lame.   So I would call this strike to be a win for Iran.   The chatter in this thread about
    how "weak" the Iranian strike was is clearly disjoint from the actual Iranian action and the room Iran has to slap around
    Uncle Scumbag.   This strike will likely guarantee an exit of US troops from Iraq.   Even after the Iraqi parliament voted to
    kick them and their allies out, we had US generals asserting that no exit would occur.   I expect this arrogant tone to change.
    This will be a real victory for Iran, but we will have to wait and see.
    +1
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    Post  Hole on Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:46 pm

    We got the word of Trump and the officialls of the deep state that there were no casualties. Looking at the track record of Trump personally and Amiland as a whole it is really weird that still some people believe anything they say. In a few weeks there will be a fake helicopter crash "killing" some soldiers and a few "road side bombs" that "kill" some more to cover up the dead from this strike.
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    Post  Mindstorm on Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:52 pm


    The Iranian "attack" was clearly a capability's show and contemporaneously an enemy air defense vulnerability show; it is clear to anyone (in particular the same US military operatives) except ,it seem, some contributor here.......


    https://edition.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/us-iran-news-01-08-2020/h_90bbeda4cb756b93059ca87ffcee8eba


    The impressive accuracy shown against the selected parts of the air bases hit and....one more time.....the total inability by part of US forces to intercept anything aimed at the air bases, had very likely the aim to show that incalculable damages both in terms of material, such as the typical US-made gold plated aircraft and ammo depot full of similarly gold-plated high precision air ammunitions concentrated in those air bases devoid even of the shadow of an air defense umbrella, EW coverage and hardening, and USAF operative's lives can be inflicted in a matter of few minutes and that therefore would be very wise 1) To lower the tones of the menaces 2) To begin prepare an exit plan from the area.


    Time will tell if the renowed thousand-year-old Persian diplomatic proficiency and tradition will find a way in the forest of the barbaric people.......


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