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    S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

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    Arrow

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  Arrow on Wed May 24, 2017 5:55 pm

    By wikipedia Russia has now 19 RGTs S-400 or 38 battalions.

    There are tests of an anti-aircraft anti-missile anti-missile system for the S-500 complex, work is under way to create other advanced air defense and anti-missile systems. wrote:


    Maybe we will see S-500 in 2025. Where is 40N6 ? All new S-400 battalion use 5P85SM TEL with standard tube for 48N6DM missile.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  miketheterrible on Wed May 24, 2017 6:21 pm

    It has already been alluded that recent exercises using very long range missiles were 40N6 since S-300V4 were not present during the test.

    Most believe the S-500 will be using a further modification of S-300V4 missile.

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  Arrow on Sun Jun 04, 2017 4:04 pm

    And as usual, any photos and movie from the 40N6 tests. Laughing That is a lot of 48N6 48N6DM, 9M96 test material and none of the 40N6. Russia has been working on this missile for 20 years.


    Last edited by Arrow on Sun Jun 04, 2017 4:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  miketheterrible on Sun Jun 04, 2017 4:07 pm

    I tend to trust the ministry of defense since there wasn't any videos of the exercise at all yet it did happen.

    Do you have info to state otherwise?
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    franco

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  franco on Sun Jun 04, 2017 4:52 pm

    Arrow wrote:By wikipedia Russia has now 19 RGTs S-400 or 38 battalions.




    Maybe we will see S-500 in 2025. Where is 40N6 ? All new S-400 battalion use 5P85SM TEL with standard tube for 48N6DM missile.


    Don't believe them. Shoiku said 13 Rgt's the other day plus those tracking say 16. I suspect 13 are complete and 3 are in transition.

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  Arrow on Sun Jun 04, 2017 5:56 pm

    This is not a lot of S-400 systems now. Russia need about 50 RGT.
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    franco

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  franco on Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:39 pm

    There are 56 S-400 battalions / divisions / batteries on order. There are 28-30 battalions of 300PMU's and deliveries will start soon of a planned 38 battalions / batteries of 350's which replaces the 300PS's and PT's left operational. Plus the 500's will soon start to arrive.
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    AMCXXL

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  AMCXXL on Thu Aug 10, 2017 5:36 am

    rambo54 wrote:Strange; MOD Shoygu reports of 13 (!) RGT S-400....


    My count is 15 - 16* RGTs:

    Moscow: 5 (606, 210, 93, 584, 549)
    St. Petersbg: 2 (500, 1488)
    Kaliningrd: 1 (183)
    Murmansk: 1 (531)
    Severodvinsk: 1 (1528)
    Kamchatka: 1 (1532)
    Nachodka: 1 (589)
    Novorossisk: 1 (1537)
    Crimea: 1 (18)
    Novosibirsk: 1 (590)
    Vladivostok: 1 (1533)




    But even when we leave out the 1533 we would have 15 RGT right now...and not 13 ??????


    Total is 17 regiments , with the first set deployed this year
    Seems that 13 are managed by VKS and 4 the Navy

    606 ZRP in Elektrostal received a regimental set , (the first) in 2009 , and another set last year for replace the first
    The first regimental set went to Kasputin Yar range (Astrakhan Oblast) as part of 185 TsBP i PeLS for training purposes as replacement for S-300
    Nowadays , a battery of this unit is deployed in Syria
    The 16 ZPR regiments of your list are OK , including the 1533th of Vladivostok, of course , deployed in 2015

    1st ARMY PVOiPRO MOSCOW SPECIAL PURPOSE COMMAND
    4ºDIV: 93rd (Funkovo) , 210th (Dubrovka) , 584th (Marino-Solnechnogosk)
    5ºDIV: 549th (Podolsk) , 606th (Elektrostal)


    45th ARMY VVSiPVO of NORTH JSC  (Joint Strategic Comand)
    1ºDIV: 531st (Poliarny) , 1528th (Severovdinsk)


    BALTIC FLEET
    44ºDIV: 183rd (Gvardeysk/Kaliningrad Oblast)


    6º ARMY VVSiPVO
    18ºDIV: 500th (Lomosonov), 1488th (Zelenogorsk)

    4º ARMY VVSiPVO
    51ºDIV: 1537th (Novorossiysk)
    31ºDIV: 18th (Feodosia)

    14º ARMY VVSiPVO
    41ºDIV: 590th (Novosibirsk)

    11º ARMY VVSiPVO
    93ºDIV: 589th (Nakhodka) , 1533rd (Vladivostok)


    PACIFIC FLEET
    53ºDIV: 1532nd (Petropavlovsk-Kamchatka)


    TRAINING REGIMENT; Ashuluk (Astrakhan Oblast)



    Arrow wrote:
    By wikipedia Russia has now 19 RGTs S-400 or 38 battalions.

    Russian Wikipedia list of S-400 has at least two mistakes:
    The new 33th ZRP at Rogachevo (Novaya Zemlya) have S-300
    The supossed regiment at Tiksi (Sakha Republik) is projected but for the moment not deployed, and it seems that it will also have S-300
    These S-300 are surplus from regiments that have received S-400

    So , as I said before, the total is 17 regiments, 16 combat regiments and one training/test regiment
    The number of Battalions must be 35 because Kamchatka regiment have 3 battalions instead 2
    Total projected is 56 battalions , about 10-11 more regiments for deploy before 2020


    Last edited by AMCXXL on Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:29 pm; edited 6 times in total
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    franco

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  franco on Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:31 pm

    AMCXXL wrote:
    rambo54 wrote:Strange; MOD Shoygu reports of 13 (!) RGT S-400....


    My count is 15 - 16* RGTs:

    Moscow: 5 (606, 210, 93, 584, 549)
    St. Petersbg: 2 (500, 1488)
    Kaliningrd: 1 (183)
    Murmansk: 1 (531)
    Severodvinsk: 1 (1528)
    Kamchatka: 1 (1532)
    Nachodka: 1 (589)
    Novorossisk: 1 (1537)
    Crimea: 1 (18)
    Novosibirsk: 1 (590)
    Vladivostok: 1 (1533)




    But even when we leave out the 1533 we would have 15 RGT right now...and not 13 ??????


    Total is 17 regiments , with the first set deployed this year
    Seems that 13 are managed by VKS and 4 the Navy

    606 ZRP in Elektrostal received a regimental set , (the first) in 2009 , and another set last year for replace the first
    The first regimental set went to Kasputin Yar range (Astrakhan Oblast) as part of 185 TsBP i PeLS for training purposes as replacement for S-300
    Nowadays , a battery of this unit is deployed in Syria
    The 16 ZPR regiments of your list are OK , including the 1533th of Vladivostok, of course , deployed in 2015

    1st ARMY PVOiPRO MOSCOW SPECIAL PURPOSE COMMAND
    4ºDIV: 93rd (Funkovo) , 210th (Dubrovka) , 584th (Marino-Solnechnogosk)
    5ºDIV: 549th (Podolsk) , 606th (Elektrostal)


    45th ARMY VVSiPVO of NORTH FLEET JSC  (Joint Strategic Comand)
    1ºDIV: 531st (Poliarny) , 1528th (Severovdinsk)


    BALTIC FLEET
    44ºDIV: 183rd (Gvardeysk/Kaliningrad Oblast)


    6º ARMY VVSiPVO
    18ºDIV: 500th (Lomosonov), 1488th (Zelenogorsk)

    4º ARMY VVSiPVO
    51ºDIV: 1537th (Novorossiysk)
    31ºDIV: 18th (Feodosia)

    14º ARMY VVSiPVO
    41ºDIV: 590th (Novosibirsk)

    11º ARMY VVSiPVO
    93ºDIV: 589th (Nakhodka) , 1533rd (Vladivostok)


    PACIFIC FLEET
    53ºDIV: 1532nd (Petropavlovsk-Kamchatka)


    TRAINING REGIMENT; Kasputin Yarv (Astrakhan Oblast)



    Arrow wrote:
    By wikipedia Russia has now 19 RGTs S-400 or 38 battalions.

    Russian Wikipedia list of S-400 has at least two mistakes:
    The new 33th ZRP at Rogachevo (Novaya Zemlya) have S-300
    The supossed regiment at Tiksi (Sakha Republik) is projected but for the moment not deployed, and it seems that it will also have S-300
    These S-300 are surplus from regiments that have received S-400

    So , as I said before, the total is 17 regiments, 16 combat regiments and one training/test regiment
    The number of Battalions must be 35 because Kamchatka regiment have 3 battalions instead 2
    Total projected is 56 battalions , about 10-11 more regiments for deploy before 2020

    Apparently a training unit also at Yaroslavl in conjunction with the training Academy.
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    AMCXXL

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  AMCXXL on Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:47 am

    franco wrote:

    Apparently a training unit also at Yaroslavl in conjunction with the training Academy.  


    The list only is about the S-400 current known deployements, I heard nothing about Yaroslavl for now
    Not clear.... after read several webpages, all the S-400 , or most of them, was tested at Kasputin Yar before to be deployed to its regiments
    The first set of ZPR 606th has been sent to other place, propably in Astrakhan Oblast as I read

    I though that the training range for S-300/400 is in Ashuluk , and I saw in a ORBAT that there was a S-300 training unit , but I cannot remember where I read that
    In wikipdia (2008) >> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forces_of_central_subordination_of_the_Russian_Air_Force_2008

    185th TsBP i PeLS has at least:
    -116th Operational Combat Training Regiment (Privolzhsky-Astrakhan) Mig-29
    -42th Operational Training Center (Ashuluk-Astrakhan Oblast) SAM and targets.

    Not sure if 4th Misile Test Range "Kasputin Yar" (really a "cosmodrome") is now included , but is near (the same "Oblast" or russian district)
    Probably I read that news in a conventional web , not specialized , and probably the final destiny is mistaken , and is Ashuluk , and also a part of this regimental set was sent to Syria, as I read
    You can look at the satellite 50 km east of Ashuluk village,big facilities and a quantity of material and... large trucks??
    It seems logical to think that training/test units are concentrated in southern Russia (Astrakhan, Krasnodar ...)


    About that you say about Yaroslavl, probably ten years ago there was a regiment of 4th Brigade VKO (Today 4th división of PVO) , but the things changed a lot and several times in last ten years. VKO forces changed to PVO and now integrated with VVS into VKS
    In Yaroslavl also is (or was) the: "ANTI AIRCRAFT DEFENSE INSTITUTE" , not a test range. In a place like this can be "prototypes" of launchers , not battaliions or other units.
    It is an Institute of AA "engineering" as it seems

    Also I have read in a couple of webpages that in Yaroslav is placed the GATCHINA Range, but this is mistaken, this place is in Leningrad Oblast:
    "Gatchina training aviation and air defense center" or "Center for anti-aircraft missile troops", At Uchhoz (Gatchina-3) , depends the date or the place you find the information
    The problem is that the translators also translate as "training" , (academic) "formation". Probably here also, active troops study and take contact with new missile systems
    The last tittle found ,  Gátchina Aerospace Defense Academy . It does not seem that there are units with troops here, only students, even if there is any launcher for practices without fire. On the satelite you do not see great facilities or materials and it is very close to Pushkin, on the outskirts of Leningrad



    The matter with the information is all the ORBAT´s you can find in internet are just "the opinión" of the writer , generally a "defence advisor" as could be a "stock exchange advisor"  or a simply journalist that write about military information, even in places as Globalsecurity or Jane´s
    Other sites as Wikipedia , fórums, etc... generally have a lot of outdated or mistaken information , thinking that the ORBAT is in remodeling right now

    Russian Defense Ministry does not give information about the ORBAT (of course) so all you can do is find information on serious and specialized Russian websites, forums and blogs , and get reliable data

    The two better websites with enough current data were warfare.ru/warfare.be, closed last year and milkavkaz.net written by a russian, recently locked
    I see in this forum , some information copied from milkavkaz.net
    It's really bad luck not to have copied the whole web (even in russian), despite their errors/omissions

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  rambo54 on Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:35 am

    Just to remarks:

    1.
    1533
    no S-400 deployment as of July 2017!
    (one site still with PS and one site without TELs)
    2.
    Number of Batts its harder to determine than RGT
    e.g. major changes in 183
    6 Batts now.
    2 S-300PS changed position and the two 5P85T2 moved to forward postions! Moreover there are two S-400 with 5P85S2. So we have 4 Batts of S-400 with 183!

    Same situation of 531 RGt.
    12 TELs (S2) with Radar sets for 2 Batts at Gadschievo
    two more (mixed sites) Batt with S2 at (two sites) at Severomorsk together with Two Batt of S-300PM.
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    AMCXXL

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  AMCXXL on Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:56 pm

    rambo54 wrote:Just to remarks:

    1.
    1533
    no S-400 deployment as of July 2017!
    (one site still with PS and one site without TELs)
    2.
    Number of Batts its harder to determine than RGT
    e.g. major changes in 183
    6 Batts now.
    2 S-300PS changed position and the two 5P85T2 moved to forward postions! Moreover there are two S-400 with 5P85S2. So we have 4 Batts of S-400 with 183!

    Same situation of 531 RGt.
    12 TELs (S2) with Radar sets for 2 Batts at Gadschievo
    two more (mixed sites) Batt with S2 at (two sites) at Severomorsk together with Two Batt of S-300PM.

    If I understand, you say you try to "count battalions" using the satellite images?
    The satellite is useful to know that there is a place on a specific date, but not to determine accurately the composition of a unit
    A example of mistaken ORBAT:
    Both warfare.ru and globalsecurity have located "5 SU-27 and 5 Su-25" in Kant year after year
    Of course that is false, maybe one specific day there were 5 Su-27 doing maneuvers, as another I saw Su-24 or Mig-31. Kant only had one unit with 6 Su-25 (5+1UB) and one complete squadron since 2015

    Battalions are soldiers, not missile launchers
    Squadrons are pilots, not airplanes

    I think it is not possible a regiment with 6 battalions, probably the old machines are in reserve/waitnig for a new destination
    Some S-300 habe been relocated expanding regiments, open new regiments or sold to other countries. The rest couuld stay in their place
    The most probable is 3-4 battallions in most units , and 2 in the smaller units or new formed units that waiting for more material

    The only thing is true, when MoD accepts the material after testing it, it is assigned to a unit.This is a conclusive fact when it is published every year by MoD
    The fact that it is not parked at its theoric base, at a particular moment, is not conclusive, it may be somewhere else
    There are many facilities undergoing renovations/upgrades and other of new construction , including the PVO bases
    For example the Su-34 "of Vorónezh" , are not in Vorónezh , but that does not mean they are not operational , have been in Buturnilovka for 4 years


    Benya wrote:
    I don't know that who and why did downed those two sites, I have visited both of them frequently (mostly milkavkaz). It's a pity  Neutral . However I have managed to find milkavkaz in a web archive, and collected some info. I plan to get my ORBAT topics back on track by September with updates to the Ground Forces and VKS ORBAT threads, and adding the Navy's.

    It's easy to imagine: "KGB" Laughing

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  rambo54 on Fri Aug 11, 2017 9:09 pm

    I do not only count sites but Radar support. Just look at the 183 (ggole & Terraserver)

    Kaliningrad - 183 RGT
    many things have changed.

    The 12x 5P85T2 at Gwardeisk have been transferrred to two other locations:
    Baltysk: 1 site with 1 Batt (with 6x T2 TELs): 54.600538° 19.847339°
    Baltiyskoye: 1 site with 1 Batt (with 6x T2 TELs): 54.480249° 19.916012°

    The 2x8 S-300PS which had occupied these sites before seems to have been transferred to:
    Gwardeisk: 1 site with 2x4 5P85S: 54.682654° 21.012234° and
    Chernjachovsk: 1 site with 2x4 5P85S & D: 54.614255°21.810721°
    The 5N64S is at Chernjachovsk = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMENe3KZnec&feature=youtu.be

    Moreover there are two S-400 sites with 5P85S2:
    Jantarny: 1 site with 6x S2 TELs: 54.872952° 19.953052°
    Dorozhnoye: 1 site with 6x S2 TELs: 54.746007° 20.072403°
    The 91N6 vehicle supporting the 4x S-400 Batts is at Lunino 54.747646°19.971054° (seen non deployed at google earth now).
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    franco

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  franco on Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:34 pm

    Benya wrote:
    AMCXXL wrote:The two better websites with enough current data were warfare.ru/warfare.be, closed last year and milkavkaz.net written by a russian, recently locked
    I see in this forum , some information copied from milkavkaz.net
    It's really bad luck not to have copied the whole web (even in russian), despite their errors/omissions

    I don't know that who and why did downed those two sites, I have visited both of them frequently (mostly milkavkaz). It's a pity  Neutral . However I have managed to find milkavkaz in a web archive, and collected some info. I plan to get my ORBAT topics back on track by September with updates to the Ground Forces and VKS ORBAT threads, and adding the Navy's.

    warfare switched to a pay for view format and then seemed to fade off into the sunset
    milkavkaz (actually an Ukrainian) tried to sell his site for about 6 months while trying to get a job with any Western Think Tank. Believe he is still looking for a job but his site is gone. Could either be the new Ukrainian internet regulations or his domain had expired.
    vlad before those two was also an excellant source of information. He has been gone for at least 10 years.
    Plus several others and I always copy Wink

    As for sat imagery and PVO, Sean O'C was one of the best and this site has as a member the best I have seen since Jane's hired O'C to work exclusively for them.
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    AMCXXL

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  AMCXXL on Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:54 pm

    rambo54 wrote:I do not only count sites but Radar support. Just look at the 183 (ggole & Terraserver)

    Kaliningrad - 183 RGT
    many things have changed.

    The 12x 5P85T2 at Gwardeisk have been transferrred to two other locations:
    Baltysk: 1 site with 1 Batt (with 6x T2 TELs): 54.600538° 19.847339°
    Baltiyskoye: 1 site with 1 Batt (with 6x T2 TELs): 54.480249° 19.916012°

    The 2x8 S-300PS which had occupied these sites before seems to have been transferred to:
    Gwardeisk: 1 site with 2x4 5P85S: 54.682654° 21.012234° and
    Chernjachovsk: 1 site with 2x4 5P85S & D: 54.614255°21.810721°
    The 5N64S is at Chernjachovsk

    Moreover there are two S-400 sites with 5P85S2:
    Jantarny: 1 site with 6x S2 TELs: 54.872952° 19.953052°
    Dorozhnoye: 1 site with 6x S2 TELs: 54.746007° 20.072403°
    The 91N6 vehicle supporting the 4x S-400 Batts is at Lunino 54.747646°19.971054° (seen non deployed at google earth now).

    Hello.My native tongue is not english so is probable I cannot understand the exact meaning of some phrases or words , and translators do not work miracles

    When you write "Batt." , what do you mean?  What mens "4x S-400 Batt." ??
    The units have different names in different countries
    In my country:
    A Colonel commands a Regiment
    A Lieutenant Colonel commands a Battalion (infantry) / Group (cavalry, artillery)
    A Captain commands a Company (infantry), Squadron (cavalry), Battery (artillery)
    A Lieutenant commands a Section in all branches

    I use here: Regiment/Battalion/Battery because I beleive this is standard in english speaking countries , despite in russian are using "división" for S-300/400 battallions

    About Kaliningrad , If I remember there are two regiments in the división, Baltysk is in the coast and other places as Chernyakhovsk  are in the interior, on the other side of the province. Are all locations of the same unit?
    How many battallions had the 183rd , before to receive the S-400 ?


    Last edited by AMCXXL on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:12 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  AMCXXL on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:09 am

    franco wrote:
    Benya wrote:
    AMCXXL wrote:The two better websites with enough current data were warfare.ru/warfare.be, closed last year and milkavkaz.net written by a russian, recently locked
    I see in this forum , some information copied from milkavkaz.net
    It's really bad luck not to have copied the whole web (even in russian), despite their errors/omissions

    I don't know that who and why did downed those two sites, I have visited both of them frequently (mostly milkavkaz). It's a pity  Neutral . However I have managed to find milkavkaz in a web archive, and collected some info. I plan to get my ORBAT topics back on track by September with updates to the Ground Forces and VKS ORBAT threads, and adding the Navy's.

    warfare switched to a pay for view format and then seemed to fade off into the sunset
    milkavkaz (actually an Ukrainian) tried to sell his site for about 6 months while trying to get a job with any Western Think Tank. Believe he is still looking for a job but his site is gone. Could either be the new Ukrainian internet regulations or his domain had expired.
    vlad before those two was also an excellant source of information. He has been gone for at least 10 years.
    Plus several others and I always copy Wink

    As for sat imagery and PVO, Sean O'C was one of the best and this site has as a member the best I have seen since Jane's hired O'C to work exclusively for them.  

    Warfare and milkavkaz was good for the numbers and locations of missile regments and things like that but not for other things, as that particular aircraft are in service
    The satellite is useful but not conclusive
    The matter with the soviet weapons , is Rusiia have a lot of them and is not posible to know exactely what weapon is in use and what is in reserve or retired
    For example if you look Armavir , you could see some Mig-29 , more of 20 , the same at Kuschevskaya , more of 30 , Privolzsky,etc...
    But how many are flying rigth now???
    Last year about 6-7 UB´s at Armavir and similar number in Kuschevskaya
    This year in Armavir only fly Yak-130,  and in Kuschevskaya one squadron of 12-14 Mig-29UB
    The rest are "stored" or in reserve, many with paint in poor condition. The same happends with other units
    About russian modern weapons , there are enough information about numbers deployed
    About "ucranian" , well for me a ucranian is like a russian if write in russsian , my aunt is from ukraine, she worked in Kiev in soviet times and later in Moscow when the ukrainian economy failed , and she can not understand what is happening there now , that she is retired in my country
    The only advantage of being "ucranian" is that you can find easy many information in russian (cirilic) characters
    to get a job with any Western Think Tank??? I think that it's easier than a westerner (US,canadian,british ,israelite... ) get to be governor of an oblast or minister of the government of Ukraine as they are the things today


    rambo54 wrote:
    franco wrote:New S-300PS regiment went on combat duty in Abakan. Have heard it will be called the 170th.

    "The anti-aircraft missile systems S-300PS today (Friday) at 10.00 local time (06.00 MSK) atonement for combat duty in the Republic of Khakassia", - told Shchemelev.

    According to the source, the calculations Abakan anti-aircraft missile compound successfully completed the training course for new weapons, carried out a program of training and combat shooting on Ashuluk range in the Astrakhan region in late March. "To accommodate the new S-300 systems were equipped with the appropriate positions," - said the representative of the military.

    He said that the anti-aircraft missile compound was formed on the territory of Abakan December 1, 2015. "The main objective of anti-aircraft gunners - cover important objects in the zone of responsibility", - said Shchemelev.

    S-300PS - anti-aircraft missile system of medium-range, designed to destroy air targets at ranges up to 300 kilometers, flying at speeds up to 1.2 thousand meters per second. The complex is able to simultaneously fire six goals, suggesting every two missiles.

    Did you found it already? History is of no help - as far as I know there never was a S-200/300 RGT in that district...

    bmpd.livejournal.com/2302353.html

    Deployment of only the newly-created 170th anti-aircraft missile regiment of the 41st Air Defense Division of the 14th Air Force and Air Defense Army of the Central Military District to the anti-aircraft missile brigade. The 170th Missile Regiment was formed in Khakassia on the order of the Russian Defense Minister on October 1, 2015 (the regiment's control was the Boots of the Ust-Abansk District, near Abakan), entered combat duty on July 1, 2016, and, according to open sources, had In its composition two battalions (два дивизиона) of ZRS S-300PS

    It should be noted that during Soviet times in the area of ​​Abakan anti-aircraft missile units of the Air Defense Forces were absent. In the territory of Khakassia, only the south of Abakan in the Sayanogorsk area in 1983-1993, the 352nd anti-aircraft missile regiment, equipped with the S-75 SAM and specially deployed for the Irkutsk 39th Air Defense Corps (later the 94th Air Defense Division), was stationed Covering the Sayano-Shushenskaya HPP.

    It can be assumed that a second group of S-300P SAM battalions was set up as part of the newly formed brigade to deploy the former 352th anti-aircraft missile regiment in the areas of deployment to cover the Sayano-Shushenskaya HPP.

    rambo54

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  rambo54 on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:02 pm

    Hi! I'm no native english speaker too. So the blame is pretty much on my side.

    First let me say that I appreciate your input. I'm just a private reseacher and nerd. And I'm far from being perfect.

    You are right : I'm basically counting sites.
    Because the inner structure of the AD RGT are not known to me and it varies over the time.
    Your structure : RGT/Battalion/Battery is fair for the Airforce AD scene.

    RGT should be easy for "guys like us". So how many Battalions and in turn how many Batteries are within a RGT? That varies!
    Sometime you have only 4 TELs supported by 30N6 or 92N6. Sometime you have 6 or 8 and sometimes even 12.
    And this is not even constant for a certain RGT!

    For example the 583 RGT Gadshievo site has 12 S2 TELs - is this one Battalion with two Batteries (two Radar sets are there)? Or is it two Battalions?
    In the two Severomorsk sites you have up to 12 other S2 and up to 12 PMs plus Radar. Is this only "reserve" in a garrsion?

    A recent video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMENe3KZnec&feature=youtu.be - which I metioned it before) show active PS at Chernjachovsk (183 RGT)!
    8 TELs not seen before. Full Radar support - even 5N64.

    A year ago only the Gwardeisk site 54.682654° 21.012234° show S-400 (5P85T2). 12 TELs.
    Now they CHANGED position with two previous PS sites:
    3. Baltysk: 1 site (with 6 T2 TELs): 54.600538° 19.847339° (Is this a Battalion or a Battery?)
    4. Baltiyskoye: 1 site (with 6 T2 TELs): 54.480249° 19.916012° (Is this a Battalion or a Battery?)

    Both sites had 2x 8 PS before. Where did they go? To Chernjachovsk AND now (see google earth) to Gwardeisk! Gwardeisk has 2x4 PS now at two sub-sites - both with Radar support. Probably Batteries. 5N64 support from Chernjachovsk.
    Why do they still use them? I don't know.

    The 8 TELs (S1 & D) at Chernjachovsk seems to have one 30N6 see video. Is it one Battalion (I think so)? Or a Battery?
    The 2x4 TELs (google earth) at Gwardeisk 54.682303° 21.012422° (at two sub-sites) are EACH supported by a complete Radar set. Is it two Batteries in one Battalion? Or - as previous with the 2x6 T2 TELs - two Battalions?
    You see - those things are not easy to determine!

    Therefore I admit that at least to me it is more sufficient just to count RGT and sites and not Battalions or Batteries :-)

    Two other sites had PS a couple of years ago. But since about two years (without much announcement) transferred to S2!
    Some video clips revealed this in 2017:
    1. Jantarny: 1 site (with 6 S2 TELs): 54.872952° 19.953052° (Is this a Battalion or a Battery?)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw6qjiqxfNQ
    2. Dorozhnoye: 1 site (with 6 S2 TELs): 54.746007° 20.072403° (Is this a Battalion or a Battery?)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iL1Z2rybX1I

    So the previous constellation of : (1.-4.) four sites with PS and one site (Gwardeisk) with 12 T2 has changed now.
    BTW the 91N6 support for the - well 4 sites ;-) - of S-400 is here (seen non deployed on google) 54.747646° 19.971054°. It changed over from the Gwardeisk position (about here 54.681437°21.021518°).

    Regarding the construction of the SM-3 base at Slupsk 54.480478° 17.110407° it makes sense to me to have this base within the envelope of four forward S-400 sites at the western coastline of Kainingrad...backed by 2 more S-300PS sites.

    And a mix of those equipment is not uncommon. See 1528 RGT .
    Two S-400 (S2) 64.646300° 39.830040° / 64.495963° 39.647178° and two with S-300PM 64.614896° 39.827151° / 64.531434° 40.139405°.
    I would count them as 4 Battalions... :-)

    Cheers

    rambo54

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    S-400 ORBAT

    Post  rambo54 on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:07 pm

    AMCXXL wrote:
    franco wrote:
    Benya wrote:
    AMCXXL wrote:The two better websites with enough current data were warfare.ru/warfare.be, closed last year and milkavkaz.net written by a russian, recently locked
    I see in this forum , some information copied from milkavkaz.net
    It's really bad luck not to have copied the whole web (even in russian), despite their errors/omissions

    I don't know that who and why did downed those two sites, I have visited both of them frequently (mostly milkavkaz). It's a pity  Neutral . However I have managed to find milkavkaz in a web archive, and collected some info. I plan to get my ORBAT topics back on track by September with updates to the Ground Forces and VKS ORBAT threads, and adding the Navy's.

    warfare switched to a pay for view format and then seemed to fade off into the sunset
    milkavkaz (actually an Ukrainian) tried to sell his site for about 6 months while trying to get a job with any Western Think Tank. Believe he is still looking for a job but his site is gone. Could either be the new Ukrainian internet regulations or his domain had expired.
    vlad before those two was also an excellant source of information. He has been gone for at least 10 years.
    Plus several others and I always copy Wink

    As for sat imagery and PVO, Sean O'C was one of the best and this site has as a member the best I have seen since Jane's hired O'C to work exclusively for them.  

    Warfare and milkavkaz was good for the numbers and locations of missile regments and things like that but not for other things, as that particular aircraft are in service
    The satellite is useful but not conclusive
    The matter with the soviet weapons , is Rusiia have a lot of them and is not posible to know exactely what weapon is in use and what is in reserve or retired
    For example if you look Armavir , you could see some Mig-29 , more of 20 , the same at Kuschevskaya , more of 30 , Privolzsky,etc...
    But how many are flying rigth now???
    Last year about 6-7 UB´s at Armavir and similar number in Kuschevskaya
    This year in Armavir only fly Yak-130,  and in Kuschevskaya one squadron of 12-14 Mig-29UB
    The rest are "stored" or in reserve, many with paint in poor condition. The same happends with other units
    About russian modern weapons , there are enough information about numbers deployed
    About "ucranian" , well for me a ucranian is like a russian if write in russsian , my aunt is from ukraine, she worked in Kiev in soviet times and later in Moscow when the ukrainian economy failed , and she can not understand what is happening there now , that she is retired in my country
    The only advantage of being "ucranian" is that you can find easy many information in russian (cirilic) characters
    to get a job with any Western Think Tank??? I think that it's easier than a westerner (US,canadian,british ,israelite... ) get to be governor of an oblast or minister of the government of Ukraine as they are the things today


    rambo54 wrote:
    franco wrote:New S-300PS regiment went on combat duty in Abakan. Have heard it will be called the 170th.

    "The anti-aircraft missile systems S-300PS today (Friday) at 10.00 local time (06.00 MSK) atonement for combat duty in the Republic of Khakassia", - told Shchemelev.

    According to the source, the calculations Abakan anti-aircraft missile compound successfully completed the training course for new weapons, carried out a program of training and combat shooting on Ashuluk range in the Astrakhan region in late March. "To accommodate the new S-300 systems were equipped with the appropriate positions," - said the representative of the military.

    He said that the anti-aircraft missile compound was formed on the territory of Abakan December 1, 2015. "The main objective of anti-aircraft gunners - cover important objects in the zone of responsibility", - said Shchemelev.

    S-300PS - anti-aircraft missile system of medium-range, designed to destroy air targets at ranges up to 300 kilometers, flying at speeds up to 1.2 thousand meters per second. The complex is able to simultaneously fire six goals, suggesting every two missiles.

    Did you found it already? History is of no help - as far as I know there never was a S-200/300 RGT in that district...

    bmpd.livejournal.com/2302353.html

    Deployment of only the newly-created 170th anti-aircraft missile regiment of the 41st Air Defense Division of the 14th Air Force and Air Defense Army of the Central Military District to the anti-aircraft missile brigade. The 170th Missile Regiment was formed in Khakassia on the order of the Russian Defense Minister on October 1, 2015 (the regiment's control was the Boots of the Ust-Abansk District, near Abakan), entered combat duty on July 1, 2016, and, according to open sources, had In its composition two battalions (два дивизиона) of ZRS S-300PS

    It should be noted that during Soviet times in the area of ​​Abakan anti-aircraft missile units of the Air Defense Forces were absent. In the territory of Khakassia, only the south of Abakan in the Sayanogorsk area in 1983-1993, the 352nd anti-aircraft missile regiment, equipped with the S-75 SAM and specially deployed for the Irkutsk 39th Air Defense Corps (later the 94th Air Defense Division), was stationed Covering the Sayano-Shushenskaya HPP.

    It can be assumed that a second group of S-300P SAM battalions was set up as part of the newly formed brigade to deploy the former 352th anti-aircraft missile regiment in the areas of deployment to cover the Sayano-Shushenskaya HPP.

    The question I issued are solved to me meanwhile. I'have learned the 170 became 24th now.
    It has PS over here 53.613223° 91.230400° (one Battalion :-) )
    and here 55.936434° 92.253166° (another Battalion) (see Terraserver)
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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  George1 on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:40 pm

    @AMCXXL i appreciate your contribution till now, but its forum's rule to introduce yourself as a new member

    http://www.russiadefence.net/f6-member-introductions-and-rules


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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  AMCXXL on Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:46 am

    rambo54 wrote:I do not only count sites but Radar support. Just look at the 183 (ggole & Terraserver)

    Kaliningrad - 183 RGT
    many things have changed.

    The 12x 5P85T2 at Gwardeisk have been transferrred to two other locations:
    Baltysk: 1 site with 1 Batt (with 6x T2 TELs): 54.600538° 19.847339°
    Baltiyskoye: 1 site with 1 Batt (with 6x T2 TELs): 54.480249° 19.916012°

    The 2x8 S-300PS which had occupied these sites before seems to have been transferred to:
    Gwardeisk: 1 site with 2x4 5P85S: 54.682654° 21.012234° and
    Chernjachovsk: 1 site with 2x4 5P85S & D: 54.614255°21.810721°
    The 5N64S is at Chernjachovsk = youtube.com/watch?v=KMENe3KZnec&feature=youtu.be

    Moreover there are two S-400 sites with 5P85S2:
    Jantarny: 1 site with 6x S2 TELs: 54.872952° 19.953052°
    Dorozhnoye: 1 site with 6x S2 TELs: 54.746007° 20.072403°
    The 91N6 vehicle supporting the 4x S-400 Batts is at Lunino 54.747646°19.971054° (seen non deployed at google earth now).

    Hello:
    I try to see the sites.
    Terraserver demostrator don´t works, the zoom is locked and cannot get a full zoom, and this is the better place because the images has a date
    Google has images of different times. Most viewed sites , the images renew more times
    For example, in this moment in Google,  Chernyakhovsk image I can see , has at least 1 year or more, while airbase of Vladivostok has a image of May

    Anyway in terraserver I can see the suppossed SAM site of Chernyakhovsk
    There are nothing on May, is empty terrain of the base at the end of the runway , behind the last shelters. Could have any vehicle much smaller than a SU-27 , but nothing more
    The video is of a maneouvres , a deployment for drills. The PVO garrisons are out of airbases and in Chernyakhovsk airbase there is no PVO garrison or facilities

    About the other places I think that may be garrisons battalion-type , regardless of what SAM hardware have at a particular moment

    It seems that in Kaliningrad the deployement of a regimental set of S-400 have expanded the 44 División
    I see there are 4 units near the coast now
    Gvardeivsk is the 44 División Headquarters if I remember that milkavkaz.net said, then should have a headquarters

    Can you tell me the location of SAM sites of the 1545 ZPR ?? ( the other regiment of 44 Div. if the number is rigth)



    About the ORBAT , I think the thing should be like that >> upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/02/4th_US_Infantry_Division.png
    The specific composition of each basic unit shoul be studied case for case out the orbat diagram
    The battalion is the basic maneouver unit since the Roman times (cohors = battalion)
    A regiment is an administrative unit, that groups battalions of same branche

    The battalion has a liutenant colonel with his staff of command , company of command and company of services (support) , in addition to several combat companies
    Of course in the case of artillery all of these companies are called "batteries" have rockets/howitzers or haven´t

    In the facilities/garrison of a división , regiment or single battalion must have facilities , barracks , buildings , wharehouses , etc... that a single battery should not have
    I think you can look all the garrisons and could find more clues about what type of unit is, despite the hardware parked in one specific moment
    To look with satellite images ofen , help because you can look what is happening through the time

    I think probably the 44 DIV has been reinforced because the Baltic is a hot place right now
    Then , 44 DIV Is in the process of restructuring, it is very difficult to know exactly where everything is, more time is needed

    rambo54

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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  rambo54 on Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:13 am

    Terraserver changed its policy again but you may have the full zoom (although not comparable to that what they had until last September) by becoming a member (there are three levels of membership - the first (zoom wiht watermarks) is for free!.

    1545: Its an S-300V unit - garrison is (still) here 54.602107° 21.233617° - some TELs and Radar visible. A "Battery" deployment often happened here 54.601367° 21.237273° (use history layer in google earth)
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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

    Post  franco on Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:44 pm

    Here is the only TO&E of a S400 that I have found on the net;

    • Anti-aircraft missile regiment of S-400 consists of:
    - Management of the regiment, which includes the command headquarters;
    - Automated command post (Battery Management, Department of radar reconnaissance, electromechanical unit where 1 unit of item 55K6E combat control, 1 unit 91N6E detection radar..);
    - Group divisions (2-3 anti-aircraft missile division, technical battery);
    - Anti-aircraft artillery battalion ZRPK 96K6 "Carapace-C" ( up to 6 units of MB.);
    - Radar separation, chemical and biological protection;
    - Repair and maintenance companies;
    - Company financial security (material support)
    - Economic platoon. (supply)

    Anti-aircraft missile battalions of S-400 consists of:
    - the division of management;
    - Electronic battery (Department of command and control, separation of receiving and transmitting devices, separation of radar reconnaissance, where 1 unit 92N6E multifunction control radars, mobile tower 1 unit 40V6M for antenna post 92N6E, 1 unit 96L6E all-altitude radar...);
    - Starting battery (3-4 units 5P85TE2 launchers.); Usually 2 but maybe 3-4.
    - Electromechanical compartment;
    - Automotive platoon;
    - Liaison offices;
    - Separation of survey;
    - Branch of logistics.


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    Re: S-300/400 ORBAT. Battalions and Regiments

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