Russian Su-24 shootdown by Turkish Air Force F-16 fighter

Mustafa wrote:

Acheron wrote:

Mustafa wrote:
Let me answer this. The trucks attacked were most likely from a syrian corporation with syrian drivers. They deliver concrete, food and other daily supply from turkey to syria. They don´t use turkish truck drivers in most cases, because turkish truck drivers are organized in unions and they don´t allow them to go in civil war areas.

When you say "Syrian corporation" I assume you mean volunteers from some of the armed groups controlling the area, right? If so, then Azzaz is known to be controlled by Jabhat al-Nusra, a terrorist group. Do you think it wise that Turkey is essentially sending convoys into the hands of such terrorist groups?

concrete and food causes no harm and danger to anyone. Or do you fear they throw tomatoes on you?

And i want to say one thing. The current events there are unfortunate. But nobody in turkey is afraid about Russia. Russia is far over its prime. Its a northern nigeria. All its stockmarket united is smaller than google. Its economy is stagnating and depends on gas and oil. The war in syria can´t be won by russia. As long the sunni nation + turkey don´t agree, no solution will be reached, the war will go on until russia is pushed out.

We should not forget that russia suffered two plane crashs and the one in sinai was far worse for Putin than the downed fighter jet.

Russia isn´t scary. And nobody in turkey is scared about them. So forget about that and it should sit down at table so we solve the problems.

That's why Turkish AF stopped overflights to Syria? Because Russia isn't scary. There's only one thing that keeps you Safe, that's NATO's (USA) arsenal. Turkish armed forces have huge technological gap and lack of dedicated numbers. Your air defence is weak and generally strategically, Turkey is just a giant target, it's exactly for that purpose that you're in NATO, being slaughtered until the US of A gets there.

If anything Turkey has no retaliation means against a Russian strike, you could even overrun the Small Russian contingent in Syria, but by then, if the US isn't coming you'll be getting tactical cruise missiles all over your air bases. Compare the message Russia sent by bombing the shit out of meaning less targets in Isis land, think about what can happen to Turkey within a week-end.

Oh and believe me Russia can't be pushed out as long as Iran is in. But what scares you more than bombs is that Russia might simply stop spending money in Turkey. It's what? 20/25 billion USd per year spent in Turkey? Like 27% of your hotel rooms? So have fun.

Mustafa wrote:

Rodinazombie wrote:

Mustafa wrote:

higurashihougi wrote:My question is why did the Turk people vote for Erdogan et al. in the first place and is it the time now to kick the a** of Erdogan et al. and replace them with a cleaner, less corrupted goverment ?

No offence here but I cannot stand the idiocy of Erdogan et al. any longer.

I did not vote for Erdogan. But i respect what he has done internal for our economy. And i would never stand against the president.

Sounds more like you support him than not. That makes you part of the problem.

I´m a patriot. I stand for my nation 100%. Erdogan has his mistakes as any human being. But he is my president and as this i will never stand against him.

I believed russians understand this. They too have a president who ruined their country, is openly homosexual and a corrupt thug. Yet they respect his office.

Mustafa wrote:

Acheron wrote:

Mustafa wrote:
Let me answer this. The trucks attacked were most likely from a syrian corporation with syrian drivers. They deliver concrete, food and other daily supply from turkey to syria. They don´t use turkish truck drivers in most cases, because turkish truck drivers are organized in unions and they don´t allow them to go in civil war areas.

When you say "Syrian corporation" I assume you mean volunteers from some of the armed groups controlling the area, right? If so, then Azzaz is known to be controlled by Jabhat al-Nusra, a terrorist group. Do you think it wise that Turkey is essentially sending convoys into the hands of such terrorist groups?

concrete and food causes no harm and danger to anyone. Or do you fear they throw tomatoes on you?

And i want to say one thing. The current events there are unfortunate. But nobody in turkey is afraid about Russia. Russia is far over its prime. Its a northern nigeria. All its stockmarket united is smaller than google. Its economy is stagnating and depends on gas and oil. The war in syria can´t be won by russia. As long the sunni nation + turkey don´t agree, no solution will be reached, the war will go on until russia is pushed out.

We should not forget that russia suffered two plane crashs and the one in sinai was far worse for Putin than the downed fighter jet.

Russia isn´t scary. And nobody in turkey is scared about them. So forget about that and it should sit down at table so we solve the problems.

Mustafa I didn't realize that you were a professional comedian

Anyway, your opinions about Russia are irrelevant; it's there, and it will wipe out all Islamists in its path, in coalition with allied forces.
If Turkey tries to destroy its aircraft again; the response will be a military one this time - it will end up like something like the Khalkin-Gol incident between the USSR and Japan in the 30s, or the Sino-Soviet border conflict in the 60s; where a short intense bout of fighting will decide everything but it will be prevented by both sides from escalating further.

It's a shame but I can already see signs that the situation is escelating towards something like that.

Mustafa wrote:Thing is, there are no terrorist activity in turkmen areas. Turkmens don´t bow to Assad and never will. And its clear that this civil war will move on as long those peope are´t free.

I don't know, those guys who shot the pilot in mid-air and then placed his body in a position for decapitation, and shouted Islamist warcries - kinda look like terrorists to me.
But perhaps that's the just the way everyone rolls there, idk.

Either way, what's relevant is that this region is being used as a massive supply operation for the terrorists; Al-Nusra, Al-Fatah and as on. It all comes through there, that's my understanding of it.
If the Turkmen don't want Assad, fine, but if supplies for Islamists roll through that area, they're going to get hit.

Mustafa wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

Mustafa wrote:Assad used poison gas on his own people as well as barrel bombs.

Barrel bombs are nothing; the US and Russia both use vacuum bombs which are far more destructive. But they use them against enemy targets, not just against civilians in order to terrorize them, and I'm sure that the SAA too employs barrel bombs against enemy targets not just random civilians.

The turkmens are safe from him because our protection.

That's fair enough, but then why are the Turkmen at the nexus of a massive supply operation to the 'FSA' (Islamists), and are fighting so vehemently against Assad themselves? Assad hasn't done anything to them, correct me if I'm wrong. Al Nusra is right next to where you say the Turkmen are; they get their supplies from Turkey. I've heard there are Jihadists in precisely that area too. Why are the Turkmen tolerating them? Why is Turkey tolerating them?
Unless of course, they are all really on the same side.

The Syrian Kurds also probably have no love lost for Assad. So what did they do? They sort of declared their own area, armed their own militias and took control - but they didn't, and aren't fighting the SAA, and they are certainly not helping any Islamist groups.

My view is that the Turkmen issue is just used as an excuse by the Turks, as cover for a massive operation to help the largely Islamist insurgency.
If the Turkmen want protection by Turkey I think that's a fair demand, considering the war, but at the moment the situation doesn't look that way to me, it looks like something else is going on.

It's not just Turkey that does this; but Jordan, Israel, etc... too. Look at the map. All the 'strongholds' of FSA/Islamist resistance are right at the Turkish, Israeli, Jordanian borders. This is where they are the most strongest and the most dug in. Are there Turkmen next to Israel and Jordan too?
Syrian aviation can't even bomb these regions; when they tried Israel shot a Syrian plane down (actually I believe it was a Su-24 too), while Syrian planes haven't even dared to approach Turkish airspace as they knew that they will be ambushed and shot down like the Russian Su-24M was.
When Syrian artillery tried to take on the rebels near the Israeli border; Israeli firepower responded and destroyed them (using a pretext of some shells landing on the Israeli-held side of the Golan Heights). The same likely happens on Syria's border with Turkey; I believe I heard about some Syrian vehicles or planes destroyed at the Turkish border a couple of years ago. Since then they haven't gone near it, Syria is no match for the Turkish Army.

So now Russia is going to wipe these dens out. Turkey thought that it could respond to Russian aviation the same way Israel responded to Syrian aviation.
Now Russia has brought in a missile cruiser equipped with a S-300F system, a ground-based S-400 system, and Su-30 fighter escorts. This time, any Turkish attempt to deny Russia will result in a quite catastrophic clash. And Russia will certainly come again. So make your decision.

Let me ask you something, would you allow that a tyrant who used poison gas on his own people is in charge over some of your people? The russians intervened in crimea for far less than that.

Of course not, but are you sure that's what's happening here?

Putin knows this and evryone knows Putin will drop Assad sooner or later. We are in the endgame here. Evry site want to achieve the best outcome for itself. I know that russia must keep that Assad thing running but in the end will drop him.

Assad could be dropped or he could not, it's not for Russia to decide, all Russia can do is advise Syria albeit it of course has a great deal of influence.
My view is that after the war Assad himself might choose to step down, this will satisfy all sides and allow everyone to save face; while still keeping the Syrian state apparatus and government elite intact.

Just explain me how you will hold syria alive when evry single government around it break off diplomatic relations, keep supporting anti assad groups?

Well that's their problem, I hope they will reconsider when the Islamist groups that they are providing cover for are destroyed by Russian aviation. They will have no-one else to help, and will hopefully turn to more pragmatic policies and establish peace with Syria.

Israel has already stated that it won't shoot any Russian planes down, in the wake of the incident between Russia and Turkey, even if they do violate its airspace, and that it doesn't view Russia as an enemy, but as a major player in the region.
So with this message, Israel is stating that it's not going to cover for the Syrian rebel groups near its borders when the Russians come to bomb them. It's washing its hands of them.
Putin met with the Jordanian King just a few days ago. They have good relations, and always have very frank talks. I doubt that the Jordanians will do anything against Russian aviation either.

So that just leaves Turkey. If the Turkmen are the issue; then I'm sure an agreement can be reached. Russia has brokered ceasefires before, and if Turkey wants to protect them directly then I think that would be acceptable. But if deposing Assad is the issue, then no, Turkey's operations will have to be closed down.

I´m full supporting crushing ISIS, PKK, Al Nusra and all those monsters. But Assad is a red line. There is no scenario where Assad can be accepted from Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, USA, Israel. Its plain and simple impossible.

Assad is accepted or not accepted by his own people. If he's accepted, there's little that anyone from the outside can do about it, nor should do about it. If you want, you can cut off diplomatic relations with Syria - that's your right. But supporting rebel groups won't accomplish anything and will just prolong a needless war and strengthen violent Islamism in the region.
But like I said, probably as a face-saving measure for those who seeked to depose him, he will have the wisdom to step down by himself.

Thing is, there are no terrorist activity in turkmen areas. Turkmens don´t bow to Assad and never will. And its clear that this civil war will move on as long those peope are´t free.

Oh yes there is, not only you guys smuggle arms and ammunition through the hills there, you also stage attacks on Syrian positions, help Al Nusra and generally Turkish intelligence has gatherings with Ahrar al Sham and Al Nusra each month to check the situation. Basically Azzaz is the hub for every possible crap MiT is doing in Syria and that's Nusra ground.

So yeah, Northern Nigeria, says the country who needed to sell people to Germany for cash and who has an economy based on theft and book cooking. But sure, being Northern Egypt is so much better than northern Nigeria...Lel.

Our national symbol is the wolf. And they usually are organized in packs and attack and kill bears. The small bears that inhabit russia for example are part of their diet.

wolves are more intelligent than bears and mostly strike in winter. Bears also kill wolves. So its in best interest for both to keep distance and be friendly with each other.

russia is a fragile thing. China sees it as weak and degenerating and looks for its east. In the west its influence shrinks. The sinking gas and oil prices hurt russia hard.

Thats why i believe putin is smart enough to not escalate this any further.

Mustafa wrote:Our national symbol is the wolf. And they usually are organized in packs and attack and kill bears. The small bears that inhabit russia for example are part of their diet.

wolves are more intelligent than bears and mostly strike in winter. Bears also kill wolves. So its in best interest for both to keep distance and be friendly with each other.

russia is a fragile thing. China sees it as weak and degenerating and looks for its east. In the west its influence shrinks. The sinking gas and oil prices hurt russia hard.

Thats why i believe putin is smart enough to not escalate this any further.

Just so you know, the USSR culled/killed most wolves on its European territory in the 50s; they were attacking innocent people and finally a campaign was launched to reduce their population and neutralize the threat.

Don't be under any illusion that Turkey is a match for Russia militarily, Russia would completely annihilate Turkey in any sort of fight. Russia is not the one looking for a fight here, and it didn't start anything.

How did you work our that the turkmen are safe under your protection?

Right now they are being bombed to fuck by the the russian air force for their and your countrys crimes, didnt exactky do a good job there of protecting them did you?

Mustafa wrote:Our national symbol is the wolf. And they usually are organized in packs and attack and kill bears. The small bears that inhabit russia for example are part of their diet.

wolves are more intelligent than bears and mostly strike in winter. Bears also kill wolves. So its in best interest for both to keep distance and be friendly with each other.

russia is a fragile thing. China sees it as weak and degenerating and looks for its east. In the west its influence shrinks. The sinking gas and oil prices hurt russia hard.

Thats why i believe putin is smart enough to not escalate this any further.

Yeah but Russia's national symbol is the Golden Eagle (like the Turkmen btw), who're used to hunt wolves. BTW wolves are just untamed dogs. Uncle Sam needs to put a leach back on you and cut your balls when the Syrian problem will be done between Russia and the US. See I don't see Erdogan intervention in Syria with troops. Guess why.

See this is the problem with Turks, they ignore their own state of bliss.


Putin just escalated further and bombed your kinsmen and that's going on, until your Sultan helps them. You want to see what cruelty looks like, stare what happens to stray dogs posturing as wolves.

I´m full supporting crushing ISIS, PKK, Al Nusra and all those monsters. But Assad is a red line. There is no scenario where Assad can be accepted from Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, USA, Israel. Its plain and simple impossible.

You are full of SHIT.. thats what you are..
you do not live in Syria to have a say in the president Syrians can have or not.
Turkey have no right to elect a president in Syria.. imbecile.. who the fuck you think you are?
It is to Syrians to elect their President.. 90% of American coalition not even have elections in their countries.. lol.. how can they demand freedom in syria, when Syria is not a religious retard country .Neither the dictators of Jordan or Saudi Arabia have a right to elect presidents in Syria. Neither Americans or Israel..  ONly Syrians have the right to elect a president .  Assad is not killing civilians as your Bullshit comedy media claims and jewish american controlled propaganda media CNN or FOX claim. Assad is only killing the TERRORIST that your stupid country ,israel and americans send to Syria to fight imbecile . STOP sending mercenaries to Syria and the war will stop. Stop giving weapons to Turkman retards to fight the Syrian army.. There is equal rights for all minorities in Syria contrary to the stupid nation you live.. where kurds are treated like trash..and full secular government too..where people are FREE to choose any religion they please.The Syrians that do not take weapons and do not kill police or attack civilians who refuse to join . that are not terrorist are allowed to create a political party and compete against Assad through Politics..not by Guns .


Neither Assad or Putin are arming terrorist.. neither they are invading other nations to
overthrow their government. Neither they are telling Turkey which government to have or not.
neither their interfere in other nations politics.. Turkey IS interfering in Syria politics.. it wants a muslin brotherhood terrorist in power.and Assad refused and thats why relations broke between
Turkey and Syria.. because Erdogan wanted to be a king of Syria..and Assad told not thanks.
Assad is a million times better than Erdogan and any other Turkey SHIT leader you ever had in power.


And you can take your red line up in your ass..Because that is worth of SHIT. Assad is not bombing any foreign country ,not invading any foreign nation ,neither interfering with Turkey politics ,neither financing alqaeda or ISIS.. neither atacking civilians
like your propaganda media controlled by Erdogan claims. The only crime of Assad.. is that he
is 100% secular.. not like every other nation in the middle east. is not a puppet of Turkey or Americans.. So thats is why Assad is attacked.. because he oppose American and Israel imperialism. So go to hell with your red lines imbecile.. If you want to remove assad get a gun and try to enter in Syria ,so that the Russian alliance drop a bomb over your head .

Get the hell out of Syria piece of trash or you will get a bomb over your head. Turkey without
American help will be like Somalia ,a third world muslin nation with no technology ,since radical muslins like you ,have no brain for technology or military to defend itself.Need to buy everything from Free NATIOns that have freedom of expresion ,something that do not exist
in Turkey land. Assad only problem is that is allied with RUssia and IRAN.. and that is not compatible with the American and Israeli exceptionalism that wants to control all middle east.
Since why ISIS do not invade Turkey or Saudi Arabia or Israel.? Why ISIS do not invade QATAR or Bahrain?  ISIS or Alqaeda are mercenaries under payroll of  American ,Turkey Saudis and Israel.. and they hired to destroy any nation that Reject Anglozionist Imperialism.  

And there will be no Ottoman Empire.. Russia will not allow turkey to take an inch of Syria piece of shit.  And if you had any brains which obviously not.you will stop your Lunatic President from Attacking Russian planes in syria.. before Erdogan scalate things and do something really stupid ,and Russia retaliate sending Turkey to the stone.. And i say this not because of morons like you, that are ok with Terrorism.. have some tolerance with it.. But because there are decent people in Turkey too..Journalist that are fighting Erdogan ,trying to expose your country lies being told about Assad and Syria and how he is arming Terrorism.

Plain and simple ,neither Syrians or Russia cares about what imbeciles like you will accept or not as their leaders. the FACTs are there.. The European Union says TURKEY is the problem and NOT RUssia.  Most of the world see Turkey ,Israel ,Saudi Arabia and Americans as the problem in Syria and not Assad or Putin. in short ,plain and simple you are an idiot or an impostor.

You went in full retard mode for blaming the break of relations in Putin and not in Erdogan .
For your information 100% of the Russian Government ,from all political parties , left ,right and center support Putin policies in Syria and its stance with Turkey.. Medveded that will be the successor of Putin was even more hard with ERdogan.. called him a terrorist without diplomacy.
90% of Europe too.. backs Russia.. and most of the world Latin America 100% backs Russia.
. So plain and simple Turkey is the problem..and millions of fanaticals brainwashed muslins imbeciles like you that give any kind of support to ERdogan.

Our national symbol is the wolf. And they usually are organized in packs and attack and kill bears. The small bears that inhabit russia for example are part of their diet.

Haha.. this guy is truly a retard.. he thinks Turkey have a chance to defeat Russia..or that
Europe will come in defense of a muslin nation that is responsible for their invasions of muslins and have been arming ISIS in IRAQ and Syria.. lol  

Just a couple of Topol-M is all that Russia needs to completely destroy turkey..and not give a chance to even start a fight.. How are you going to defend against Ballistic Space missiles?
patriot defenses cannot protect against that..  With your Alah Wakbarians retarded chant?  Not even Americans have defense of a rain of 12,000 of nuclear missiles that Russia have.  Just a couple of Topol M will be enough to defeat Turkey before it even start.  

Russia is not in a rush to start war with Turkey because it have nothing to win ,in doing that ,,they know Americans wants that.. to See Russia in a war with Turkey..to use the event to pressure Europe to stop all economic relations with Russia.

To Mustafa:

Way to go dude here  = Turk-stronkness at it bests.

Turkey just grow too much it seems and is in a dire need of proper trim .

Unfortunately for you Yeltzyn is not with us anymore so don't expect anything good really.
Your turkoman bros probably cant wait your warm welcome and your spare beds.

Mustafa wrote:Our national symbol is the wolf. And they usually are organized in packs and attack and kill bears. The small bears that inhabit russia for example are part of their diet.

wolves are more intelligent than bears and mostly strike in winter. Bears also kill wolves. So its in best interest for both to keep distance and be friendly with each other.

russia is a fragile thing. China sees it as weak and degenerating and looks for its east. In the west its influence shrinks. The sinking gas and oil prices hurt russia hard.

Thats why i believe putin is smart enough to not escalate this any further.

Funny that you use national animal symbols to somehow want to intimidate russia but unfortunatley for you russians do not see themselfs as animals, but glad you see yourself as dogs no need for us to dennounce you. You done that already quite well yourself dog.

Mustafa wrote:

Acheron wrote:

Mustafa wrote:
Let me answer this. The trucks attacked were most likely from a syrian corporation with syrian drivers. They deliver concrete, food and other daily supply from turkey to syria. They don´t use turkish truck drivers in most cases, because turkish truck drivers are organized in unions and they don´t allow them to go in civil war areas.

When you say "Syrian corporation" I assume you mean volunteers from some of the armed groups controlling the area, right? If so, then Azzaz is known to be controlled by Jabhat al-Nusra, a terrorist group. Do you think it wise that Turkey is essentially sending convoys into the hands of such terrorist groups?

concrete and food causes no harm and danger to anyone. Or do you fear they throw tomatoes on you?

And i want to say one thing. The current events there are unfortunate. But nobody in turkey is afraid about Russia. Russia is far over its prime. Its a northern nigeria. All its stockmarket united is smaller than google. Its economy is stagnating and depends on gas and oil. The war in syria can´t be won by russia. As long the sunni nation + turkey don´t agree, no solution will be reached, the war will go on until russia is pushed out.

We should not forget that russia suffered two plane crashs and the one in sinai was far worse for Putin than the downed fighter jet.

Russia isn´t scary. And nobody in turkey is scared about them. So forget about that and it should sit down at table so we solve the problems.

OK, Turkish friend. If that is what you choose to believe, then you will be shaken to reality very soon, and quite unpleasantly. Before talking about Russia, I suggest you take off your rose-tinted glasses and carefully look at the state of your own country. Would Mexico act towards the US in the same way Turkey is acting towards Russia? A bit of training for Russian armed forces is always welcome. I hope you won't be mobilized, because I will certainly miss our fruitful and enjoyable conversations.

The problem that a lot of our Turkish friends don't seem to understand is that when a petulant child slaps an adult in the face, that child should not expect the adult to back down from his stern position and acquiesce to the child's whims. I think you are intelligent enough to deduce the moral in that succinct parable.

In case you haven't noticed, there are certain conventions to follow before a humanitarian convoy is sent. It must be registered, all sides must be notified, and it must be clearly marked as such. Has that been done? No.
Also, food shipment to militants can be considered as a valid military target, if you are not aware.
However, there is no conclusive evidence of the cargo being simply food. The one photo that was posted, showed unburned and untouched by shrapnel boxes stacked inside a completely wrecked truck. Doesn't that seem just a little bit strange?
BTW: I hear the Israelis have a particular fondness for IHH as an "international humanitarian organization". Apparently they hold it to such a high regard as to label it a terrorist organization.

Acheron wrote:

Mustafa wrote:

Acheron wrote:

Mustafa wrote:
Let me answer this. The trucks attacked were most likely from a syrian corporation with syrian drivers. They deliver concrete, food and other daily supply from turkey to syria. They don´t use turkish truck drivers in most cases, because turkish truck drivers are organized in unions and they don´t allow them to go in civil war areas.

When you say "Syrian corporation" I assume you mean volunteers from some of the armed groups controlling the area, right? If so, then Azzaz is known to be controlled by Jabhat al-Nusra, a terrorist group. Do you think it wise that Turkey is essentially sending convoys into the hands of such terrorist groups?

concrete and food causes no harm and danger to anyone. Or do you fear they throw tomatoes on you?

And i want to say one thing. The current events there are unfortunate. But nobody in turkey is afraid about Russia. Russia is far over its prime. Its a northern nigeria. All its stockmarket united is smaller than google. Its economy is stagnating and depends on gas and oil. The war in syria can´t be won by russia. As long the sunni nation + turkey don´t agree, no solution will be reached, the war will go on until russia is pushed out.

We should not forget that russia suffered two plane crashs and the one in sinai was far worse for Putin than the downed fighter jet.

Russia isn´t scary. And nobody in turkey is scared about them. So forget about that and it should sit down at table so we solve the problems.

OK, Turkish friend. If that is what you choose to believe, then you will be shaken to reality very soon, and quite unpleasantly. Before talking about Russia, I suggest you take off your rose-tinted glasses and carefully look at the state of your own country. Would Mexico act towards the US in the same way Turkey is acting towards Russia? A bit of training for Russian armed forces is always welcome. I hope you won't be mobilized, because I will certainly miss our fruitful and enjoyable conversations.

The problem that a lot of our Turkish friends don't seem to understand is that when a petulant child slaps an adult in the face, that child should not expect the adult to back down from his stern position and acquiesce to the child's whims. I think you are intelligent enough to deduce the moral in that succinct parable.

In case you haven't noticed, there are certain conventions to follow before a humanitarian convoy is sent. It must be registered, all sides must be notified, and it must be clearly marked as such. Has that been done? No.
Also, food shipment to militants can be considered as a valid military target, if you are not aware.
However, there is no conclusive evidence of the cargo being simply food. The one photo that was posted, showed unburned and untouched by shrapnel boxes stacked inside a completely wrecked truck. Doesn't that seem just a little bit strange?
BTW: I hear the Israelis have a particular fondness for IHH as an "international humanitarian organization". Apparently they hold it to such a high regard as to label it a terrorist organization.

Because the IHH is a front for terror, big buddies of Hamas or the sucide bombers kind and money launderer in Belgium for everything Nusra related among the Turkish community here. Israel's usually overdoes it's clamor, but with IHH they're right on the money.

Zhirinovsky made a comment today that IF the situation between Russian and Turkey very badly deteriorated to the point of imminent war, then Turkey should be aware that one nuke detonated in the NE corner of the Sea of Marmara will cause a tidal wave 15 meters high that will wash away Istanbul and it's 9 million residents. This sounds typical Zhirinovsky running off at the mouth, but recall that in Gulf War 1 Saddam was threatened that if he used chemical weapons then one of the Euphrates dams would be destroyed by a nuke and the resulting flood would kill millions in Baghdad. So, Zhirinovsky is no worse than Bush senior, and is he speaking for himself, or......

Werewolf wrote:AFAIK turkey never acquired nor Raytheon made any deals for AIM-9X with turkey. The best they have are AIM-9M and L versions.

"May 4, 2007 - The Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Turkey of AIM-9X All-Up-Round SIDEWINDER missiles as well as associated equipment and services. The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $71 million. The Government of Turkey has requested a possible sale of 105 AIM-9X All-Up-Round SIDEWINDER missiles, 78 LAU-129 launchers, 22 captive air training missiles, missile containers, missile modifications, test sets and support equipment, spare and repair parts, publications and technical data, maintenance, personnel training and training equipment, U.S. Government and contractor representatives, contractor engineering and technical support services, and other related elements of logistics support. The estimated cost is $71 million."

Source: http://fas.org/asmp/resources/110th/Turkey_07-18.pdf

"Under the estimated $140m FMS, Turkey has requested the delivery of a total of 117 AIM-9X-2 Sidewinder Block II all-up-round missiles, six AIM-9X-2 Block II tactical guidance units, six dummy air training missiles and 130 LAU-129 launchers. The deal will also include containers, missile support and test equipment, provisioning, spare and repair parts, personnel training and training equipment, as well as other associated logistical support services. The AIM-9X-2 missiles are scheduled to equip the Turkish Air Force's (TuAF) fighter aircraft in an effort to address the country's air defence requirements, in addition to boosting its regional security."

Source: http://www.airforce-technology.com/news/newsturkey-seeks-aim-9x-2-sidewinder-missiles-from-us

"Raytheon Missile Systems, Tucson, Arizona, is being awarded a $264,805,607 cost-plus-fixed-fee contract for an AIM-9X system improvement program to provide additional capability and resolve obsolescence issues for the Navy, Air Force, and the governments of Korea, Singapore, Malaysia, Belgium, Netherlands and Turkey under the Foreign Military Sales program. The effort includes engineering services required to incorporate new AIM-9X missile components and associated software updates into the Lot 17 and Lot 19 production programs.

+

This contract combines purchases for the Air Force ($24,783,835; 53.35 percent); Navy ($10,746,165; 23.15 percent); and the governments of Turkey ($3,340,868; 7.2 percent); "

Source: http://www.afcea.org/content/?q=Blog-raytheon-awarded-nearly-265-million-aim-9x-improvement#sthash.bH5TWHWi.dpuf

So they might actually have certain numbers of AIM9X, question stays how many. Also it seems this first "plausible" contract that i mentioned above was never signed only the second.

Khepesh wrote:Zhirinovsky made a comment today that IF the situation between Russian and Turkey very badly deteriorated to the point of imminent war, then Turkey should be aware that one nuke detonated in the NE corner of the Sea of Marmara will cause a tidal wave 15 meters high that will wash away Istanbul and it's 9 million residents. This sounds typical Zhirinovsky running off at the mouth, but recall that in Gulf War 1 Saddam was threatened that if he used chemical weapons then one of the Euphrates dams would be destroyed by a nuke and the resulting flood would kill millions in Baghdad. So, Zhirinovsky is no worse than Bush senior, and is he speaking for himself, or......

With the population density and the shitty construction norms, you don't need nukes, you just strike all around galata.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

With the population density and the shitty construction norms, you don't need nukes, you just strike all around galata.

I think the reasoning behind a nuke in the sea is that while damage to structures would occur, most damage would be to the population and leave Istanbul in reasonable condition to be re-populated and re-emerge as Konstantinopolis.

Khepesh wrote:Zhirinovsky made a comment today that IF the situation between Russian and Turkey very badly deteriorated to the point of imminent war, then Turkey should be aware that one nuke detonated in the NE corner of the Sea of Marmara will cause a tidal wave 15 meters high that will wash away Istanbul and it's 9 million residents. This sounds typical Zhirinovsky running off at the mouth, but recall that in Gulf War 1 Saddam was threatened that if he used chemical weapons then one of the Euphrates dams would be destroyed by a nuke and the resulting flood would kill millions in Baghdad. So, Zhirinovsky is no worse than Bush senior, and is he speaking for himself, or......

The difference between Bush Sr. and Zhirnovksy is that one of the was in power while the other hopefully never will get power.

SturmGuard wrote:I can't believe I am going to write this....

...but what the hell has gotten in most of you?

You act and write in the most irrational and illogical way. Let my exemplify this by comparing the outrage and things being said about Turkey and Turks to the level of anti-Russian actions and rhetorics they have displayed.

You literally went full retard over a single plane that was performing bombing runs in a foreign country, while there was less outrage, resolve and hate about all those blatantly anti-Russian rhetorics, actions (more like murders, crimes) over the past year displayed  by the West and Ukraine. A neighbouring, historically Russian land.

You then proceeded to mention all those conflicts of the past between two imperial powers. Yet the fact still remains that Russians themselves killed far more Russians than Turks, and more recently. Should I go on about this topic?

At the same time, we read here about opinions of German and French, or British and US politicans and people, comment them. Well, for starters, all of them were major Russian enemies at one point, and some continued to be to this day. Be it Catholic Church, Napoleon, Drang nach Osten, The Great Game, World Wars, Nazis, Cold War. Speaking of ruthlesness and barbaric crimes and attributing them to Turks while somehow conveniently forgetting that no one came even close to Westerners when it comes to mass murder/genocide, exploitation and conquest.

You speak about Turkey with disgust, label them as terrorist supporters, while practically NATO is in bed with terrorism exporters, funded and equipped original Syrian terrorists (Croatia included, we all remember those cargo planes leaving ladden with weapons). These murderes of Russian pilot were proclaimed moderate by the "friends of Syria", they received western weapons, training and support.

The initial plot was to use media propaganda campaign to brand every single nutjob as democratic opposition, when they failed in that, they quickly invented "moderates", now they are trying to replace IS with "democratic Arab tribal army opposed to IS (?!)". Every single day we heard about West arming "anti-IS" "moderates" yet no one saw them actually fight IS, IF or Al-Nusra.


Of all the people, I can't believe that I, an ardent and convinced anti-Turk, be it Ottomans, Kemalists or Islamists, have to write common sense here.


I guess it is easier to vent on a vasal, poorer and less developed state, than on actual string-pullers, all the while secretly hopping that the West embraces you as part of their culture.
Disgusting.

This. Your whole post. People need to read it.