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    Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

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    Vladimir79

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  Vladimir79 on Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:43 am

    PTURBG wrote:

    No, given that you can see join date infer from there, and given that I want to prove a point.
    Textwalls are also very easy to see while skimming through threads.
    You accused me of trolling. Now youre accusing me of being previously banned. Youre grasping at straws.

    Can mods remove this meaningless discussion?

    Considering you have a cross IP with a banned account would explain it better. Now you have two banned accounts.
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    flamming_python

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  flamming_python on Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:47 pm

    PTURBG wrote:This is absolutely disgusting. Russia needs new frigates. India doesnt and shouldnt get them because its friendly with the US.

    India is friendly to India. And our interests mostly match closely to them, we have no rivalries over anything, and we have a history of co-operation and close ties.

    What's going to be on those Talwars that's going to be all that interesting to the US anyhow.

    Might as well export them and make some money. We can't induct them into our own fleet.. well we can, but they won't be much good without powerplants.

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:
    BTW Cruiser Moskva will be modernized. Oh well would be great to have radars, avionics and P-500 replaced by Onyx.

    Not to mention the S-300F to be replaced by Redut with 40N6, 48N6 and 9M96 missiles Twisted Evil
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  AlfaT8 on Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:14 pm

    flamming_python wrote:Not to mention the S-300F to be replaced by Redut with 40N6, 48N6 and 9M96 missiles Twisted Evil

    What???
    The Redut is a navalised S-350, it only uses the 9M96/E2 and 9M100.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:24 pm

    What???
    The Redut is a navalised S-350, it only uses the 9M96/E2 and 9M100.

    Original model Rif has a range of about 90km... the long range 9M96 has better range and performance... in fact late model BUKs have comparable range and better accuracy than the first model S-300s.

    The real question is... will S-350 at sea use individual tubes for each 9M96, or will they be bigger tubes for old S-300 missiles with four S-350s packed in each one and potentially more of the 9M100s packed in each tube so that larger missiles could also be carried in reduced capacities...

    Certainly the ability to reach some threats at 400km would be useful to shoot down launch platforms instead of their munitions, but it is unlikely any launched munitions would be engaged at more than 60km and probably rather less distance, so 9M96 would be fine...

    Might as well export them and make some money. We can't induct them into our own fleet.. well we can, but they won't be much good without powerplants.

    The problem is that they were built for the Russian Navy to begin with so the Indians might want more foreign components added, but that would not be a huge issue.

    Selling them to India and starting all Russian component models would benefit the Russian Navy even if their will be a delay.

    I would use the contract to crank up production of the Russian propulsion systems so that Russian navy production can ramp up faster and more capacity would be spare for export models as well... screw the orcs...
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    Isos

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  Isos on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:57 pm

    https://mobile.twitter.com/Syrian_SR/status/1056953726617956353

    Does it mean that Makarov tracked a Zumwalt destroyer near Syria ??

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:06 am

    Traditionally those are marks for crew identification at least in western navies.
    Seems like a weird anachronism on a modern ship though.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:45 am

    https://tass.ru/mezhdunarodnaya-panorama/5731146
    Apparently contract for 2* 11356 built in Russia for India has been signed, $950mil.
    Expecting a further contract for 2 to be built in India soon.

    A bit odd though, quotes Indian media but no Russian confirmation Suspect

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Sat Nov 03, 2018 4:12 am

    Not signed afterall https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20181029/1531659790.html
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  PapaDragon on Sat Nov 03, 2018 4:21 am

    hoom wrote:Not signed afterall https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20181029/1531659790.html

    For Cthulhu's sake, just get those things stored away until engines are delivered and then complete them for RU Navy

    This Bollywood drama is getting beyond annoying...
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Sat Nov 03, 2018 4:23 am

    hoom wrote:Not signed afterall https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20181029/1531659790.html



    your news are form 29/10 mine form 1/11  and Vedmosti says that they did. Best  IMHO is just wait ans see in 2-4 weeks back  ;-)

    https://www.vedomosti.ru/politics/articles/2018/11/01/785435-rosoboroneksport-oruzhie-rekordnie-sanktsii





    Contract breaking news from tomorrow cheers cheers cheers


    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:01 am

    (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
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    Hole

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  Hole on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:27 am

    Is this Klingon?
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:56 pm

    Hole wrote:Is this Klingon?

    almost What a Face What a Face What a Face
    https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=%28%E2%95%AF%C2%B0%E2%96%A1%C2%B0%EF%BC%89%E2%95%AF%EF%B8%B5%20%E2%94%BB%E2%94%81%E2%94%BB%29
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    George1

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  George1 on Mon Nov 19, 2018 11:08 pm

    The frigates "Admiral Butakov" and "Admiral Istomin" will still be completed for India

    According to the source of our blog in the Russian shipbuilding industry, the contract signed with India for the construction of two frigates of project 11356 in October 2018 still provides for the completion of two unfinished frigates of this type for the Indian fleet at Yantar Shipyard in Kaliningrad. built for the Russian Navy - "Admiral Butakov" (serial number 01360) and "Admiral Istomin" (serial number 01361) - and not the construction of completely new ships, as we reported earlier. At the same time, according to the source, the actual cost of the contract for the completion of these two frigates for India is not $ 950 million, as reported by the Indian media, but $ 1.2 billion.



    The fate of the frigate Admiral Kornilov (serial number 01362), which was not completed on the Yantar PSZ, is still uncertain, however, we can assume that it will be used later on as part of the planned additional contract for the construction of two frigates of the project 11356 at the Indian state shipyard Goa Shipyard Limited (GSL) in Goa. Actually, from the very beginning of negotiations with India under an agreement on four frigates 11356, it was reported that the "localization" of the construction of two frigates in India involves towing and completing the construction of one unfinished hull in India and the construction of only one ship from scratch in India.

    Planned to be completed for India at Yantar PSZ, project 11356 frigates will be equipped with their own standard gas turbine main power plants M7H produced by the Nikolaev GP NPKG Zorya - Mashproekt (Ukraine) - with two sets originally built in Nikolaev for these frigates built for Russian Navy, but never sent to Russia due to the events of 2014. On August 17, 2017, the government procurement commission of the government of India approved the purchase from Ukraine of two specified sets of M7H gas turbine units for frigates of the project 11356 for $ 76 million.

    For the two frigates planned for construction in India, the Indian side will order additional sets of power plant on the GP NPKG "Zorya" - "Mashproekt".

    Recall that the construction of the second three ships of a modified project 11356 (of the type “Admiral Grigorovich"; sometimes designated as project 11356R or 11357) for the Russian Navy was conducted by the Yantar RPM in Kaliningrad under a contract with the Ministry of Defense of Russia No. З / 1/1/0553 / GK-11-DGOZ from September 13, 2011 worth 40 billion rubles. All six ships of the modified project 11356 were originally planned to replenish the Black Sea Fleet.

    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3419968.html
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    George1

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  George1 on Mon Nov 19, 2018 11:08 pm

    i wonder, couldn't these frigates be completed for Russian Navy with Russian gas turbine engines?

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:15 am

    Only once engines/gearboxes are available.
    Engines are supposedly but rumor has it basically no work has been done on the gearboxes yet with Zvezda overloaded with work.

    Thing that doesn't make sense about such news is 404s have refused to supply engines/gearboxes for work to be done in Russia & the one thing thats certain about this whole shebang is the 404s won't have changed their minds about that.
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    Big_Gazza

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  Big_Gazza on Tue Nov 20, 2018 5:54 am

    hoom wrote:Only once engines/gearboxes are available.
    Engines are supposedly but rumor has it basically no work has been done on the gearboxes yet with Zvezda overloaded with work.

    I'm calling BS on that. No way they would develop a MGT and proceed with testing and certification and serial production unless they had parallel program for gearboxs.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:46 am

    Oh there's a program but its Zvezda which has famously been very overloaded with orders for new gearboxes & M-507 engines.

    They haven't been idle, have put out gearboxes for 20385 & at least testing for 22350, I think stuff for Arktica icebreakers too?
    I think 11356 has just been down the priority list since its only for 3 ships.

    Personally I'd have given it high priority even ahead of work for 22350, not only to complete the BSF squadron but as I've previously suggested a 2nd 6* for Pacific/North.
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Tue Nov 20, 2018 2:33 pm

    hoom wrote:
    Personally I'd have given it high priority even ahead of work for 22350, not only to complete the BSF squadron but as I've previously suggested a 2nd 6* for Pacific/North.

    Then in 22350 Thread check newest info about "extra" 2-4 22350 FFGs russia russia russia

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:40 pm

    I posted that a day before you...

    I mean back in 2014 when they first started setting up the domestic production & 22350 was still severely borked.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  GarryB on Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:56 pm

    Hopefully the money they make on the sale of these incomplete vessels could be invested in expanding production of the propulsion systems for new vessels.

    I also hope they can take this time to look at the designs and make any minor changes that might be wanted or needed so that the new vessels Russia gets are better fits for their needs.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:35 am

    Apparently actually official now https://flotprom.ru/2018/%D0%A2%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BB%D1%8F%D0%9E%D1%80%D1%83%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%B5%D0%BC165/
    Russia and India signed a package of contracts that include the supply and production of Russian project 11356 frigates in India. The press service of the Federal Service of the Russian Federation for Military-Technical Cooperation (FSMTC) told reporters on Tuesday, November 20

    The parameters of the contracts are not specified, however, according to unofficial data, the amount of the contract for the supply of two ready-made ships is about 950 million dollars.

    "Construction contracts were signed for the benefit of the Indian Navy of frigates of Project 11356. This is another important event in the development of the Russian-Indian MTC," RIA Newsstatement of the press service of the Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation

    Edit: just noticed the 'Federal Service' quote is at the bottom of the BMPD article above.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  hoom on Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:05 am

    https://flotprom.ru/2018/%D0%AF%D0%BD%D1%82%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%8C55/
    "Work began at the plant that preceded the resumption of construction for the Indian Navy of two frigates of Project 11356. For this purpose, guard ship hulls that were built for the Black Sea Fleet will be used. These are frigates Admiral Butakov and Admiral Istomin, which are in varying degrees readiness "
    ...
    the start of work is scheduled for the first months of 2019. Gas turbine engines, which were produced in Ukraine but not delivered to Russia for installation on patrol ships of the "admiral" series, will be installed on ships for the Indian Navy
    I still wonder how they intend to get the engines off the 404s since 404s repeatedly refused to deliver if they are to be worked on by Russia.
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    flamming_python

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    Re: Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

    Post  flamming_python on Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:43 pm

    hoom wrote:https://flotprom.ru/2018/%D0%AF%D0%BD%D1%82%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%8C55/
    "Work began at the plant that preceded the resumption of construction for the Indian Navy of two frigates of Project 11356. For this purpose, guard ship hulls that were built for the Black Sea Fleet will be used. These are frigates Admiral Butakov and Admiral Istomin, which are in varying degrees readiness "
    ...
    the start of work is scheduled for the first months of 2019. Gas turbine engines, which were produced in Ukraine but not delivered to Russia for installation on patrol ships of the "admiral" series, will be installed on ships for the Indian Navy
    I still wonder how they intend to get the engines off the 404s since 404s repeatedly refused to deliver if they are to be worked on by Russia.

    No, they refused to deliver engines for ships procured for the Russian Navy.

    Delivering engines for ships selling to 3rd countries is fine.

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