Russian special military operation in Ukraine #55

PhSt wrote:
I sincerely hope that this is not all hot air talk. Killing Unofficial NATzO personnel in Ukraine should be a TOP priority. Along with destroying food, water, and power infrastructure in Ukraine to starve the entire population to death.

WTF has the first statement to do with the second? Are you out of your mind, or just taking people here for idiots?

JohninMK wrote:https://twitter.com/i/status/1776571572926431389

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More info

https://www.facebook.com/K01Archive/posts/pfbid0Z8TemHWCfDbpAjYGDakSqJxRdFqX5jakgDKdvby5SqV94WnkHU8vM7DiCa2cuBzCl

This is the result of the secondary explosion from the Ukrainian MLRS destroyed by Russia, hidden in a civillian residence area in Kharkov. The secondary explosion severely damaged the commercial center building nearby.

This is not the first time Ukrainian armed forces hide their MLRS in civillian bulldings. The Ukrainians even opened fire from the residence area.

https://www.facebook.com/K01Archive/posts/pfbid022oXBqtqtue7ZLEQHTEddQpPHA1LK6fACBnpgY2z5HSxu7BFtS6B9f8j9tQTaaDW4l

This is the crater resulted from the secondary explosion from the destroyed MLRS of Ukraine in Kharkov.

The Ukrainian removed the remains of the MLRS before taking picture, but fortunately, Russians managed to take the picture of the vehicle as evidences.

https://www.rt.com/russia/595521-ukrainian-uragan-launchers-destroyed/

The local authorities acknowledged the strike, while local police released photos from the scene and condemned Russia’s “daily strikes” on the region. The police carefully avoided showing any evidence that the strike actually targeted the two rocket launchers, showing instead the damage inflicted on the mall and other structures. Ukrainian forces have throughout the conflict frequently made use of shopping malls, civilian warehouses, and other similar facilities for military purposes.

Kiev’s forces have also routinely used Uragan launchers, as well as other multiple rocket launchers, including Czech-supplied Vampire systems, to indiscriminately shell Russia’s border regions, including the city of Belgorod. The Ukrainian military ramped up such strikes following its botched attempt to break through the border in mid-March.

An interesting part is that those were parked next to a big mole and a gas station.
After the strike, tons of oink oink oink appeared of how the pesky Russkie bombed "civilians", with tons of photos of destructed mole facade.
Even on those photos, one can easily spot detonated Uragan missiles and it's parts scattered all around.
The bulk of the destruction was because of a secondary detonation of the missiles - a situation quite similar to the famous event in Charkov back in Feb22.
I was a Grad that was destroyed while parking in a front of high rise building, tat detonated and seriously damaged the building, with multiple civilian perished.
By the way, the accuracy of Iskander presented on the records is unmatched.
It struck directly in the middle of the multiple vehicles parked there.

Hole wrote:There are still "experts" in the west who claim that the sanctions are working. 
To be honest, they really work, but those dudes never say for which side of the conflict. 

Economics is a complicated matter, and it can be interpreted differently for purpose. Some data are lacking, some are arguable, and some can be understood differently. It is a fluid case that can be claimed in a different way if needed.
But cruise missiles are a product of technology.
It possesses some clear pros and cons.
Both naval and air-launched cruise missiles Russia owns, are a generation ahead of any cruise missile US has.
Kalibrs are longer ranged than Tomahawks, slightly faster and more precise. Not to forget that we are talking about a family of missiles.
Ch-101 is a light years ahead of AGM-68.
The scale of advantage Russian missiles own put the Murican Wunderwaffe to the museum exhibition, straight ahead. There is no need to discuss that further.
And those are only two types that have an active US-produced/fielded equivalent.
While pesky Russkie have several different weapons in the class that outperforms everything Murica owns.
Every single thing.
So we are talking now not about some scale of being an "expert", but being either idiot or a liar.

PhSt should be temporarily banned for inciting a genocide.

He is not suggesting something western countries don't already practise... the sanctions were supposed to cause a collapse of the Russian economy and either get Putin directly overthrown or start a bloody civil war that would divide up the country.

What he is suggesting is purely out of frustration and anger that the west is so selfish and shortsighted to have created this situation in the first place.

What he is suggesting is that for the average Ukrainian to pay for the sins of their government... remembering Zelensky was elected because he promised peace and to talk to Russia and sort things out via diplomacy, and he so clearly and openly lied.

They should have protested and kicked him out of office but any that did would just be called Putin Sympathisers and murdered, or sent to the front.

Like seriously, Putin says Russians and Ukrainians are one people so why should he treat them badly?

Putin does say that, but honestly there are plenty of murders within families let alone within ethnic groups. Putin is upset too and manages to direct his anger at the west... but not all people are so forgiving of those that mislead and those that blindly allow themselves to not see the truth.

It's not like Russia is in some kind of race with the west over who kills more civilians... It isn't. Russia is trying to minimize civilian casualties wherever possible and that's the only right approach.

That is true, but people who are conscripted to take up arms against Russian soldiers can choose to fight or choose to surrender and they have very clear and very different ways of dealing with people who make each choice.

The fact of the matter is that as long as the Ukrainian people stay quiet and support Zelensky and the west in its crusade to murder Russians then they are part of the problem that Russia has to deal with. Damaging infrastructure to cause civil unrest in an enemy country is a legitimate military tactic... cutting off food and power and supplies creates a situation, but whether they actually have mass starvation or not is down to the enemy leadership... I am sure they can get food and supplies from the west instead of ammo and weapons, but they have their own priorities...

The Palestinians are facing the same thing as he is suggesting for Ukrainian people... love the contrast and flexibility of values the west is openly showing.

It seems war crimes are not war crimes when you are pretending it is self defence.

It would be war crimes if Russia did it trying to end the war quickly, but anything Russia does is a war crime obviously.

JohninMK wrote:How dare you attack our tanks

Sprinter clown factory
@Sprinter00000

The head of the Pentagon asked the Russian military not to hunt for Abrams tanks, MK correspondents report his words.

“A repetition of the situation with German Leopard tanks, when they were hunted, is unacceptable, I saw these calls on the Internet. Play by the rules,” US Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin

Yeah, he didn't say this....The source for this is a twitter post which is already a red flag.

Other than that there is no mention of this, no record nothing.

This is clearly your typical twitter propaganda post John always take what you see on there with a grain of salt, I normally don't care to correct such lies because its pointless on this forum but this one was so so silly I had to comment on it

GarryB wrote:They should have protested and kicked him out of office but any that did would just be called Putin Sympathisers and murdered, or sent to the front.

It is easier said than done. That requires a successful organized and synchronized movement large enough to disrupt the function of the state, which is the result of many accumulated factors and is not always successful. In fact, in history, revolutions and uprisings suffered many lost and setbacks before the conditions were ripened.

We must be reminded that the Maidan regime has Azov thugs, thugs in uniforms named police, guns, weapons, fund from the USA, disinformation and censoring system, while the Ukrainian people have bare hands, lack organization, and lack information.

That is true, but people who are conscripted to take up arms against Russian soldiers can choose to fight or choose to surrender and they have very clear and very different ways of dealing with people who make each choice. The fact of the matter is that as long as the Ukrainian people stay quiet and support Zelensky and the west in its crusade to murder Russians then they are part of the problem that Russia has to deal with.

Actually they do not stay quiet. There is a story of a man using his bicycle to travel continously from his home to the borders to avoid conscriptions. And probably there are other instances... it is just that mainstream media won't tell us.

It is critical to understand that Maidan regime is completely different from the Ukrainian nation. This is not empty moral slogan, but it has important implications.

The source is also from September 2023...

Of course it is on a pro western pro ukrainian fact checking website where they say it is fake.... so obviously it must be true..

Who cares what US officials say any way... who would bother listening to them?

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

This is clearly your typical twitter propaganda post John always take what you see on there with a grain of salt, I normally don't care to correct such lies because its pointless on this forum but this one was so so silly I had to comment on it

Fair enough but it raised some smiles.

It is easier said than done. That requires a successful organized and synchronized movement large enough to disrupt the function of the state, which is the result of many accumulated factors and is not always successful. In fact, in history, revolutions and uprisings suffered many lost and setbacks before the conditions were ripened.

He did the opposite of what he promised to do and blamed Putin for everything... if the Ukrainian people are satisfied with that answer and don't want to kick him out of the top job then the consequences are on them. They voted for Zelensky for peace, if they wanted war there was Poroshenko. They voted for peace and got war anyway and didn't do anything about it... who should be blamed for that?

We must be reminded that the Maidan regime has Azov thugs, thugs in uniforms named police, guns, weapons, fund from the USA, disinformation and censoring system, while the Ukrainian people have bare hands, lack organization, and lack information.

Yes, the coup that drove them towards war was fully funded and organised by the west, and they accepted that and did nothing to change that or stop that.

It is their country but they were happy for America and some local nazi thugs to take over and **** up the country... is that Putins fault?

Who takes the blame for that... other than the obvious US and Nuland and Nazi brigade, but also the people that accepted that and did nothing to stop that disease from spreading across their country.

The people of the Crimea did something, but they were essentially an island so it was easier. The people of the Donbass and Lugansk regions and a few other areas also did something... the ones in Odessa were brutally murdered and the ones in the Donbass and Lugansk suffered shelling and accusations that they were Russian invaders for over 8 years... little surprise they went off the experiment called Ukraine.

Well now it is time for the rest of the country to feel the just deserts of poking the bear for the US and the EU and G7.

Actually they do not stay quiet. There is a story of a man using his bicycle to travel continously from his home to the borders to avoid conscriptions. And probably there are other instances... it is just that mainstream media won't tell us.

And people in Odessa were burned to death, but as a so called democracy they didn't get together and sort the shit out... now they are waiting for Putin to do it for them... at the cost of how many Russian young men?

It is critical to understand that Maidan regime is completely different from the Ukrainian nation. This is not empty moral slogan, but it has important implications.

They let them take over and eliminate rivals and cement their power over the country and in the regions they couldn't cement their power they shelled and bombed for the better part of a decade... and the people either ran away, or ignored it... and in many cases openly supported it.

I saw a man with a sign in the streets in Europe that said... If you think about Nazi Germany all those years ago and what you might have done... now you know, because you are doing it.

Get ready for the inevitable. Oh and a Sunday smile

GarryB wrote:He did the opposite of what he promised to do and blamed Putin for everything... if the Ukrainian people are satisfied with that answer and don't want to kick him out of the top job then the consequences are on them. They voted for Zelensky for peace, if they wanted war there was Poroshenko. They voted for peace and got war anyway and didn't do anything about it... who should be blamed for that?

Your assessment require an important premise: the Maidan a true democracy in which the people are presented with all options and realistic information available to make their choice, and they are trully allow to actively manage the policy of the state and the country.

Unfortunately, that premise does not exist.

Everybody know that the Maidan fascist regime is a dictatorship controlled by puppets owned by foreign entities, and any elections are a total farce. You are free to choose either this liar or that puppet but not free to choose a Communist or a politician with independence mind and it is not like you can do anything about it, either by intense disinformation and brainwashing, or by blalant brutal oppression such as the Nazi Azov thugs.

The concept of "collective guilt" of a nation is simply untrue, it ignores the power dynamics and class structure of the society, and in many case it is also a convenient means for many historical and contemporary regimes to whitewashing the employment of Nazi criminals in the government (West Germany), or to whitewashing the war crimes of genocide (Tel Aviv criminal regime).

Last but not least, I feel the need to emphasize that revolution and uprising is risky and bloody from the individual perspective... you don't want to directly confront the Azov thugs armed to the teeth when you are having bare hands, and a family to care for, and no visible signs of any comrades that can join your cause.

Revolution is not easy and is very bloody, people normally do not have the incentive to join it unless in the case people realize that there will be more blood if you don't do that.

This is not meant to whitewashing anyone, but to show people why resistance movements in reality is completely different than in PC games.

Given the continuing attacks on their command bunkers perhaps the Ukies should keep these with their original function

Zlatti71
@djuric_zlatko
Lithuania transferred M577 command and staff vehicles to Ukraine for use as armored personnel carriers

I have nothing to say.

https://www.rt.com/russia/595557-ukraine-kid-violence-draft/

14-year-old Ukrainian violently abducted in mobilization campaign – media
A teenager in Odessa Region was reportedly briefly tied up and driven away by four armed men before they realized he was a minor

The official claimed that a white minivan with four men in military uniform and balaclavas – one of whom was the driver – pulled over near the teenager as he was walking to meet his girlfriend. They then dragged the boy into the van while pressing the muzzle of an assault rifle to his temple. Terzi explained that the gunmen might not have suspected the boy was a minor because he was broad-shouldered.

The boy started to resist, the official continued. “The kid plays sports, so the self-defense instinct kicked in. He began to struggle, and the attackers restrained him, hitting him in the back with an assault rifle. They beat him and tied his hands with a plastic tie.”

Terzi stated that the soldiers drove in complete silence for a while, and only much later asked the boy’s age. “When he said how old he was, they didn’t believe him and asked for his passport. When they realized that they were transporting a minor, they threw him out of the van,” she said adding that the men warned the boy to keep quiet about the incident.

Why does zelensky not draft his own family and extended family members? Why are they given a special treatment.

Degradation of Kharkov's energy supply after the destruction of the Zmievskaya Thermal Power Plant on March 22, 2024. After 2 weeks, the scale and duration of rolling blackouts continues to grow, and the general decline in Internet traffic peaks indicates that the population is gradually leaving the city.

a family to care for

As one American answered the question why there is no revolt against the Deep State in Washington:
Paychecks.

Hole wrote:

a family to care for

As one American answered the question why there is no revolt against the Deep State in Washington:
Paychecks.

There may eventually be eventually be a revolt even here,but its not likely because for all the little woke kids in gen Z and gen alpha, the actions of the woke mob like all other major protest movements (Vietnam excluded, but even the antiwar movement in the 60s were mostly children of privilege who didn't want to be sent to Nam, later in life they have no problem sending other people's, mostly poor people, kids to war but they were to privileged to go to war. You have heard of some of these people, Bill Clinton and Joe Biden among others) are nothing but tools of the powerful to promote their agendas. Even the mob actions in the early days of our "revolution" in the 1770s were more about stopping the well heeled from having to pay taxes for the Seven Years War (or as we call it, The French and Indian War).

Revolts that come from the people are almost always put down quickly. Its why Occupy Wall Street is gone, why voting and civil rights for Blacks took almost 100 years (even after they were enshrined in the constitution) to achieve.

Part of the reason they rarely go anywhere is indeed paychecks. The other is that social media and the corporate state controlled media are in bed with our intel agencies, and they are always quick to discredit and smear. At most, what we can do is show our disapproval for stupid and dangerous crap (like starting and escalating a proxy war with another nuclear power) by posting semi anonymously on internet message boards

ucmvulcan wrote:

There may eventually be eventually be a revolt even here,but its not likely because for all the little woke kids in gen Z and gen alpha, the actions of the woke mob like all other major protest movements (Vietnam excluded, but even the antiwar movement in the 60s were mostly children of privilege who didn't want to be sent to Nam, later in life they have no problem sending other people's, mostly poor people, kids to war but they were to privileged to go to war.  You have heard of some of these people, Bill Clinton and Joe Biden among others) are nothing but tools of the powerful to promote their agendas.  Even the mob actions in the early days of our "revolution" in the 1770s were more about stopping the well heeled from having to pay taxes for the Seven Years War (or as we call it, The French and Indian War).  

Revolts that come from the people are almost always put down quickly.  Its why Occupy Wall Street is gone, why voting and civil rights for Blacks took almost 100 years (even after they were enshrined in the constitution) to achieve.  

Part of the reason they rarely go anywhere is indeed paychecks.  The other is that social media and the corporate state controlled media are in bed with our intel agencies, and they are always quick to discredit and smear.  At most, what we can do is show our disapproval for stupid and dangerous crap (like starting and escalating a proxy war with another nuclear power) by posting semi anonymously on internet message boards

Perhaps if Russia were to scare the oligarchy and political elite enough that they would fear annihilation they might put a gorbachov like figure into power in pindostan and being an american he might be stupid enough to agree to unilateral disarmament, how to fight a world war with zero casualties, just exploit their liberal tendencies and set off the fireworks.

Today's bang

As mentioned above, NATO is taking advantage, to get rid of old weapons of Soviet origin, in the countries that formerly belonged to the Warsaw Pact.
With this, it will be possible to homogenize the weapons in Europe, with Western material.
That is why it is important for Russia to continue advancing, control and/or occupy all of Ukraine. And don't forget Transnistria.
Apart from improving defenses in the border area, where there is an increasing number of hostile forces.

Hole wrote:

a family to care for

As one American answered the question why there is no revolt against the Deep State in Washington:
Paychecks.

The West is full of "debt slaves"...

JohninMK wrote:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1777057089174503604

The only warship in the Black Sea that has the Pantsir-M (Naval Pantsir) is the Karakurt class missile ship TSIKLON.

Your assessment require an important premise: the Maidan a true democracy in which the people are presented with all options and realistic information available to make their choice, and they are trully allow to actively manage the policy of the state and the country.

No it doesn't... in fact it is the opposite... the Ukrainian people should have realised they were being manipulated into doing something they had no interest in even just a couple of years before.

If they watch a coup happening in their own country and don't do anything to stop it because they think the west will spend money and save them from their economic problems (hahahaha... not how the west got rich BTW) then the consequences of them sitting on their arses and not doing anything about Poroshenko and then Zelensky shelling Ukrainians and claiming they are a Russian invasion of the country since 2014 then who else can you blame.

Just the same as the murder in Iraq and Syria and Libya by the western powers... do you blame the Iraqis and Syrians and Libyans for having their countries located on oil resources, or do you blame the people of the west who ignored or just didn't care about what their governments did to those countries with your tax money?

War is happening in the Ukraine and Ukrainian people have been suffering and will continue to suffer... if they had gotten together and risen up against the people funding Zelensky and Poroshenko then maybe the Minsk agreements could have solved their problems with much less bloodshed. They didn't try or they didn't try hard enough and they can't blame Russia for not sending 5 billion their way or FSB to organise it and cater it...

Everybody know that the Maidan fascist regime is a dictatorship controlled by puppets owned by foreign entities, and any elections are a total farce. You are free to choose either this liar or that puppet but not free to choose a Communist or a politician with independence mind and it is not like you can do anything about it, either by intense disinformation and brainwashing, or by blalant brutal oppression such as the Nazi Azov thugs.

If you don't stand up to bullies then you are complicit in their crimes. I would think that region of Europe would understand better than any other the damage nazism creates... but they said it was not their problem or they can't do anything about it.

OK. Fine. Russia is not going to take out your 21st Century comforts... don't do anything about that either you can't do anything about that either.

Don't be surprised that when you didn't deal with nazis in your country that when the problem spreads to other countries that other countries might do something about it.

They should be grateful for a few months without power and food and transport because it is part of the process of removing the nazis.

If you object then you can always protest against Kiev and the decisions they have been making the last 10 years.

Or you can do what the west does and blame Russia... I doubt Russia is listening any more and everyone else is not listening either.

The concept of "collective guilt" of a nation is simply untrue, it ignores the power dynamics and class structure of the society, and in many case it is also a convenient means for many historical and contemporary regimes to whitewashing the employment of Nazi criminals in the government (West Germany), or to whitewashing the war crimes of genocide (Tel Aviv criminal regime).

The west has applied that to Russia and China and Iran and Cuba and Vietnam and lots of other countries. The Ukraine applied it to the Donbass and Lugansk regions and other regions since.

If they want to be treated with respect they will show resistance to Kievs and the Wests evil policies... otherwise in absence of effort we can assume you agree or simply don't care.

Last but not least, I feel the need to emphasize that revolution and uprising is risky and bloody from the individual perspective... you don't want to directly confront the Azov thugs armed to the teeth when you are having bare hands, and a family to care for, and no visible signs of any comrades that can join your cause.

If you choose to remain and do nothing to stop them, then why should I have any sympathy if they go without electricity or food for a few weeks?

The obvious is to leave, the next obvious is to resist... to do nothing... well why would I care that Russian actions to end this war faster is inconveniencing you?

This is not meant to whitewashing anyone, but to show people why resistance movements in reality is completely different than in PC games.

And there are plenty who don't care either way and just go with the flow... that Clint Eastwood movie where he played a southern soldier... Josie Wales... he got on a punt to take him across the river and the operator was singing southern war songs and by the time he dropped him off on the other side he was singing northern battle songs when he went and picked up the northern soldiers who were chasing him.

I understand that and I have no problem, but what I am saying is that if a southern soldier or a northern soldier shot him for helping the other side... well I have no problem with that either.

When it comes to picking sides you can pick the side that wins or is there are the moment, so why would I care about your life and wellbeing?

I have nothing to say.

My father told me stories of quite a few very young men who lied about their age so they could go to fight in WWII... it is strange that considering they are winning that Ukrainians are not keen to join up...

Walther von Oldenburg wrote:@GarryB

PhSt should be temporarily banned for inciting a genocide.

Like seriously, Putin says Russians and Ukrainians are one people so why should he treat them badly? It's not like Russia is in some kind of race with the west over who kills more civilians... It isn't. Russia is trying to minimize civilian casualties wherever possible and that's the only right approach.

I met a Russian guy at the gym in one of gulf countries , i was dropping him to the gym everyday as his apartment is near to mine and he didn't have a car .

A nice guy and we were talking about many things including this war .

One day i was dropping him to his apartment and he laughed and pointed on his friend on the street where it was raining heavily and his friend was wearing a slipper and confused how to go through the water on ground to pass the street   , i went to him and took him on the car too to drop them to the same building .

His friend was Ukrainian guy , they are living in same apartment with a third guy and they dealing like real friends with each other , that time i figured out how the west is real evil to push those guys to kill each other .