Russian special military operation in Ukraine #29

Backman wrote:

Python. Do you think that Russia can strategically bomb Ukraine into surrender ? I don't think its in the cards. Because this govt doesn't care about Ukraine. Russia could bomb every power station for 3 weeks until theres not one light on in the whole country and Zelensky would still get on TV and demand Crimea.

So yeah. I think this army being moved to Belarus has to be the real deal. Thats the only way to solve it

It needs to begin bombing urban centers

Full grozny style

If you all in the forum still expect for a half assed solution to work, expect a half assed result

I already told how to handle this

And in my opinion, eventually it will happen because the leadership already goes to strike critical infrastructure

But it's not enough - if you send mobilized, make sure the buildings they storm are fully bombed

You don't want dead reservists and mobilized on rossiya-1

Backman wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:

mr_hd wrote:
Regarding West -those countries are in decline and are not angels either, still most of them have far superior societies compared to Russia and have much more organized institutions, rule of law etc and sadly Russia is falling behind more last 5-6 years. Before that was making huge gains and progress - not anymore.

Bold part shows

Python. Do you think that Russia can strategically bomb Ukraine into surrender ? I don't think its in the cards. Because this govt doesn't care about Ukraine. Russia could bomb every power station for 3 weeks until theres not one light on in the whole country and Zelensky would still get on TV and demand Crimea.

So yeah. I think this army being moved to Belarus has to be the real deal. Thats the only way to solve it

The relatively small amount of troops being sent to Ukraine suggests to me the main blow is going to be elsewhere. The question is, where. Donbass? Finish up in Donetsk? Maybe. Odessa, Nikolayevsk? Maybe. Kharkov again? Maybe. I don't think the main blow is going to be Kiev though, not nearly enough troops. However, I do see an offensive coming because of what is being hit.

Along with China, Russia should also hire western pilots

Arkanghelsk wrote:It needs to begin bombing urban centers

If with this, you mean mass innocent civilian casualties you are really no better than your opponent. Even worse than that. And that is a gentle statement.

famschopman wrote:

Arkanghelsk wrote:It needs to begin bombing urban centers

If with this, you mean mass innocent civilian casualties you are really no better than your opponent. Even worse than that. And that is a gentle statement.

Then don't cry when civil unrest begins

How long can society tolerate terrorist attacks?

How long can drafted sons, fathers, brothers, husband's be killed because you wanted to play the white knight?

Play stupid games win stupid prizes

If you think Putin has the luxury to play this inane game, il be here to say I told you so

Garryb apparently thinks that this is the best way to conduct the war, as do many here who have blinders on their faces

People are really shocked that Russians left and dodged mobilization

Are you stupid or what? You sit in whatever country you are, calling Russians pussies and whatever as some Polack and his Serbian friend do

And then you are shocked the civil society is turning against the state

Wake the **** up

flamming_python wrote:
Don't know about the civil society

In between the government lying or being silent, the 5th column coming out into the open and wishing Russia defeat and destruction in public, all sorts of draft-dodgers and rich kids running from the country, and the right-wingers gathering money for troops slipping into hysterical doomerism and out of it

What strong development. It's a clown show and a disgrace. 80-90% of it.
Russian society is a disappointment. And although Ukro bullshit is regularly discounted, sometimes people do fall for it, or for Western info-war nonsense.

Most of the 5th column, as you call it, were part of the elite of Russia post 2000.
Russians rich and elites were born out of robery privatisation and law of the stronger in the '90s. Did you seriously consider such elites patriotic or ready to take sacrifice?
Not all nationalists are right wingers, as you often imply. Your politics are blinding you. Nobody says it will be easy or nice. As every change it comes with pain. 
As for institutional Communists, it is shown once again, that Zyuganov et al are just opportunists and nothing more than that.

caveat emptor wrote:
Most of the 5th column, as you call it, were part of the elite of Russia post 2000.
Russians rich and elites were born out of robery privatisation and law of the stronger in the '90s. Did you seriously consider such elites patriotic or ready to take sacrifice?
Not all nationalists are right wingers, as you often imply. Your politics are blinding you. Nobody says it will be easy or nice. As every change it comes with pain. 
As for institutional Communists, it is shown once again, that Zyuganov et al are just opportunists and nothing more than that.

According to forum members , the telegram authors and audience are all 5th or 6th column

Actually not, most civil society is not supportive of liberasts or the far right

However, what people are not supportive of, is a mishandled war that the leadership simply "adapts" to after every debaucle which occurs

That they are "adapting" after several tens of Russians are blown up here, another ten there, some mobilized get slaughtered here and another there- is not a success

That planes get shot down, or suffer engine flame outs, and they adapt is not a success after the loss of 10+ planes

That they adapt after a chunk of the longest bridge in Europe is blown into the water is not a success either

It is a fucking failure- which is costing Russian lives

This is not ww2 , great patriotic war, it is fucking 2022

WAKE TF UP most Russians aren't backwater peasants belonging to some small town

It is a modern state that demands more of this leadership

Either hit Ukraine hard or do not hit at all and step down for someone to handle this correctly

RTN wrote:Along with China, Russia should also hire western pilots

https://twitter.com/Capt_Navy/status/1582252996951351296?s=20&t=kRM5zcqlZLNWejPJ96Hsyw

Where do you want to get?
If Russia had hired Western pilots, wouldn't the accident have happened?
Sorry to inform you, but accidents happen to everyone, including western pilots/western trained pilots.

3 January

An Israeli Air Force Eurocopter AS565 Panther used by the Israeli Navy crashes at sea near the beach of Haifa. Both air force pilots were killed and the third crewman, a navy liaison officer was injured.

11 January

An F-16V fighter of the Taiwanese air force crashes at sea.

A South Korean Air Force F-5E fighter crashed into a mountain in Hwaseong, some 40 kilometers south of Seoul. The pilot is dead.

24 January

A USN F-35C crashed in South China Sea after a hard landing on USS Carl Vinson. The pilot managed to eject but sustained injuries along with six other sailors and there was superficial damage to the runway.

2 March

A Romanian Air Force IAR 330 crashed near Gura Dobrogei while searching for a missing MiG-21 LanceR, killing seven.

14 March

A ROC Air Force Dassault Mirage 2000 fighter jet crashed into the sea after a mechanical problem. The pilot survived after ejecting.

18 March

A U.S. Marine Corps MV-22B participating in military exercise Cold Response in Norway crashed in the Gråtådalen valley in Beiarn municipality, Nordland county. The aircraft was carrying a crew of four at the time. They were all killed.

23 March

An F16 From the Oklahoma Air National Guard crashed in Central Louisiana after departing Houston.

8 June

A U.S. Marine Corps MV-22B, of Marine Aircraft Group 39 of the 3rd Marine Aircraft Wing, crashes near Glamis, California, killing five.

All this just this year...

Ahh... the putrid stench of soiled doomer underwear in the morning. Smells like... victory. Ark you're either a 5th/6th columnist or Ukrainian because I couldn't imagine a normal Russian falling for Ukro propaganda the way you do, advocating for Russia to do the very things that would lead to its destruction.

Things played out the way they did for Russia to win the support of the Global South and avoid being isolated geopolitically (which the West desperately needs to pull a Yugoslavia 2.0 on Russia). Now General Surovikin is put in charge of 300k conscripts, the rules of engagement have been altered so the new boss can do his job with minimal russian losses, Ukraine is being de-energized as we speak and the only thing on your mind is carpet bombing Country 404 so the collective west no longer has to make up stories of atrocities committed by Russia? 

I'm guessing that Putin is weak too and needs to be overthrown, correct? Funny how doomer talking points and Stoltenberg's talking points match up perfectly.

Broski wrote:Ahh... the putrid stench of soiled doomer underwear in the morning. Smells like... victory. Ark you're either a 5th/6th columnist or Ukrainian because I couldn't imagine a normal Russian falling for Ukro propaganda the way you do, advocating for Russia to do the very things that would lead to its destruction.

Things played out the way they did for Russia to win the support of the Global South and avoid being isolated geopolitically (which the West desperately needs to pull a Yugoslavia 2.0 on Russia). Now General Surovikin is put in charge of 300k conscripts, the rules of engagement have been altered so the new boss can do his job with minimal russian losses, Ukraine is being de-energized as we speak and the only thing on your mind is carpet bombing Country 404 so the collective west no longer has to make up stories of atrocities committed by Russia? 

I'm guessing that Putin is weak too and needs to be overthrown, correct? Funny how doomer talking points and Stoltenberg's talking points match up perfectly.

How does Odessa fall? Please explain it to me , along with Nikolayev, Kharkov, Sumy, Chernigov, Kiev and the rest of the border territories where Russian army is massing ?

So the power is cut, and energy is gone, great! Good job, you still have to take the city

Arkanghelsk wrote:
Then don't cry when civil unrest begins

How long can society tolerate terrorist attacks?

And then you are shocked the civil society is turning against the state

Wake the **** up

I don't know how to explain this other than telling you that you cannot just kill a million+ of people. These people are fed by propaganda, but they are still people. The beauty of people is that they can be taught and educated differently.

Provide and help them with proper infrastructure, housing, roads, education, healthcare and employment opportunities. It's these simply things that can turn a broken society in a prosperous Russia-positive society. Will it be easy, probably not. Is it possible, absolutely.

Will you have terrorist cells, of course. Eliminate those fast and rapidly.

But just killing is never the answer. I hope this makes sense to you.

Broski wrote:Ahh... the putrid stench of soiled doomer underwear in the morning. Smells like... victory. Ark you're either a 5th/6th columnist or Ukrainian because I couldn't imagine a normal Russian falling for Ukro propaganda the way you do, advocating for Russia to do the very things that would lead to its destruction.

Things played out the way they did for Russia to win the support of the Global South and avoid being isolated geopolitically (which the West desperately needs to pull a Yugoslavia 2.0 on Russia). Now General Surovikin is put in charge of 300k conscripts, the rules of engagement have been altered so the new boss can do his job with minimal russian losses, Ukraine is being de-energized as we speak and the only thing on your mind is carpet bombing Country 404 so the collective west no longer has to make up stories of atrocities committed by Russia? 

I'm guessing that Putin is weak too and needs to be overthrown, correct? Funny how doomer talking points and Stoltenberg's talking points match up perfectly.

Normal russians read rybar, voenkorkotenok, the grey zone, etc, and their views mostly align with arks? How many russians do you know? Do you know how to read russian?

When will Avdeevka, Artemovsk, Slavyansk and Kramatorsk be liberated? How long has the SMO lasted without these cities liberated?

famschopman wrote:

I don't know how to explain this other than telling you that you cannot just kill a million+ of people. These people are fed by propaganda, but they are still people. The beauty of people is that they can be taught and educated differently.

Provide and help them with proper infrastructure, housing, roads, education, healthcare and employment opportunities. It's these simply things that can turn a broken society in a prosperous Russia-positive society. Will it be easy, probably not. Is it possible, absolutely.

Will you have terrorist cells, of course. Eliminate those fast and rapidly.

But just killing is never the answer. I hope this makes sense to you.

In Syria , 300, thousand died

1 million definitely won't die, they will leave their homes when it begins

You don't have to destroy everything, just wherever nazis hide, you hit it like Israel does in Palestine

Or How Russia did in Aleppo,Douma, Damascus

I'm so sick of hearing about these fucking Ukrainians and the pity party you all have for them

It makes me sick to my stomach,  how you pro Ukrainians are literally tearing up because of some dead hohols

Everyone here says the same shit that pro Ukrainians say

It's better that Russians die! Because the poor innocent Ukrainians

I don't give a **** about Ukrainians, and you crypto Ukrainian scum are as bad as the nazis

How many of you are there crawling in Canada, USA, Poland, Russia!?

We have a Ukrainian disease

It's worse than any conspiracies of Jewish secret societies

Ukrainians are a nightmare they are everywhere and all audiences advocate for them

Coincidentally the ones calling them brotherly people have surnames ending with "enko"

MatviyENKO, and crypto ukrs like Putin

Those people are not brothers, they are enemies

Arkanghelsk wrote:

Broski wrote:Ahh... the putrid stench of soiled doomer underwear in the morning. Smells like... victory. Ark you're either a 5th/6th columnist or Ukrainian because I couldn't imagine a normal Russian falling for Ukro propaganda the way you do, advocating for Russia to do the very things that would lead to its destruction.

Things played out the way they did for Russia to win the support of the Global South and avoid being isolated geopolitically (which the West desperately needs to pull a Yugoslavia 2.0 on Russia). Now General Surovikin is put in charge of 300k conscripts, the rules of engagement have been altered so the new boss can do his job with minimal russian losses, Ukraine is being de-energized as we speak and the only thing on your mind is carpet bombing Country 404 so the collective west no longer has to make up stories of atrocities committed by Russia? 

I'm guessing that Putin is weak too and needs to be overthrown, correct? Funny how doomer talking points and Stoltenberg's talking points match up perfectly.

How does Odessa fall? Please explain it to me , along with Nikolayev, Kharkov, Sumy, Chernigov, Kiev and the rest of the border territories where Russian army is massing ?

So the power is cut, and energy is gone, great! Good job, you still have to take the city

Oh thank God Archie, you just might have won the war. Quick, someone get ahold of the Ru MOD and tell them that to win this thing they have to take cities. I am sure that they were unaware of this. I am sure the Stavka had this on their planning boards: mobilize, deploy troops to combat zones, bomb enemy, ? Win. Now they know they have to take cities. I shall email the Russian embassy and ensure that you win your gold star medal for Hero of Russian Federation for your timely intelligence and keen grasp of the obvious.

Arkanghelsk wrote:How does Odessa fall? 

Same way the other 4 regions were liberated, kill the enemy until he loses his capacity to fight. Or did you not notice the 500-1000+ Ukrainians that are killed every day? But of course, that doesn't matter to you.

Please explain it to me , along with Nikolayev, Kharkov, Sumy, Chernigov, Kiev and the rest of the border territories where Russian army is massing ?

300k conscripts with military experience are being retrained as we speak, or should Surovikin send them to the front without preparation like the Ukraine does? Maybe they should rush this operation because you're getting impatient, Da?

So the power is cut, and energy is gone, great! Good job, you still have to take the city

How long can a city last without fuel, ammunition, electricity and armored vehicles? Most cities aren't fortified like Mariupol was.

Nice example of the use of Lancet drone:
https://t.me/rybar/40395

500-1000 a day lol no its stupid statements like these that make me chuckle.

7 months late but they understood the usefulness of this drone.

Backman wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:

mr_hd wrote:
Regarding West -those countries are in decline and are not angels either, still most of them have far superior societies compared to Russia and have much more organized institutions, rule of law etc and sadly Russia is falling behind more last 5-6 years. Before that was making huge gains and progress - not anymore.

Bold part shows

Python. Do you think that Russia can strategically bomb Ukraine into surrender ? I don't think its in the cards. Because this govt doesn't care about Ukraine. Russia could bomb every power station for 3 weeks until theres not one light on in the whole country and Zelensky would still get on TV and demand Crimea.

So yeah. I think this army being moved to Belarus has to be the real deal. Thats the only way to solve it

I think given the circumstances Russia is adopting the right strategy

Some mass bombing campaign won't win the war, it will just dial up the extremism in the Ukraine and make rebuilding more expensive.
With infrastructure and cities intact however, people have something to lose.

Russia has been busy drawing the Ukrainian army and all its mercs out of the cities and fortifications, and into the field where said army can be smashed - even if Russia has to give up some territory as a bait.
The exact same strategy Podolyaka was talking about when the war started; the Napoleon-era doctrines of avoiding cities altogether and destroying enemies out in the open to win wars. And avoiding any more costly grinding battles such as Mariupol, where the DNR has lost half the men it has lost overall in the war, or whatever it is.

People who expected a swift victory will just have to deal with it. If the Ukraine was as isolated as Iraq was in 2003 then such an expectation wouldn't be out of place. Otherwise, no. Do realize that the collective West is going to spare no efforts to overthrow the Russian state, up to and including promoting separatism in Russia, which Western media are already talking about openly and Western-based 'Russian' NGOs and media are trying at the moment to implement.
And it won't just be limited to the Ukraine. Once Ukrainian manpower is spent, and that will soon be upon us, they'll throw Poland and other states into the fray. And so on.
This war won't be won when the Ukrainian regime falls or is forced out from the capital. At the very least don't bet on that. Prepare for the worst, because no doubt the Russian military leadership is. There is little sign so far of some sort of diplomatic solution being on the table - and that means that everyone is going to raise the stakes further.

Russia's best bet at the moment is as I mentioned, Surovikin launching an offensive towards Kiev, or whatever his plan is, and by so doing forcing the collapse of Ukrainian lines in the south in the manner that was earlier discussed. The Ukrainian-NATO forces may well decide to withdraw to Dnepropetrovsk or wherever their next set of defensive lines are, and attempt to shorten the front as they're able. NATO's full complement of officer corps has been busy no doubt going over every scenario. Almost certainly they also have new defenses built up further back for exactly this eventuality.
It's not just a simpleton matter of hurr durr bombing everything or Russia making predictable offensives at every opportunity, not giving up any ground to look good, etc... STAVKA has to actually outsmart the enemy and use its own resources more wisely. NATO has so far not been outsmarted in anything. They've predicted and countered everything Russia has tried. But they've also played right into Russia's hands by treating Ukrainian manpower as absolutely expendable and wasting tens of thousands of them in recent offensives that have achieved nothing, in the hopes of somehow shaking Russian morale or its mobilization effort. In this context, doomerists and others who think they know better than career officers are stepping into the role of allies of NATO. Nevertheless, NATO has thus far failed entirely in its latest endeavor, and wasted a huge amount of reserves in the attempt. This should be viewed as very much a Russian victory, albeit as much due to the enemy's miscalculations as it was due to the Russian strategy of controlled retreats and small amounts of highly mobile garrison forces.
More NATO miscalculations will shorten the war further. The most important thing is for Russia not to miscalculate anything, and end up in a trap of some kind. I can definitely understand Russian conservatism in the war from this angle.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:500-1000 a day lol no its stupid statements like these that make me chuckle.

Don't think the Ukrainians that took part in the "Great Kherson Counteroffensive" find it so funny or stupid, but I guess I'll choose to believe the Russian MoD and you can believe the Ukrainian MoD, British "intelligence" agencies, CNN and Twitter instead

d_taddei2 wrote:

JohninMK wrote:

So shock horror, when there are more than a handful (that can be pushed around) they are refusing to be used as front line cannon fodder!

Just give it another 1-2 months those volunteers/mercenaries will be wanting to leave Ukraine or be killed by their Nazi zealot masters for trying to leave. Winter is coming and most don't have proper winter kit, and certainly no fun living in ruin buildings or trenches during winter being hit by Russian artillery and drones, while the Nazi masters sit in safe warm houses or Mansions with bellies full of the finest food. Suddenly fighting for Ukrainian neo Nazi conquests doesn't seem so appealing. And in the run up to Christmas morale will likely dwindle further while your families sit at home and prepare for Christmas meal, open their gifts from loved ones, all celebrating with Christmas cheer, and you are forgotten about and while you sit in your cold wet trench feeling hungary, cold, and miserable not knowing when the next artillery barrage will be, or the unnerving sound of a drone fly over head and will it be your last moment alive or not. Suddenly what you volunteered for doesn't seem so appealing.

As I implied, when there are only a few mercs then they can indeed be pushed around, even killed, by their Nazi back stops. But if there are say a company of say Polish or mixed mercs then it would be a different kettle of fish.

Can't see the mercs standing for inferior living conditions either.

Part of the angst of not being at home is the possibility (I don't know how it works) of the family enjoying his danger money.

Broski wrote:

Arkanghelsk wrote:How does Odessa fall? 

Same way the other 4 regions were liberated, kill the enemy until he loses his capacity to fight. Or did you not notice the 500-1000+ Ukrainians that are killed every day? But of course, that doesn't matter to you.

Please explain it to me , along with Nikolayev, Kharkov, Sumy, Chernigov, Kiev and the rest of the border territories where Russian army is massing ?

300k conscripts with military experience are being retrained as we speak, or should Surovikin send them to the front without preparation like the Ukraine does? Maybe they should rush this operation because you're getting impatient, Da?

So the power is cut, and energy is gone, great! Good job, you still have to take the city

How long can a city last without fuel, ammunition, electricity and armored vehicles? Most cities aren't fortified like Mariupol was.

AND what is even more relevant...winter is coming. Its dark, its wet, its cold...and the stinking rotten world around you is going up in flames.
Also some strange lawnmower noises all day and all night long...