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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #13

    GunshipDemocracy
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:14 am

    Erk wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:
    That's a minimum. I would say it's far better to take all the key oblasts that have any strategic and economic value. This will help the Novorussia, while depriving Ukraine of key industries making them suffer and require life support from EU, UK, USA for decades making this costly for them as a form of punishment. Odessa, and Transnistria is a done deal question is will Gagauzia follow Transnistria? I think it might.

    Russia can't just take oblasts, they need the approval of the vast majority of the oblast citizens by referendum, that they want to be involved with Russia, or independent, or remain part of Ukraine.


    Did anyone ask Japs or Italians what they wanted after IIWW? Some regions will be grateful for thsi the other will require some educational work / camps and will agree anyway.

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    Post  par far Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:15 am

    "Azov people rotting alive in the Azovstal catacombs."





    https://t.me/intelslava/26445

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    Post  mnztr Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:20 am

    I think even after Ukraine surrenders it is not really over. Russia wants a new security architecture for Europe and its not going to be satisfied with catch and release. If NATO will not negotiate there will be massive forces with nuclear weapons right on the border of nato states.

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    GunshipDemocracy
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:21 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Commenting on the position of India, which refused to join the anti-Russian sanctions, the British prime minister said that he respects the point of view of New Delhi, although he does not share it. "The position of India towards Russia is historically well known. They are not going to change it, it's true," Johnson admitted.

    Hahaha... so he admits there is no chance of changing Indias idea about the war but he thinks a few more tanks will turn the tide of battle and make the Russians stop attacking?

    What a dick.




    lets agree, a Boris Johnson's interview to BBC shall be called a BJ to BBC lol1 lol1 lol1

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    Post  Erk Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:35 am

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:
    Erk wrote:...

    Russia can't just take oblasts, they need the approval of the vast majority of the oblast citizens by referendum, that they want to be involved with Russia, or independent, or remain part of Ukraine.


    Did anyone ask Japs or Italians what they wanted after IIWW? Some regions will be grateful for thsi the other will require some educational work / camps and will agree anyway.

    Then you haven't been observing Putin very closely, he doesn't just take over territory, he gets the approval of the citizens first, I seen no reason why he should suddenly stop doing that.

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    Post  PapaDragon Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:38 am

    Erk wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:
    That's a minimum. I would say it's far better to take all the key oblasts that have any strategic and economic value. This will help the Novorussia, while depriving Ukraine of key industries making them suffer and require life support from EU, UK, USA for decades making this costly for them as a form of punishment. Odessa, and Transnistria is a done deal question is will Gagauzia follow Transnistria? I think it might.
    Russia can't just take oblasts, they need the approval of the vast majority of the oblast citizens by referendum, that they want to be involved with Russia, or independent, or remain part of Ukraine.

    If they don't like it they can pack their shit and hightail to EU, they have golden opportunity now because Euros are to whipped to say no

    If they didn't say no to Nazis they sure as shit don't get to say no to anyone else










    Last edited by PapaDragon on Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:41 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:40 am

    Erk wrote:

    Then you haven't been observing Putin very closely, he doesn't just take over territory, he gets the approval of the citizens first, I seen no reason why he should suddenly stop doing that.

    oh I have been observing Russia for many years, it is now game with highest stakes so fast. IIIWW without nukes. Dependent lands can be easily converted to love their liberators and thos who feel Russians not fascists probably wan tto join Russia anyway.
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    Post  Krepost Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:50 am

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #13 - Page 22 Unname10

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    Post  LMFS Sat Apr 23, 2022 5:16 am

    Airbornewolf wrote:
    the portrayed situation is indeed strategically undesired.
    At least, the territory up to the red line is an favorable strategic defensive position.

    Why not the line that joins Brest with Transnistria, leaving just Galicia out? Better border even, and more in line with historic justice.

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    Post  Dr.Snufflebug Sat Apr 23, 2022 5:27 am

    Urluber wrote:So now there is fire also in Korolyov. After Tver and Kineshma.
    That's in Moscow area and known for example hosting the mission control center of Roskosmos.

    Don't want to feed the rumor mill but it's hard to believe these recent fires are pure accidents.
    I doubt they are Kievan sabotage either. Kievan nazis don't have capacity to carry out this many operations. I have zero evidence but if I had to say it's most likely the American nazis. Cyber attacks overheating some machinery or similar.

    If FSB finds evidence, some US research nuclear reactor should experience sudden malfunction of all safety systems.

    Look, the only possibly suspicious one is Tver. But even that one is most likely to have been faulty wiring in an old building with wooden beams, plus lack of proper fire suppression. A recurring thing.

    Kineshma fire was a warehouse acetone spill that caught fire. Workers on site said as much, and the chemical plant wasn't affected.

    Korolyov was on Cosmonaut Strekalov street, in a gruffy garage behind the street shops, not anywhere near say the MCC or anything of the sort.
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #13 - Page 22 CUb10lA

    Caused by welding sparks, workers were doing some reconstruction.

    Russia has fires like these every single day, somewhere in the country. It' a huge place with 150,000,000 people and 15 cities with over 1 million residents each, which in pure statistical likelihood would produce multiple fires a day. Then on top of this it's compounded by the fact that fire safety standards often aren't quite up to scratch.

    It's just that now you have UA trolls amplifying every freaking dog house that catches fire, and NATO trolls latching onto and spreading everything as if it's significant.

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Apr 23, 2022 6:40 am

    Biden in his own place again

    https://t.me/denazi_UA/7637

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Apr 23, 2022 6:45 am

    GarryB wrote:Would very carefully search through that to make sure there are no slow fuses burning....

    In fact if it is old just burn it down anyway...

    Not worth the risk.

    I'd cordon it off, make sure its covered by air defences, and send some robots in to start unloading things. Haul things out day in day out, and supply them straight to the front
    Don't let any good ammo go to waste
    Apparently there are artillery shells there, 120mm mortar rounds, 60mm NATO mortar rounds, 122mm Grad rockets, and RPG-7 rounds at a minimum.
    Also a lot of artillery shell casings, which can be reused
    The 2017 fire spread to the 152mm artillery shells, aircraft bombs and 125mm tank rounds, don't know how many are left there now if any

    I'd say the likelihood is that it's trapped. Well when the trap does trip, all you'll lose is some robots so no big deal

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Sat Apr 23, 2022 8:35 am

    VARGR198 wrote:

    This is the same ammo depot that was heavily hit back in 2015, claimed to host a decent supply of Tochkas and Smerch ammo.
    But it seems that the destruction back there was very limited, and applied only to the storage they had in open. Well, you can't expect much more from a grenade dropped from a drone Laughing
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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Apr 23, 2022 8:40 am

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:It's getting more interesting now, I look forward to seeing the third phase  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil . Will it be a scene in Kiev's bunker with the killer clown?  kinda remake of 45?



    The Federation Council supported the idea of ​​creating the Tauride Territory

    Tsekov supported the idea of ​​the Tauride region from the Crimea, Kherson and part of the Zaporozhye regions

    https://ria.ru/20220422/tavriya-1784947797.html





    Are they a legit target for calibration?

    https://ria.ru/20220423/lvov-1785039344.html

    Source: Britain sent sabotage specialists near Lvov

    Britain sent SAS sabotage specialists near Lviv to the location of the air brigade of the Armed Forces

    KHERSON, April 23 - RIA Novosti. At least two groups of about 20 specialists in sabotage and guerrilla warfare from the Special Air Service of Great Britain (Special Air Service - SAS) were abandoned in the Lviv region - at the location of the air brigade of the army aviation of the armed forces of Ukraine, an employee of the Russian law enforcement agencies told RIA Novosti with reference on information received from sources in the Armed Forces of Ukraine.
    "According to information received from sources in the Armed Forces of Ukraine, at least two groups of military personnel were deployed to the settlement of Brody, Lviv region, on the territory of the 16th separate brigade of the army aviation of the Armed Forces of Ukraine from the city of Hereford in the UK, where the headquarters of the SAS is located. Composition one group - about 8-10 people," the source said.

    He clarified that we are talking about specialists in the field of sabotage and partisan activities, as well as in the field of recruiting and training agents to work in hostile territory.

    The citiy of DONETSK is above all !
    My opinion is that the capital should be DONETSK, if the formation of Novorussiya occurs.
    Donetsk is the biggest city of rebellion and revolt against the Kiev bastards and Donetsk should be the center of whatever is formed - Novorussiya or whatever. Kiev is shithole and apart from Kievo Pecherskaya Lavra there is nothing worthwhile. Even if the Russians conquer the whole of Banderistan, Donetsk should be the capital again.

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    Post  nomadski Sat Apr 23, 2022 9:00 am



    @ GarryB


    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dnieper


    If Ukraine puts Dams on Dnieper to stop water for Russian sector in South , then Russia and Belarusian Dams can be built further up the River to stop water reaching further south ! So it is not possible to divert water to the South . And not necessary to capture the entire East of River in Ukraine , for water security . As far as Odessa is concerned , it has a majority Russian speaking population , and will probably be incorporated into Russian sector . However as Hole said " they will have to pay money for transit of goods to Odessa . " But as KVS also said " there is no point in occupying West of the River ( hostile population and no resources ) as well as control border with Poland , " it is far easier to leave West Ukraine to the West , and as I said earlier " establish the border along the River , as it is easier to spot and destroy traffic over it . " This has recently been done , by blowing Bridges over the River .

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Apr 23, 2022 9:35 am

    Artillery supplied to the Ukraine

    🇪🇪 - 9 howitzers D-30
    🇺🇸 - 18 + 72 howitzers M777
    🇨🇦 - 4 howitzers M777
    🇨🇿 - 20+ SPG DANA и DANA M2
    🇸🇰 - 18 SPA Zuzana
    🇵🇱 - 20+ SPG Gvozdika
    🇳🇱 - up to 24 SPG PzH 2000
    🇫🇷 - 12 SPG CAESAR
    🇧🇪 - up to 24 SPG M109A4BE
    🇬🇧 - SPG AS-90
    🇵🇱 - BМ-21 Grad
    🇨🇿 - RM-70
    🇺🇸 - РСЗО M142 HIMARS

    BTW, looks like Pantsir-S1 systems took out a couple of Tochkas and even some MLRS munitions in the air (Uragans maybe)

    ALAMO wrote:
    VARGR198 wrote:

    This is the same ammo depot that was heavily hit back in 2015, claimed to host a decent supply of Tochkas and Smerch ammo.
    But it seems that the destruction back there was very limited, and applied only to the storage they had in open. Well, you can't expect much more from a grenade dropped from a drone Laughing

    There's like 100 hangers there or something. So you can't take it all out in one go unless you use a big explosive.

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    Post  Hinex1988 Sat Apr 23, 2022 9:37 am

    🇷🇺🇺🇦Briefing by the Russian Defence Ministry

    ▫The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue a special military operation in Ukraine.

    💥During the night, high-precision air-based missiles of the Russian Aerospace Forces hit 11 military assets of Ukraine.

    ▫Among them: 7 strong points and areas of manpower and military equipment concentration. As a result of the strikes, the enemy's losses amounted to up to 2 companies of personnel, 25 armored vehicles and motor cars. Also, 3  depots of missile and artillery weapons were destroyed near Chervonnoe.

    ✈💥Operational-tactical and army aviation of the Russian Aerospace Forces hit 66 military assets of Ukraine during the night.

    ▫Among them: 3 command posts, 58 areas of manpower and Ukrainian military equipment concentration, as well as 3 missile and artillery weapons depots near Alexandrovka, Komar and Bogatyr.

    Missile troops and artillery performed 1,098 firing tasks during the day.

    ▫As a result of the strikes, 3 Ukrainian Mi-8 helicopters were destroyed near Chuguev, 3 anti-aircraft missile system Osa-AKM on the outskirts of Barvenkovo, 16 depots of weapons and military equipment, as well as 33 command posts of Ukrainian units.

    ▫919 strong pointss and areas of manpower and military equipment concentration, as well as 124 firing positions of Ukrainian artillery were hit.

    ▫Su-25 aircraft of the Ukrainian Air Force was shot down in the air by Russian air defence means near Novaya Dmitrovka, Kharkov region.

    ▫Also during the night, 15 Ukrainian unmanned aerial vehicles were destroyed, including 1 Bayraktar TB-2 over Novaya Zarya, Nikolaev region.

    ▫In the Chernobayevka area, crews of  Pantsir-S anti-aircraft missile and cannon complexes shot down 2 Tochka-U tactical missiles and 3 multiple launch rocket projectiles in the air.

    📊In total, since the beginning of the special military operation, 141 aircraft, 110 helicopters, 538 unmanned aerial vehicles, 261 anti-aircraft missile systems, 2,471 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 274 multiple rocket launchers, 1,075 field artillery and mortars, as well as 2,311 units of special military vehicles have been destroyed.

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    Post  GarryB Sat Apr 23, 2022 9:40 am

    Some Chinese official was saying that demand for everything Russian is rising in China and they're interested in products Russia has to offer

    So China will open its market for Russian goods and promote them, helping Russia's civilian economy

    That would be good because the Chinese could probably replace all the consumer goods that used to come from the west that the Russians bought, and China gets energy and clean food without GM or steroids...

    Trouble is the Americans are now threatening to send troops to Taiwan; they want to goad China into an invasion so that they can try to cut them off from 'the world' too.

    Pretty sure Russia will help China any way it can considering Taiwan is sanctioning Russia too... that just makes things easy.

    China could just say they will destroy all computer chip manufacturing capacity in Taiwan instead of invading... that might be enough to make the US realise the situation better..

    Russia could offer to ban the exports of Uranium fuel to the US if the US tries anything funny in Taiwan...

    If Ukraine puts Dams on Dnieper to stop water for Russian sector in South

    Dams take time to build and are fixed coordinate targets that should be quite easy to hit.

    If they want to play stupid games like that the Russia can play too... investment into bio weapons labs is going to be useful down the track.

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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Apr 23, 2022 9:51 am

    nomadski wrote:

    @ GarryB


    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dnieper


    If Ukraine puts Dams on Dnieper to stop water for Russian sector in South , then Russia and Belarusian Dams can be built further up the River to stop water reaching further south ! So it is not possible to divert water to the South . And not necessary to capture the entire East of River in Ukraine , for water security . As far as Odessa is concerned , it has a majority Russian speaking population , and will probably be incorporated into Russian sector . However as Hole said " they will have to pay money for transit of goods to Odessa . " But as KVS also said " there is no point in occupying West of the River ( hostile population and no resources )  as well as control border with Poland , " it is far easier to leave West Ukraine to the West , and as I said earlier " establish the border along the River , as it is easier to spot and destroy traffic over it . " This has recently been done , by blowing Bridges over the River .


    The collapse of the Russian Empire brought all this.
    After the collapse of the USSR and 70 years of rule of the "red heretics", the Russians returned to the Orthodox faith and the Russian Orthodox Church, while the Ukrainians invented "their own" church and turned to Nazism.
    Ukrainians and those who call themselves as Ukrainians are not in the same league with Russia and the Russians. I cannot respect those who are in fact Russians and today are "baptized" as "centuries-old" Ukrainians.
    Russia does not need "dead tissue" and those who essentially despise Russia. I have already written once that O N L Y Donetsk and Lugansk deserve to join the Russian Federation. The rest should be broken into small pieces, until the Banderistans themselves start pissing on Bandera's legacy.
    To separate Kharkov, Odessa, Zaporozhye, Nikolaev from Ukraine, yes, but not to accept the mentioned regions as part of Russia. No way. There is a lot of shit in those cities that will continue to worship and swear to Bandera
    I sometimes wonder if the Russians REALLY even want Kharkov or Odessa. That state of Banderistan is completely broken religiously, politically, by corruption, and in all other ways. Ukraine has been a wreck for more than 100 years.
    There are a lot of brainwashed people there to be accepted into an alliance with Russia. Ukraine must be trampled, broken and shattered by any of their ideas of "centuries-old statehood", as the Bandera government likes to say in a shithole called Kiev.

    Just make military bases all over "Ukraine" and that's it, so let them gnaw Russian sausage then.
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    Post  ALAMO Sat Apr 23, 2022 10:01 am

    d_taddei2 wrote:
    Obviously the biggest obstacle to all this is the population. What do they want? I think the best way to play this, is referendum in each oblast on independence. From that the oblast can then decide if it wants to remain independent, form a federation with Novorussia, or the United federation of orcs. People like the idea of independence and having more control. This would weaken zelenskys control and could drastically reduce Ukraine in size.  Either way the map shown is pretty certain. And I think after this war, the newly independent regions will happily accept neutrality they will have had enough of war and forced conscription and neo Nazi's holding a gun to their head. Peace and stability is what they want. And for many it's a way to get out of the conflict and not take a side.

    I think realistically the map shown will be Novorussia. The far west of the country will be orc land but still be forced to remain neutral, and by that time NATO will no longer be interested in its failed pet project. While the remaining regions Kiev, and central will for a federation that will remain totally neutral not taking any side and will just want to get on with life, trading with both Russia and EU. And although we all want a complete overthrow it's unlikely to happen but Russia will have achieved various levels of buffer zones, gained pro Russian areas including Transnistria and Gagauzia. Land locked Ukraine. Made it extremely weak, left NATO with another fail project, with a bloody nose. EU economy in tatters, and USA and UK as countries u no longer want to lead you down the garden path to another project.

    ... and that is something that armchair generals don't get, lacking historical memory, to begin with.
    Soviet suppression of Ukro nationalist-driven resistance lasted for 20 years and the price was the lives of about 100k Soviet soldiers.
    It ended up well into 50s.
    And that was only a follow-up of the very similar resistance Poland faced there earlier, including the filtration camps for Ukro nationalists that filtred about 100k of them, leaving more than 20k dead.
    So in reality, they have struggled for their own Banderastan for more than 40 years back then, and 30+ years now. No matter how we consider the ideology itself, we can't deny them the determination for independence.
    Who needs that?
    Neither Russia nor Poland.
    There is no point in the occupation of western Ukraine from the Russian perspective. Costly, with no long-term gains for real.
    The whole western part of Ukr is an agricultural land mostly, without any serious industry. It will be home to maybe 15 mln population, if we consider the migration, making it an equivalent of Romania.
    So in reality, any serious danger of becoming anti Russia will be gone.
    Someone who is yapping about "West Germany" obviously never has been there Laughing
    I have. In both WG and West Berlin.
    It was an industrial hub, a vibrant and massive economy leaving anyone with a dropped jar.
    It was driven by billions looted by the Nazis, that was pumped back into it in the 60s already, a population boom making it about 60 mln nation, on a constant rise well into 80s.
    There is not a single point that matches the Ukro, neither now, nor when Russkies will finish with them.
    Landlocking them and stripping off the whole Russian speaking regions will be an absolute victory, for a humble price.
    It will be a smaller, weaker, poorer Romania, but with a huge ego.
    This huge ego will be wiped very fast, while you can't make a blowjobs or clean the toilets with your ego much.

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    Post  Erk Sat Apr 23, 2022 10:16 am

    GarryB wrote:...

    China could just say they will destroy all computer chip manufacturing capacity in Taiwan instead of invading... that might be enough to make the US realise the situation better..
    China would not have to destroy chip manufacture, just shut down all methods of exporting the chips out of Taiwan.

    Taiwan, being an island, has only a couple of transport options, ports and airports.

    The US + EU only account for about 20% of Taiwan's imports and exports. PRC alone beats that in both directions, and that's not counting Hong Kong trade, so Taiwan really needs to think about who are their trade partners. If they get sucked in by the US, it's their own fault. We have already seen what that did to the EU over Ukraine.


    Last edited by Erk on Sat Apr 23, 2022 10:25 am; edited 2 times in total

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Apr 23, 2022 10:22 am

    A D-20 battery of the DNR. Nice

    https://t.me/boris_rozhin/44430

    Also a Ukrainian Su-25 was shot down near Izyum. They're literal kamikazes being sent on suicide-missions at this point, those Su-24s and Su-25s that have been downed over the past 2 weeks in this area.

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:36 pm

    Erk wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:
    That's a minimum. I would say it's far better to take all the key oblasts that have any strategic and economic value. This will help the Novorussia, while depriving Ukraine of key industries making them suffer and require life support from EU, UK, USA for decades making this costly for them as a form of punishment. Odessa, and Transnistria is a done deal question is will Gagauzia follow Transnistria? I think it might.

    Russia can't just take oblasts, they need the approval of the vast majority of the oblast citizens by referendum, that they want to be involved with Russia, or independent, or remain part of Ukraine.


    How unfortunate that so many voters have fled west and may not be able to partake. Laughing

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    Post  Dr.Snufflebug Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:38 pm

    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:

    And "over 121" drones, these "Phoenix Ghost" are cheapo Switchblade derivatives from what I gather.

    What's the point..

    Seems confirmed that this "Phoenix Ghost" is a monkey model of Switchblade, specifically designed/downgraded for Ukraine.

    I am curious about Russia's MIC and how they are adapting things to the current situation.

    I've read on Russian military forums calls to develop similar cheapo PGMs.
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    Post  Hole Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:43 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    billybatts91 wrote:So this is basically what the official plan is now in terms of Russian goals for Ukraine, taking over the blue parts (except Crimea, which is already a part of Russia).
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #13 - Page 22 462-4610

    Horseshit, this isn't even consolation prize

    They just get another Western Germany this way



    Hole wrote:Jokes aside, I got some gruesome pics of dead Ukrops, left in trenches. They´re buried by the Russian Army, of course.

    Post raw links, just don't embed them



    https://thesaker.is/sitrep-operation-z-13/
    There are some "nice" videos.

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