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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #12

    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Tue Apr 19, 2022 2:40 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:...Well, its technically a war grave now (assuming it was lost due to actions by hostiles, and that there have been unrecovered fatalies onboard), so your suggested course of action might be considered ill-advised...

    That rat faced maggot Peskov was assuring us (between his groveling on CNN) that everyone got out fine although people should know better than to trust someone who's job is to lick his owner's butt for a living

    If body of any sailor is still stuck down there they should be retrieved and given proper burial, they deserve better than to rot forever on that embarrassment

    Also it's funny how captain got out without a scratch, Naval tradition folks Rolling Eyes



    Serberus wrote:...Incompetence aside, the ship and its crews served for decades, so it should and probably will be memorialised in some way...

    She could have served for century but it's irrelevant now

    She didn't sink as a result of some battle or horrible accident or unforseen circumstances, she was blown out of the water by bunch of Ukrainian apes using nothing but couple of oversized RC toy planes and some knockoff subsonic missiles

    Retrieve the bodies and blast that accursed thing to pieces

    Memory of humiliation will remain forever but at least physical testament to it will be gone



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    Post  Dr.Snufflebug Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:08 pm

    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:Large RU forces apparently advanced 20km from Kreminna to Torske in 12 hours without meeting much resistance, then they drove UA out of the latter town just now. Almost gotten half way to Slavyansk from where they started yesterday.

    Even the Russian MoD has now announced "phase 2".

    Meanwhile in Slavyansk and Kramatorsk, UA militants are getting nervous and it shows in an uptick of crimes against civilians. Looting, stealing cars, killing people who object.

    RU forces are now assaulting Liman, another 5km advance. Only 15km from Slavyansk.

    Stiff resistance.

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    Serberus
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    Post  Serberus Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:12 pm

    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:
    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:Large RU forces apparently advanced 20km from Kreminna to Torske in 12 hours without meeting much resistance, then they drove UA out of the latter town just now. Almost gotten half way to Slavyansk from where they started yesterday.

    Even the Russian MoD has now announced "phase 2".

    Meanwhile in Slavyansk and Kramatorsk, UA militants are getting nervous and it shows in an uptick of crimes against civilians. Looting, stealing cars, killing people who object.

    RU forces are now assaulting Liman, another 5km advance. Only 15km from Slavyansk.

    Stiff resistance.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #12 - Page 40 2136b410

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    Arkanghelsk
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    Post  Arkanghelsk Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:15 pm

    Offensive from the north: they will not storm Slavyansk head-on

    “A grouping of Russian troops will be deployed in the Donbass region of Izyum to ensure a further offensive in the direction of Kamenka and other settlements in order to encircle the Ukrainian grouping of troops in the Slavyansk-Kramatorsk and Lisichansk-Severodonetsk urban agglomerations,” says military expert Andrei Prokaev.

    It can already be stated: after the defeat of the Ukrainian group near Izyum, the slow but gradual advance of the Russian Armed Forces began to the south directly to Slavyansk and to the southwest to Barvenkovo. This creates the prerequisites for movement from north to south in order to close the cauldron around the Donbass group of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. The resistance in this area was serious, but gradually the front began to shift. Now Russian troops have gained a foothold on the southern shore of the Seversky Donets and continue to accumulate forces there.

    The Svyatogorsky Holy Dormition Monastery, conveniently located on the high bank of the river and turned into a defensive position by the AFU and the territorial battalions, also falls into a semi-circle. In a straight line to Slavyansk, there are about 10 kilometers left, but, according to experts, most likely no one will storm the fortified agglomeration of Slavyansk – Kramatorsk head–on.

    “There are fortified areas on the line of contact, which are marked by important points – Avdiivka, Slavyansk, Severodonetsk, Lisichansk and Krasnoznamensk,” recalled Alexei Leonkov, editor–in-chief of the Arsenal of the Fatherland magazine.

    According to Prokaev, Russian troops will need to protect the flanks in order to avoid attacks on them during the offensive. “We are opposed in Donbass by experienced units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, they have been fighting there since 2014, have headquarters, warehouses, fortifications. In addition, Ukrainian sappers will blow up the remaining bridges, and this factor should also be taken into account by the Russian military during the offensive,” the analyst noted.

    Offensive from the southwest: the key role of Gulyai-Pole

    Russian troops are “waiting for the cleanup of Mariupol to be completed in order to transfer additional forces to the Zaporozhye direction, Rozhin believes. In turn, the Ukrainian General Staff decided to strengthen the southern flank of the Donbass group at the expense of assault units – the 95th Zhytomyr and 25th Dnieper odshbr (separate airborne assault brigades).

    The General Staff of the AFU planned to recapture Volnovakha, recently liberated by the forces of the DPR, and “unblock” Mariupol. But Kiev’s calculations were not justified. The above-mentioned two amphibious assault brigades, abandoned in the area from Gulyai-Pole to Ugledar, are gradually rolling back north to Novomikhailovka and further to Kurakhovo, driving themselves right into the cauldron, analysts say.

    A breakthrough near Novomikhailovka and near Gulyai-Pole will destroy the entire front of the AFU, and therefore it is to these areas that the released units and reinforcements are being transferred now. Experts believe that the occupation of Novomikhailovka by Russian units will lead to a breakthrough on the front with access to Kurakhovo – this is already 50 km from Donetsk. Parts of the DPR in the same place are slowly moving west through Marinka. The fighting is already underway in the area of the main landfill, dominating the steppe, up to Kurakhovo. All this threatens the Ukrainian group west of Donetsk with a cauldron.

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    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:29 pm

    Dr.Snufflebug wrote:...RU forces are now assaulting Liman, another 5km advance. Only 15km from Slavyansk.

    Stiff resistance.

    Artillery shells are stiffer, just keep pounding away until she screams: "roll me over, daddy!!!"

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    GunshipDemocracy
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:39 pm

    Serberus wrote:🇺🇦🇬🇧Great Britain refused to exchange two captured mercenaries for Viktor Medvedchuk.
    This position was voiced by the former chairman of the Conservative Party and Minister for Northern Ireland, Brandon Luce.
    "The British should not have gone to Ukraine at all, it is illegal," the politician said.
    The UK has previously warned its own about criminal liability for sending to fight in Ukraine.
    On the eve of the mercenaries Sean Pinner and Aiden Aslin, who surrendered in Mariupol, appealed to Prime Minister Boris Johnson.
    Both asked to exchange themselves for the Ukrainian politician Medvedchuk.


    will they say the same when a NATO general will be cached ?

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    d_taddei2
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    Post  d_taddei2 Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:42 pm

    Ukrainian PM obviously needs to fill more suitcases of money.

    Updates

    1) Prime Minister in Lviv: I appeal to the European Commission for the solidarity fund for Ukraine to start working and for new money to appear. There is nothing to wait for. No more crimes should be allowed to occur. Today, sanctions must be as strong as possible

    2) Hungary doesn't support gas and oil sanctions against Russia: Hungarian Foreign Minister

    3) Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov announced that the next stage of military operation in Ukraine begun

    4) Russian army is shelling the villages of Staromayorske, Makarivka, Storozhevo, Neskuchne, Remivka, Priyutne, Vyshneve, Malinovka, Poltavka, Novodarivka, Novoukrainske, Stepove with tanks, MLRS GRAD, attacking with armored personnel carriers, infantry, missiles

    5) Governor of Belgorod region reports shelling in Golovchino village near the border of Ukraine

    6) Netherlands will send Ukraine armoured vehicles. Rutte says allies are looking at sending more "heavy material" to Ukraine, after phone call with Zelensky

    7) 76 Ukrainians released in 5th prisoners swap with Russia - Vice PM

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    Post  Podlodka77 Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:43 pm

    19 Apr, 13:30; TASS

    Borisov said there is no shortage of high-precision weapons in the Russian Armed Forces

    According to the Deputy Prime Minister, state armament programs paid special attention to the creation and mass supply of high-precision weapons to the troops.

    MOSCOW, 19 April. /TASS/. Enterprises of the military-industrial complex provide all the needs of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation in high-precision weapons. This was announced in an interview with RT by Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov.

    “Now let’s talk about whether it’s enough or not. All the latest state armament programs since 2011 have paid special attention to the creation and mass supply of high-precision weapons to the troops, increasing the production capabilities of our military-industrial complex year by year. Today we provide almost everything the needs of our armed forces in this effective weapon," he said in response to a question whether Russia had run out of precision-guided missiles.

    The Deputy Prime Minister noted that the use of high-precision weapons by the Russian Armed Forces (Caliber, Iskander, Kinzhal, H-101 aircraft cruise missiles, Bal and Bastion coastal complexes) ensures the necessary efficiency in achieving the set goals.

    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/14412545

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    Post  kvs Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:46 pm

    So the information about civilian hostages at the Azov Stal plant from several weeks ago appear to be true. They are being used
    as human shields and NATzO is making a stink. For some reason NATzO does not concern itself with the question as to why there
    would be civilians at the steel mill in the first place.

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:56 pm

    The original VSU plan was to go into Voronezh and NovoCherkassk , and go into the cities , to encircle LDNR

    That's what provoked phase 1

    The strikes on Belgorod and Taganrog are no coincidence

    The VSU had planned to launch an offensive, but the pre emptive feint towards Kiev, stifled the decision making of Zelensky and NATO generals

    The hesitation bogged down their forces in Donetsk

    Now Russia has the initiative to wipe out this agglomeration of Nazi forces

    Once they're gone, nothing is between the rest of Ukraine and denazification

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    Post  Serberus Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:56 pm

    kvs wrote:So the information about civilian hostages at the Azov Stal plant from several weeks ago appear to be true.   They are being used
    as human shields and NATzO is making a stink.    For some reason NATzO does not concern itself with the question as to why there
    would be civilians at the steel mill in the first place.


    Basurin first said this morning that reports of civilian presence were untrue, then the Russian MOD contradicted him by announcing a time frame window for civilians to leave.
    There were rumours early on of Azov announcing a safe heaven for civilians at the plant so they can trap them there, but they could have just as easily taken them there by force during their withdrawal.

    However they ended up there, they are clearly being forced to stay and be used as human shield, the west obviously couldn’t care less about this. Just another propaganda piece to use.
    These are the same “people” labelling nazis as heroes, well its not hard for them , they are nazis themselves.
    I will now be referring to nato as the 4th Reich, because let’s be honest, that’s what they are.


    Last edited by Serberus on Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:29 pm; edited 2 times in total

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    Post  Isos Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:02 pm

    kvs wrote:So the information about civilian hostages at the Azov Stal plant from several weeks ago appear to be true.   They are being used
    as human shields and NATzO is making a stink.    For some reason NATzO does not concern itself with the question as to why there
    would be civilians at the steel mill in the first place.


    Go ask iraqi and libyan what NATO think of collateral damages civilians.

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    Post  par far Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:18 pm

    "Combat work of the Chechen special forces in Mariupol."

    https://t.me/intelslava/25912

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    Post  Sujoy Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:41 pm

    Javelins have a range of 3km. Meaning at any given time Russian troops will have to secure a 18km circle around the tank. That's a lot of ground to secure against someone popping out of a hole for 30 seconds and pressing a button.

    The best strategy that Russian troops can adopt right now of suppressing ATGM ambushes from a Javelin (especially since their front of choice is wide open so the sight range of 3 km is realistic) is overwhelming sustained artillery bombardment combined with a simultaneous armor and mobile infantry push.

    This will still incur tank casualties but this is a functional way to advance. Russians are executing the bombardment part, the simultaneous armor push part is TBD.
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:41 pm

    MOSCOW, April 19 - RIA Novosti. Russia at this stage of the special operation in Ukraine is considering only the option of using conventional weapons, said Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov.

    https://ria.ru/20220419/ukraina-1784261157.html

    at this stage... I hope no NAZ(to)I actions will fotcr Russia to change the stage...

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    Post  Podlodka77 Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:42 pm

    Military operation in Ukraine
    19 Apr, 15:40 (Updated 16:37), TASS

    NAZI cocksucker Zelensky proposed extending martial law in Ukraine until May 25

    Draft law submitted for consideration to parliamentary leadership

    Kyiv, April 19. /TASS/. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has proposed extending martial law in the country until May 25. The text of the bill proposed by Zelensky was published on Tuesday on the website of the Verkhovna Rada.

    "To extend the period of martial law in Ukraine from 05:30 on April 25 for a period of 30 days," the document says.

    Earlier, Zelensky submitted to the Verkhovna Rada a document on the extension of martial law in the country. According to information on the website of the parliament, the draft law on the approval of the presidential decree "On the extension of martial law in Ukraine" was registered on Tuesday and has already been submitted for consideration to the leadership of the Rada.

    Martial law on the territory of Ukraine was introduced on February 24. On March 15, the Rada extended its validity from March 26 for another 30 days.

    On February 24, Russian President Vladimir Putin announced a special military operation in Ukraine in response to a request from the leaders of the Donbass republics for help. He stressed that Moscow's plans do not include the occupation of Ukrainian territories, the goals of the operation are the demilitarization and denazification of the country.

    * NAZI cocksucker; that's what I added.

    https://tass.ru/mezhdunarodnaya-panorama/14414831

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    Post  GarryB Wed Apr 20, 2022 7:47 am

    Reality is that thry don't want to spend on the navy. Like the Moskva and other successfull anti ship missile hits showed, surface ship are targets.

    You can't defend sea lines of communication with submarines... the navy has been the most neglected branch of their military and the Moskva, while large and impressive was totally obsolete... like a fighter aircraft or tank from the 1980s... there is still no evidence of any missile being involved.

    What the Moskva was doing could have been done by a brand new Destroyer because its radar and systems even if made right now would be far superior to the systems on the Moskva were. It would have S-350 and S-400 based SAMs which can destroy low flying missiles out to enormous distances and would likely also see drones at extended ranges too and it would have a wide variety of missiles to deal with such targets.

    In comparison Moskva only had 30mm gatlings and OSA missiles to defend against sea skimmers... which means they were still better defended than British ships in the Falklands period.

    New Destroyers would have the endurance and capacity to defend Russian interests around the globe which will be something they will need moving forward.

    The fact that they keep old cruisers and their aircraft carrier in service suggests that new models of such vessels are on the cards too... but not this year.

    I suspect destroyers will become a greater priority and when the upgraded Gorshkovs have been tested they will put either them or the existing model into serial production.

    The modular design and unified design (one frigate type instead of different ones for different jobs like with their destroyers the Sov and Udaloy) should make serial production quite fast.

    What they need is submarines and a powerful air force as well as long range missiles and satelittes.

    They already have those... they just need to get their Su-57s into service and either MiG-35s or their replacement or the Su-75 into service to get some numbers available for use... and of course new satellites will help as well, and the new long range missiles will make the current missiles look a bit tame.

    If true there must be a possibility that the (surprise?) attack on the Moskva could have been in response to this event.

    Unlikely... not the sort of thing you do on the spur of the moment.

    If it hits a mine or has a fire or other problem then you claim it was for this or that purpose but of course you don't release any footage because you don't have any.

    If it is useful to station warships at Sea (for example , to make use of Radar , for higher resolution images ) where they can be possibly hit with Sea- skimming missiles , then an easy way to protect ships , is to erect a steel plate on Barges around ship , at least as high as Hull of the ship . This barrier can be stationed near enough to ship , so that skimmers can not dive down quickly enough , after climbing this fence ! Alternatively station old ships , filled with expanded foam blocks , so they do not sink , if hit , around fighting ships . Can be done now . Same Barges or ships , can hang down steel net chain , under it , to stop Torpedo !

    It was an old ship... what they should have done was assign a new corvette with it that is equipped with Redut, but of course that would not have helped if they hit a mine or had an accident... for all we know they might have had a more modern ship there supporting it anyway.

    Some anti ship missiles approach at very low altitude and the last 250m they climb and then dive down on the target... Uran could certainly do that too.

    As for the frigates, I do not agree at all, because the speed of their construction is still worryingly slow.

    They built a small batch and tested them and what they decided to do was upgrade the design and enlarge the ship slightly and change its armament which is what they have done... it makes no sense to put the first ship into serial production until you have tested the modified improved model to make sure it is better and if it is better then that is the one you should be serially producing in volume.

    China has no experience patroling outside its water even if it has 40 destroyers and helicopter carriers and 2 aircraft carriers.

    Nothing they can aid russian navy with.

    Would be interesting them training together though, I suspect China will learn a lot regarding submarine warfare and the extra ships in the hands of a neighbour and ally is a good thing... they have always been fast learners.

    Bases are the way of the Empire to keep the minions under its thumb.

    When other countries stop accepting US dollars it stops working though...

    Su-34 launching Kh-29 missile

    A 317kg HE shaped charge warhead designed to undermine the foundations of heavy structures... and also blow stuff up... excellent image.

    Great Britain refused to exchange two captured mercenaries for Viktor Medvedchuk.
    This position was voiced by the former chairman of the Conservative Party and Minister for Northern Ireland, Brandon Luce.
    "The British should not have gone to Ukraine at all, it is illegal," the politician said.
    The UK has previously warned its own about criminal liability for sending to fight in Ukraine.
    On the eve of the mercenaries Sean Pinner and Aiden Aslin, who surrendered in Mariupol, appealed to Prime Minister Boris Johnson.
    Both asked to exchange themselves for the Ukrainian politician Medvedchuk.

    Excellent.... trading two criminals and likely murderers for a politician illegally imprisoned didn't sit right with me.

    She didn't sink as a result of some battle or horrible accident or unforseen circumstances, she was blown out of the water by bunch of Ukrainian apes using nothing but couple of oversized RC toy planes and some knockoff subsonic missiles

    That is the claim the nazis are making...

    Retrieve the bodies and blast that accursed thing to pieces

    Memory of humiliation will remain forever but at least physical testament to it will be gone

    Retrieve the bodies, but after a few days in the water they wont be pretty.... but then use the experience to hit the planners and supporters of any potential attack like they are suggesting happened... whether it did or not.

    The funny thing is that if it was an American ship that was sunk or damaged it would be the civilians that suffered from heavier attacks in civilian areas, but Russia can instead hit military targets to make them pay more dearly instead... which is a good thing.

    The original VSU plan was to go into Voronezh and NovoCherkassk , and go into the cities , to encircle LDNR

    That's what provoked phase 1

    The strikes on Belgorod and Taganrog are no coincidence

    The VSU had planned to launch an offensive, but the pre emptive feint towards Kiev, stifled the decision making of Zelensky and NATO generals

    The hesitation bogged down their forces in Donetsk

    Now Russia has the initiative to wipe out this agglomeration of Nazi forces

    Once they're gone, nothing is between the rest of Ukraine and denazification

    So Putin is still an idiot and a war criminal but the tactics of his military is starting to make sense?

    Basurin first said this morning that reports of civilian presence were untrue, then the Russian MOD contradicted him by announcing a time frame window for civilians to leave.

    Maybe the civilian corridor is to allow soldiers to surrender and dress as civilians instead of as soldiers who might get shot for desertion or surrendering...

    [qutoe]Javelins have a range of 3km. Meaning at any given time Russian troops will have to secure a 18km circle around the tank.[/quote]

    No, that would be a 3km radius circle which would be 6km across... it is still a large area. But Javelins effectiveness has not been impressive.... it can be fired in a fire and forget mode but once launched it might target a burned out vehicle on the side of the road just as easily as an operational vehicle.

    The best strategy that Russian troops can adopt right now of suppressing ATGM ambushes from a Javelin (especially since their front of choice is wide open so the sight range of 3 km is realistic) is overwhelming sustained artillery bombardment combined with a simultaneous armor and mobile infantry push.

    Not really. The best defence would be to keep to tree lines and near buildings and shoot anyone who launches a missile at you because without a lock it is a command to line of sight missile that is rather slow.

    Martial law on the territory of Ukraine was introduced on February 24. On March 15, the Rada extended its validity from March 26 for another 30 days.

    Perhaps that meeting could be interrupted with a few missiles...

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