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    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8

    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko 30/03/23, 10:10 pm

    Rostec announced the development of material for "invisible" aircraft, 03.30.2023.

    Rostec: new aircraft coating material absorbs 95% of radio waves.

    Specialists of the Rostec state corporation have created a fundamentally new material capable of absorbing electromagnetic radiation in a wide frequency spectrum, according to a message published on the corporation's website.

    The development was made in the Ruselectronics holding, which is part of Rostec.

    With the basis of the material - glass fiber with metal cores. “Due to its exceptional characteristics, the new material absorbs up to 95% of the incident electromagnetic radiation of radars and significantly complicates the detection of an air object using radar,” the state corporation specified, adding that such a design solution was proposed for a stealth material for the first time.

    One advantage of the material is that it is maintenance-free due to the durability of fiberglass, while existing aircraft stealth coatings must be regularly refurbished.

    The prototypes have already successfully passed the required factory tests.

    https://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/642546cd9a79473c3edaa1c6.

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    Post  xeno 30/03/23, 10:26 pm

    too good to be true?Anyway,congrats...
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    Post  Arrow 30/03/23, 10:52 pm

    Wow, this is a revolution when it comes to RAM materials Shocked

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB 30/03/23, 11:38 pm


    It would be easier and far cheaper to have an entire machining department at that airfield than to provide it with such a printer.

    They are probably expensive and complex now, but over time they will improve and get cheaper, while CNC machines do not have such growth potential...

    The very idea of printing things makes sense to have it forward deployed to where it is needed rather than centralised.

    In terms of the new stealth material... that is transformational because at the core of the F-35s horrible cost figures is the time it takes to remove and replace stealth coatings during even routine maintenance on the aircraft. Old stealth coatings wear off but have to be sanded off to get to access panels to check electronics and equipment and then need to have its joints taped up and several layers of stealth material recoated over the top with hours needed for each layer to cure within a specific temperature range that makes them less rugged... and soldier proof.
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    Post  thegopnik 31/03/23, 02:42 pm

    So the patent for the Su-57 stated 1 to 0.1, and we saw the interview before where the Su-57 was stated as 0.5m2 and the F-22 as 0.3m2 to 0.4m2 and that they planned on still lowering the average RCS of the Su-57 by giving it new engines and some modifications with sawtooth nozzles being added. But if we are removing 95% of the radio waves based on the material where we still have to account for the 5% that was not absorbed the average RCS from interview to lowest point possible would be between .025m2 to .005m2 although that would be considered the "average RCS" where every angle and part has been accounted for that RCS. This means the front could be way lower than .005m2 in which this is an absolute win because any adversary stealth aircraft would have to be forced to get very close to the Su-57 and the closer you are the more important maneuverability would be.

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    Post  william.boutros 31/03/23, 07:11 pm

    It is probably not how you calculate RCS.

    95% reduction means 1, log reduction. Also, I am sure the original planned coating served a similar purpose.
    Additional issues with the current Su-57 version
    Engines (will be upgraded in Su-57M)
    Engine intakes (will not change in Su 57M although not sure why they didn't improve this bit of the design)
    Protruding probes (will change in Su 57M but not the level of F22)
    Overall shaping (Will not Change in Su-57M)

    Su-57 will not reach the RCS level of F22 with only a new RAM coating.
    It doesn't need to either because Su-57 is a defensive weapon intended to fly over friendly airspace with the support of ground radars and contest an attack by a superior stealthy foe.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB 31/03/23, 10:05 pm

    Engine intakes might change with the new engines assuming the improved performance potential is achieved, it might allow it to operate at rather higher speeds both in full AB and also in supercruise modes.

    Even in the last decade since the Su-57 got airborne their design and stealth tech has probably improved with the use of super computers allowing them to test lots of different designs very quickly... we also know they use scale models with real radar antenna to test actual results so the most promising computer model based designs could be made into physical models and tested to check the computer model with radar and IIR sensors to create a useful data base of such information which could be used to ID targets using IIR and radar signatures only.

    You get the level of stealth you pay for... the cost of the US stealth is what makes it useless... it is drawing funds out of HATO budgets, yet is not effective against a range of devices and systems the Russians use now let alone what they will be operating in 10 years time.

    Spending trillions of dollars on a stealth technology that is going to be useless is short sighted but the US MIC sees that as a bonus... in 10 years time after they have made enormous profits selling stealth that doesn't work, they will next solution, which will likely be even more expensive no doubt.

    The difference between how stealthy an F-22 and an Su-57 is wont make any practical difference on the battlefield as each is likely to be able to defeat their enemies air to air missiles so it will come down to manouvering combat and guns and numbers... the west currently has numbers, but no IADS to support those numbers and make them useful.

    F-22s will likely be soon retired and the F-35 is a terrible aircraft that will damage HATO for some time to come economically.

    The US edge in stealth is largely meaningless because their air defence forces are not optimised to hunt and deal with stealth targets while Russian air defence is so effectively Russian air defence can detect more stealthy US aircraft and western air defence would struggle to deal with conventional cruise missile and drone and hypersonic weapon threats let alone stealth.

    The fact that the stealth is built in to the materials instead of needing to be painted on (and then left to cure for a day) means operational tempo rates can be much higher and operational costs will be rather more comparable to conventional aircraft.

    Cheaper to buy and cheaper to operate... and also stealthy... I believe if it was America they would be talking about game changing and new levels and other such bollocks.

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    Post  marcellogo 01/04/23, 06:28 am

    william.boutrous wrote:It is probably not how you calculate RCS.

    95% reduction means 1, log reduction. Also, I am sure the original planned coating served a similar purpose.
    Additional issues with the current Su-57 version
    Engines (will be upgraded in Su-57M)
    Engine intakes (will not change in Su 57M although not sure why they didn't improve this bit of the design)
    Protruding probes (will change in Su 57M but not the level of F22)
    Overall shaping (Will not Change in Su-57M)

    Su-57 will not reach the RCS level of F22 with only a new RAM coating.
    It doesn't need to either because Su-57 is a defensive weapon intended to fly over friendly airspace with the support of ground radars and contest an attack by a superior stealthy foe.

    Actually, an armed confrontation of a Su-57 with a F-22 is more than improbable, last update of the Raptor would be applied just on 120 planes of 187 serial ones produced.
    The rest would be used just for training.
    No one of F-22 is based abroad or anywhere near to the frontier of another state (except Cuba) and they are tasked with role than in the RUASF are performed by Mig-31 instead.
    So the adversary that the Felon would directly face instead would be the F-35A and also the actual production version is more than enough for deal with it.
    And also actually there are more J-20 than F-22 in service so leave it to them

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    thegopnik
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    Post  thegopnik 02/04/23, 03:21 am

    william.boutrus wrote:It is probably not how you calculate RCS.

    95% reduction means 1, log reduction. Also, I am sure the original planned coating served a similar purpose.
    Additional issues with the current Su-57 version
    Engines (will be upgraded in Su-57M)
    Engine intakes (will not change in Su 57M although not sure why they didn't improve this bit of the design)
    Protruding probes (will change in Su 57M but not the level of F22)
    Overall shaping (Will not Change in Su-57M)

    Su-57 will not reach the RCS level of F22 with only a new RAM coating.
    It doesn't need to either because Su-57 is a defensive weapon intended to fly over friendly airspace with the support of ground radars and contest an attack by a superior stealthy foe.

    I took the value of the patent RCS and the value of 5% with the assumption of what Rostec says that 95% of it would all be absorbed. (of course, I know that is a rough estimate since they used a coating for cockpit glass)

    Engine intakes: have a curved shape they are not like the F-18 for the 100th time. The engines also have a radar blocker in the intake to reduce RCS. Finally, it can apply the engine mesh screens to further reduce radar profile of the engine in case you need to, at cost of speed, and the second stage engine will have composite fan blades, and treatments to reduce RCS of the engine in the frontal aspect.

    The F-22 lacks an infrared system that if the frontal aspect values somehow are .001 or lower on the Su-57 or in your case values that still can't reach .0001m2 from the front only the performance of new infrared systems would track the F-22 before the F-22 radar would track the Su-57. They have had photonic radar prototypes with their modules tested and I heard a full scale production on PICs starts in 2024 which is the year the testing of the 2nd phase Su-57 would end. So rather or not protruding bulbs are a problem for its current infrared system with RAM to cause much of a significant RCS return value with creeping wave return it can be removed if it causes that much of hassle since photonic radars values will be getting close in the EM spectrum to infrared but that is currently not the case.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB 02/04/23, 02:28 pm

    All the tiny sub metre measures of stealth are for high frequency Ku and Ka band radar that can actually see the shape of the target, and therefore the shape of the target effects the return.

    Think of a person standing in a field in complete darkness. Shine a torch on them and you can see them. Paint them totally black and you can still see them but it is much harder to see them easily compared to if they are white or brightly coloured.

    Imagine they pick up a full length mirror and hold it up in front of themselves... your light is reflected directly back at you and you could see them from much much greater distances than if they didn't have a mirror. But now think about what happens if they turn that mirror 45 degrees so instead of reflecting the light from your torch back at you it reflects that light off in another direction... angled up so you can't see the light reflected along the ground either.

    But now change the frequency.... instead of using visible light use a thermal imager that does not use visible light at all and you will see a black spot where the mirror is in the field.

    L band radar are long enough that they can't see features and shapes, the entire aircraft reflects a signal... more like sonar than radar really... it gives you an indication of presence, how big the object is, how far away it is, and the shift in signal if it is moving and how fast.

    If your main radar does not detect anything then your L band wing mounted radar can scan and find a significantly sized object your other radar could not easily detect.

    NEBO is a ground based anti stealth system that connects long and short wave radar and computers to process their information to maximise the effectiveness of both radar types and to minimise the problems with each type to get the best possible anti stealth performance and I would think the radar on the Su-35 and Su-57s would be treated the same in terms of optimisation to find and kill stealth targets... aircraft, missiles, and drones.

    The difference is that the aircraft have thermal and IRST sensors that can be included in the computations to further improve performance.

    And also that Su-57s and Su-35s wont operate alone so multiple aircraft could scan together while other aircraft can just listen for results and the results combined to get a better picture of what is operating in the airspace in front of them.

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko 21/04/23, 07:45 pm

    Rostec has developed a communication complex with AI for the Su-57 fighter, 04.21.2023.

    Rostec has developed a communication system with artificial intelligence for the Su-57 fighter.

    MOSCOW, April 21 - RIA Novosti. Rostec has developed an artificial intelligence communication system for 5th generation aircraft, the state corporation told reporters.

    "Ruselectronics holding of the Rostec State Corporation has developed a set of on-board digital communication tools using artificial intelligence technologies. The equipment is designed for fifth-generation aircraft. Its use will improve the quality of information transfer between aircraft and ground complexes," the corporation said.

    Currently, the Russian Aerospace Forces operate 5th generation Su-57 fighters. In particular, as RIA Novosti sources previously reported, they are used during the NWO.

    The complex, developed by the specialists of NPP Polet (part of Roselectronics ), operates in the high and very high frequency ranges. The use of cognitive radio technology makes it possible to significantly increase the interference and reconnaissance immunity of the on-board complex communications.

    The equipment ensures the reliability of information transmission due to noise-immune coding, interleaving of symbols in the message, common time synchronization in signal processing, the possibility of simultaneous transmission of messages over parallel channels, increasing the range of stable communication, as well as the use of artificial intelligence technologies.

    Alexei Komyakov, General Director of NPP Polet, noted that many functional tasks that increase the efficiency of aviation operations are solved with the help of on-board digital communication systems. At present, these complexes are widely used for the exchange of messages between aircraft avionics and ground services.

    "Our new complex is an initiative development and is planned to be introduced as part of the S-111 communications complex," he said.

    The complex includes computing devices, interleavers and deinterleavers, RF antenna matching devices, digital signal processing units, error-correcting coding and decoding devices, as well as a global navigation satellite system signal receiver with an antenna and a digital signal processing and synchronization bus. The patent for the invention was presented at the Moscow International Salon of Inventions and Innovative Technologies "Archimedes-2023" and received a gold medal.

    https://ria.ru/20230421/kompleks-1866808807.html

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    Post  Krepost 18/05/23, 03:45 pm

    I will leave this here:

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    Post  Podlodka77 01/06/23, 08:10 pm

    Five More Potential Clients for Russia’s Su-57 Next Generation Fighter: From Kazakhstan to Ethiopia

    Military Watch Magazine Editorial Staff
    May-30th-2021

    A previously published article looked at the five leading potential clients for Russia’s Su-57 next generation heavyweight fighter - concluding that India, Algeria, China, Vietnam and Turkey were the most likely countries to purchase the aircraft. As the Su-57 has further matured a growing number of countries have shown interest in acquiring it for their own fleets, with Algeria reported by a number of sources to have already ordered its first squadron’s worth to replace its Cold War era MiG-25 Foxbat interceptors. More countries are expected to follow as the fighter integrates a new generation of engines and enters service in larger numbers in the Russian Air Force itself. A look at the five ‘runners up’ - the next five leading potential clients for the Su-57 or its future derivatives following the five previously discussed - is given below. The assessment is made on the basis of their current assets, budgets, foreign relations, and how well the Su-57 could fit into their existing force structures.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 21 Articl34
    Kazakh Air Force Su-27 (back) and MiG-27 Fighters

    Kazakhstan


    Kazakhstan has been the leading client for new Russian armaments in the Collective Security Organisation of post Soviet states, most notably ordering one of Russia’s most capable new fighter classes the Su-30SM to replace older Soviet era models in its fleet. The country is permitted to purchase Russian fighters as the same prices offered to the Russian Defence Ministry itself - which makes new acquisitions considerably cheaper than they would be for other clients. Kazakhstan deploys two classes of high end heavyweight combat jets inherited from the Soviet Union alongside the Su-30SM, including the Su-27 and MiG-31 Foxhound. At least one of these two, and possibly both, are likely to eventually be replaced by the Su-57 or a future derivative of the same airframe design. While Kazakhstan has no immediate concerns for the safety of its airspace, the lifespan of the Su-27 airframes is expected to be reached within a decade or so at current rates of use - with the Su-57 and Su-30SM2 being the leading choices for a replacement.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 21 Articl35
    Ethiopian Air Force Su-27 Heavy Fighter

    Ethiopia

    Ethiopia was one of the first foreign operators of the Su-27, and acquired an estimated 18 airframes in the late 1990s with the first deliveries made during its war with Eritrea. Tensions with Egypt and Sudan have meant that Ethiopia’s aerial warfare capability continues to be highly relevant, and with the Su-27 expected to be phased out of service by the mid 2030s at the latest the Su-57 remains a clear choice for a replacement. The next generation Russian fighter would ensure a qualitative edge over potential adversary fighters such as the Egyptian Su-35 and Sudanese MiG-29SE, and allow Ethiopia to strike targets deep into the territories of both countries due to the Su-57’s considerable endurance. Ethiopia’s continuous and rapid economic growth is expected to be sustained, and will make such an acquisition increasingly feasible over the coming decade despite the country allocating only a relatively modest portion of its state budget to new arms acquisitions.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 21 Articl36
    Egyptian Air Force Su-35 Heavy Fighter

    Egypt

    Following the overthrow of its Western aligned Islamist government in 2013, Egypt emerged as a leading client for Russian arms ranging from T-90 battle tanks to Ka-52 carrier based attack helicopters. The North African country has invested particularly heavily in Russian aerial warfare systems, including MiG-29M and Su-35 fighter jets and a range of air defence systems including the S-300V4. While it has been speculated that the country could place followup orders for further Su-35s, and for lighter MiG-35 jets, it is also possible that as the Su-57 design matures it will look to acquire the newer aircraft instead of the Su-35. This would provide a more decisive advantage over rival aircraft such as the F-15EX which Israel is expected to order, and could be a more cost effective investment than acquiring the older jets. Current trends in Egyptian arms acquisitions and the reorientation of the Egyptian Air Force towards a high end capability to engage near peer adversaries makes a purchase of Su-57 fighters, or one of the airframe's future derivatives, highly plausible. Egypt has been known to purchase fighter aircraft in small quantities in the past despite the logistical burden caused by an overly diverse fleet, meaning that it may not be deterred from abandoning the Su-35 after purchasing just a single squadron to move on to the Su-57.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 21 Articl37
    Russian Air Force Su-30 and Su-57 Heavyweight Fighters

    Myanmar

    Amid fast growing defence ties between Russia and Myanmar, the Southeast Asian state’s ambassador to Russia Ko Ko Shein highlighted in 2019 that his country could be interested in acquiring Su-57 fighters. Older variants of the Russian MiG-29 medium weight fourth generation fighter currently form the bulk of the Myanmar Air Force's fleet, but the service’s modernisation program has seen unprecedented investments made in acquiring heavyweight fighters with an order for six Su-30SM Flankers placed 2018 and six to twelve more reportedly planned. With the Su-57 only available in single engine configuration, the twin seat Su-30SM could prove an effective complement for later acquisitions of the jets and help to familiarise Myanmar’s Air Force with operating high end post-Cold War fighter designs. Myanmar has also ordered a dozen Yak-130 twin seat trainer jets, which were developed specifically to train pilots to operate high end Russian fighters and would play an important role in facilitating integration of Su-57s into the country’s fleet. With Myanmar facing poor relations with the Western world, and frequent periods of tension with neighbouring Bangladesh, it could well emerge as a client for a squadron’s worth of Su-57s over the coming decade - which may be a more cost effective investment than acquiring smaller numbers of lower end aircraft.  

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 21 Articl38
    Malaysian Air Force Su-30MKM Fighter

    Malaysia


    The Malaysian Air Force currently operates two classes of Russian fighter, including the medium weight MiG-29 and the heavier and more modern Su-30MKM. With neighbouring Singapore moving to acquire more advanced F-35 stealth jets in significant numbers from the United States, Malaysia is expected to modernise its own fleet with superior classes of Russian fighters. In December 2019 Malaysia’s Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad elaborated on the country’s plans to modernise its air force, stating that the country was actively considering replacing older fourth generation MiG-29 and ‘4+ generation’ Su-30MKM fighters with next generation aircraft. He indicated that the Su-57 was a contender, with the possibility raised that Russia could purchase older aircraft back from Malaysia to help cover the costs of purchasing newer aircraft. A single Su-57 squadron to replace the Su-30s, and possibly more depending on how seriously the country perceives threats to its security, would be a major game changer for the regional balance of power in the air. The fighters have many very significant performance advantages over the F-35 which could compensate for their likely numerical disadvantages, although questions regarding Malaysia’s ability to match Singapore’s quality of pilot training or its network of support aircraft remain.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 21 Articl39
    Iranian Air Force F-14 Fighter

    Honorable Mention - Iran


    The Iranian Air Force is another possible client for the Su-57, although unlike the aforementioned countries Iran has not acquired any post-Soviet Russian fighters, nor does it deploy any Soviet era Russian heavyweight fighters that the Su-57 could comfortably replace. The country has focused investment in aerial warfare systems on fielding a wide range of drones, including advanced stealth models which have proven themselves in combat, as well as on mobile ground based air defences such as the Khordad 15. For its fighter fleet, modernisation efforts have been restricted manufacturing indigenous lightweight Kowsar fighter jets in small numbers, and to refurbishing and upgrading its fleet of 1960s and early 1970s era American fighters - namely third generation F-5E and F-4D/E jets and heavyweight fourth generation F-14s. Iranian officials previously expressed an interest in acquiring the Su-30SM from Russia in the mid-2010s, although UN sanctions and a poor economy has meant that no purchases have been made. While Iran today appears more inclined to look to China for fighter purchases - namely for lightweight ‘4++ generation’ J-10C jets, as its F-14 fleet approaches 50 years of age it may well look to acquire a new class of heavyweight fighter to replace it. With Iran’s economy potentially seeing some improvement in the coming years as U.S. sanctions are potentially lifted, and with the Su-57 expected to be produced in larger numbers and more cheaply by the second half of the decade, an Iranian purchase to replace its F-14s cannot be ruled out.

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    Post  lancelot 02/06/23, 02:03 am

    Myanmar does not have the budget for it. Egypt and Malaysia seem to be caving in to US CAATSA sanctions so they will not be buying any Su-57s soon I think.

    Algeria, and Vietnam are the most likely clients I think. India, and Iran are also likely possible clients. But you can bet Israel will lobby the Russian government against Iranian weapons purchases. It is possible more Muslim countries will buy the Su-57. It depends on how soon it reaches the market and what competition is available by that point.

    But for that to happen Su-57 production rate needs to increase. Modernized Su-57M also needs to enter production.

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    Post  lyle6 02/06/23, 07:21 am

    Before someone buys the Su-57 they better secure a nice Russian style IADS net first. Stealth jets are useless when airbases can just be easily targeted with missiles.

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    Post  ALAMO 02/06/23, 07:28 am

    Oh no!
    Murican Wunderwaffe is immune!
    All should buy that!
    Marvel can't lie!

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    Post  lyle6 02/06/23, 07:35 am

    NATO IADS leaks like a sieve. It makes no difference lmao.

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    Post  GarryB 02/06/23, 04:12 pm

    The thing I see as an issue would actually be the Checkmate programme, which might make sales of large numbers of Su-57s a bit redundant.

    A cheap simple light 5th gen fighter bought in large numbers would offer rather better coverage and protection than a dozen or two dozen large heavy fighters could.

    Commonality with the Su-57 might make a purchase of both very attractive so perhaps instead of buying 36 or 48 Su-57s, they might end up buying perhaps 18 Su-57s and say 96 Su-75s to improve coverage... it really comes down to purchase price and operational costs, but then countries with good relations with Russia are going to increase in number and as they do the threat from the west or most particularly the US will increase dramatically I suspect... at least for a period until grownups start getting elected...

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    Post  Swgman_BK 03/06/23, 06:17 am

    We can count India out of the Su57 program and any further arms purchases from Russia. Recently India changed their mind on the Su30SM2/ Super Sukhoi upgrade program they expressed interest in. India is like China. They are only gonna buy from you to find out how it's made and then do it locally and never buy from you again. eg, S400, T-90, AK series of rifles, AL31Fs, Su30MKI. Besides, India is also in bed with the Western side. Its better for Russia to not include India in any arms deals when she is planning out new packages. India is the most unreliable partner to date. She will place an order for stuff and then cancel at the last minute. And she will be cancelling stuff a lot since the US is wooing India with F/A18s and other US arms purchases.

    If I were Russia, Algeria, Vietnam and Venezuela would be my main priority. They have never actually cancelled an order because the US threatened them. They also look in Russia 1st every time when they need something and buy it there when they find it. Those are the only reliable partners who could end up buying Su57s.

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    Post  sepheronx 03/06/23, 06:54 am

    Yeah, India is extremely unreliable.

    Russias customer base is depleting fast. So Russia has very few countries they will be able to sell to, and they aren't rich nations either. India is a conniving shithole that will go with western tech even if they get fucked over. China steals tech so they will buy a token force to reverse engineer. Turkey is still part of NATO.

    Vietnam and Algeria indeed are two nations Russia should invest heavily into and get a return on purchases of Russian weapons. Same with Cuba amd Venezuela. Both those nations can't afford high end weaponry but after some investments, guaranteed they will be able to afford some.

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    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 03/06/23, 07:17 am

    Garry is right but I have to add something..
    Two regiments with 24 Su-57 aircraft in each regiment is not a small number. But maybe Algeria, Egypt and some other countries that were not buyers of Russian weapons can afford it, but smaller countries cannot.
    In Russia's place, I would have imposed a restriction on the export of Su-57 aircraft on the same principle as the Americans did with the F-15.
    This means that I would only sell that aircraft to reliable clients who would buy at least three to four squadrons of those aircraft - at least that many.
    This is just my opinion and therefore not authoritative, of course.

    The Russian Air Force will also benefit from the Su-75, of course, but the Russian military industrial complex will benefit far more.


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    Post  Scorpius 03/06/23, 08:13 am

    sepheronx wrote:Yeah, India is extremely unreliable.

    Russias customer base is depleting fast. So Russia has very few countries they will be able to sell to, and they aren't rich nations either. India is a conniving shithole that will go with western tech even if they get fucked over. China steals tech so they will buy a token force to reverse engineer. Turkey is still part of NATO.

    Vietnam and Algeria indeed are two nations Russia should invest heavily into and get a return on purchases of Russian weapons. Same with Cuba amd Venezuela. Both those nations can't afford high end weaponry but after some investments, guaranteed they will be able to afford some.

    You're missing out on some opportunities. Let's say you sold some advanced weapons to China or India, and they want to copy them. In order to copy modern high-tech weapons, you must not only know the detailed process of technological production, up to the effort of tightening fasteners (India actually destroyed dozens of its Su-30MKI due to the fact that Indian workers at the assembly plant tightened fasteners on power structures too much, which led to accelerated wear and tear cracking). You must have the entire technological chain - from the production of structural materials to the assembly and testing of large components and final products.
    Well, if you want it, Russia has specialists who will help you create these technological chains. Russia will invest the proceeds from these transactions in further research and development of new weapons.

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    Post  thegopnik 03/06/23, 09:38 am

    To be honest they shouldn't sell the Su-57 but the LTS instead.
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    Post  AMCXXL 06/06/23, 07:43 pm

    GarryB wrote:The thing I see as an issue would actually be the Checkmate programme, which might make sales of large numbers of Su-57s a bit redundant.

    A cheap simple light 5th gen fighter bought in large numbers would offer rather better coverage and protection than a dozen or two dozen large heavy fighters could.

    Commonality with the Su-57 might make a purchase of both very attractive so perhaps instead of buying 36 or 48 Su-57s, they might end up buying perhaps 18 Su-57s and say 96 Su-75s to improve coverage... it really comes down to purchase price and operational costs, but then countries with good relations with Russia are going to increase in number and as they do the threat from the west or most particularly the US will increase dramatically I suspect... at least for a period until grownups start getting elected...

    I don't think Russia will sell the Su-57, at least in the medium-long term, since it must equip at least 10 regiments (one regiment for each combined arms army).
    If there are two squadrons per regiment, we are talking about 240 single-seater Su-57s plus two-seaters if they are manufactured, therefore it is impossible for it to sell anything unless it is a major ally like China, as happened with the Su-35

    I see the export of the Su-75 much more feasible than Russia would probably only need for the Navy, unless an assault version is made to replace the Su-25
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    Post  GarryB 06/06/23, 08:43 pm

    India said it wasn't interested in joint development of a new stealth fighter based on the Su-57 like they did with the Su-30MK.

    I would assume that would mean they would just buy export Su-57s when they become available... the equivalent of just buying Su-35s instead of going to the cost and effort of developing the Su-30MKI.

    The Checkmate is for export only at the moment so I suspect it will get a rather hard sell, and its costs in terms of buying them and operating them could lead to a lot of countries not bothering with any other platform, but a few countries might want to take advantage of the related design between the Su-57 and Su-75 and buy a few super fighters and use the Checkmate as a numbers fighter to fill out the gaps and give density to their air power.

    The new MiGs will be interesting but it might be quite a while before we hear anything about them because they will let the Checkmate have its chance to sell to foreign customers first... the way they did in the late 1980s and early 1990s with the Mi-28A and the Ka-50.

    I really think the chances of getting a 5th gen light fighter to do the role of an A-10 or Su-25 is just pushing things way too far... they already tried with the A-16, and the air to ground MiG-29... but they were not the same as a real dedicated CAS aircraft.

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