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    Will the Muslims that live in Russia cause problems for Russia?

    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:44 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:
    flamming_python wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I noticed it too in comments section but there seems to be a considerable amount of wierd wording.

    They say country but not in the sense of country as separate but also mention that they are southern Russia.

    Wording is fucked but it is similar to how they say "this or that country" within Canada or USA.  


    This is pretty much it. Actual seperatists in Dagestan are rare but they are proud of their own republic and traditions. In practice Dagestan like Chechnya pretty much is ruled by its own people not those sent from Moscow and everyone is fine with this arrangement. When Moscow does send someone there (like now with Vasilyev) it's because they failed to get their own shit together themselves.

    Daegestan and Ingushetia are the two regions where they had one of the highest in wanting to stay part of Russia back in the early 90's.  In current times, they are also some of the most patriotic to Russia next to Chechnya where they all vote heavy for a heavy handed government in Moscow.

    They seem to at least love their home country Russia.  And yes, they love their region of Russia and well, that is good for them.

    All those votes are faked by controlling clans and leaders for the benefit of Moscow so we have no way of knowing

    What we can guess though is that Chechnya is still the most separatist region; albeit the percentage has gone way down and probably most people don't care anymore. Ingushetia is still somewhat seperatist (and it was in the 90s too back when it was ruled by the closet independist Ruslan Aushev who gave cover to Chechen rebels operating on Ingush territory), and Dagestan is pretty loyalist albeit also with a good enough amount of Islamist scumbags (whose main worry is not independence from Russia but rather uniting with other Russian and ex-Soviet Muslims).
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:51 pm

    I doubt it. It was pushed by Western groups who had a wish for separatism.

    Chechnya proved that they initially had that desire.

    These days, they are usually quiet. But I imagine it's the money they get and yes, the dominant clans who control the area.
    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Fri Nov 13, 2020 6:55 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:I doubt it. It was pushed by Western groups who had a wish for separatism.

    Chechnya proved that they initially had that desire.

    These days, they are usually quiet. But I imagine it's the money they get and yes, the dominant clans who control the area.

    Point is if Erdogan ever makes his way to the North Caucasus there'll be enough of a welcoming party of his fans from the part of Ingushetia and more so Chechnya. Not saying all, or most - but enough; and when they turn everything into a Russians vs Chechens shitshow and both sides start taking to arms the rest of them will be inclined to take sides with their relatives if for no other reason.
    A few Erdo fans will be in Dagestan as well but they'll be far outnumbered and never reach critical mass.

    Same as when the Saudi Wahhabists came to visit

    Same as when the Nazis came to visit

    Each time actually Dagestan saves Russia's ass in the region and doesn't let the rot spread further.

    It's always the same and don't be surprised when these fake votes turn out not to show the complete picture. Kadyrov is genuine in his loyalty to Moscow, but he has plenty of enemies in his own republic.
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:16 pm

    That isn't really how things work. This isn't the 18th century where you have to be at the border to fuck someone over.

    Turkey already plays these games. Hence why Russia has a national guard.
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    Post  flamming_python Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:21 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:That isn't really how things work. This isn't the 18th century where you have to be at the border to fuck someone over.

    Turkey already plays these games. Hence why Russia has a national guard.

    It's exactly how things work

    How did the Saudis, Turks, Western intelligence services all start making allies and encouraging Chechen rebels in the 90s?

    Through Georgia and a fuck ton of money, corrupt Russian officials and officers, and a collapsing political system in general

    You don't have to be at someone's border but it certainly helps, and a land-based supply route is the most reliable. Georgia's still unfriendly and encourages seperatism in the North Caucasus through its intelligence services at every opportunity. The Turks are in Azerbaijan now and only have to wait until the next real political crisis or collapse in Russia.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Sat Nov 14, 2020 1:29 am

    Well, they will be waiting for a lot longer than you or I will be alive.

    Neither of them have close to the same stability as Russia.
    Scorpius
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    Post  Scorpius Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:27 am

    flamming_python wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:That isn't really how things work. This isn't the 18th century where you have to be at the border to fuck someone over.

    Turkey already plays these games. Hence why Russia has a national guard.

    It's exactly how things work

    How did the Saudis, Turks, Western intelligence services all start making allies and encouraging Chechen rebels in the 90s?

    Through Georgia and a fuck ton of money, corrupt Russian officials and officers, and a collapsing political system in general

    You don't have to be at someone's border but it certainly helps, and a land-based supply route is the most reliable. Georgia's still unfriendly and encourages seperatism in the North Caucasus through its intelligence services at every opportunity. The Turks are in Azerbaijan now and only have to wait until the next real political crisis or collapse in Russia.

    About my attitude to Armenia:
    Will the Muslims that live in Russia cause problems for Russia? - Page 6 KsyRZShiXHI

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sun Nov 15, 2020 2:19 am

    But the problem is that this is how colour revolutions work... pay a few idiots and malcontents to demonstrate in the streets to stir things up and radicalise and polarise positions on both sides... there are always hardliners on both sides who will see this and think... fuck you guys... even though it is a paid minority trying to stir up trouble.

    When the other side then reacts then they get defensive and pretty soon there is division that Soros and the US and the west can take advantage of... the obvious problem is that 5 or ten years down the track and they start telling you to do things you don't want to do like take refugees from Syria or Afghanistan, or pass laws regarding all sorts of sexual perversion hidden in legislation about human rights and other such BS.

    There are probably quite a few people in the Baltic states who think Russians were bad but then never made us take refugees or demanded we make this or that rule regarding gay parades down our main street with brightly coloured weirdos prancing about the place...

    But that is their problem now isn't it?

    Not saying Russia could have stopped things in Ukraine... really it is a problem for the Ukraine... they should have anticipated it and taken steps to stop it because it is not even their first attempt in the Ukraine.

    The irony is that something similar has really happened in New Zealand... the older people look to the UK and Europe, but the young people think the US is where it is at... the irony is that we get new more fascist laws based on American laws really... but the two main exceptions that they refuse to consider copying from the US and those are the self defence laws and the gun ownership laws...

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    PhSt
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    Post  PhSt Tue May 04, 2021 8:34 pm

    So what do these "Muslim leaders" want to happen to these women who were only doing some workout? Just because there is a mosque on the horizon doesn't mean the area where they are filming is still part of the mosque. I hope Russian authorities don't fall for this Whining/Drama that Muslimes seem to always do when they want to Impose Islamic rule over territories and its people. Russian government needs to remind the Muslimes whinners that such an overreaction is a form of Islamic Extremism and that they would be shipped to Institutions in Xinjiang if they continue such behavior.


    Russian women offend Muslim leaders by cheerily squatting in body-hugging workout outfits – using a mosque as the backdrop (VIDEO)

    A group of fitness-loving Russian women have been filmed squatting in front of a mosque during the holy month of Ramadan, causing Muslim leaders to reportedly label the posterior-pronouncing clip "provocative" and "unacceptable".

    The athletic group of girls were filmed from behind performing squats before simpering for the camera in front of the Kul-Sharif mosque ahead of the Kazan Marathon, providing a racey warm-up which they are said to have insisted was not intended to be disrespectful ahead of the epic race.

    Their protestations of innocence are said to have done little to appease unimpressed religious chiefs, with the Deputy mufti of Tatarstan, Rafik Mukhametshin, reportedly calling the stunt a provocation.

    "They can refer to the secular state – 'whatever we want, we do it'," Mukhametshin is quoted as saying by Lenta. "But for the religious Muslim community, such forms are unacceptable."

    https://twitter.com/i/status/1389161098583191552

    The event in the majority Muslim state of Tatarstan prides itself on passing a number of historic landmarks including the sacred site, which was first built during the 16th century and is one of the largest of its kind in Europe.

    The video was said to have been uploaded to Russian social media site VK on the day of the race. "We did not pursue any malicious intent and never wanted to offend anyone,” its author is claimed to have said, adding that the backdrop for the show-offs was a coincidence.

    "We were warming up on the stage, which stood against the background of the mosque."

    Local news website PDM News quoted Mukhametshin as elaborating: "It is unacceptable. Another background could be found.

    "I think these are provocative actions on their part. We do not support such behaviour.”

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    lyle6
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    Post  lyle6 Tue May 04, 2021 10:04 pm

    PhSt wrote:So what do these "Muslim leaders" want to happen to these women who were only doing some workout? Just because there is a mosque on the horizon doesn't mean the area where they are filming is still part of the mosque. I hope Russian authorities don't fall for this Whining/Drama that Muslimes seem to always do when they want to Impose Islamic rule over territories and its people. Russian government needs to remind the Muslimes whinners that such an overreaction is a form of Islamic Extremism and that they would be shipped to Institutions in Xinjiang if they continue such behavior.

    They can go ahead and eat pig shit. They want their Sharia bullshit, go ahead, pick up that AK. Until then they better learn to grin and bear it.

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Wed May 05, 2021 5:21 am

    They were fully clothed, the real problem is that these women were out on their own doing their own thing and the high up muslims don't like that... they want them at home cooking and cleaning and looking after their children.

    Perhaps the women should say that the photos were taken in front of spectacular buildings that represent a religion that needs to drag itself out of the dark ages, and that if there is any head chopping plans that in a game of paper rock scissors that a twelve gauge shotgun beats some fools with a knife...

    No wonder becoming a muslim is attractive to so many men, they can act like backward arse holes and hide behind their religion to defend their right to be a censored

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    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Wed May 05, 2021 5:44 am

    I dunno if people already mentioned this but there are already Muslim cultures inside portions of Russia, Turks included and that haven't tried to do anything, the only case of this was Chechyena way back when.

    So the answer at this time is no, in the future? I mean that's hard to say. No one knows what the future holds.

    When it comes to Russia you need to remember Russia just isn't Russians its a nation made up of many cultures and creeds, that have their own constitutions and more.

    Finty
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    Post  Finty Sun May 09, 2021 11:54 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:I dunno if people already mentioned this but there are already Muslim cultures inside portions of Russia, Turks included and that haven't tried to do anything, the only case of this was Chechyena way back when.

    So the answer at this time is no, in the future? I mean that's hard to say. No one knows what the future holds.


    Indeed, things like a change of leader or economic problems could trigger such tensions.
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    Post  elconquistador Mon May 10, 2021 12:09 am

    More like US sponsored and US backed outside interference like 1980s Central Asia and 1990s Chechnya

    Also agree with the muzzies for once. This sort it degenerate whoring-yourself-for-likes-and-male-validation doesn't belong in or near holy places.
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    Post  Finty Mon May 10, 2021 12:13 am

    elconquistador wrote:

    Also agree with the muzzies for once. This sort it degenerate whoring-yourself-for-likes-and-male-validation doesn't belong in or near holy places.

    Slippery slope, I don't want to agree with that goat-f*cking lot but there will be other things e.g. when you see things like 11 year olds in the west saying they are queer and doing drag then I'd have probably have similar views on it.

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    Finty
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    Post  Finty Mon May 10, 2021 12:14 am

    lyle6 wrote:
    PhSt wrote:So what do these "Muslim leaders" want to happen to these women who were only doing some workout? Just because there is a mosque on the horizon doesn't mean the area where they are filming is still part of the mosque. I hope Russian authorities don't fall for this Whining/Drama that Muslimes seem to always do when they want to Impose Islamic rule over territories and its people. Russian government needs to remind the Muslimes whinners that such an overreaction is a form of Islamic Extremism and that they would be shipped to Institutions in Xinjiang if they continue such behavior.

    They can go ahead and eat pig shit. They want their Sharia bullshit, go ahead, pick up that AK. Until then they better learn to grin and bear it.

    Either that or **** off to somewhere like Saudi Arabia.
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    Post  flamming_python Mon May 10, 2021 1:29 am

    Finty wrote:
    elconquistador wrote:

    Also agree with the muzzies for once. This sort it degenerate whoring-yourself-for-likes-and-male-validation doesn't belong in or near holy places.

    Slippery slope, I don't want to agree with that goat-f*cking lot but there will be other things e.g. when you see things like 11 year olds in the west saying they are queer and doing drag then I'd have probably have similar views on it.

    They're not really that radical in Russia, most of our Muslims are moderate and tend to have pretty modern views on women and so on.

    I'd tend to say that if spiritual Muslim leaders have an issue with women doing workouts in spandex with a mosque as a backdrop, then OK fair enough, many Orthodox Christian clergy would also have an objection to make if it's being done in front of a church.

    You can see by the response the Muslim commission gave that there's nothing extreme in it, they'd just prefer the girls to chose another place.

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    Finty
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    Post  Finty Mon May 10, 2021 1:40 am

    flamming_python wrote:
    Finty wrote:
    elconquistador wrote:

    Also agree with the muzzies for once. This sort it degenerate whoring-yourself-for-likes-and-male-validation doesn't belong in or near holy places.

    Slippery slope, I don't want to agree with that goat-f*cking lot but there will be other things e.g. when you see things like 11 year olds in the west saying they are queer and doing drag then I'd have probably have similar views on it.

    They're not really that radical in Russia, most of our Muslims are moderate and tend to have pretty modern views on women and so on.

    I'd tend to say that if spiritual Muslim leaders have an issue with women doing workouts in spandex with a mosque as a backdrop, then OK fair enough, many Orthodox Christian clergy would also have an objection to make if it's being done in front of a church.

    You can see by the response the Muslim commission gave that there's nothing extreme in it, they'd just prefer the girls to chose another place.

    I guess if they don't kick off by beheading teachers like they did in France then fair enough. They should know their limits though and try to keep their beliefs to themselves as much as possible.

    Most of them are alright in the UK too, there's been some guff about sharia law being imposed in some areas but that has little impact on other people's lives.
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    Post  kvs Mon May 10, 2021 1:56 am

    Western Islam is infiltrated with Wahabbi heretical rot and very radicalized. This is because the west succors every non-systemic opposition
    element and regime change radical. Canada does this for Kalistani Sikhs (hence the 1985 Air India bombing), Tamil Tigers and Ukr Banderites
    since WWII. Sweden was even openly talking about hosting ISIS/Daesh militants on its soil recently and is likely doing it.

    Russia does not host jihadis and ethnic militants with the ambition to regime change and install pliant regimes around the world. The Muslims
    in Russia are traditional Sufi and not western tool Salafis.

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