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    Kalibr missile system

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    Mindstorm

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    Post  Mindstorm on Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:58 pm

    Isos wrote:
    kvs wrote:So the 4500 km range Kalibr-M has a 1 ton warhead.  That is impressive.

    Two hits from these missiles can sink a carrier and they can also be used against bunkers.   Mounting a nuclear warhead
    with a 1 ton of weight makes them ICBM-like in their damage potential.   Most nuclear warheads are lighter than 1 ton.


    Where did you see that ? Kalibr M can't be much bugger than Kalibr because they will need to be launched from UKSK. I doubt they can carry 2 times bigger warheads.



    It will be exactly so.

    The increase in potential of the missile is a key feature because latest models for very long range sub-strategic attacks against the most important and hardened OTAN's shown that, in this way, majority of enemy targets could be attacked by single missile instead of two (therefore with an enormous increase of the degradating capabilities of similar attacks on OTAN's military potential with the same number of laucnhing platforms taken in consideration); there will be also a new submunition warhead , for area targets, that will sharply decrease the number of cruise missiles necessary to reliably destroy large groups of aircraft, helicopters and UAVs in theirs displacement area.

    The warhead's potential requirements for Калибр-М follow the same models that have generated the requirements for internal weapon bay's volume of ПАК ФА and the new line of air to ground ammunitions the result of which showen that this would :

    1) Allow to destroy attacked targets also in satellite guidance degradated of absent environment.
    2) Allow the destruction of heavily hardened key targets.
    3) Reduce the0 number of delivering platforms necessary to execute the mission.
    4) From point 2 descend a sharply reduced time of preparation ,cost and logistical needs for prepare and execute the missions.
    5) Greater chance to obtain strategic surprise on the enemy.

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    Post  Isos on Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:05 pm

    i asked for the size of the missile, not its capabilities.

    1t of warehead means 2 times the space used for the 450kg of kalibr. 4500km range also means more fuel than kalibr.

    Neither the fuel nor the warhead can be compacted to fit the same size as on kakibr.

    At the end if the missile is 1.5 bigger/longer than the kalibr theb it won't fit inside UKSK so none of the actual ships could carry it and your analyze of kalibr-M capacities becomes wrong.
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    Post  kvs on Mon Oct 26, 2020 8:23 pm

    Arrow wrote:It's very strange that there is no official news about the Calibr M tests. So it's a fake

    Ah shaddup, you hater twat.

    It was tested during "Caucuses 2020" exercises from the Kolpino submarine in the Black Sea.

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    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Oct 26, 2020 8:28 pm

    Arrow is a trolling retard and our mods keep him even though he is blatantly trolling.
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    Post  Arrow on Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:35 pm

    I pasted this video myself, but LMFS rightly noticed that there is no other information about the Kalibr M tests.

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    Post  lyle6 on Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:58 am

    Isos wrote:i asked for the size of the missile, not its capabilities.

    1t of warehead means 2 times the space used for the 450kg of kalibr. 4500km range also means more fuel than kalibr.

    Neither the fuel nor the warhead can be compacted to fit the same size as on kakibr.

    At the end if the missile is 1.5 bigger/longer than the kalibr theb it won't fit inside UKSK so none of the actual ships could carry it and your analyze of kalibr-M capacities becomes wrong.

    Well maybe it is 1.5 times longer.

    Take a look at this:
    Kalibr missile system - Page 8 3S-14_launcher_maquette

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    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:12 am

    Where did you see that ? Kalibr M can't be much bugger than Kalibr because they will need to be launched from UKSK. I doubt they can carry 2 times bigger warheads.

    As I explained in my post above the 2,500km range Kalibr subsonic long range land attack cruise missile is designed to be launched from torpedo tubes so it is a 533mm calibre weapon that is about 6.2 metres long and weigh about 1.4 tons with a 450kg warhead.

    The Kalibr-M is intended to be carried in the UKSK launch tubes which can carry 750mm calibre missiles like Onyx and Zircon that are 10m long and 2-3 tons in weight, so they could certainly double the warhead and greatly increase the fuel capacity by increasing its diameter and its length and more than doubling its weight...

    And we don't know what the UKSK-M launch tubes are light... they might be larger calibre to carry S-500 sized missiles which further allows size and weight increases for upgraded weapons that will be used in such launchers...

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    Post  Mindstorm on Tue Oct 27, 2020 11:38 am

    Isos wrote:i asked for the size of the missile, not its capabilities.

    1t of warehead means 2 times the space used for the 450kg of kalibr. 4500km range also means more fuel than kalibr.

    Neither the fuel nor the warhead can be compacted to fit the same size as on kakibr.

    At the end if the missile is 1.5 bigger/longer than the kalibr theb it won't fit inside UKSK so none of the actual ships could carry it and your analyze of kalibr-M capacities becomes wrong.


    Actually surface and submarine units capable to employ from vertical lauchers both rocket "Оникс" and "Калибр" sacrifice a significant fraction of the potential volume of the launcher when firing "Калибр" ,the choice followed the reasoning of standardization of the "Калибр" with 533 mm torpedo tubes (a пр. 885/885M can potentially employ all its 30 torpedo space for 30 Калибр -an option unavailable to US Navy submarines, from theirs torpedo tubes, for the latest Block IV TLAM).

    All units capable to employ "Оникс" will be capable to employ Калибр-M ,but obviously for vertical launchers adapted to fire different numbers of missiles when employing "Оникс" and "Калибр" (3"Оникс"/4 "Калибр" or 4 "Оникс"/5 "Калибр") the number will be that of "Оникс".

    Torpedo launchers with standard 533 mm tubes instead will continue to employ "Калибр" (2600 km and not the over 4500 km Калибр-M) for the new missile it would be necessary to employ 650 mm tubes.

    The new vertical launchers now in development instead, if completed, will leave a spare volume for employments of missiles of new generation with greatly improved characteristics and new propulsions.

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    Post  Isos on Tue Oct 27, 2020 11:43 am

    The post above says a kilo class launched a kalibr M but it has 533mm torpedo tubes only.

    Yasen has 650mm tube I think.
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    Post  kvs on Tue Oct 27, 2020 3:04 pm

    Isos wrote:The post above says a kilo class launched a kalibr M but it has 533mm torpedo tubes only.

    Yasen has 650mm tube I think.

    As if Russia is not able to modify any submarine in its arsenal.

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    Post  Mindstorm on Tue Oct 27, 2020 3:15 pm

    Isos wrote:The post above says a kilo class launched a kalibr M but it has 533mm torpedo tubes only.

    Yasen has 650mm tube I think.

    And in facts is not correct.
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    Post  Isos on Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:50 pm

    kvs wrote:

    As if Russia is not able to modify any submarine in its arsenal.  


    They can but did they acrually modified it ?

    The kalibr M used in that exercice can refer to an improved version thanks to lessons learned in Syria and not to the 4500km Kalibr M.

    They said the use of kalibr in Syria will lead to correct and improve it.

    And in facts is not correct.

    What are those facts ?

    If kalibr M needs 650mm torpedo tubes to be used then kilo can't use it.

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    Post  dino00 on Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:56 pm

    When Russia will test Kalibr-M, Russia media will talk about it, and there will be foreign reactions.
    Kalibr-M was not fired.

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    Post  kvs on Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:19 pm

    dino00 wrote:When Russia will test Kalibr-M, Russia media will talk about it, and there will be foreign reactions.
    Kalibr-M was not fired.

    Because you just know that the Russian media has said nothing about it, right.

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    Post  dino00 on Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:33 pm

    kvs wrote:
    dino00 wrote:When Russia will test Kalibr-M, Russia media will talk about it, and there will be foreign reactions.
    Kalibr-M was not fired.

    Because you just know that the Russian media has said nothing about it, right.


    I didn't saw anything. In the news aggregated nothing. I would love to be wrong. There's just a youtube video that looks like is ambiguous.  You understand Russian, do you have a source?

    Edit: The first launch would be from a submarine? Not a land launcher, not even a surface launcher, a submarine, less than 2 years from R&D to submarine launch, don't believe for a second.
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    Post  Mindstorm on Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:17 pm


    Isos wrote:If kalibr M needs 650mm torpedo tubes to be used then kilo can't use it.

    This is correct: Проект 636.3 will continue to employ Калибр.

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    Post  Isos on Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:47 pm

    Mindstorm wrote:
    Isos wrote:If kalibr M needs 650mm torpedo tubes to be used then kilo can't use it.

    This is correct: Проект 636.3 will continue to employ Калибр.


    But KVS said kalibr-M was tested by a kilo sub. So there is an issue somewhere. Either it wasn't a kalibr M or the kalibr M is just as compact as kalibr but with much better caracteristics.
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    Post  Mindstorm on Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:56 pm


    Isos wrote:Either it wasn't a kalibr M or the kalibr M is just as compact as kalibr but with much better caracteristics.


    It is not compact like standard Калибр.

    Launch from 533 torpedo tubes is not possible.
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Oct 28, 2020 8:37 pm

    lyle6 wrote:YJ-18, but its really 3M-54:
    Kalibr missile system - Page 8 ElMPebBXgAAZq_H?format=jpg&name=large
    Kalibr missile system - Page 8 ElMPl29WAAEzWfX?format=png&name=small

    Don't forget it's funny dance moves! Wink Twisted Evil

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    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 29, 2020 6:05 am

    But KVS said kalibr-M was tested by a kilo sub. So there is an issue somewhere. Either it wasn't a kalibr M or the kalibr M is just as compact as kalibr but with much better caracteristics.

    But what was the test... if it was a test sub it might have been fitted with test equipment like a UKSK launcher...

    Looking back through this thread it was Arrow that posted information on the B-271 Kolpino project 636.3 Kilo class sub, which he described as having a range of 1,500km against ships and based on the 3M14 which suggests it is clearly not the 4,500km range land attack enlarged missile we are talking about.... earlier in this thread it was clearly stated work on the latters design started last year and is not expected till 2025...

    As Dino posts just after Arrows post:

    Of course it wasn't tested it's too early.

    From 8 January 2019:
    "The creation of the rocket is at the stage of scientific research and financed by the Ministry of Defense"



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    Post  kvs on Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:00 am

    GarryB wrote:
    But KVS said kalibr-M was tested by a kilo sub. So there is an issue somewhere. Either it wasn't a kalibr M or the kalibr M is just as compact as kalibr but with much better caracteristics.

    But what was the test... if it was a test sub it might have been fitted with test equipment like a UKSK launcher...

    Looking back through this thread it was Arrow that posted information on the B-271 Kolpino project 636.3 Kilo class sub, which he described as having a range of 1,500km against ships and based on the 3M14 which suggests it is clearly not the 4,500km range land attack enlarged missile we are talking about.... earlier in this thread it was clearly stated work on the latters design started last year and is not expected till 2025...

    As Dino posts just after Arrows post:

    Of course it wasn't tested it's too early.

    From 8 January 2019:
    "The creation of the rocket is at the stage of scientific research and financed by the Ministry of Defense"




    The video I linked looks like it was using filler footage and I have not been able to track down more information.

    But work on this missile was not started last year. It was announced last year. These sorts of projects are forming long
    before any official statements. The pattern has been to announce some project when it is basically guaranteed. So
    all the knee jerk skepticism here is BS. As if Russia cannot into tech. The discussion around the Ukrainian ship gas turbine
    engine replacements sums it up well just how all the skepticism is not worth the time of day.

    It is America that always hypes tech that is not ready for prime time. All the yapping about hypersonic this and that and
    not a single missile system deployed. The culture in Russia is different. Instead of accusing others of stealing tech they
    do not have, Russians get the job done.

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    Post  Hole on Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:58 pm

    Kalibr missile system - Page 8 Calibe10
    Inclined launcher for Kaliber and Co.

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    Post  Isos on Thu Nov 05, 2020 9:30 pm

    Will be ready for christmas as a gift for Slavas lol1 .

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    Post  LMFS on Thu Nov 05, 2020 9:38 pm

    Analysed by Shishkin here:

    https://navy-korabel.livejournal.com/250207.html
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Fri Nov 06, 2020 2:44 am

    Hole wrote:Kalibr missile system - Page 8 Calibe10
    Inclined launcher for Kaliber and Co.

    It would be cool if their were several types of these angled launchers. Like a modular type to accommodate for different missiles. Maybe instead of 4 containers, it could be 16 containers, or 1 single massive launch container for very large strategic capable missiles. Because it doesn't penetrate the deck it could allow for this.

    Sponsored content

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