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    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    franco
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    Post  franco Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:12 am

    The Ministry of Defense has agreed on the cost of the upgraded Ka-52M helicopters. The new attack helicopters will cost over 1 billion rubles each.


    The Russian military department will pay 1 billion 75 million rubles for each copy of the modernized Ka-52M helicopter. At the same time, it is specified that this is the cost of the helicopter itself, it does not include ammunition, ground equipment, spare parts and other accessories.

    According to Izvestia , in fact, the cost of the new modernized Ka-52M is very close to the price for one Su-30SM multipurpose fighter, which costs 1 billion 187 million rubles, but is significantly lower than the price for one Su-35S (2 billion 287 million rubles) and Su-57 (more than 3 billion rubles).

    It is emphasized that the cost of about $ 15 million per helicopter is only for the Russian army, the Ka-52M will be exported at a much higher price. Considering that the Mi-8 and Mi-15 are exported at $ 30 million per helicopter, the attack Ka-52M will be much more expensive. At the same time, it is noted that the cost of the Russian helicopter is significantly lower than that of American or European counterparts. A similar American Apache is not sold for less than $ 115 million.

    The first contract for the supply of the modernized Ka-52M was signed in August this year. Under the agreement, Russian Helicopters will supply 30 new attack helicopters to the Defense Ministry during 2022-2023. In total, the military intends to receive more than a hundred Ka-52Ms by 2027, previously a figure of 144 units was called.

    The Ka-52M attack helicopter was developed taking into account the operation of the Ka-52 helicopter in Syria, as well as the proposals of the flight and engineering personnel who participated in the battles. Unlike its predecessor, the Ka-52 helicopter, the modernized Ka-52M received enhanced booking, a new airborne defense system and new weapons.

    https://topwar-ru.translate.goog/187724-minoborony-soglasovalo-stoimost-modernizirovannogo-vertoleta-ka-52m.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=nui

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    Isos
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    Post  Isos Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:23 am

    That's 14 million € for a su-30SM and 26 million € for a su-35.

    I doubt the figure about the su-30. It shouldn't be far from su-35 price.

    14 billion for a russian chopper is reasonble.

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Sat Nov 06, 2021 8:12 am

    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 29558110
    Ka-52M

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    Post  GarryB Sun Nov 07, 2021 12:01 am

    That's 14 million € for a su-30SM and 26 million € for a su-35.

    I doubt the figure about the su-30. It shouldn't be far from su-35 price.

    14 billion for a russian chopper is reasonble

    The Su-30SM they are talking about is not the two seater Su-35 they are going to upgrade it to and I agree that that version of the Su-30SM should be very similar in price to an Su-35 as it uses all the expensive and high tech parts the Su-35 that makes it so damn expensive.

    In MiG-29 terms the Su-30SM is a MiG-29M2 and the Su-35 is the MiG-35.

    The difference in price is significant and in some areas the difference in performance is significant too, but for most general duties they can do the same job but one can do it cheaper.

    The upgraded Su-30SM will be a two seat MiG-35 which of course will cost the same as the Su-35... but ironically the increased production volume of the more expensive components of the more advanced aircraft should help reduce the costs as well as commonality of being able to share parts and maintenance costs as well as ground equipment can all be the same it ends up making both aircraft cheaper... while getting a more advanced two seater... which is probably why they are doing it.

    Hole
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    Post  Hole Wed Nov 17, 2021 9:19 am

    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 10809010
    Ka-52 with the new "smart" rocket pod

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Wed Nov 17, 2021 10:22 pm

    Interesting that the 30mm cannon shell belts seem to have a belt of one type of ammo and the front belt seems to be a mixed belt with every second round having a red tip.

    The 2A42 cannon is dual feed so you could therefore select between one belt and the other... I wonder what the mixed rounds are...
    franco
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    Post  franco Thu Nov 18, 2021 8:06 am

    GarryB wrote:Interesting that the 30mm cannon shell belts seem to have a belt of one type of ammo and the front belt seems to be a mixed belt with every second round having a red tip.

    The 2A42 cannon is dual feed so you could therefore select between one belt and the other... I wonder what the mixed rounds are...

    Tracer dunno

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Thu Nov 18, 2021 8:34 am

    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 2kpvqh10
    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 Dtdsnf10
    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 H-xory10
    Some hovering/flying

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:04 am

    Just looking at their arms catalogue for 30mm cannon shells for the Havoc and Hokum, the red tipped rounds are HEI and the all black rounds are AP.

    The AP might be AP or APT, but being mixed with HEI means they are not APDS or APFSDS or they would not be mixed belts.
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    Post  franco Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:13 am

    NOTE: by the appearance of this article it would seem that the Army Aviation squadron in Armenia has replaced it's Mil.24V with Ka-52's.

    Young pilots of the Erebuni Air base of the Southern Military District (SE), stationed in Armenia, have started flying in high-altitude terrain.

    The servicemen underwent additional training to perform flight tasks in simple and difficult weather conditions in flat and mountainous terrain under the guidance of experienced instructors.

    During the introductory course, the servicemen worked out various elements of piloting: take-off, hovering, approaches and movements near the ground, vertical descent, landing and landing over a military airfield.

    Upon completion of the special course, the pilots passed tests, passed certification and received admission to perform independent flights and combat training missions in mountainous terrain.

    Also, specialists of the engineering and technical staff of the compound have prepared reconnaissance and strike Ka-52 and amphibious transport Mi-8MTV-5 helicopters for winter operation.

    From the beginning of the winter training period and after the flight of aircraft that have undergone routine seasonal maintenance, pilots will begin performing exercises according to the combat training program, performing various tasks for their intended purpose.

    https://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12396198@egNews

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    Post  Krepost Wed Jan 19, 2022 4:23 pm

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    Cheetah
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    Post  Cheetah Thu Jan 20, 2022 8:51 pm

    GarryB wrote:Just looking at their arms catalogue for 30mm cannon shells for the Havoc and Hokum, the red tipped rounds are HEI and the all black rounds are AP.

    The AP might be AP or APT, but being mixed with HEI means they are not APDS or APFSDS or they would not be mixed belts.

    The way they are laid out may just be for display. If it's anything like the original Ka-50, then it had two belts to dual feed the cannon, one AP, the other HE, and they were switched via a control on the weapons console.
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    Post  GarryB Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:11 am

    True but they have different ammo for different branches of their military... for instance fighter aircraft with 30mm cannon can't fire APDS or APFSDS rounds because sabot fragments could get sucked into jet engines and damage them.

    This means the ammo intended for helicopters is designed for use against light ground targets and soft ground targets, so the AP-T and HEI rounds can be fired in one belt because they are ballistically matched, which means they can be loaded in the same belt and fired without worrying about point of aim.

    Ammo for other 30mm guns like the GSh-301 cannon in Russian fighters and the 2A38M gun of the Tunguska and Pantsir systems use single belts where all the rounds fired have to have the same trajectory too.

    With the 2A42 and 2A72 cannon with dual feed, you could have a mix of HEI and AP-T in one belt as a multipurpose round to do damage to lightly armoured or unarmoured targets, while the other belt might be APDS for firing at hard targets from above or the side...
    franco
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    Post  franco Mon Jan 24, 2022 10:11 am

    Ka-52 attack helicopters will enter service with the Central Military District for the first time in 2022

    YEKATERINBURG, January 24. /TASS/. The Central Military District (TsVO) will for the first time receive a squadron of new Ka-52 attack helicopters by the end of 2022. This was reported to journalists by the commander of the Central Military District, Colonel-General Alexander Lapin.

    "By the end of the year, in order to strengthen the combat power of the army aviation brigade stationed in the regions of the Urals, we plan to receive a squadron of new Ka-52 attack helicopters. This will be the first unit in the military district armed with this type of modern helicopters," he said.

    The Ka-52 "Alligator" helicopter can provide reconnaissance of targets, target distribution and hardware target designation. The Ka-52 is equipped with visibility reduction devices, an electronic protection system and active countermeasures. A counter-rotating pair of propellers in parallel allows it to quickly maneuver into tight spaces to take advantage of an attacking position. The Ka-52 has a high crew security, modern automated systems to facilitate piloting, and is also easy to maintain on the ground.

    https://tass-ru.translate.goog/armiya-i-opk/13504087?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en

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    Post  walle83 Thu Feb 24, 2022 12:04 pm

    Crashed Ka-52 outside Kiev.

    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 Bb653510

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    Post  limb Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:08 pm

    walle83 wrote:Crashed Ka-52 outside Kiev.

    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 30 Bb653510
    I thought the ka-52 had Vitebsk DIRCM. Why wasn't this one equipped?

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    Post  GarryB Thu Feb 24, 2022 10:51 pm

    We don't know what brought it down.

    You will note the crew abandoned the aircraft... it is sitting up off the ground so the undercarriage are deployed and the canopy have been opened rather than the main rotor blades ejected and ejection seats used.

    This aircraft crash landed.

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    lyle6
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    Post  lyle6 Thu Feb 24, 2022 11:35 pm

    Countermeasure dispensers run out eventually, I guess.
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    Post  limb Fri Feb 25, 2022 12:14 am

    lyle6 wrote:Countermeasure dispensers run out eventually, I guess.

    Flares are of reduced effectiveness against modern IIR seekers. Russia has fully functional DIRCM since the late 2000s, but doesn't install them on its attack helicopters. This is handicapping yourself.
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    Post  Regular Fri Feb 25, 2022 1:35 am

    limb wrote:
    lyle6 wrote:Countermeasure dispensers run out eventually, I guess.

    Flares are of reduced effectiveness against modern IIR seekers. Russia has fully functional DIRCM  since the late 2000s, but doesn't install them on its attack helicopters. This is handicapping yourself.

    How do you know it's not installed? How does it look?
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    Post  limb Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:30 am

    Regular wrote:
    limb wrote:
    lyle6 wrote:Countermeasure dispensers run out eventually, I guess.

    Flares are of reduced effectiveness against modern IIR seekers. Russia has fully functional DIRCM  since the late 2000s, but doesn't install them on its attack helicopters. This is handicapping yourself.

    How do you know it's not installed? How does it look?

    If it was installed, it wouldn't have been shot down by any IR manpad. The damage on it was done by a proximity fuse of a manpad.
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:12 am

    Regular wrote:
    limb wrote:
    lyle6 wrote:Countermeasure dispensers run out eventually, I guess.

    Flares are of reduced effectiveness against modern IIR seekers. Russia has fully functional DIRCM  since the late 2000s, but doesn't install them on its attack helicopters. This is handicapping yourself.

    How do you know it's not installed? How does it look?

    They look like these little optical complexs around the helicopter.  Only newer Ka-52's built in the last 5 years or so got them. Any Ka-52 prior didn't get them as integrating them would require either serious work or pods which kinda is pointless.

    So if these are older units, they won't have the countermeasures besides flares.


    Last edited by miketheterrible on Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:20 am; edited 1 time in total
    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:19 am

    DIRCM is really expensive. Only makes sense on select aircraft which go into hot zones.
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    Post  limb Sat Feb 26, 2022 12:44 am

    lancelot wrote:DIRCM is really expensive. Only makes sense on select aircraft which go into hot zones.

    Well this was clearly a hot zone...

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sat Feb 26, 2022 6:04 am

    DIRCMS are not magic.... the US sent aircraft loads of Stingers.... when there are 20 missiles coming up at you at one time what exactly are you expecting any DIRCMS system to do?

    Too much video games I think...

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