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    Su-30 for Russian Air Force #2

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    hoom

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    Post  hoom on Wed Dec 18, 2019 1:33 pm

    I didn't think anything could top that video of the Su-30 flying along with its nose practically in the ramp of an Il-76 for demonstrating the controllability of an Su-30.
    I was wrong
    https://www.instagram.com/p/B6CyFI2iE9y/
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Dec 18, 2019 2:24 pm

    hoom wrote:I didn't think anything could top that video of the Su-30 flying along with its nose practically in the ramp of an Il-76 for demonstrating the controllability of an Su-30.
    I was wrong
    https://www.instagram.com/p/B6CyFI2iE9y/

    It's common to see that in air shows. Every two years I see the rafale doing this at Paris air show. There is no particular interest in doing that during real mission though.
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    Post  mnztr on Sat Dec 21, 2019 3:11 am

    d_taddei2 wrote:just for info, sorry its the Su-30 MKI but interesting read.


    https://hushkit.net/2019/07/20/flying-fighting-in-the-sukhoi-su-30-flanker-a-pilot-interview/

    One of the most intersting pilot interviews I have read. The way the IAF exploits the SU-30 is pretty unique, with a WSO. This is similar to how the F-4 and F-14 were operated. Is there a reason why India choses this very unique approach? I think they wanted a dual seat PAK FA as well.
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    Post  mnztr on Sat Dec 21, 2019 3:16 am

    I think the SU upgrade is to give an option for foreign customers to upgrade their SU fleets.The Red will have some squadrons but I think this is just to prove the platform to potential buyers. Also not everyone can afford the SU-35
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    Post  Isos on Sat Dec 21, 2019 11:44 am

    All su-30 are dual seat. It makes the work easier for multi role aircraft. Pilot can fly and look at potebtiak threats outsude whike the weapon officer look at its board and do the work.

    The upgrade is mostly to bring the su-30 to su-35 level because it start to became outdated. With its huge rcs it is detectable at max range of any radar in service whike its own radar is not tge best russian have. I'm not sure but mki radar is not the same as SM radar in terms of range and ECCM. An upgraded radar would also make possible the use of log range missiles like rvv-sd(120km) or r-37(300km).
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    Post  PapaDragon on Sat Dec 21, 2019 12:47 pm

    mnztr wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:just for info, sorry its the Su-30 MKI but interesting read.


    https://hushkit.net/2019/07/20/flying-fighting-in-the-sukhoi-su-30-flanker-a-pilot-interview/

    One of the most intersting pilot interviews I have read. The way the IAF exploits the SU-30 is pretty unique, with a WSO. This is similar to how the F-4 and F-14 were operated. Is there a reason why India choses this very unique approach? I think they wanted a dual seat PAK FA as well.


    India wanted stealth nuclear bomber hence the second seat for weapons officer

    Second seat on Su-57 is redundant for anything else

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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sat Dec 21, 2019 4:49 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    mnztr wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:just for info, sorry its the Su-30 MKI but interesting read.


    https://hushkit.net/2019/07/20/flying-fighting-in-the-sukhoi-su-30-flanker-a-pilot-interview/

    One of the most intersting pilot interviews I have read. The way the IAF exploits the SU-30 is pretty unique, with a WSO. This is similar to how the F-4 and F-14 were operated. Is there a reason why India choses this very unique approach? I think they wanted a dual seat PAK FA as well.


    India wanted stealth nuclear bomber hence the second seat for weapons officer

    Second seat on Su-57 is redundant for anything else


    Not necessarily, the successor to the Hellduck (likely designated Su-62/64) not only would it have a 2nd seat, it'll probably likely have 3 or 4 seats for the drone controlling part of the plane, imagine how many drones could be controlled with a dedicated command post built into the aircraft? That functionality apparently already exists in the A-50/100 flying radars.
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    Post  GarryB on Sun Dec 22, 2019 2:11 am

    All su-30 are dual seat. It makes the work easier for multi role aircraft. Pilot can fly and look at potebtiak threats outsude whike the weapon officer look at its board and do the work.

    The upgrade is mostly to bring the su-30 to su-35 level because it start to became outdated. With its huge rcs it is detectable at max range of any radar in service whike its own radar is not tge best russian have. I'm not sure but mki radar is not the same as SM radar in terms of range and ECCM. An upgraded radar would also make possible the use of log range missiles like rvv-sd(120km) or r-37(300km).

    As a defensive aircraft however is RCS even relevant when it will be using its radar to detect threats and targets... or it might operate based on ground based radar and sensors and airborne radar in AWACS platform and no emit any signal at all so enemy platforms could only locate it by using their radar and revealing their location to the radar silent Flanker...

    It is a large aircraft so you can fit a big radar and lots of missiles... both of which are valuable... it is probably every bit as manouverable or more so than the primary western fighter... the F-35, and more space for bigger radar... more missiles, and more fuel... trading missile for missile the Su-30 is always going to win there... and in a gun fight I would suspect the Su-30 is not the worst aircraft to turn and burn...

    For many roles like patrolling airspace or even interception it is a fine aircraft that stealth would not improve... it would only make them more expensive to buy and to maintain and to operate.

    Second seat on Su-57 is redundant for anything else

    The advantage of glass cockpits is that it hides unimportant information from the pilot so he can concentrate on the job at hand. All information is available in other screens, but the most important and relevant is put before the pilots eyes at any one time.

    The AI system for the Su-57 basically manages menial and mechanical things that need to be done but don't require the pilots attention, so he can focus on the job at hand... information is shared in the network so other platforms benefit from the sensors and weapons on the aircraft in the location it is in.

    Not necessarily, the successor to the Hellduck (likely designated Su-62/64) not only would it have a 2nd seat, it'll probably likely have 3 or 4 seats for the drone controlling part of the plane, imagine how many drones could be controlled with a dedicated command post built into the aircraft? That functionality apparently already exists in the A-50/100 flying radars.

    Swarm technology drones are not remote controlled and will be given waypoints and modes of operation but wont need continuous monitoring or control.

    Their first two seat to control a drone would be the Ka-52... inside enemy territory it could launch a drone from a container under its wing that can fly over trees or into a valley to look for targets or threats and send back a signal... they could even just orbit the helicopter itself and just climb up in a spiral to get height to see targets located all around and to find threats... it could lase targets for all sorts of guided weapons the Ka-52 could be carrying or target information could just be passed up to HQ for an air strike or artillery strike while the Ka-52 commands the drone it launched to crash in to a nearby air defence vehicle to destroy it and then leave the area quietly...

    It would make more sense to use an aircraft like a Tu-214 to monitor drones... hell the Tu-22M3 already has four seats and the new Tu-22M3M gets rid of two seats because of the automated attack and self defence systems makes bomb aimers and ESM operators redundant... perhaps they could use the two extra crew positions for drone operations and perhaps weapon aiming pods to mark individual targets with a laser for engagement from high altitude...
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    Post  owais.usmani on Fri May 15, 2020 8:54 pm

    Su-30 for Russian Air Force #2 Bomba_10

    Sukhoi Su-30SM fighter-bomber loaded with an IAB-500 bomb, designed to simulate an izdeliye 244N tactical nuclear bomb
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    Post  mnztr on Mon May 18, 2020 3:51 pm

    Strange that the bomb is so far to the rear of the plane.
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    Post  kvs on Mon May 18, 2020 4:40 pm

    mnztr wrote:Strange that the bomb is so far to the rear of the plane.

    Looks to me that it could easily carry two of them so that we are seeing only one in the photograph.

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    Post  Isos on Mon May 18, 2020 4:49 pm

    There is no point in using a free fall bomb as a nuclear weapon. Cruise missiles are better and gives you more chances to reach a target than a su-30.
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    Post  GarryB on Tue May 19, 2020 11:27 am

    Aircraft delivered bombs you can change your mind right up until the last minute, and of course an Aircraft can defend itself with missiles and electronics.. imagine the issues if one of the 73 American missiles shot down over Syria was a nuke...

    Cruise missiles are capable and useful but manned aircraft still make sense.

    The location of the bomb in this case is fairly normal... there are two weapon pylons between the engines that can carry weapons... it could carry another weapon in front of the one shown if needs be...
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    Post  dino00 on Mon Aug 10, 2020 11:12 pm

    "Sukhi" - at sea: Su-30SM fighters await serious modernization

    Multifunctional combat vehicles will be equipped with hypersonic anti-ship missiles


    Russian engineers are developing a fundamentally new powerful weapon to equip Sukhoi fighters, Izvestia sources in the military-industrial complex told, without specifying a specific model. The aircraft will also receive upgraded onboard electronics.

    According to the documents at the disposal of Izvestia, development work (R&D) on the modernization of the Su-30SM began in 2015 and was designated "Adaptation-Su". Several leading companies of the military-industrial complex are involved in it, including the State Machine-Building Design Bureau "Raduga" named after A.Ya. Bereznyak. GosMKB is the largest domestic manufacturer of supersonic and hypersonic weapons for aviation.


    To ensure the use of the latest ammunition, according to the documents, the N011M Bars radar will be modified. The fighter's computer system and the onboard defense system will also be updated, and foreign components will be replaced with domestic ones. Completion of work on the development of aircraft modernization is scheduled for the end of the year.

    Under the name of the ROC "Adaptation-Su" there are several different programs for the creation of missiles for strike aircraft, Dmitry Kornev, editor of the militaryrussia portal, told Izvestia. These include work on the Kh-32, a modern modification of the rather old Kh-22 missile, which is used on the Tu-22M3 bomber. In addition, within the framework of these R&D projects, more modern hypersonic missiles, still secret, are being created.

    Full Article
    https://iz.ru/1046447/anton-lavrov-roman-kretcul/sukhie-v-more-istrebiteli-su-30sm-ozhidaet-sereznaia-modernizatciia

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    Post  kvs on Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:22 am

    Isos wrote:There is no point in using a free fall bomb as a nuclear weapon. Cruise missiles are better and gives you more chances to reach a target than a su-30.

    The whole premise of the B-2 rests on using strategic weapons in the form of a bomber, not standoff missile platform.

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    Post  LMFS on Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:43 am

    Are they really saying that they will carry the Kh-32 in the Su-30SM???? Or will rather the Kh-32 carry the Su? Suspect

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    Post  Isos on Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:58 am

    kvs wrote:
    Isos wrote:There is no point in using a free fall bomb as a nuclear weapon. Cruise missiles are better and gives you more chances to reach a target than a su-30.

    The whole premise of the B-2 rests on using strategic weapons in the form of a bomber, not standoff missile platform.


    And makes it a juicy target for sosna-r, igla-S with thermal camera mounted on vehicles, pantsirs with 30mm guns.

    Using bombs put you in range of AAA and shorads. B2 is the easiest target for them.
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    Post  GarryB on Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:15 am

    Are they really saying that they will carry the Kh-32 in the Su-30SM???? Or will rather the Kh-32 carry the Su?

    No, they are saying the company that currently makes the Kh-32 hypersonic missile is also working on other hypersonic missiles for use on smaller aircraft including the Su-30 for use as air to ground weapons.

    The Kh-32 is rocket propelled, but I suspect the newer smaller more compact missiles will be scramjet powered...

    And makes it a juicy target for sosna-r, igla-S with thermal camera mounted on vehicles, pantsirs with 30mm guns.

    Using bombs put you in range of AAA and shorads. B2 is the easiest target for them.

    To be fair dropping nuclear bombs does not require extreme precision so you can do it from altitude, but of course they are not that stealthy as to be able to fly through Russian airspace at high or medium altitude unnoticed.... they were supposed to be the ideal scud killers which translated to TOPOL killers, but after Desert Storm they realised both would be effectively impossible even if they were invisible in every regard...
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    Post  LMFS on Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:47 pm

    GarryB wrote:No, they are saying the company that currently makes the Kh-32 hypersonic missile is also working on other hypersonic missiles for use on smaller aircraft including the Su-30 for use as air to ground weapons.

    That at least would make sense, in the original article they speak non-stop of the Kh-32. And they say they would modify the Su-30 to carry it Rolling Eyes

    The Kh-32 is rocket propelled, but I suspect the newer smaller more compact missiles will be scramjet powered...

    They can work on the scramjet for sure, but I think they will progress in steps, the first one being a hypersonic version of Kh-31 or Kh-58, this is the kind of weapon that does not need massive ranges but where speed can increase effectiveness substantially. A rocket version will be much cheaper and with the energy imparted by the aircraft it will already have 100-200 km range easily and still keep a good warhead. If it is a very big missile, longer ranges are possible of course.
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    Post  LMFS on Tue Aug 11, 2020 8:05 pm

    Charly015 has bothered doing the drawing of the Su-30 with the Kh-32... I think it would be even worse on a side view, the plane would land or take off directly riding on the missile

    Su-30 for Russian Air Force #2 EfI2S_kXYAAX6gg?format=jpg&name=900x900

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    Post  Isos on Tue Aug 11, 2020 8:21 pm

    Russian media poping information from their ass about military stuff again. They don't even know what is the kh-32 or the su-30.

    It's physically impossible for it to carry that missile.

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    Post  miketheterrible on Tue Aug 11, 2020 8:57 pm

    I agree.

    The media is clearly quoting the corporation wrong. Guaranteed it is simply a new missile of similar principle but not the Kh-32 itself.

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    Post  Isos on Tue Aug 11, 2020 9:40 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:I agree.

    The media is clearly quoting the corporation wrong. Guaranteed it is simply a new missile of similar principle but not the Kh-32 itself.

    IMO tey told the journalist kh-59 or another tactical missile with kh- in the name and back in his office he googled "kh- missile" and choose the first he saw and made an article on that.
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    Post  GarryB on Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:41 am

    That at least would make sense, in the original article they speak non-stop of the Kh-32. And they say they would modify the Su-30 to carry it

    The Kh-32 is about 6 tons, and I rather doubt it would be the best choice for the Su-30 to be honest.

    Charly015 has bothered doing the drawing of the Su-30 with the Kh-32... I think it would be even worse on a side view, the plane would land or take off directly riding on the missile

    I think that image is enough to show it is not going to happen...

    Russian media poping information from their ass about military stuff again. They don't even know what is the kh-32 or the su-30.

    Well... more like they don't know enough about the new missile to talk about so they will talk about the missile they do know a little about that this company makes and that is also hypersonic...

    IMO tey told the journalist kh-59 or another tactical missile with kh- in the name and back in his office he googled "kh- missile" and choose the first he saw and made an article on that.

    Or they did a search on the company and hypersonic missiles and the Kh-32 was the only one that came up.

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    Post  Hole on Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:47 am

    "Under the name of the ROC "Adaptation-Su" there are several different programs for the creation of missiles for strike aircraft, Dmitry Kornev, editor of the militaryrussia portal, told Izvestia. These include work on the Kh-32, a modern modification of the rather old Kh-22 missile, which is used on the Tu-22M3 bomber. In addition, within the framework of these R&D projects, more modern hypersonic missiles, still secret, are being created."

    Read the paragraph again. Nobody claims that the Kh-32 will be used on the Su-30SM. The modernisation of the plane falls under the same programm as the modernisation or development of missiles. Like the Burevestnik program for the creation of new artillery systems.

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