Russian special military operation in Ukraine #42

TMA1 wrote:
You seem to love posting cheery Ukrainian propaganda. Glad you are now so cynical in this fog of war. Maybe you will be careful when you spew ukrainian propaganda from now on?

Said about:

sundoesntrise wrote:Maybe it's time to start actually setting examples. Next saboteur/traitor that gets caught gets shot in all 4 limbs with the entire process videotaped for extra impact.

He does love Orc propaganda and his delusional punishments sound like the sort of thing the nazis do to their prisoners too...

Serberus wrote:When i said many moons ago it was a mistake to withdraw from border areas of ukronazistan and lose a significant buffer , i was laughed off here by gary and a few other sycophants, yet i am unfortunately proven to be right over and over again, this smo is being run by a bunch of clowns who I wouldn’t trust with running a lemonade stand.

When cocksuckers try to say I told you so most people listening thing they are cocksuckers.

Withdrawing from an area has zero impact on infiltration units bringing down aircraft inside Russian territory... but even if they did having Russian units of 200 or 300 men overrun and captured to prevent the deaths of helicopter crews... especially when there is no link at all is just being stupid.

Such a comment from you confirms I was right all along and you are an idiot. Holding indefensible lines is why the Orcs have been losing large numbers of their soldiers and also why the Russians have not, but having large numbers of Russians captured and still not holding the lines is not better.

I will not call out the Russian government and MOD for this incident, it will be playing into the hands of NATzO. But I demand that Russia start mass extermination in Ukraine and give special attention to killing NATzO personnel inside Ukrop territory.

An over reaction is exactly what they want... they want Russia to change tactics and become more brutal and mindless because they can then show their western allies how brutal Russia is and why aren't they sending more stuff and better stuff.

Take your time and find targets that are going to effect the war... I would say target the Americans in the Ukraine in the government positions and at the US embassy... they have thousands of people there essentially running the country... time for them to be targets.

Years 2022 and 2023 will be in history books as one of the greatest geopolitical successes for the West since the Cold War ended.

I would say the opposite... most western countries are in economic trouble and at the same time are sending money and weapons and ammo to Kiev from their own budgets that will need to be replaced at top cost at a time when extra borrowing to survive Covid is hurting already.

The west is on the brink of collapse and its appeals to the rest of the world to back it up over Russia has clearly failed completely... to the point where western diplomats are told to get lost and Russian diplomats are invited to discuss more cooperation and trade.

The West is creating a real split with Russia... something Putin could never have managed on his own from his position because there are so many pro west Russians he could not have done it, but now that the west is extending the conflict and arming terrorists to kill Russians, I think most Russians will realise the west has always hated them and wanted them dead...

It is like Shelob in the Lord of the Rings... little Putin didn't have the power to push his blade through the thick hide of the giant spider but she tried to crush him with her mass and all her strength and the blade is making it through...

China is now dumping US debt and reducing its trade in US dollars, and the rest of the world will have to do the same.... because China is the new economic leader of the world.

The West made two eastern Slavic nations Ukraine and Russia kill each other by hundreds of thousands and weaken both by a significant decree.

Ironically in its broken corrupt state the US could have milked the resources of the Ukraine for decades and given itself a bit of an economic boost in doing so, but it got greedy and now it is losing it.

Right now it is already clear that Russia will not win the war, and will not even capture the Donbass region.

Open your eyes. Russia has not been trying to capture the entire country, it has been destroying Kievs military force, which it has been achieving... if it wanted to advance rapidly it could have been encircling these areas and cutting them off from any support, but it wants nazis to step up to fight...

My conclusion is that Russia’s conventional army is unable to defeat Ukraine and Russia will not be using nukes either.

The Russians have barely used 10% of available forces in peace time... going to a war footing it is more like 1% of their potential being used.

Their economy has gone under western sanctions... 11 rounds of sanctions and their economy is now growing at the rate it was before the conflict started, while western economies seem in rather worse states.

He has been leading Russia for the last 23 years. He has had time to build Russia and its military.

And that is Russias victory... at no other time in its past could Russia have turned its back on the west as it currently has without the support of any of the former soviet states and without eastern europe. Russia is as strong as it has ever been before and its future actually looks good... even some Americans think so:

https://www.rt.com/russia/576204-conservative-migrant-village-russia/

Now why the politicians do not wish to declare war, I have my guesses but that is it.

Shifting to a war footing negatively effects the economy so why do it when you don't need to...

Edit: AD systems eh? Looks like Russia needs to clean up these AD systems st a much faster pace. Also I think western intel is becoming more dominant and we are seeing less of a Ukrainian planning going on.

It looks like an Su-24 part so I guess he is talking about the Su-24 that carried the MALD and British cruise missiles...

If i was Moscow, I'd cancel the grain deal and stick the last dagger in the dollar, then let shit hit the fan,

The west is not going to let that Russian bank use SWIFT to sell grain so odds are the deal will get cancelled... and good riddance.

One Patriot destroys so many stuff in one attack. Seriously? Those sukhois suck. They don't even detect radar emissions.

What are you talking about... Patriot was not involved... these incidents happened on Russian territory and were likely infiltrated Orc forces.

Queers and steers, faggots and maggots, doomers and gloomers...

Names for the next generation US Marine units I suspect... they get upset if you call them men though... that would be sexist...

I think the delay in the vaunted Kiev regime offensive is real and not a feint. The strikes on ammo dumps have been epic. I do not recall such
enormous explosions a year ago. Without these ammo dumps there is no offensive. Russian intel must be on a roll. I am sure that every
bit of munitions was shuttled in via civilian traffic and stored in a way as to minimize obvious exposure of the storage activity.

Would think the storm shadow attacks and attacking Russian aircraft in Russian airspace would be part of a plan during the probing attacks before an offensive to find weak spots and upset the air power of the enemy.

The Su24 and MiG-29 escort that launched the Storm Shadows were shot down... I doubt Patriot could be moved to Russian borders and operate without exposing itself... more likely IRST or other newer system might have been used...

Probably PAC-2. I think they have fragmentation warheads, range is 160km. If Ukraine manages to deploy a net of those around its territory, they can down RU aircraft fairly safely 120km inside of Russian territory.

S-300s they used to have has much better range and would much more mobile and have 360 degree radar coverage rather than 120 degree coverage that the Patriot has...

Patriot is inferior to what they had by a wide margin.

Patriot has a central radar. They should have EW planes and RWR inside su-34 detect them as soon as they are turned on. Patriot can't shoot passively and doesn't use active radar missiles.

What are they expecting ? They received Patriots and they are in a war in which ukro use all their weapons. Are they that much dumb ?

Who is making the claim it was Patriot is the question you should be asking.

Dead enemy can't shoot down your overhyped planes

Just sayin'

The US wanted to do that to Serbia... and they failed too, what makes you think Russia should be able to do better than it has.

Honestly I do not understand the reason for your criticism or even hostility towards me, this goes to the others here who dislike my opinions for no good reason

The Orcs launched two cruise missiles and lost two planes doing that, and they managed somehow to shoot down some Russian aircraft over a couple of days just before their big offensive.

Russia has been launching dozens of cruise missiles most days and has shot down over 400 Orc aircraft... why are you so upset?

Did you think they will not fight back?

Are you serious?

It probably wasn't a PAC-3. Could it have been drones with R-27 missiles?

Very unlikely it was either.

To launch R-27s to max range you would need to fly very high and very fast and after launch you could slow down but you would have to keep marking the target until impact... with the enemy aircraft illuminated during the engagement there would be no surprise.

The West and its population must feel the war in the end.

This war is driven by Biden and his backers... when he leaves power it will not last a lot longer.

Shit, if mig29 using aim120 to hunt, it means s400 went missing there

The Storm shadow carrying Su-24 and its MiG-29 escort were shot down... how likely a group of MiG-29s roaming around unnoticed... the shootdown of aircraft and helicopters were hours apart and unlikely the ghost of kiev.

Why allow NATO to get away with each escalation with no retaliation.

They need to work out exactly what happened and make sure the response makes repeats less likely or perhaps impossible.

You're like him. Grasping at whatever straw you can find to deny the undeniable. Defend the undefendable. Damagecontrol the undamagecontrable. Spin the unspinnable.

Yeah, you tell us what he is like because you piss your pants every time something unpleasant happens and then bitch to us about it... all Putins fault... Kiev are going to win... and a small group of you are the same... you take conjecture and blatant Kiev propaganda as being 100% confirmed and demand to know why Russia didn't anticipate it and react quickly enough.

Why didn't the US anticipate Covid... they have hundreds of bio weapons labs in foreign countries doing things that would be illegal to do in the US but they were not ready for Covid either... in fact they probably created it and accidentally released it... or was it an accident... they were quick to try to blame China and then they shut up about it... almost like they realised if anyone looked in to it they would be asking why the US has so many bio weapons labs around the world with US funding...

How come Ukrainian airports are still operational on Day 443 of the 'SMO'?

Because there are no military aircraft there and it presented no threat... perhaps till now.

The downing of these aircraft will affect the bombing with glide KABs, which was a kind of game changer recently.

Not really... they will likely increase the resources dedicated to SEAD... guided glide bombs are accurate enough so you don't need to carry large numbers at a time and aircraft like the Su-24 and Su-25 and Su-34 could easily carry glide bombs as well as self defence anti radiation missiles and guided weapons like LMUR to shoot down ground based threats and still have room for jamming pods and other equipment.

Russia will lose this war, now it is clear.

Kiev is about to launch their counter offensive and get their faces pushed in and then with this big Kiev force eviscerated then the Russians can decide if they want to capture all of the regions that joined the Russian Federation and then 150km... no wait... now 350km deep into Orc territory to keep the Russian territory safe... that is going to cost Kiev access to the Black Sea for sure...

Evidence of ADM-160 Miniature Air-Launched Decoy use by Ukraine emerges

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/evidence-of-adm-160-miniature-air-launched-decoy-use-by-ukraine-emerges

Not sure if the information is true but read that the EW suites had to be turned off in this specific region in order to avoid jamming Russian own AD systems. That opened a small window of opportunity for an attack. That sounds like someone knew exactly about it. The goal of that mi-8 was to provide jamming.

Isos wrote:

Who is making the claim it was Patriot is the question you should be asking.

Have you seen those frags on the su-34 ? That's not manpads. That's from a big missiles. Eitger Patriot or the SAMPT.

Do you have a picture?

Hannibal Barca wrote:
The typical equipment of the Russian soldier on the ground is from the 50s and 60s.

Russians preparing for the final battle against Kiev

Have you seen those frags on the su-34 ?

So you are guessing?

For all we know the Orcs might have smuggled in some IRS-T missiles or other types... most SAMs have fragmentation warheads and sometimes the angle of the fragments makes the holes appear bigger than they are.

Patriot is not mobile like S-300 and would be a total pain in the arse to drive around and set up for an attack like this.

Now that the Russians are aware how often is it going to work... I would say not often... which I why I am not falling to pieces like some here.

The typical equipment of the Russian soldier on the ground is from the 50s and 60s.

If you think that then you are not paying attention.

Azi wrote:

onwiththewar wrote:Knowing what the other side is good at, I personally think what happened is some sabotage group infiltrated the bases and attached timed explosives on these planes and helicopters near the cockpits. Then they also had someone on the ground at where the helicopters would pass with manpads.

Em....no!

Most likely scenario is....

Russia used the same flight paths for days, weeks or months. Ukraine placed a S-300 system exactly at the border or a few km behind. They switched at the right time the radar on for only a few minutes. Enough to track and destroy the aircrafts. Later the system was offline and Russia not able to detect the exact location.

Second variant and that's a really bad scenario....a mole, a traitor, a spy gave the NATZO or Ukroreich the exact data of the flight plan.

Today was a trap! A well prepared ambush with the goal to push Russian aircraft far away from the border and stopping the hammering with glide bombs. No superduper tech! No Übermenschen skillz! Just a trap. This S-300 (most likely) was used not to defend Ukraine airspace, it was used as a pinprick.

I only saw the helicopter going down. The video shows a lot of cloud about but I could not see the typical missile trail before and after the explosion. It may well be sabotage.

The question is also why the pilots did not eject, unless they were immediately incapacitated.

Thanks for the pic but that is not debris from an Su-34.

That is a blade from a helicopter.

I know I keep posting about this but it was, unlike the sad loss of those airman that has filled this thread, this was a strategically important event. There is some debate as to whether it was fuel or ammo that went up but there was a lot of energy released. Will take quite a while to replace, if they can. It is a big, well dispersed site, there must have been good intel as to exactly where to hit, no doubt helped by having the old Soviet plans for the site. A couple of Iskander/Kinzhal?

It looks like Russia, having left these sites in the west alone for a while are now going for them. Popping the NATO balloon of false confidence.

Mats Nilsson
@mazzenilsson
This is the ammunition dump in Gruzivtsy, 4km west of Khmelnitsky, from which spectacular explosions could be seen after Russian strikes yesterday.

The site is located approximately halfway between Lvov and Kiev, about 150km from the Romanian border, 270km from the Polish border. It is located on a major railway line and has its own train station. The facility occupies an area of approximately 1 x 1.5 km, similar in size to the Kobasna ammunition dump in Moldova which was featured in news reports some months ago. Aside from numerous storage facilities, the site has large barracks for personnel and a transport company with numerous vehicles.

There is no doubt that this site has significant strategic value for the AFU and NATO, and this very effective strike was a severe blow to AFU capability and resources.

This strike on a target of such strategic value, deep inside the Ukrainian interior is a major success for Russian forces, and a major defeat for the AFU.

If this debris photo is of Helicopter blade , together with video of explosion behind Helicopter are both true , then size of explosion behind Helicopter and position indicate a small explosion similar to Manpad , comparable to other Manpad hit on YouTube video . There are many small holes in blade , compatible with Manpad warhead  of 2 kg . Small force of fragmentation , not able to puncture in all places . Larger holes relate to secondary explosions and debris from Helicopter , together with big chunk missing from trailing edge , not ground impact , but Helicopter pieces impacting blade . Height of Helicopter also allow Manpad . The plane video , if true , maybe different story ! I hope it was long range SAM , because can be taken out and expensive to replace !

Is there any proof of Su-34/35 downing?
Is there any official communique that would indicate so, especially that pilots are dead?

We have pictures of a piecred Mi-8 blade.

And then we have complete story of what some special air group of VKS was doing on its special mission, role of each of them, etc. Who is the originator of this story?

It could be that Ukrainians infiltrated the Russians and knew about the operation. This would be a F-117 over Serbia style downing(*). Or it could be bullshit, and helicopters were downed by sabotage, infiltrated MANPAD, etc.

The most questionable part for me is downing of Su-34 inside friendly territory with both pilots dead.
I believe for them to die instantly you'd need an anti-bomber sized missile going straight for the engines. Usually a side explosion of a proximity charged missile isn't powerful or "shaped" enough to kill a pilot by penetrating the hull around the cockpit. But can shellshock a pilot easily out of commission. Two pilots side by side in a reinforced cockpit? Doubtful.

(*) an event that didn't affect outcome or flow of that war in any way

Hannibal Barca wrote:Russia will lose this war, now it is clear.

The typical equipment of the Russian soldier on the ground is from the 50s and 60s.

The mobilization of Russia is hampered by its demographic decline.

Zero help from China seriously questions the commitment or ability of these 2 powers to work together.

The way the war contacted with respect to the Ukrainian leadership and the little damage to non military targets shows naivety to say the least.

Although some military innovation still exists in Rus,sia, industrial capabilities are orders of magnitude below what is needed.

Russia should work on an exit plan for Putin from Kremlin. Ideally leaving walking and through a rational process.

Top priority to the nuclear triad. Russia should buy time, nukes is the only reason that Russia exists today.

1. How is it clear

2. Most of Ukraine's shit is just as old and fwiw I have seen pics and video, made in recent months of new equipment fresh from the factory

3. Demographic decline? Lulz, have you seen Ukraine's demographics?

4. China has helped quite a lot actually. Its funny though, had PRC sent arms you'd be trolling that Russianwas now subordinate to China.

5. How so? Has it occured to you that Nazilensky is an incompetent boob and so are his generals and the only people keeping Ukraine in this war are NATO? If Russia takes out NATO they get nuclear war. Also, how in the long run does bombing civilian -non military- targets help you deradicalize a population?

6. Russian industrial capacity is fine. This isn't Tsar Nicholas we are talkiny about

7. I know you are from the west, in fact so am I. The American wet dream currently is that the Russian people overthrow Putin. All I can say on that is are ya sure that is what you want? Most of those in Russia who want Putin replaced would not want Navalny or some other pro west "liberal." From Twitter, here, Telegram, etc those who want Putin gone want him gone because he won't reduce Ukraine to rubble and turn the NATO bloc into a radioactive sea of glass. You may eventually get Putin replaced, but be very afraid of what you get to replace him. You and your cia minders will not like it.

Firebird wrote:I'm told on BBC TV in England, before each song clips are shown of sights around the Pukraine. However,  I'm told that every sight shown was either Kiev region or Lvov region. Apparently nothing from sights such as Odessa or the East or South. .

Odessa is a Russian city and South/Eastern Ukraine is culturally and ethnically Russian, no need to elaborate further. Lvov and Kiev are the Bandera Nazi strongholds that have imposed their will on the rest of the country, they don't even consider most Ukrainians as "True Ukrainians" which is why there are large numbers of conscripts from Russian, Hungarian and other minority regions thrown into the meatgrinder, it's genocide by other means.

Firebird wrote:Soooooooooo........ I wonder, are the scummy "powers that be" coming round to the idea that the S and East of the Pukraine are/will be gone forever?
Well I hope Kiev also joins the "non-Ukraine", being Mother City of the Rus and all that.

Yes this is probably part of the plan, to freeze the conflict in its current state, once the task of politically justifying the complete decoupling of Europe from Russia, and its turning into a low level colony of the Anglo-Americans has been accomplished. Further continuation of the war of attrition as currently lead by MoD could lead to the complete collapse of the ukrainian military in a few months from now and spell the loss of Odessa or even worse the fall of the regime and the complete victory of Russia. So, the remaining territories would allow to keep a smoldering conflict at Russia's doorstep that could be light back again as soon as they manage to grow a new iteration of their nazi army. Of course, Russia has other plans and that is what it all is about right now...

Firebird wrote:Yesterday was the grotesque propaganda exercise called "Eurovision".
I'd prefer it was renamed "Verminvision"..

Here at our home we call it the freakshow. LBTGKSJFJIIE freaks ''performing'' at bottom level and indeed one big euro self-sucking propaganda show.

Isos wrote:The story about explosive inside the planes is also possible but hard to beleive they could infiltrate actual air bases where people generally know each other.

That's what special forces are trained for. They infiltrate, plant bombs and mines, disrupt and assassinate. Even the smallest SAM/MANPADS leave a smoke trail in the air. So far I have not seen any?

We also live in a world where people are fully prepared to lie and cheat and even kill for a couple of dollars.