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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33

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    sundoesntrise


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    Post  sundoesntrise Sat Nov 26, 2022 5:46 am

    * nazi troll whose mother should be xyz-d

    And it's not pro-Russia, but pro-Kremlin. Being pro Russia means that you hold the country and its leadership to a certain standard, something which is clearly hasn't happened for a long time.
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    Post  ucmvulcan Sat Nov 26, 2022 6:22 am

    Well for the record I am pro peace more than anything albeit in a pro Russian sense in that I want Russia to obtain a peace that at least mostly achieves its goals; denazification, end of genocide in Donbass, Ukraine demilitarized and forced to stay neutral and a new multipolar world where my country focuses on its borders and returns to its traditional Washingtonian goals of no entangling alliances, freedom of trade, and non interventionalism.

    As far as impartial views, well I give Archangel and others shit sometimes, but I can hope for Russian success and question their methods efficacy. That is not what irritates me or most. Its the notion that everything Russia does is wrong and Russia is defeated. They talk? Game over. They bomb? Game over. They don't bomb? Game over. There is a huge difference between questioning how things are going and being an all out doomer.

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    AMCXXL
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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Nov 26, 2022 7:02 am

    https://noticiasayr.blogspot.com/2022/11/ha-caido-occidente-en-una-trampa-rusa.html


    Has the West fallen into a Russian trap in Ukraine?

    Published November 25, 2022

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33 - Page 16 Trampa

    Cover of the book "Sacred War" ( Священная война ), a compilation of Russian fiction stories of the  time travel " genre ( SOURCE ) 


    Text published in the Greanville Post (July 11, 2022) and retrieved by Natylie Baldwin .

    What follows is a Russian commentary provided by Jeff J. Brown

    Greanville Post Comment: The New York Times, citing US officials on 7/24/2022 [sic], reported that US and European allies will be unable to sustain the current level of support for kyiv for an extended period of time. Despite President Biden vowing to support Ukraine "for as long as it takes," no one expects more billions in support for Ukraine when the currently authorized aid package of $54 billion in military and other assistance is Sold out in the second quarter of 2023 .

    The tactics of leisurely military operations in Ukraine still baffle the best Pentagon analysts, and only a few have begun to guess that the main goal of the Russian operation is not the surrender of kyiv at all.

    The fall of the kyiv regime is certainly detailed in the plans for a special military operation, but not as the culmination of Russia's actions, but only as an intermediate stage. The war is actually being fought at a much higher level.

    American politicians and generals firmly believe that the United States is using Ukraine as a weapon to exhaust Russia. In fact, everything that is happening is the exact opposite: the Anglo-Saxons were drawn to this battlefield to end their dubious and extremely dirty hegemony.

    Some in Washington began to suspect something, but it was already too late, since the death trap for the United States had closed, and the Americans themselves did everything possible to make it happen.

    The main trick of the special operation of the Russian Federation was revealed by the Ukrainian politician and journalist Dmitry Vasilets, noting that with their unhurried advance, the allied (Russian) forces more effectively carry out the demilitarization process of not only Ukraine, but also the entire Western collective. Vasilets explained it like this:

    “The Russian army made a tactical pause to regroup before the attack on Slaviansk. Even in the West, many have already come to the conclusion that this is far from traditional warfare. In fact, the Russian army could have long ago destroyed all the bridges across the Dnieper and stopped the transfer of equipment and personnel from the Armed Forces of Ukraine to the Donbass front.

    “We see a slow advance in the Donbass and near Kharkov, which is due to the fact that the army guards its forces as much as possible, giving the enemy even time and the opportunity to gather reserves to thus destroy the entire military potential of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

    “It is already clear that Russia is planning a long-term war with the West in Ukraine. Most of the territory of Ukraine is becoming a financial yoke for Europe and the United States. As they say, politics is concentrated economics, and war is even more concentrated economics. The West has fallen into a death trap.

    “For many years, Kyiv's “partners” exported all their resources out of the country, but now they are forced to inject only large amounts of money without receiving anything in return. This is a death trap for the United States and its satellites .

    “Most likely, this is why Russia operates in Ukraine with a limited contingent and does not rush things at all ,” Vasilets explained.

    The journalist pointed out that one should not believe in fairy tales about the unlimited resources of the United States, which, they say, can cover any cost by running the printing press at full capacity.

    The sanctions war is hurting the US economy. At the same time, the United States must fully support Ukraine, including by paying the salaries of the entire state apparatus, and will soon also need to support the declining economy of the European Union to maintain the already shaky anti-Russian coalition. under control.

    The Americans simply will not conduct a long war in such conditions, but theoretically they cannot withdraw either, at least without serious geopolitical losses. The trap has really slammed shut and in the Ukraine they (the Russians) are now crushing not only the Ukrainian Armed Forces, but the entire Western collective.

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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Nov 26, 2022 7:25 am

    @ucmvulcan
    Well for the record I am pro peace more than anything albeit in a pro Russian sense in that I want Russia to obtain a peace that at least mostly achieves its goals; denazification, end of genocide in Donbass, Ukraine demilitarized and forced to stay neutral and a new multipolar world where my country focuses on its borders and returns to its traditional Washingtonian goals of no entangling alliances, freedom of trade, and non interventionalism.

    Peace in Europe will only be achieved with the end of NATO

    The objective of this war is achieved with the end of Ukraine, but rather with the expulsion of the USA from European soil.

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    Post  ucmvulcan Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:01 am

    I don't see NATO being disbanded, but by spring there is going to be a huge backlash in Europe against the United States that NATO will be rendered meaningless and there are going to be ever increasing demonstrations against government that choose their people freezing and paying colossal food and fuel prices over peace in Ukraine. For what its worth, a lot of people here in America are very tired of high diesel costs, and we just had our most expensive thanksgiving day ever as that major holiday here cost 15 percent more than last year. Gas and food prices are on the rise here and people are no longer buying Putinflation. They are rightly blaming Biden and there is a growing peace movement here and discontent with foreign policy growing. So while NATO will still exist, at least temporarily its going to have to soften its approach.
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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:09 am

    @ucmvulcan

    I don't see NATO being disbanded, but by spring there is going to be a huge backlash in Europe against the United States that NATO will be rendered meaningless and there are going to be ever increasing demonstrations against government that choose their people freezing and paying colossal food and fuel prices over peace in Ukraine.

    This winter will not be too bad, after all it is starting with the gas reserves at their maximum and the industry has not stopped yet
    But what will happen in the winter of 2023/2024 when the gas reserves are completely depleted and the supply by ship is barely enough to keep the German population from freezing to death, assuming they can pay exorbitant prices?

    And when the war reaches the Baltic and the European countries have to decide whether to enter into a high intensity war or to withdraw from NATO?

    Germany will have to decide if it wants to continue being an industrial country or go back to being an agrarian country like in 1870 and for this it will have to "ask" the Americans to leave Germany or even have to throw them out by force

    As Kissinger said: we will not leave Europe without a fight."

    And that is precisely what this war is about.

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    Post  Sujoy Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:12 am

    I wonder if any Russian missile uses GNSS in Ukraine. Export versions certainly does.

    Anyway, the point is the success of Iran's Shahed-136 4-channel fused (jamming hardened) GNSS receiver is a good justification for relying on GNSS with its point-strike ballistic missiles

    S-136's low speed and low-grade IMU requires updates till the last ~1-2km.

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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:19 am

    New post  AMCXXL Today at 8:09 am

    I agree because while in Europe they are talking about this winter, Europe is waiting for a not so nice spring, summer and certainly an even harder next winter.
    GARRY, throw in some WINTER emoticons - it's time... Laughing
    This will most likely mean that RAFALEMAN (**** Superman and Batman) Isos will be driving Chinese cars in the future. Suspect

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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:22 am

    @franco

    Latest Western count of Russian deaths in the SMO

    The BBC has confirmed the names of 9,311 Russian military or Rosgvardia service members who have died in Ukraine (not including LDNR). At least 326 mobilized men have also died, 36 of whom died in Russia.

    It is very revealing that the BBC cares so much about counting the dead in Russia but does not give a shit about the more than 100,000 dead Ukrainians, the same Ukrainians that it claims to support.

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:58 am

    BBC would had to stick to official UK based data and call for 200k ...
    And you do know how much victorious would that sound ...

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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg Sat Nov 26, 2022 10:54 am

    How could the Russians have destroyed 6,000 Ukr tanks? The entire UAF does not have 1,000 tanks.
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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:05 am

    @Walther von Oldenburg


    How could the Russians have destroyed 6,000 Ukr tanks? The entire UAF does not have 1,000 tanks.

    6000 is total armored vehicles, included tanks, bmp´s, IFV´s

    Ukraine probably has more 1000-1200 tanks at the begining of the Russian military operation, noy only the tanks operational in the brigades, also some in reserve that have been repaierd and modernized in last 8 years

    anyway Ukraine has end the soviet legacy pf tanks since have received more 400 tanks from Poland, and other former Warsaw Pact countries, and the most of them have been also demilitarized and denazificated

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:07 am

    Rob Lee
    @RALee85
    "A third of the roughly 350 Western-made howitzers donated to Kyiv are out of action at any given time, according to U.S. defense officials and others familiar with Ukraine’s defense needs." @Tmgneff
    @johnismay

    https://nytimes.com/2022/11/25/us/ukraine-artillery-breakdown.html



    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33 - Page 16 FieQXItWIAAeqsS?format=png&name=small

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:13 am

    For the students in body language among us Laughing Laughing

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33 - Page 16 FicnMBFWQAETJhl?format=jpg&name=small

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:17 am

    You got to hand it to the Russians. Clearly an attempt to keep their kin warm in this cold weather.

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    Post  franco Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:23 am

    AMCXXL Today at 3:22 am

    @franco

    Latest Western count of Russian deaths in the SMO

    The BBC has confirmed the names of 9,311 Russian military or Rosgvardia service members who have died in Ukraine (not including LDNR). At least 326 mobilized men have also died, 36 of whom died in Russia.


    It is very revealing that the BBC cares so much about counting the dead in Russia but does not give a shit about the more than 100,000 dead Ukrainians, the same Ukrainians that it claims to support.


    I find it ironic that an attempt by Western sources to prove the Russians are lying, actually prove that the Russians are telling a far closer version to the truth then the West. Same thing happened after the Crimea referendum. Three different Western governments had polls done in the Crimea to prove that the referendum votes were faked but all 3 just confirmed the numbers.

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    Post  lancelot Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:33 am

    zare wrote:The thing is, if you don't comment day by day and especially if you're not so tied to block politics, it's still not clear to me what are the acceptable endgame scenarios for Russia.
    Demilitarization and denazification of Ukraine. That is what Putin said.

    zare wrote:Lets presume even if Ukraine signs off territory (defeat), that they'll keep on training the anti-Russian military forces in their sovereign territory. Even if Russia had supervision there (which is something I guess Ukrainians will never sign), it would still go on.
    Actually that is exactly what Ukraine need to do if they want to retain even a modicum of independence. Just like Finland had to do after the Continuation War. But I think the Russians would be fools to accept it. Although knowing Putin he might do that. Accept Ukrainian neutrality with stationing of Russian troops in Ukrainian territory after comprehensive laying down of arms by their army.

    zare wrote:I mean it's a problem today for USA to hand out 15.000 shells daily, but it won't be a problem tomorrow if they set their minds to it. Let's not kid ourselves these are the people that went to the moon from an underdog position.

    For me the issue is that west public has a quite of slice of people that are hell bent on "defeating Russia". Regardless of Ukraine, both the spirit of nation and the territory, there is no peace after this, it's Cold War 2.0 and even peace in Europe will turn itself into arms race and heavy militarization of everyone involved.
    It will mean the degradation of the economic power of the West at the same time China continues growing. Not that they were not headed there already anyway.

    zare wrote:RF on itself cannot win a prolonged arms/tech race, USSR couldn't. IMO. RF's competitiveness is not only in cheaper labour and materials and cheaper MIC overall, but also in the fact that American cots and EU milspec components were available to them up to ~10 years ago. There is also ever present fact that RF simply doesn't order enough of its own stuff and especially the cutting edge projects. Every other vapourware shit American MIC "pilot project" gets billions and years of funding.
    USSR did for like 40 years. And they did not have China to rely upon for technical assistance. You also ignore Russian history. They have many periods of closing off to the West for security reasons, economic decay as a result, then opening up again. It is just that phase right now. The thing is the West can never accept Russia as anything other than a resource colony. So that always leads to attempts to destabilize and infiltrate Russia. But Russia does not allow itself to be conquered that easily.

    zare wrote:Regardless how war in Ukraine turns out, heavy times are ahead of Russia. Things are never going to be the same. Chinese-Russian rapport has been largely based on one-sided cutting edge tech transfers. China is developing faster than Russia by definition, so that's not a reason for stable alliance.
    I think that has been more due to Russian perception of Chinese industrial products as somehow inferior to Western ones than any problem with the Chinese not wanting to provide support. But I think that is largely due to historical perceptions more than anything else.

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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:45 am

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Nov 26, 2022 11:45 am

    JohninMK wrote:Rob Lee
    @RALee85
    "A third of the roughly 350 Western-made howitzers donated to Kyiv are out of action at any given time, according to U.S. defense officials and others familiar with Ukraine’s defense needs." @Tmgneff
    @johnismay

    A nice long supply line there. Your artillery's barrel needs to be replaced somewhere in Zaporozhie. So you have to take it all the way from there, to Poland, and then all the way back. Lots of time, lots of fuel, lots of opportunities for interdiction.

    Of course one can't assume NATO is telling the truth here. Could well be that the Ukraine has set up some hidden workshops for changing barrels. Wouldn't have to be a large facility.

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:00 pm

    AMCXXL wrote:
    Has the West fallen into a Russian trap in Ukraine?

    Well despite the attempts at dressing up any development as a premeditated cunning plan, no I don't think what's happening now was part of anyone's intention.

    And I don't know what the Russian political and military leadership calculated what was likely to happen, but evidently they did hope the Ukraine to capitulate quickly, ideally when Russian forces advanced on Kiev. When that failed, they hoped to negotiate a settlement in March/April.

    However Russia was a smart gambler, and did prepare for a long war nevertheless, a long attritional war and a long economic war, and took all necessary steps. And it's this preparation which explains why the West is now 'trapped'. Exactly because the West didn't prepare for that.


    Last edited by flamming_python on Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:06 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  lancelot Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:01 pm

    This one is for Isos since he likes seeing CAESAR artillery units getting wrecked.

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    Post  franco Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:09 pm

    This one is for Isos since he likes seeing CAESAR artillery units getting wrecked.

    Pas possible Shocked Shocked
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    Post  Hole Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:17 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33 - Page 16 Fieslx10
    Related to the economic part of the SMO
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33 - Page 16 Fiewaw10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #33 - Page 16 Fiexzw10

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    Post  Isos Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:53 pm

    I was the first to share that video...

    And frankly it was time they destroy one. Those systems are on the front for months now.

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    Post  Werewolf Sat Nov 26, 2022 12:58 pm

    @JohninMK

    Is that white phosphorus or thermite?

    From other videos of white phosphorus it left a lot of white smoke, since it is used for lying down a thick smoke screen. However, here it's rather thin and you still can see through it.

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