Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    lancelot
    lancelot

    Posts : 460
    Points : 462
    Join date : 2020-10-18

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  lancelot Fri Jun 18, 2021 12:32 am

    Tsavo Lion wrote:New Turkish-Built Dry Dock Will Not Solve Russia’s Deeper Shipbuilding Problems

    What a hot mess of an article. Just read this section for example.
    Turkey will build a floating dry dock with a 30,000-ton capacity, large enough to construct the new generation of icebreakers the Russian government plans to service the Northern Sea Route. (The only existing dock presently available in the Russian High North is too small to handle these new Arctic-ready craft.) The need for such a dock has been under discussion in Russia since 2015, but no Russian yard was capable of building it. Now, a Turkish one will replace an older Russian floating dock that ingloriously sank three years ago (Twitter.com/KovtunM, October 30, 2018; see EDM, November 1, 2018). The giant PD-50 floating dock’s demise has blocked both icebreaker construction and the refitting of other naval ships, including most of its larger vessels, since that time.

    What icebreaker construction? The icebreakers are being built at St. Petersburg. Also, how will this Turkish floating dry dock they talk about with 30,000 ton capacity replace PD-50 which could service the Admiral Kuznetsov? This author is completely retarded. The floating dry docks are going to be used for icebreaker maintenance, not construction, and they are too small to service carriers. Even the helicopter carriers Russia is building are too heavy for it.

    Russia’s naval shipyards are a disaster, with money coming into them in ever-increasing amounts but nothing coming out. (Nuclear submarines are the only part of production that has not collapsed, he says). He blames this on the Kremlin’s decision to unify all shipbuilding into a single corporation and install corrupt and incompetent managers there (Nezavisimaya Gazeta, December 17, 2020). At present, Makiyenko writes, “practically all” shipbuilding projects are behind schedule and far over budget, with no one confident when deliveries will happen or what the costs of the finished product will be. Disturbingly for Moscow, the larger and the more important the vessel, the greater both of these problems have been.

    Bollocks. Russian nuclear submarine construction continued because it did not depend on foreign manufactured components like engines. Because of strategic characteristic of nuclear submarines little if anything used in them is imported. Also the nuclear submarine construction started at least a decade before the surface construction and the designs were a lot more mature so of course they are further ahead on the life cycle.

    It is also bullshit that putting the shipbuilding companies under United Shipbuilding Corporation made things worse. This is painfully obvious if you look at the Amur shipyard as a case in point. It had systemic problems which originally led to its nuclear attack submarine production being cut when Yeltsin was still in power. It took nine whole years to build and launch its first corvette. It is now doing much better. The fact is most of these shipyards did not have the economies of scale to handle projects on their own, a lot of them lacked trained staff, they lacked civilian orders when military orders did not come, putting them under the same enterprise allows mitigating these issues. Could it have been solved some other way? Probably. But other solutions were tried before and they did not work. The alternative in the US, a private duopoly which continuously milks the state for cash, is not better.

    GarryB, Big_Gazza, kvs, Hole, The_Observer and Lurk83 like this post

    kvs
    kvs

    Posts : 10282
    Points : 10429
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Canuckistan

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  kvs Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:34 am

    Another poop contribution by the TL troll to this forum.

    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 29853
    Points : 30381
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  GarryB Fri Jun 18, 2021 12:44 pm

    This is butt hurt from US intelligence via the Jamestown org website of lies and fabrications.

    At 30K ton this dry dock has nothing to do with the one that sank which had more than twice that capacity at 80K... but then that was made in the late 1970s so the Soviet shipbuilding capacity must have been shit then too because it was made in Sweden... hey... maybe the ability to make dry docks is not a critical skill that is pivotal to the future growth and development of the Russian Navy...

    Maybe Russia is throwing some work at Turkey to get a few favours or just good neighbourly relations... you know... like America doesn't.

    Big_Gazza and Hole like this post

    Rodion_Romanovic
    Rodion_Romanovic

    Posts : 1470
    Points : 1460
    Join date : 2015-12-30
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:33 pm

    GarryB wrote:This is butt hurt from US intelligence via the Jamestown org website of lies and fabrications.

    At 30K ton this dry dock has nothing to do with the one that sank which had more than twice that capacity at 80K... but then that was made in the late 1970s so the Soviet shipbuilding capacity must have been shit then too because it was made in Sweden... hey... maybe the ability to make dry docks is not a critical skill that is pivotal to the future growth and development of the Russian Navy...

    Maybe Russia is throwing some work at Turkey to get a few favours or just good neighbourly relations... you know... like America doesn't.
    I am not a naval engineer or a shipyard specialist, but I believe that a floating dock could be build without problem by Russian yards.
    One of the reasons of the foreign build of the floating dock could also be the availability of space and resources in Russia. A floating dock is not that high level of technology or contains military secrets.

    Probably all the Russian shipyards large enough for building this had more important and more lucrative orders, while the Turkish yard had more availability and less orders.

    It was a similar story for the PD50 yard
    wikipedia wrote:In March 1978, Götaverken Arendal shipyard in Gothenburg, Sweden was awarded a contract for the construction of the world's largest floating dry dock for the Soviet Union. While the company had previously built mainly oil tankers and bulk carriers, it was struggling for new orders after demand for one of its main products had dwindled following the 1973 oil crisis, and bidding for the dry dock was one of the shipyard's attempts to diversify its portfolio
    It was not a failure for Russia (or 40 years ago for the Soviet union with the much larger PD-50 ) to order the yard abroad, since otherwise it would have occupied important infrastructures that had better things to do (e.g building large ships).
    Especially since probably Sweden (and now Turkey) made a good price, so it was a win win situation.

    GarryB, Big_Gazza, owais.usmani and Rasisuki Nebia like this post

    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 29853
    Points : 30381
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  GarryB Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:40 am

    If they had two Mistrals in service now it would probably actually be four Mistrals by now and they might have ordered this from France because they probably need to send it to the Northern Fleet where it will be used and it would be a shorter trip from France and also a thank you for the Mistrals.

    Instead I guess Turkey had the best bid, but I doubt any bid from France would not be considered anyway.
    Hole
    Hole

    Posts : 4269
    Points : 4263
    Join date : 2018-03-24
    Age : 45
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Hole Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:15 pm

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 E4rma810
    Some well known yard some days ago

    GarryB, kvs and lancelot like this post

    avatar
    owais.usmani

    Posts : 704
    Points : 704
    Join date : 2019-03-27
    Age : 35

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  owais.usmani Fri Jun 25, 2021 12:10 pm

    Hole wrote:Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 E4rma810
    Some well known yard some days ago

    Which shipyard is this? Sorry I am unable to identify.
    avatar
    ALAMO

    Posts : 324
    Points : 326
    Join date : 2014-11-25

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  ALAMO Fri Jun 25, 2021 12:29 pm

    Privat Pella.

    owais.usmani likes this post


    Sponsored content

    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News - Page 30 Empty Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Tue Jul 27, 2021 11:45 am