Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK

Mir wrote:Looks like Alrosa is about to make a comeback!  
Picture taken in December.

andalusia wrote:Have anybody here ever heard about the Indonesian Navy Chief of Staff in 2014 after visiting Russia inspected two Kilo-class submarines and decided to cancel the plans because they were in bad condition? Does Russia just retrofit old Kilos or do they make new ones?

This is the quote from the wikipedia article:




"The Indonesian Navy was interested in purchasing two Kilo-class submarines. But in 2014 the Chief of Staff of the Indonesian Navy Laksamana Marsetio after a visit to Russia with the team from the Indonesian Navy to inspect the said submarines decided to cancel the plans. He said "The submarines look good on the outside, but the inside is filled with broken equipment, and the two submarines have been in storage for two years." Indonesia chose to buy six Improved Jang Bogo-class submarines later known as Nagapasa-class submarine instead including a transfer of technology, where Indonesia will eventually build four of six of the submarines with South Korea."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilo-class_submarine#Failed_Bids

While in Russia, added Marsetio, the Indonesian Navy team also saw the new Kilo Class submarine. However, the high price offered made the plan to purchase this type of submarine failed.

Kilo-class submarines are sophisticated submarines with the ability to fire missiles that are quite far away. This ship is needed to strengthen the capabilities of the Indonesian Navy's defense equipment.

George1 wrote:project 636 Ufa

andalusia wrote:I know that Russia will never upgrade the Romanian Kilo submarine since Romania is hostile to Russia but can the Definul submarine be upgraded to Project 636 standards or is it too old?

Can another nation like Venezuela or Iran purchase it and send it to Russia to upgrade?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romanian_submarine_Delfinul

What is the operation costs of a improved Kilo sub compared to the German and French subs? Is it cheaper or more expensive?

I assume that it is cheaper to run and maintain like a lot of Russian military equipment compared to the West.

GarryB wrote:

Can another nation like Venezuela or Iran purchase it and send it to Russia to upgrade?

Therein lies the rub...

How would you feel if you sold something commercially... say cars... you have brand new cars and old second hand cars to sell... and some person came to you and asked about your products but ended up deciding to save a bit of money on buying a car from one of the people you sold a car too. Obviously that person selling the car was just getting rid of it so they aren't interested in helping this new client to support and operate and upgrade this vehicle so they had to come to you because no one else supports your cars.

Are you going to give them a good price?

I woudn't support that... just like a few aircraft companies in Russia didn't offer cheap parts and support to countries that bought cheap second hand aircraft from Eastern Europe in the 1990s and then suddenly realised they kept the spare parts for the few aircraft they kept operating so a cheap plane with no spares and no support stopped being a cheap plane because the Russian companies who earn their living selling aircraft had to earn their living selling only parts... which makes the parts expensive.

If one of those countries wants a cheap sub they should buy an old sub from Russia and pay for an upgrade before it is delivered and buy a supply and support contract with it too.



Will be much more money than buying from eastern europe but it will save money in the end and create better business ties which can be used to get other products too.

The Kilos would not have sold well if they were expensive to operate.

ALAMO wrote:Did anyone find the details? Was it calibrated in the process?