The Situation in the Ukraine. #18

sektor wrote:To everyone who was panicking about Givi disappearing.
His b-day is today.

Hopefully Captain bad news..MR Doom alias "Flagship Victory" , will see how Putin betrayed Novorosiya removing
the leaders of Novorosiya from the warzone..    

We have seen before such conspiracies of Putin "in Bed with Americans and Poroshenko"
betraying Novorosiya.. The whole thing of Minsk-2 ,and Donetsk and Lugansk official announcements is a Game..  just a stupid game they force to play..  Now OSCE will be under pressure to remove the weapons of the Forces pro kiev.. from their side..   If Ukraine try to enter with tanks.. they will be escorted back with something like this..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KR2mseKQkmY

Kornets EM with 10km range will push back any enemy invasion.. this is not mentioning other weapons that Russia have.. and could do the same job. Just before anyone read it anywhere.
Learn this.. Russia will never allow the Rebels to completely disarm. NEVER. . No matter what happens , Russia will never ask the Rebels to completely disarm.. this is not part of Minsk-2 at all. In diplomacy terms.. Russia agree with Ukraine territorial sovereignty , In real practice ..The Rebels effectively have their Independence already..and the reality is what really matters.
The only thing the Rebels need is that either Ukraine give up with the war..and negotiate for peace or that Ukraine disband. .  IF poroshenko continue the war , Ukraine will disband and the Rebels will take all Donetsk and Lugansk ,and then move to support Kharkiv and Odessa.

So is a matter of time before Ukraine disband.. and the rebels will be the spear head of Russia
to get rid of the  Ultra Nationalist and fascist bombing pro Russian cities. Really neither Americans Government or Kiev will be able to continue having control of Ukraine is the war continues and the economy totally collapse.. The first thing will happen is Riots on the streets.
Nation wide.. People looting and trying to get all the food they can from Markets.  It will be impossible for kiev to control Ukraine when everyone go to the streets to protest the government demanding their Independence and or Autonomy. and no longer give a SHIT of their flag.. This is when Russia will take control of Ukraine and without invading or firing a single shot.. The future of kiev is to flee from the country once they lose the control of the nation , thanks to their failed ,and hatred policies against more than half of the population.

PapaDragon wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Neutrality wrote:

Khepesh wrote:
Well, rusvesna when they started out last year made some errors, were too hasty with news that eventually was bogus, but have since tightened their act and are reasonable, no better or worse than say Lifenews. For the story from Hungary they quote Janos Lazar who holds a similar position to Dmitry Peskov or Surkov. Hungary has in the past made statements that they have agents in Ukraine looking to the interests of ethnic Hungarians so this is not a surprise.

Lenta.ru posted basically the same article quoting Lazar. Lazar implied that Budapest has informants within the ranks of the government and that they will do everything to protect the Hungarian minority because they expect the situation to spin out of control within 10 years. Ukrainian counterintelligence and Croatian intelligence on the other hand, do everything to sabotage the efforts of Hungarian intelligence.

We can be certain that Hungary doesn't like seeing all that armor and manpower being sent to Zakarpatiya. As soon as even 1 Hungarian citizen dies, the Hungarians will be forced to do something.

Croatian? This is new. What's their angle here?

Because the current president of Croatia is the biggest NATO lap dog there is, just do a background check on her, you'll know what I mean.

I am familiar with her track record but this is  a stretch even for them.

They were sending weapons to FSA on USA behalf and we know how those clowns ended up but this is different. Very close as compared to middle east and pissing off Syria is not the same as pissing off Russia and Hungary.

Let's take a look at her track record:

1.) Went to high school within walking distance of Los Alamos National Laboratory, one of the few labs in the United States tasked with contracts to design nuclear weapons, with highest amount of secrecy granted by the US govt.

2.) One of three Croatian members of the Trilateral Commission.

3.) From 2011 to 2014 she served as Assistant Secretary General for Public Diplomacy at NATO under secretaries Anders Fogh Rasmussen and Jens Stoltenberg.

When you take all 3 things in to account (there's more mind you), one can come to conclusions...

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Neutrality wrote:

Khepesh wrote:
Well, rusvesna when they started out last year made some errors, were too hasty with news that eventually was bogus, but have since tightened their act and are reasonable, no better or worse than say Lifenews. For the story from Hungary they quote Janos Lazar who holds a similar position to Dmitry Peskov or Surkov. Hungary has in the past made statements that they have agents in Ukraine looking to the interests of ethnic Hungarians so this is not a surprise.

Lenta.ru posted basically the same article quoting Lazar. Lazar implied that Budapest has informants within the ranks of the government and that they will do everything to protect the Hungarian minority because they expect the situation to spin out of control within 10 years. Ukrainian counterintelligence and Croatian intelligence on the other hand, do everything to sabotage the efforts of Hungarian intelligence.

We can be certain that Hungary doesn't like seeing all that armor and manpower being sent to Zakarpatiya. As soon as even 1 Hungarian citizen dies, the Hungarians will be forced to do something.

Croatian? This is new. What's their angle here?

Because the current president of Croatia is the biggest NATO lap dog there is, just do a background check on her, you'll know what I mean.

I am familiar with her track record but this is  a stretch even for them.

They were sending weapons to FSA on USA behalf and we know how those clowns ended up but this is different. Very close as compared to middle east and pissing off Syria is not the same as pissing off Russia and Hungary.

Let's take a look at her track record:

1.) Went to high school within walking distance of Los Alamos National Laboratory, one of the few labs in the United States tasked with contracts to design nuclear weapons, with highest amount of secrecy granted by the US govt.

2.) One of three Croatian members of the Trilateral Commission.

3.) From 2011 to 2014 she served as Assistant Secretary General for Public Diplomacy at NATO under secretaries Anders Fogh Rasmussen and Jens Stoltenberg.

When you take all 3 things in to account (there's more mind you), one can come to conclusions...

First point is kinda stupid tbh.

I live and went to school in a US town that has a few major military installations in it. I was within walking distance of a major military academy and a short drive south from where I live is the NORAD HQ.

Interestingly, ukies have called these withdrawals a 'provocation' and thus far havent shown any willingness to go wandering in to the 'abandoned' territory.

I guess even they, stupid as they can be, smell a rat here.

Its still early days yet, but the fact they havent waded in dancing the conga in just their jackboots shows they know something is going on. Doesnt mean they wont though, they know its a trap, but if orders come from above kiev....

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:What does the enemy think of these odd movements?
Are they also trying to find a hidden meaning behind them?

Unilteral withdraw by NAF can only benefit Maidan at this stage. Maidan's strategy is shelling of Donetsk. They don't care about Donetsk. They are from western Ukraine and mostly likely have never been to Donetsk their entire lives. They will not do any ground offensive which would result in casualties. They will continue with artillery shelling on Donetsk.

Now the ball is in NAF's court. Maidan will continue to shell Donetsk. What will NAF do? Either NAF can leave Donetsk to be leveled to the ground without firing back at Maidan's artillery, or NAF can fire back and we are back at square 1.

Don't expect OSCE to be a player. OSCE is nothing but Maidan's spies and henchmen.


OSCE overseeing NAF withdraw.





Lavrov says Maidan should withdraw from Shirokino. However we all know that will never happen.

Rodinazombie wrote:Its still early days yet, but the fact they havent waded in dancing the conga in just their jackboots shows they know something is going on. Doesn't mean they won't though, they know its a trap, but if orders come from above kiev....

Not necessarily, this could the opportunity for many officers and planners to make a name of their own and the temptation should be enormous without external pressure.

Rodinazombie wrote:Interestingly, ukies have called these withdrawals a 'provocation' and thus far havent shown any willingness to go wandering in to the 'abandoned' territory.

I guess even they, stupid as they can be, smell a rat here.

Its still early days yet, but the fact they havent waded in dancing the conga in just their jackboots shows they know something is going on. Doesnt mean they wont though, they know its a trap, but if orders come from above kiev....

Seems more like common sense (one of the first time that VSU command has shown it). If the opposing side pulls back after relentless shelling without returning fire, wouldn't you agree that something was up? Besides, every time the Ukrops ventured into Novorossiyan territory it hasn't ended well.

Ivan the Colorado wrote:Seems more like common sense (one of the first time that VSU command has shown it). If the opposing side pulls back after relentless shelling without returning fire, wouldn't you agree that something was up? Besides, every time the Ukrops ventured into Novorossiyan territory it hasn't ended well.

True that. Maidan don't care about Donetsk. They see people of eastern Ukraine as second class citizens. They have fun leveling Donetsk to the ground. Bad people they are What Russia should do is give counter battery radars and 203 mm Pions to NAF to level Maidan's artilllery positions the moment they fire at Donetsk.

No shelling on Donetsk today? Maidan is getting lazy

Ivan the Colorado wrote:

Rodinazombie wrote:Interestingly, ukies have called these withdrawals a 'provocation' and thus far havent shown any willingness to go wandering in to the 'abandoned' territory.

I guess even they, stupid as they can be, smell a rat here.

Its still early days yet, but the fact they havent waded in dancing the conga in just their jackboots shows they know something is going on. Doesnt mean they wont though, they know its a trap, but if orders come from above kiev....

Seems more like common sense (one of the first time that VSU command has shown it). If the opposing side pulls back after relentless shelling without returning fire, wouldn't you agree that something was up? Besides, every time the Ukrops ventured into Novorossiyan territory it hasn't ended well.

Common sense isnt using something that you can equate to ukrainian military or political leadership hence the reason it feels more like a eureka moment when they actually use it.

On saying that, ukrainian military performance would probably have been quite different if it werent for political interference, see debalcevo for example. At the moment we are probably seeing that common sense you talk about, sooner or later we may see the result of the political goons getting involved. We will see.

Ivan the Colorado wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Neutrality wrote:

Khepesh wrote:
Well, rusvesna when they started out last year made some errors, were too hasty with news that eventually was bogus, but have since tightened their act and are reasonable, no better or worse than say Lifenews. For the story from Hungary they quote Janos Lazar who holds a similar position to Dmitry Peskov or Surkov. Hungary has in the past made statements that they have agents in Ukraine looking to the interests of ethnic Hungarians so this is not a surprise.

Lenta.ru posted basically the same article quoting Lazar. Lazar implied that Budapest has informants within the ranks of the government and that they will do everything to protect the Hungarian minority because they expect the situation to spin out of control within 10 years. Ukrainian counterintelligence and Croatian intelligence on the other hand, do everything to sabotage the efforts of Hungarian intelligence.

We can be certain that Hungary doesn't like seeing all that armor and manpower being sent to Zakarpatiya. As soon as even 1 Hungarian citizen dies, the Hungarians will be forced to do something.

Croatian? This is new. What's their angle here?

Because the current president of Croatia is the biggest NATO lap dog there is, just do a background check on her, you'll know what I mean.

I am familiar with her track record but this is  a stretch even for them.

They were sending weapons to FSA on USA behalf and we know how those clowns ended up but this is different. Very close as compared to middle east and pissing off Syria is not the same as pissing off Russia and Hungary.

Let's take a look at her track record:

1.) Went to high school within walking distance of Los Alamos National Laboratory, one of the few labs in the United States tasked with contracts to design nuclear weapons, with highest amount of secrecy granted by the US govt.

2.) One of three Croatian members of the Trilateral Commission.

3.) From 2011 to 2014 she served as Assistant Secretary General for Public Diplomacy at NATO under secretaries Anders Fogh Rasmussen and Jens Stoltenberg.

When you take all 3 things in to account (there's more mind you), one can come to conclusions...

First point is kinda stupid tbh.

I live and went to school in a US town that has a few major military installations in it. I was within walking distance of a major military academy and a short drive south from where I live is the NORAD HQ.

Assuming your in a high position in NATO, otherwise how is your life even relevant to this? Were talking about a assistant secretary general of NATO, where she was profiled and groomed as a young adult for her predetermined role, and the area where the Los Alamos Lab is located, is heavy on the intelligence and security service detail, which probably profiled and recruited her back when she was still in high school. Now also consider NATO's advocacy for ABM proliferation, combined with the fact that Croatia is located in Eastern Europe and has heated relations with Serbia, combined with the fact she was groomed by 'Strangeloves' who likely associated with Los Alamos Lab, combined with her membership in the Trilateral Commission, and you have an explosive geopolitical concoction if there ever was one.

Rodinazombie wrote:

Ivan the Colorado wrote:

Rodinazombie wrote:Interestingly, ukies have called these withdrawals a 'provocation' and thus far havent shown any willingness to go wandering in to the 'abandoned' territory.

I guess even they, stupid as they can be, smell a rat here.

Its still early days yet, but the fact they havent waded in dancing the conga in just their jackboots shows they know something is going on. Doesnt mean they wont though, they know its a trap, but if orders come from above kiev....

Seems more like common sense (one of the first time that VSU command has shown it). If the opposing side pulls back after relentless shelling without returning fire, wouldn't you agree that something was up? Besides, every time the Ukrops ventured into Novorossiyan territory it hasn't ended well.

Common sense isnt using something that you can equate to ukrainian military or political leadership hence the reason it feels more like a eureka moment when they actually use it.

On saying that, ukrainian military performance would probably have been quite different if it werent for political interference, see debalcevo for example. At the moment we are probably seeing that common sense you talk about, sooner or later we may see the result of the political goons getting involved. We will see.

AFAIK the NAF soldiers have not abandoned their positions and still have considerable weaponry to use. No mention has been made of ATGW or MANPADs being withdrawn or heavy MG and grenade launchers. They seem to be pulling back anything called artillery or mortar, 23mm and above, plus any armour.

There is probably a bit of panic in the UAF trying to work out if all this NAF gear is being moved for a strike.

As all UAF positions are known, should there be any UAF strike, or even a decision to avenge the city shelling properly, all hell will rain down from longer range, the withdrawn NAF gear might even have got in the way of that.

Nothing like unsettling and confusing the enemy. This could be looked back on as quite a clever move.

magnumcromagnon wrote:

Ivan the Colorado wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Neutrality wrote:

Khepesh wrote:
Well, rusvesna when they started out last year made some errors, were too hasty with news that eventually was bogus, but have since tightened their act and are reasonable, no better or worse than say Lifenews. For the story from Hungary they quote Janos Lazar who holds a similar position to Dmitry Peskov or Surkov. Hungary has in the past made statements that they have agents in Ukraine looking to the interests of ethnic Hungarians so this is not a surprise.

Lenta.ru posted basically the same article quoting Lazar. Lazar implied that Budapest has informants within the ranks of the government and that they will do everything to protect the Hungarian minority because they expect the situation to spin out of control within 10 years. Ukrainian counterintelligence and Croatian intelligence on the other hand, do everything to sabotage the efforts of Hungarian intelligence.

We can be certain that Hungary doesn't like seeing all that armor and manpower being sent to Zakarpatiya. As soon as even 1 Hungarian citizen dies, the Hungarians will be forced to do something.

Croatian? This is new. What's their angle here?

Because the current president of Croatia is the biggest NATO lap dog there is, just do a background check on her, you'll know what I mean.

I am familiar with her track record but this is  a stretch even for them.

They were sending weapons to FSA on USA behalf and we know how those clowns ended up but this is different. Very close as compared to middle east and pissing off Syria is not the same as pissing off Russia and Hungary.

Let's take a look at her track record:

1.) Went to high school within walking distance of Los Alamos National Laboratory, one of the few labs in the United States tasked with contracts to design nuclear weapons, with highest amount of secrecy granted by the US govt.

2.) One of three Croatian members of the Trilateral Commission.

3.) From 2011 to 2014 she served as Assistant Secretary General for Public Diplomacy at NATO under secretaries Anders Fogh Rasmussen and Jens Stoltenberg.

When you take all 3 things in to account (there's more mind you), one can come to conclusions...

First point is kinda stupid tbh.

I live and went to school in a US town that has a few major military installations in it. I was within walking distance of a major military academy and a short drive south from where I live is the NORAD HQ.

Assuming your in a high position in NATO, otherwise how is your life even relevant to this? Were talking about a assistant secretary general of NATO, where she was profiled and groomed as a young adult for her predetermined role, and the area where the Los Alamos Lab is located, is heavy on the intelligence and security service detail, which probably profiled and recruited her back when she was still in high school. Now also consider NATO's advocacy for ABM proliferation, combined with the fact that Croatia is located in Eastern Europe and has heated relations with Serbia, combined with the fact she was groomed by 'Strangeloves' who likely associated with Los Alamos Lab, combined with her membership in the Trilateral Commission, and you have an explosive geopolitical concoction if there ever was one.

Nah, I just don't think there is any real correlation between her and a top secret laboratory. This doesn't hurt any of your other points. The laboratory does have a political role and it exists primarily as a research facility and nothing more. The researchers there have nothing to do with politics too and they wouldn't go around recruiting local high school students to serve as agents to push the geopolitical agenda of some bureaucrats a few thousand miles away. I heard it is hard enough for college students in STEM fields to get an internship at Los Almos. If she lived in close to Capitol Hill or Langley and still had those high connections, there could be a link, I just don't see one otherwise.

Yes, well, mmmm, my highlight.

KIEV (Sputnik) — Kiev has fulfilled its commitments under the Minsk agreement and hopes to regain control over the Donbass region until the end of the year, Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko said Sunday.

On Thursday, Poroshenko submitted a proposal on constitutional amendments which would address the special status of the Donbass region to the Ukrainian parliament, the Verkhovna Rada.

"It is Ukraine's obligations to carry out constitutional reforms. We are ahead of the schedule, with the 11th article [of the Minsk agreement] de facto fulfilled. We have launched the process of constitutional amendments. Now, Russia must begin to carry out its obligations as it should be 'until the end of the year.' Russia must withdraw illegal armed formations, close the border and give the border control back to Ukraine," Poroshenko told the ICTV television channel in an interview. Poroshenko added that "the understanding with the Ukrainian brothers will be found" as soon as Ukraine regains control over the Donbass region.

Constitutional amendments providing more autonomy to the Donetsk and Lugansk regions were stipulated by the February Minsk agreements signed by Kiev and Donbass representatives, along with a ceasefire deal.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150719/1024815652.html#ixzz3gNe2STvx

Flagship Victory wrote:

Ivan the Colorado wrote:Seems more like common sense (one of the first time that VSU command has shown it). If the opposing side pulls back after relentless shelling without returning fire, wouldn't you agree that something was up? Besides, every time the Ukrops ventured into Novorossiyan territory it hasn't ended well.

True that. Maidan don't care about Donetsk. They see people of eastern Ukraine as second class citizens. They have fun leveling Donetsk to the ground. Bad people they are What Russia should do is give counter battery radars and 203 mm Pions to NAF to level Maidan's artilllery positions the moment they fire at Donetsk.

All of these words have been echoed by the people currently in control in Kiev in one form or another actually.

NAF has a few Russian and one or two captured US counter battery radars and they used them two show the OSCE that the Ukrops were bombing them before. Those radars are pretty advanced tech and you wouldn't find them lying around in Ukrainian Military base filled with derelict equipment.

NAF doesn't need much more artillery as they have more than enough lying around.

sektor wrote:To everyone who was panicking about Givi disappearing.
His b-day is today.

Awesome

This is how American Government Propaganda operates.. This is the norm ,not a rare thing..
but actually the standard procedure in ALL CONFLICTS they interfere directly or
indirectly and wants to manipulate public opinion ,in a way that the government can justify
their actions..

Anyone remembers the Japaneses hostages of ISIS?  

Moon light studio productions presents..



As it happens many of the videos uploaded on internet are actually made
by the CIA and US Government federal Agencies..

The next video.. was hacked/stolen from a Laptop from MCAIN staff when visited
Ukraine..  



Notice the fake sand in floor ,how the whole scene is filmed in a film studio.
Disinformation is a real important part of western organized conflicts.. and Ukraine
is one of them..  Those videos of people in Crosses crucified like Christ looks more like
a provocation to Russia.  Unfortunately in Eastern Ukraine people really die every week..
and because Russia backup the Rebels.. NATO cannot interfere directly there.. so their objectives are different.. that is demonization of Russia.. and provoking Russia to invade Ukraine ,so give them another Afgan 10 years war. Is not necessary to win but to keep the
conflict going.. for that manipulation of Ukraine society that.. "Russia is evil" and that all
their economy problems.. is "Russia Fault"  needs to continue.  

the videos aboves are really good examples to illustrate how far western agencies can go..
to get the propaganda they want. in the videos above case..They want to justify the invasion of Syria to "Stop ISIS" before they continue killing their allies.  

If Russia army invade Ukraine with thousands soldiers and tanks and airforce with the intention to stay defending Donetsk and Lugansk., (which i doubt will ever happen..thats what the west wants. ) the first thing you will see is LOTS of Moon light productions actors.. probably civilians "killed" and "Russian soldiers" blamed for it.. and such videos later will be used to Manipulate the Ukrainian population as "proof" of Evil Putin.. and how Ukrainians needs to United to Fight Evil Russia. .

To remember this fakes ,pulled by the west in middle east is really useful.. whenever
you see Russian army tanks" in Ukraine killing women and children.. or "Russian soldiers"
in Russian army uniforms.. beating civilians or raping womens.. They will try to do that.. already
ViCE reports accuse Russia Army of torturing Ukrainians who reject their invasion..But they do not use Moon studios for that.. but only "witness declarations"  of what happens in Donetsk,
and "how they want Russian army to leave". The west do have the capabilities to pull a stunt
with almost any Russian hardware.. ,including 3d printed Armata's made in clay, and make a video if its helps to create an image problem to Russia.. something like videos of "hundreds of Russian soldiers killed" or even "armata tanks" in Ukraine destroyed.. or a more convenient one will be a BUk defense fake video with Rebels discussing "how they shot" the malasyan plane .

JohninMK wrote:Yes, well, mmmm, my highlight.

KIEV (Sputnik) — Kiev has fulfilled its commitments under the Minsk agreement and hopes to regain control over the Donbass region until the end of the year, Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko said Sunday.

On Thursday, Poroshenko submitted a proposal on constitutional amendments which would address the special status of the Donbass region to the Ukrainian parliament, the Verkhovna Rada.

"It is Ukraine's obligations to carry out constitutional reforms. We are ahead of the schedule, with the 11th article [of the Minsk agreement] de facto fulfilled. We have launched the process of constitutional amendments. Now, Russia must begin to carry out its obligations as it should be 'until the end of the year.' Russia must withdraw illegal armed formations, close the border and give the border control back to Ukraine," Poroshenko told the ICTV television channel in an interview. Poroshenko added that "the understanding with the Ukrainian brothers will be found" as soon as Ukraine regains control over the Donbass region.

Constitutional amendments providing more autonomy to the Donetsk and Lugansk regions were stipulated by the February Minsk agreements signed by Kiev and Donbass representatives, along with a ceasefire deal.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150719/1024815652.html#ixzz3gNe2STvx

Yeah porky, sure...

And tonight a had sex with Taylor Swift. Hard. 11 times in a row.

Reality is such a flexible thing....

Ivan the Colorado wrote:

Rodinazombie wrote:Interestingly, ukies have called these withdrawals a 'provocation' and thus far havent shown any willingness to go wandering in to the 'abandoned' territory.

I guess even they, stupid as they can be, smell a rat here.

Its still early days yet, but the fact they havent waded in dancing the conga in just their jackboots shows they know something is going on. Doesnt mean they wont though, they know its a trap, but if orders come from above kiev....

Seems more like common sense (one of the first time that VSU command has shown it). If the opposing side pulls back after relentless shelling without returning fire, wouldn't you agree that something was up? Besides, every time the Ukrops ventured into Novorossiyan territory it hasn't ended well.

Ukrops may try to play smart but with all that juicy ''undefended'' clay just sitting there it is matter of time before they jump the gun or they risk one of their less intelligent but very numerous elements going at it themselves or, better yet, going after Kiev.

He forgot to add that he was talking about his dreams.

Rodinazombie wrote:

auslander wrote:Calm down, gentlemen, sit and watch.

Indeed.

Its quite clear, NAF is up to something.

As sherlock himself would say, the game is afoot.

Yes. Donetsk People's Republic, etc. is not in it this long to lose.

...trying to catch up on reading the Ukraine threads. I see lots of shelling, but still doesn't seem as bad as it was before Debaltsevo (spelling?).

Looks like all those miners and tractor drivers in the East are catching up on training and re-supplying.

The ATO in the West is crazy.

ATO in Transcarpathia !?

Real time commo with Gorlovka says, as of 04:30 this morning, the orcs are still pounding away and have been off and on all night and yesterday.