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Oh my... good that there is an adult (Mourao) to oversee this brat... vice-president has denied any military action in Venezuela. Would not be good for US to unseat him, he is the true army guy in the government.George1 wrote:Brazilian president Jair Bolsonaro has said that if there was a military invasion in Venezuela, he would ask the country's parliament if Brazil should join, Reuters reported.
Bolsonaro has reportedly added that Brazil and the US are trying to sow dissent within Venezeula's army.
https://sputniknews.com/latam/201904091073938076-brazil-president-bolsonaro-venezuela-can-not-stay-as-it-is/
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Venezuela crisis
Poll
Will usa be successful in installing it's puppet
- [ 9 ]
[24%]
- [ 28 ]
- [76%]
Total Votes: 37
Poll closed
Poll closed
LMFS- Posts : 5111
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Join date : 2018-03-03
LMFS- Posts : 5111
Points : 5107
Join date : 2018-03-03
Tsavo Lion wrote:Russia may get VAF F-16s:
https://svpressa.ru/war21/article/227540/?utm_source=24smi&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=2152&utm_content=2147847&utm_campaign=573
Wouldn't it be sweet to reverse-engineer the F-16 with help of Chinese and Iranians and sell "do it yourself" kits all over the world at cost prices? Dozens of Western aligned AFs in the world would find it extremely amusing to see their potential enemies fielding essentially the same planes they have and having knowledge of their systems. For even more fun, the opposite would not be true since the substituting avionics would not be known to the West. Turkey could contribute to the effort (they have up to date knowledge of the avionics and capacity to build almost all systems for the F-16) as a show of gratitude if they are finally kicked out of the F-35 program. Talk about using the resources of the enemy against them
The new "aggressor" squadrons in Russia and China:
magnumcromagnon- Posts : 8138
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LMFS wrote:Tsavo Lion wrote:Russia may get VAF F-16s:
https://svpressa.ru/war21/article/227540/?utm_source=24smi&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=2152&utm_content=2147847&utm_campaign=573
Wouldn't it be sweet to reverse-engineer the F-16 with help of Chinese and Iranians and sell "do it yourself" kits all over the world at cost prices? Dozens of Western aligned AFs in the world would find it extremely amusing to see their potential enemies fielding essentially the same planes they have and having knowledge of their systems. For even more fun, the opposite would not be true since the substituting avionics would not be known to the West. Turkey could contribute to the effort (they have up to date knowledge of the avionics and capacity to build almost all systems for the F-16) as a show of gratitude if they are finally kicked out of the F-35 program. Talk about using the resources of the enemy against them
The new "aggressor" squadrons in Russia and China:
Seeing how the U.S. side killed the parts supply on the contracts, I guess a reverse-engineered parts supply black market is due. Is there any real legal repercussions? Is there legal legs to stand on? Nations that would go as far as to procure the 3rd-party parts would probably already be under economic attack (sanctions, attacks on their bond market, etc.), besides NATO states do the same exact thing with soviet era equipment, so whats good for the goose is good for the gander!
LMFS- Posts : 5111
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True, West is stealing Kalashnikov IP in plain sight right now, so they should be ready for the consequences. There would be obvious IP issues but there could be also claims that US held back the spares needed to keep the fleets operational out of political motivations, not leaving the operators other way forward than reverse-engineering the plane. And the countries taking the lead here could be the ones already under such an amount of sanctions that one more would do no difference, like Iran, North Korea or Russia, with the difference that the build kits and spares could produce a handsome profit and provide notable deterrence capability to the buying countries / force massive update expenses in the supposedly advanced Western air forces using F-16. With the thousands of planes in operation this could be a good kick in the collective West's balls indeedmagnumcromagnon wrote:Seeing how the U.S. side killed the parts supply on the contracts, I guess a reverse-engineered parts supply black market is due. Is there any real legal repercussions? Is there legal legs to stand on? Nations that would go as far as to procure the 3rd-party parts would probably already be under economic attack (sanctions, attacks on their bond market, etc.), besides NATO states do the same exact thing with soviet era equipment, so whats good for the goose is good for the gander!
GarryB- Posts : 39672
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What they should do is Russianise the aircraft, with new Russian parts and components as an "upgrade".
They should be able to replicate basic components that need replacement during normal use, but most of the time if they can replace western parts with Russian parts it would become rather easier to transition their new customers to a Russian alternative further down the track...
I think an Al-41 engine might suit the aircraft rather well...
They should be able to replicate basic components that need replacement during normal use, but most of the time if they can replace western parts with Russian parts it would become rather easier to transition their new customers to a Russian alternative further down the track...
I think an Al-41 engine might suit the aircraft rather well...
LMFS- Posts : 5111
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F100/F110 and AL-31 family are quite similar in external dimensions indeed, some centimeters apart, and have similar levels of thrust. Biggest difference is external diameter but I don't have data for all the many engines in the family. Even F100 and F110 which both are used in F-16 have different inlet and flow needs, so the F-16 using F110 are called "big mouths". BPR is quite different, AL-31 should be more economic to operate.GarryB wrote:I think an Al-41 engine might suit the aircraft rather well...
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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I don't think it will be worth to reverse engineer the F-16, or China could use a Pakistani 1 for that a long time go. She has a similar, but bigger J-10: https://aviatia.net/j-10-vs-f-16/
Parts is another matter.
Iran takes control of Venezuela after Russia
https://politobzor.net/192617-iran-idet-v-venesuelu-vsled-za-rossiey.html?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com
The attack against the rising multipolar order goes through Nicaragua
http://www.pravdareport.com/opinion/142344-nicaragua/
Pence: US Determined to Oust Venezuela’s Maduro and ‘All Options Are On the Table’
https://news.antiwar.com/2019/04/10/pence-us-determined-to-oust-venezuelas-maduro-and-all-options-are-on-the-table/
Parts is another matter.
Iran takes control of Venezuela after Russia
https://politobzor.net/192617-iran-idet-v-venesuelu-vsled-za-rossiey.html?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com
The attack against the rising multipolar order goes through Nicaragua
http://www.pravdareport.com/opinion/142344-nicaragua/
Pence: US Determined to Oust Venezuela’s Maduro and ‘All Options Are On the Table’
https://news.antiwar.com/2019/04/10/pence-us-determined-to-oust-venezuelas-maduro-and-all-options-are-on-the-table/
Last edited by Tsavo Lion on Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:15 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : add link)
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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US Issues New Venezuela-Related Sanctions
Pompeo: China Financing of Maduro Prolongs Venezuela Crisis
Former Venezuelan General With 'Treasure Trove' of Intelligence Arrested for Drug Trafficking
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-47917291
US Slaps Sanctions on Four Shipping Firms, Nine Ships, Carrying Oil From Venezuela https://www.antiwar.com/
https://lenta.ru/news/2019/04/13/blitzkrieg/
https://ria.ru/20190414/1552674503.html
Pompeo: China Financing of Maduro Prolongs Venezuela Crisis
Former Venezuelan General With 'Treasure Trove' of Intelligence Arrested for Drug Trafficking
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-47917291
US Slaps Sanctions on Four Shipping Firms, Nine Ships, Carrying Oil From Venezuela https://www.antiwar.com/
https://lenta.ru/news/2019/04/13/blitzkrieg/
https://ria.ru/20190414/1552674503.html
Last edited by Tsavo Lion on Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:39 pm; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : add link)
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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https://ria.ru/20190419/1552823590.html
Putin Envoy in Caracas Rejects US Revival of Monroe Doctrine
https://www.yahoo.com/news/putin-envoy-caracas-rejects-us-revival-monroe-doctrine-193155933.html
Venezuela Skirts US Sanctions by Funneling Oil Sales Via Russia
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-politics-rosneft-exclusive/exclusive-venezuela-skirts-u-s-sanctions-by-funneling-oil-sales-via-russia-idUKKCN1RU2A4
Russia Says It Will Help Venezuela, Cuba to Weather US Sanctions
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-venezuela-politics-bolton-russia/russia-says-it-will-help-venezuela-cuba-to-weather-u-s-sanctions-ria-idUKKCN1RU0NV
Putin Envoy in Caracas Rejects US Revival of Monroe Doctrine
https://www.yahoo.com/news/putin-envoy-caracas-rejects-us-revival-monroe-doctrine-193155933.html
Venezuela Skirts US Sanctions by Funneling Oil Sales Via Russia
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-politics-rosneft-exclusive/exclusive-venezuela-skirts-u-s-sanctions-by-funneling-oil-sales-via-russia-idUKKCN1RU2A4
Russia Says It Will Help Venezuela, Cuba to Weather US Sanctions
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-venezuela-politics-bolton-russia/russia-says-it-will-help-venezuela-cuba-to-weather-u-s-sanctions-ria-idUKKCN1RU0NV
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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Behind the Scenes of Russia’s Military Detachment to Venezuela
andalusia- Posts : 735
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what do you guys think of this article by the vox? Is it any truth or is it wrong in some ways?
It differs from the point of view of many on here.
https://www.vox.com/2019/2/15/18225109/elliott-abrams-ilhan-omar-venezuela?fbclid=IwAR3WPoHEVD0oMxVMgNsfsl8odTlMVR9hHUPkGkJj8YFH1R0iL9-MsuiXNI4
It differs from the point of view of many on here.
https://www.vox.com/2019/2/15/18225109/elliott-abrams-ilhan-omar-venezuela?fbclid=IwAR3WPoHEVD0oMxVMgNsfsl8odTlMVR9hHUPkGkJj8YFH1R0iL9-MsuiXNI4
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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Republicans & Rupert Murdoch Created al-Qaeda when Ilhan Omar's Somalia upheld Scientific Socialism
If Russia didn't support Bashar Assad, Syria would be another Iraq & Afghanistan now; If Trump & Adams have their way in Venezuela, a new dirty war will start & last for years, possibly spreading to Colombia & Brazil. Obama already started a civil war in Ukraine that Russia managed well so far.
If Russia didn't support Bashar Assad, Syria would be another Iraq & Afghanistan now; If Trump & Adams have their way in Venezuela, a new dirty war will start & last for years, possibly spreading to Colombia & Brazil. Obama already started a civil war in Ukraine that Russia managed well so far.
GarryB- Posts : 39672
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It differs from the point of view of many on here.
Wow, interesting article... I was pretty much thinking this guy is thinking what I was thinking till I got to:
While Venezuela may resemble Cold War-era conflicts in Latin America in the abstract, the details of it are quite different. In this case, the regime led by leftist President Nicolás Maduro is clearly responsible for the destruction of Venezuela’s economy and the collapse of its democracy. His challenger, Juan Guaidó — whom the US is backing — not only seems to have a pretty solid claim to being the actual legitimate president of the country but could also be the best chance Venezuela has to escape this nightmare.
What the Fuck...
Who cares if Maduro has made serious changes to the Venezuela economy... he is the democratically elected leader of the country... they voted him in just last year, and his so called challenger was largely unknown by the people of Venezuela before January this year and he has never even received one vote in an election for the leadership of the country...
I could say the American economy is fucked up... 21 trillion dollars debt for fucks sake... how about we declare Tom Hanks as the legitimate president of the United States... no one voted for him but apparently that does not matter... he could be the legitimate leader of the country.
The best chance for Venezuela to escape its nightmare is for the US to be nuked from orbit by some passing by friendly aliens...
Rather, he’s asserting that Maduro is not the legitimate president because the election he won last May was rigged — an assertion backed up by many citizens and international observers.
Really?
Because at the time US observers said nothing at all...
So this is clearly a wolf in sheeps clothing attack... pretend to give a fuck about people and then recommend that the best solution is to let the wolf eat as many sheep as it wants because then it will go away and I can continue what I was doing and I will be happy... after all a war started by America wont kill everyone in Venezuela... just some and it is not the first war crimes we have supported and it wont be the last... let us steal your enormous untapped oil resources and we will make things right... and we can do that because we are the reason things are so wrong at the moment so obviously we can fix things quickly for you if you just turn around and bend down and pick up the soap so to speak...
If Russia didn't support Bashar Assad, Syria would be another Iraq & Afghanistan now; If Trump & Adams have their way in Venezuela, a new dirty war will start & last for years, possibly spreading to Colombia & Brazil. Obama already started a civil war in Ukraine that Russia managed well so far.
Indeed, if Russia can keep the venezuelans out of the jaws of the US long enough to recover and develop alternatives to things the US has cut off, then they might avoid becoming Libya or Afghanistan.
In the Ukraine Russia managed to get back the Crimea and it is gradually completely replacing its Ukraine sourced dependencies like engines and rocket components... so in the longer term it is good for Russia... not so good for the Ukraine because their new best buddies... America... doesn't give a shit about Antonov or Motor Sich, or their large shipyards or coal mines....
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andalusia wrote:what do you guys think of this article by the vox? Is it any truth or is it wrong in some ways?
It differs from the point of view of many on here.
https://www.vox.com/2019/2/15/18225109/elliott-abrams-ilhan-omar-venezuela?fbclid=IwAR3WPoHEVD0oMxVMgNsfsl8odTlMVR9hHUPkGkJj8YFH1R0iL9-MsuiXNI4
Mostly true.
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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US mulls naval blockade of Venezuela
https://regnum.ru/news/polit/2618809.html
https://regnum.ru/news/polit/2618809.html
miketheterrible- Posts : 7383
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Tsavo Lion wrote:US mulls naval blockade of Venezuela
https://regnum.ru/news/polit/2618809.html
They can go ahead. Doing so will just further show the world what they really are. And on top of that, Russia will continue to fly in, same with China. And they can still get vessels through since US Naval blockade cant cover all of Venezuelas coast line without stretching themselves thin. And it wouldn't be the first time a civil tanker may end up running into a US vessel
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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The Cuban coastline is longer, & the US blockaded it. They can send their CG ships there too...US Naval blockade cant cover all of Venezuelas coast line without stretching themselves thin.
miketheterrible- Posts : 7383
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Tsavo Lion wrote:The Cuban coastline is longer, & the US blockaded it. They can send their CG ships there too...US Naval blockade cant cover all of Venezuelas coast line without stretching themselves thin.
Its closer to the US (Cuba). Let us not forget that back then, no one would be stupid enough to ram vessels into each other on a daily occurrence. Now it just seems to happen more so than not. Mistakes happen. Right?
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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Puerto Rico, Honduras, Panama, Colombia & Aruba bases r close enough to support the blockade. The US can also sabotage port facilities like they did the power plants.
miketheterrible- Posts : 7383
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Tsavo Lion wrote:Puerto Rico, Honduras, Panama, Colombia & Aruba bases r close enough to support the blockade. The US can also sabotage port facilities like they did the power plants.
Of course, but I think you are clearly ignoring what I am trying to say.
These days, a Naval blockade may not work unless it is a narrow passage way like Kerch straight or a Canal. In this case, its a coast line.
Regardless, it wont happen. If it does, then Russia and China will find other ways to get around it. This could also be declaration of war by Venezuela standards and would end up stirring a conflict which no one actually wants.
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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Aircraft & mines may also be used against ships. The insurance will skyrocket & the shipping companies will cut their losses.
miketheterrible- Posts : 7383
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Tsavo Lion wrote:Aircraft & mines may also be used against ships. The insurance will skyrocket & the shipping companies will cut their losses.
You aren't grasping the realities here.
That stuff doesn't fly anymore. If Russia and or China decides to go to Venezuela by ship with escort, US won't do shit because not only would their blockade not be legal, they would have no one to back them if they did something stupid that forced Russian or Chinese retaliation. So they will go through that blockade no matter how much power you think they got. Cuban missile crisis was one thing, this is different. It's purely economical. If a civilian vessel Rams into the US ships, then they cant do jack shit either. Wouldn't be first time nor last of a ship ramming into another to make a point or show of force without actually opening fire.
Last edited by miketheterrible on Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5953
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No, Trump isn't grasping!
miketheterrible- Posts : 7383
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Tsavo Lion wrote:No, Trump isn't grasping!
Re read what I wrote.
Trump won't do shit.
Isos- Posts : 11379
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miketheterrible wrote:Tsavo Lion wrote:Puerto Rico, Honduras, Panama, Colombia & Aruba bases r close enough to support the blockade. The US can also sabotage port facilities like they did the power plants.
Of course, but I think you are clearly ignoring what I am trying to say.
These days, a Naval blockade may not work unless it is a narrow passage way like Kerch straight or a Canal. In this case, its a coast line.
Regardless, it wont happen. If it does, then Russia and China will find other ways to get around it. This could also be declaration of war by Venezuela standards and would end up stirring a conflict which no one actually wants.
US navy can block the venezuelan ships but not russian or chinese.
They even don't touch Iranian ships off Yemen.
US can afford to lose a ship to Venezuelan or iranian antiship missiles. It will show the real capabilities of their ship against older and export variants of russian missiles. And russia and China have deadlier ones in their hands than Venezuela or Iran.
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