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    Education in Russia: News

    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Tue Sep 05, 2023 8:27 am

    Modern Hebrew spoken in Israel is a language revived from nothing. And very successfully too. An artificial language even, as it differs as much from ancient Hebrew as modern Greek does from ancient Greek. It was formalized by some Belarussian Jew in the beginning of the 20th century or something and then that work was adopted by the Zionist movement.

    While Israel is kind of a fake country of course, there is no denying the role that this language has played in the cementation of their statehood and identity.

    You can argue that small, local languages are useless and doomed but what if you made that argument about religions, or about peoples themselves. Wouldn't it be better if the entire world's population had the same identity, spoke the same language, all looked the same, and had the same belief system. According to some, that will solve all the world's problems and remove the reasons that everyone is at each others throats.
    Of course though that's nonsense. And not only nonsense, I suspect that more than a few people will object too. Because belief systems are subjective, national identities are subjective, native languages are subjective - but they all have value to the particular people that they belong to. That on the whole though being everyone though; as we all have native languages, national identities and belief systems. Some are under threat and some aren't, that's the only difference.
    And since we're all human, if an aspect of our experience such as knowing one's ancestral language being important to enough people isn't criteria enough to make it a priority for society towards on the whole, no less so than other common interests such as protecting the environment, saving endangered species, etc... then what is?

    So yeah, I can totally get behind language support schemes and language revivals.
    Star Trek style communicator, real-time auto-translation devices do look like they're only a matter of decades away. But I think that after humanity has spent some more time adjusting to this technology, it can actually end up preserving minor languages. No longer will it be necessary to teach kids in the regional lingua franca at school or at least not exclusively in the lingua franca. They simply have all their speech and writing auto-translated regardless. We can already see that here on this forum with a couple of members who I've noticed use Google translate to read everything in their own language and write everything in English.
    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi Tue Sep 05, 2023 9:11 am

    GarryB wrote:
    English is still the most common language used in the majority of international commercial, culture and scientific activities and therefore proficiency in English is essential.

    So Hollywood movies are true where when foreigners are alone they stop speaking their native language and start speaking English?

    I don't quite graps the question here but my argument is the very anti-thesis of it: when people are alone, they can speak whatever they want and nobody have any moral or legal authority to intervene, but when they are negotiating the terms with foreign partners or having a conference with multinational scientists, for example, they have to speak in a way everybody can comprehend.

    In most of the case the suitable language is English, in many other cases it can be Chinese, Vietnamese, Russian, Korean, Japanese. And of course with the increase prestige and influence of China and Russia then the corresponding languages has been gaining momentum but English is still enjoy the first position for many reasons which of course have no association whatsoever with the self-proclaimed moral superiority that the West have been bragging shamelessly without any evidences to back their claims.

    I only state the facts and by no mean to use it to justify the domination of Western imperialism, neither am I attempt to justify the criminal assimilation and cultural genocide that imperialists committed agaisnt Ainu, Okinawans, Maori, Polynesian, or Native Amerinidians. But in order to fight against imperialism we have to understand how much influence they still retain.


    Last edited by higurashihougi on Tue Sep 05, 2023 12:14 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Tue Sep 05, 2023 9:18 am

    Actually, the Russian language is well-represented in science.
    A whole of exSU are using it, lacking their own material.
    Ukrainian scientific and industrial development, or simply being, was carried in Russian. There were no higher degree grade books in Ukrainian, they lacked the vocabulary whatsoever. Plus hardly anyone in Ukraine speaks Ukrainian Laughing Laughing
    The same applies to thousands of students who studied in Russia or Soviet Union. Half of Latin America and Africa are using Russian on a scientific level.
    That alone makes some 300+ mln people.

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    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Tue Sep 05, 2023 10:18 am

    During the Soviet era a lot of the reading materials had Ukrainian versions. Not sure about sciences specifically but definitely a lot of the humanities as well as fiction, etc... And these Ukrainian-language books were all over the stores. This is what I heard at any rate.
    Because essentially the language while confined to the villages and West of the country in colloquial use, seemed to have been marketed as a sort of intellectual language in print as well, for the higher-brow reader.

    When I traveled to Belarus I observed the same phenomenon. The country itself was being "Belarussified" in the public sphere, in a soft non-invasive sort of way, so things like the metro signs and announcements, and stuff like that. On the streets meanwhile all you ever heard was Russian. But when you go into the book store, you notice that the proportion of Belarussian-language literature is very high, considering the dominance of Russian in Minsk. Maybe a 1/3rd of all the books on sale. A lot of high brow stuff among them. And some books were bilingual Russian/Belarussian, which would have been a waste of ink for ordinary consumption as anyone who knows the later surely knows the former, but for someone who wanted to practice their Belarussian - it would have been just the ticket.

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Tue Sep 05, 2023 10:28 am

    Novels and other light literature - sure.
    But they don't have the specialized scientific/technology materials in Ukrainian, and I am pretty sure about that.
    Every single piece provided for a few common projects carried out here was made in Russian.
    The funny is, that most of it is dated in the Soviet era, clearly presenting the level of "ukrainian" complex, honestly.
    Usually, Ukrainian professionals don't even know Ukrainian language words for most things, or try to use some monstrosities that clearly indicate to be made ad hoc "ukrainized" versions of Russian equivalents.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Tue Sep 05, 2023 1:47 pm

    The Ukr language is a political project just like Ukria itself. It follows that it would have gaps such as you see in the science field. Sure, there was an
    Ukr dialect in use by the peasants in the west of Bolshevik concocted Ukraine. But this language did not have any presence in written literature until
    after 1900. All the "Ukrainian" literature before then was written in Russian.

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    caveat emptor
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    Post  caveat emptor Tue Sep 05, 2023 10:12 pm

    Taras Schevchenko was writing mostly in Ukrainian.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Wed Sep 06, 2023 6:48 am

    I don't quite graps the question here but my argument is the very anti-thesis of it: when people are alone, they can speak whatever they want and nobody have any moral or legal authority to intervene, but when they are negotiating the terms with foreign partners or having a conference with multinational scientists, for example, they have to speak in a way everybody can comprehend.

    Understand what you mean but would argue that English is the language of cheating bastards and there are so many different words that appear to mean the same thing but with slightly different meanings so you can be clever when dealing with someone for whom English is not their first language and trick them based on the very specific meaning of the words used where you can choose several, each with a slightly different meaning purposefully to fool or trap the non native English speaker.

    I have a friend whose uncle went from New Zealand to France for a holiday and there was a car accident for which the local was obviously at fault. The local spoke to my friends uncle who spoke english to him and the guy said he would handle it when the policeman approached. The French guy then started claiming that my friends uncle was in the wrong and he was crazy and had threatened the frenchman and he was dangerous. My friends uncle teaches French and put the police officer right... but lots of people will try to get away with things if they think they can... more so in business.

    Speaking English in business is like using the American dollar in international trade... it is a form of power and abuse and should be avoided whereever possible.

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    Post  ALAMO Wed Sep 06, 2023 8:34 am

    caveat emptor wrote:Taras Schevchenko was writing mostly in Ukrainian.

    Schevchenko is a very bad example.
    People citing the case usually don't know, forget, or don't mention by purpose the fact that he was a folklorist and ethnographer, first of all.
    Being a poet was only a side occupancy, assisted by being a painter.
    His principal studies covered local dialect, which we can call his idea fix.
    And a funny case - he was an academician at Art Academy in Peter, which allowed him to carry those cultural and language studies.

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    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Wed Sep 06, 2023 8:53 am

    caveat emptor wrote:Taras Schevchenko was writing mostly in Ukrainian.

    Schevchenko was the original Ukro nationalist

    Complaining about the Moskals in letters to his brother and that his brother's kids wrote to him in Russian instead of a 'human language' (by which he means Ukrainian) clown

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Mon Feb 12, 2024 7:54 pm

    Sanctions convinced Russians of the possibilities of domestic education, by Marina Lemutkina for VZGLYAD. 02.12.2024.

    Sanctions stimulated the country to import substitution and healthy selfishness, with these words experts comment on the results of a survey on the reaction of Russians to Western sanctions directed against Russian education. Sanctions in this area, according to Russians, either did not affect our country at all, or even contributed to the growth of the quality of domestic education.

    The very first blows of anti-Russian sanctions turned out to be very painful for students from Russia studying at foreign universities. “We received appeals from parents, from students themselves. Various life situations began, oppression, various kinds of incidents - everyday, simple, everyday. Students from Russia became uncomfortable. And this is not one or two or ten people, but hundreds and even thousands,” Valery Falkov, head of the Ministry of Education and Science, described the situation a year ago.

    Indeed, sanctions, including in the field of education, have become a serious challenge for our country. “This also applies to our youth, who are faced with a number of challenges,” admitted the head of the Russian government, Mikhail Mishustin. The West was rapidly destroying long-term scientific and educational inter-university ties, blocking academic mobility and exchanges, and complicating the circulation of curricula, scientific ideas and personnel that had existed for decades.

    The Czech Republic, Poland, Great Britain, France, Austria, and Finland especially aggressively squeezed Russian students out of their universities. However, the same processes took place in other Western countries - the USA, the Netherlands, Germany. As a result, by the end of the 2022-2023 academic year, Russian universities accepted two and a half thousand Russian students expelled from universities in unfriendly countries.

    The exodus of Russian students from Western universities has not yet ended. But in the end, Mishustin stated, the sanctions backfired on their authors. But our country is adapting to new conditions, having overcome the negative effect of Western sanctions, in particular in the field of education.

    The Russian government has developed an action plan. To begin with, a simplified mechanism for transferring students from foreign universities to domestic ones has been launched. But the matter will not be limited to emergency measures. The education system is facing large-scale changes.

    “Under the conditions of sanctions and restrictions, domestic enterprises especially need employees - developers of promising equipment, systems engineers, programmers, and representatives of a huge list of other specialties that are necessary to strengthen industrial potential.

    To solve these problems, the Russian education system must become more modern and competitive on the world stage. <...> Now the world is going through another stage of changing technological structures, which is leading to a transformation of the requirements for existing specialties, as well as to the rapid emergence of new professions that require deep competencies in innovative areas. And of course, we need to more actively attract talented young people into the field of research. This will be facilitated by a large number of events within the framework of the Decade of Science and Technology, which was announced by the head of state in 2022,” Mishustin said in early January 2024.

    In particular, a network of new world-class university campuses is being equipped in different regions of the country (on February 1, 2024, campuses were opened in Moscow, Bashkiria, Tatarstan and Ugra; in total there will be 25 such supercampuses ). In parallel, “Advanced Engineering Schools” are being created on the basis of 30 universities, where more than two thousand young people are already studying.

    However, the most interesting thing is perhaps something else. Following the state, society also accepted the challenge posed to Russia by sanctions in the field of education. Thus, according to a December survey by the Synergy University analytical center, 26% of Russians believe that the situation with Western sanctions has a positive impact on the development of the education system in Russia, and only 16% see this as a negative impact.

    An important positive consequence of the sanctions, according to Russians, was Russia’s abandonment of the Bologna education system and the building of its own approach with an emphasis on the interests of the national economy. This position was expressed by 35% of respondents.

    Also, among the important advantages, respondents identified an increase in the quality of education due to the development of new educational directions (29%), strengthening of patriotic education (19%) and the influx of foreign students from countries friendly to Russia (17%).

    This reaction, including regarding the abandonment of the Bologna system, has a completely rational explanation, Vadim Lobov, president of the Synergy corporation, explained to the VZGLYAD newspaper.

    “The Bologna process is one of the most obvious manifestations of cooperation between the Russian education system and the Western one. It is with Russia’s accession to this system that the brain drain from the country is most often associated,” says Lobov. – The guys studied in Russia, the state spent energy and resources on them in the hope that they would work in their country, produce new products or services. But some of them went abroad first on exchange, and then stayed there forever, largely under the influence of propaganda rather than real advantages. Now Russia has withdrawn from the Bologna process – and this flow has stopped. Of course, from the point of view of society and the state, this is positive, which is confirmed by the survey.”

    The authors of the study also found out how the situation with sanctions, as observed by Russians, influenced the choice of profession by students. Amid sanctions, a number of foreign companies left Russia and a significant number of jobs became vacant. As a result, demand among Russians has increased for professions that were not previously particularly popular - for example, workers and engineers (this point of view is shared by 34% of survey participants).

    According to 27%, the number of young people who want to study and work in Russia or in friendly countries has increased. Well, 21% believe that sanctions do not play any role when students choose a future career or specialization.

    58% of respondents believe that sanctions did not have any impact on the educational system at all. Meanwhile, 41% of respondents from among those who see restrictions as having a predominantly negative impact on the education system in Russia (recall that this is only 16%) noted that sanctions have caused difficulties with studying abroad, but the majority (63%) say that This means that sanctions only partially prevent students from gaining international learning experience. About 30% do not see any obstacles and only 7% believe that sanctions completely limit students’ opportunities to get an education or internship abroad.

    The situation is obvious. “About 11 thousand sanctions and restrictions have been imposed against Russia, which to varying degrees affects almost all areas of our life. Therefore, we look at the branch of education that we understand through this prism. It turned out that the sanctions, contrary to expectations, had a very limited, targeted effect, and in some ways even stimulated the country to import substitution and healthy selfishness, which is also noticeable to many. Hence the positive assessments,” Lobov commented on the survey results.

    https://vz.ru/society/2024/2/12/1249648.html

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Mon Feb 12, 2024 9:22 pm

    The hater retards in NATzO couldn't help their base impulses to attack Russians. So they lost a generation of potential pro-western recruits. It is common to see
    around the world people taught in NATzO universities acting like enablers of NATzO's imperial agenda.

    Keep huffing and puffing with hate NATzO. It won't save you.

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