PAK FA, T-50: News #1

TR1 wrote:Garry: info has come out that Sukhoi specifically requested maximum speed be limited to Mach 2.
So no cruising above that speed.

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I know Russia has corruption problems, but I dont think it has cash black holes in the way the USA does."

Yeah, it has far far worse ones. Terrible corruption to this day, and not just in politics.

Firebird wrote:I watched the whole vid. Shows, as we know, how sinister corporate America can be when selling something thats either good or garbage.

Firebird wrote:I wonder how the F-22 stands up to close examination.

Firebird wrote:The next thing I wonder is, how good will the Pak-fa be. Its looking like an extreme bargain compared to the F-35 so far...

Now, let us take a close look at the Russian PAK FA program. The PAK FA already comes with a forward looking large nose mounted I-band Active Electronic Scanned Array (AESA) radar, smaller, side looking I-band AESA radars, and wing mounted C/D-band AESA radars. In addition, it uses multi-spectral IRST both in the front and back. Going by the prototype it seems that extreme manoeuvrability has been given precedence over all aspects of stealth, so the PAK FA may not carry out the deep penetration role of the F-22. It is understood that the PAK FA has been designed from the onset to detect the F-22 or similar stealth aircrafts from a long distance using its IRST and then destroy these aircrafts in a Within Visual Range conflict.Obviously, designing the avionic suite of the PAK FA (also the Sukhoi/HAL FGFA for India) is not going to be easy for Sukhoi. The provision of high capacity avionic cooling is essential, to avoid producing infrared hotspots. Likewise, the need for wideband, yet very low RCS radio-frequency apertures for the use of both passive and active sensors and aircraft datalink/network terminal transceivers. Unlike the Lockheed Martin F-22, which uses conventional stealth technology for signature reduction, Sukhoi favored another innovative approach – 85 percent of the surface of PAK FA is covered with unique coating made of nano-particle materials that decrease the visibility of the plane. (In addition, this coating is also said to offer extra benefit in drag reduction).

Firebird wrote:It would be very interesting if it did emerge that Su-35 beats the F-35.

So a Russian or Chinese SU 35 pilot can very easily defeat a NATO F 35 in both BVR as well as WVR conflict.

Zivo wrote:

So a Russian or Chinese SU 35 pilot can very easily defeat a NATO F 35 in both BVR as well as WVR conflict.

It wouldn't say it would be "very easy", but if the Su-35's were working closely with ground radar the F-35's probably wouldn't last long.

We all know the F-35 has faults. OK some/many will be sorted, perhaps not.
I wonder how the F-22 stands up to close examination.

Anyone wonder whether the Mig1.44 (VTOL) tech that was sold to the US was a "poison pill" ie sent America down a wrong path...

It would be very interesting if it did emerge that Su-35 beats the F-35.

Garry: info has come out that Sukhoi specifically requested maximum speed be limited to Mach 2.
So no cruising above that speed.

After a simulation exercise carried out by the US air force the F 35 ( to quote an Australian Air Force official) "had been clubbed like baby seals by the Sukhois " . Link below :

GarryB wrote:

We all know the F-35 has faults. OK some/many will be sorted, perhaps not.
I wonder how the F-22 stands up to close examination.

F-22s main problem is that it was designed to fight enormous hordes of unstealthy aircraft during a third world war than didn't come at the right time.

The result is that the F-22 is a super sniper, but if you are immune to its bullets (AMRAAM and AIM-9X) then it is in trouble if you are in a smaller more nimble fighter with a modern short range missile or gun.

The F-22 works best from a distance.

Anyone wonder whether the Mig1.44 (VTOL) tech that was sold to the US was a "poison pill" ie sent America down a wrong path...

??? the Mig-1.44 is the stealthy version of the Mig-1.42 built for the MFI program... pretty sure it is not VTOL.

It would be very interesting if it did emerge that Su-35 beats the F-35.

How will we tell? If you read western histories of WWII the Soviet retreat to Moscow in 1941 was a rout, while the British "escape" at Dunkirk was a victory...

Garry: info has come out that Sukhoi specifically requested maximum speed be limited to Mach 2.
So no cruising above that speed.

The same reason for the limitation of the speed of the F-16 and F-18... lower speed requirements means lower costs and allows certain parts to be greatly simplified... including the air intakes.

After a simulation exercise carried out by the US air force the F 35 ( to quote an Australian Air Force official) "had been clubbed like baby seals by the Sukhois " . Link below :

Such simulations make a lot of assumptions... not all of them would apply all of the time. Keep in mind that not using even very good equipment effectively is the leading cause of death in arab israeli wars...

GarryB wrote:The VSTOL main engine bits are license produced Sukhoi technology... the west didn't have a vectored thrust system that could operate in full AB, so they bought the technology cheap from Sukhoi.

AlfaT8 wrote:

GarryB wrote:The VSTOL main engine bits are license produced Sukhoi technology... the west didn't have a vectored thrust system that could operate in full AB, so they bought the technology cheap from Sukhoi.

Wowowowo....GarryB are you telling me that the US/LM had bought the VSTOL vectored thrust systems from Sukhoi under license or are you implying that they replicated it??

Tests of Russia’s fifth-generation T-50 fighter jets in the Chkalov state flight test center in Akhtubinsk, Astrakhan Region in south Russia may start in July, Air Force Commander Lt. Gen. Viktor Bondarev said.
“In two months,” he said Monday when asked when the center would start tests of such jets, adding that the first serial fifth-generation jet may be manufactured in 2014-2015.

United Aircraft Corporation President Mikhail Pogosyan said in April Russia will start state flight tests of the T-50 in 2014.

The fighter jets will enter service with the country’s armed forces in 2016, and not 2015 as was previously announced, President Vladimir Putin said at a live Q&A session with the Russian public in April.
The Defense Ministry had earlier said the jet would be ready in 2015.

The T-50, also known as PAK-FA (future tactical fighter aircraft), first flew in January 2010 and was presented to the public at the Moscow Air Show in 2011.

The T-50, which will be the core of Russia's future fighter fleet, is a fifth-generation multirole fighter aircraft featuring elements of stealth technology, super-maneuverability, super-cruise capability (supersonic flight without use of afterburner), and an advanced avionics suite including an X-band active phased-array radar.

Bondarev also said some 60-70 military airfields will be built or reconstructed for Russia’s Air Force by 2020.

They got consultation from Yak, but the F-35s system in terms of actual hardware is all new.

TR1 wrote:1.) What does Sukhoi have to do with it? I've only heard about a deal with Yak.
2.) I have not heard anything about licensing either. That is a much bigger step than consultation and technological assistance, which is substantial in its own.

n June 1994, Lockheed, which had merged with Martin Marietta to form Lockheed Martin, revealed that it had entered into a collaborative relationship with Yakovlev on their bid for the Joint Advanced Strike Technology competition, consisting of the purchase of design data from the Russian company; according to Jane's All the World's Aircraft 2000-2001 this was data from the cancelled Yak-141 program which employed a similar propulsion system.[5][6][7][8]

Sujoy wrote:The T-50, which will be the core of Russia's future fighter fleet, is a fifth-generation multirole fighter aircraft featuring elements of stealth technology, super-maneuverability, super-cruise capability (supersonic flight without use of afterburner), and an advanced avionics suite including an X-band active phased-array radar.

flamming_python wrote:So you're going to start scanning the skies with Radio telescopes now?
Cool story bro

What's wrong with that . Radar has failed .

Department Of Defense wrote:

Sujoy wrote:The T-50, which will be the core of Russia's future fighter fleet, is a fifth-generation multirole fighter aircraft featuring elements of stealth technology, super-maneuverability, super-cruise capability (supersonic flight without use of afterburner), and an advanced avionics suite including an X-band active phased-array radar.

Fail . The T 50 can be detected by radio telescopes .Radio telescopes can detect signal from stars thousands of light year distance, The basic of these systems is that objects which have certain temperature radiates electromagnetic energy based on Planck"s radiation law.

It is therefore feasible to use these radio telescope like systems to detect stealth targets at great ranges.

What's wrong with that. Radar has failed.

Fail . The T 50 can be detected by radio telescopes .Radio telescopes can detect signal from stars thousands of light year distance, The basic of these systems is that objects which have certain temperature radiates electromagnetic energy based on Planck"s radiation law.

It is therefore feasible to use these radio telescope like systems to detect stealth targets at great ranges.

Hardly. L-Band and X-Band radars can still detect stealth aircraft. For the money it would take to develop a radio telescope for military applications, you could develop a powerful, long-range L-band radar. (I think the biggest obstacle with L-Band and X-Band is that they are relatively short-range, as compared to S-Band)

Zivo wrote:Rust was tracked on multiple occasions and interceptors were sent out. No shootdown order was given for obvious reasons.

BlackArrow wrote:

Zivo wrote:Rust was tracked on multiple occasions and interceptors were sent out. No shootdown order was given for obvious reasons.

What were the obvious reasons? Soviet air defences failed to prevent a foreign aircraft penetrating the most sensitive and protected zone in the whole of the USSR, Rust landed right beside the Kremlin in Red Square - that was not supposed to happen. Certainly a massive failure on the PVO's part. How were they going to learn to deal with a B-2?