Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #12

There are several observation points build by Turkish Army in İdlib and Aleppo. Some observation points are near to Darat Izza. There is one observation point in İdlib. Turkish Army established it or will establish it somewhere near to Al-Hadher or Atarib, I'm not sure about that right now, because Turkish Army convoy couldn't reach to Al-Eis village because of operations conducted by SAA and Russian forces in İdlib and returned to Atarib village. Our convoy is probably still in that village.

It seems that could well have been incoming Kalibre as well.

Using Su-25 jets flying so low using unguided rockets in such heavy air defense protected area is very risky. They should use their Su-25SM as they used them at the beginning of campaign flying high and droping unguided bombs on given targets. They have enough UAVs to fly lower and find targets, specially now, when Abu Duhur airbase have enough big protected perimeter around it to operate safely. For rockets strikes SAA should use Grads, planes should use bombs from higher altitude. I'm sure RuAF will take proper conclusion from this loss of plane and pilot.

Don't full yourselves. Terrorists in Idlib have stong air defense. True, they don't have meduin and long range SAMs, but that doesn't mean they don't have air defense. They have huge arsenal of AA guns of various calibres and large stocks of MANPADs, which they received from Lybia, Turkey, KSA, Qatar, US,... from 2011 till now. They have from Strelas, Iglas to Chinese types of MANPADs. They shot down many Syrian jets and helicopters, so don't underestimate their arsenal. Novorussian army also have only AA guns and MANPADs (now also Osa-AKM), but they still manage to shot down many Ukrainian jets and helicopters. Unguided rockets could not be used from high altitude, bombs could be, so the choise of armament is clear.

medo wrote:Using Su-25 jets flying so low using unguided rockets in such heavy air defense protected area is very risky. They should use their Su-25SM as they used them at the beginning of campaign flying high and droping unguided bombs on given targets. They have enough UAVs to fly lower and find targets, specially now, when Abu Duhur airbase have enough big protected perimeter around it to operate safely. For rockets strikes SAA should use Grads, planes should use bombs from higher altitude. I'm sure RuAF will take proper conclusion from this loss of plane and pilot.

Don't full yourselves. Terrorists in Idlib have stong air defense. True, they don't have meduin and long range SAMs, but that doesn't mean they don't have air defense. They have huge arsenal of AA guns of various calibres and large stocks of MANPADs, which they received from Lybia, Turkey, KSA, Qatar, US,... from 2011 till now. They have from Strelas, Iglas to Chinese types of MANPADs. They shot down many Syrian jets and helicopters, so don't underestimate their arsenal. Novorussian army also have only AA guns and MANPADs (now also Osa-AKM), but they still manage to shot down many Ukrainian jets and helicopters. Unguided rockets could not be used from high altitude, bombs could be, so the choise of armament is clear.

They can still bomb and run after dispensing flares. They just loitered in area we're drones could have been used.

Don't Su-25s have missile detector to know when to lunch flares ? Where is president S ? They have full stocks of MANPADS there, Syrian bases were full of them when they were captured.

Isos wrote:Don't Su-25s have missile detector to know when to lunch flares ? Where is president S ? They have full stocks of MANPADS there, Syrian bases were full of them when they were captured.

President S isn't on the Su-25SM3

Terrorists inside Idlib: 'The Russia/n Pilot didn't want to be captured alive so he threw a hand grenade at us and fired several shots from his sidearm'

Image: the sidearm of the Russian Pilot.

RIP Hero

calm wrote:

Terrorists inside Idlib: 'The Russia/n Pilot didn't want to be captured alive so he threw a hand grenade at us and fired several shots from his sidearm'

Image: the sidearm of the Russian Pilot.

RIP Hero

Good job, pilot. Rest in peace.

I've been saying it. Russia should just stick to UAV and artillery combo. UAV can locate and designate targets and artillery can fire 152 mm Krasnopol from 20 km away well behind the front lines. Would have been far safer than flying around in a plane taking AA fire all day long.

This is very sad and the pilot will be remembered as a hero, but changing your tactics for a loss of only one plane is not how war works. Losses are normal in a war. This only shows how effective those planes are, because of all the sorties they made, only one got lost. The pilot died for his motherland, the greatest honor. RIP

Sent from Topic'it App

miketheterrible wrote:

medo wrote:Using Su-25 jets flying so low using unguided rockets in such heavy air defense protected area is very risky. They should use their Su-25SM as they used them at the beginning of campaign flying high and droping unguided bombs on given targets. They have enough UAVs to fly lower and find targets, specially now, when Abu Duhur airbase have enough big protected perimeter around it to operate safely. For rockets strikes SAA should use Grads, planes should use bombs from higher altitude. I'm sure RuAF will take proper conclusion from this loss of plane and pilot.

Don't full yourselves. Terrorists in Idlib have stong air defense. True, they don't have meduin and long range SAMs, but that doesn't mean they don't have air defense. They have huge arsenal of AA guns of various calibres and large stocks of MANPADs, which they received from Lybia, Turkey, KSA, Qatar, US,... from 2011 till now. They have from Strelas, Iglas to Chinese types of MANPADs. They shot down many Syrian jets and helicopters, so don't underestimate their arsenal. Novorussian army also have only AA guns and MANPADs (now also Osa-AKM), but they still manage to shot down many Ukrainian jets and helicopters. Unguided rockets could not be used from high altitude, bombs could be, so the choise of armament is clear.

They can still bomb and run after dispensing flares. They just loitered in area we're drones could have been used.

Modern MANPADs have multispectral homing heads to distinguish flares from planes, so don't put your safety too much on flares. in Yemen Saudi F-15S was hit after launching flares. Modern FCS enable planes to bomb targets from high altitude. Su-25SM was very succesful with high altitude bombing at the beginning of campaign in Syria. They should keep this tactics over populated area in Idlib. RuAF still have enough Su-34 and Su-30SM with powerful radars to coordinate work of Su-25Sm groups.

The pilot was from Ukrainian airforce who joined RuAF after Crimeas return to Russia.

Good bye hero.

How many losses on Russia side so far? (Personnel and equipment)

RIP...

Hope that kalibers can exact swift revenge.

miketheterrible wrote:

eehnie wrote:

par far wrote:

kvs wrote:Russia needs to slaughter thousands of jihadis to send them the message.   They will feel it even if they dream of
f*cking 72 virgin goats in the afterlife.  

I am a bit suspicious about the timing.   There appear to have been Turk attempts to grab SAA held territory and the Turks
have shot down a Russian jet already.  

RIP to the pilot.

I don't think that Turkey would do something like this, they already are having a tough time against the Kurds and there are reports that the Turks tried to rescue the Russian pilot.

In Idlib, the the Russian Air Force should only use advance d fighters like the SU 30 or the SU 34 because the terrorists have MANPADS, the Syrian Air force has no business being there, just be on the safe side.

How did know the Turks it was a pilot to be rescued?

About the MANPADS, every aircraft can avoid the MANPADS by altitude. Even the L-39. The case of the helicopters is different, it depends of the model.

Unless you dispense flares, bomb, and fly out - you are open Target and easy takedown by manpads if you loitered the area. Unfortunately this looks like what happened.  You can't detect incoming IR/IIR missiles unless you have a camera that picks up the incoming object or UV sensors.  Neither which exists on current used jets.

Flying higher than manpad allows in engagement is only other tactic used.

Sad events that could been avoided if fly either higher or used flares and no loitering. Cost the pilot his life too.

Good thing is the Russians are flattening the area.

He was obviously flying CAS, which limited pilots to URO for most part in RuAF. So he had to fly low, he had no other option with what he was given.

He was obviously flying CAS, which limited pilots to URO for most part in RuAF. So he had to fly low, he had no other option with what he was given.

They really need some reco pods. Even a simple camera with a zoom would be nice. The most advanced zoom in civilian market allow you to clearly zoom on the moon and see the details of it. Just see nikon coolpix p900.

Looking for targets with eyes from less than 1km height is stupid.

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-02-03/video-captures-cruise-missile-strike-militants-shot-down-russian-fighter-jet-syria

Retards posting in the ZH forum think that some video is showing Russia using cluster bombs. This video shows precisely f*ck all.
It could be a barrage of mortar fire filmed elsewhere.

The USA used cluster bombs on civilian targets in Serbia in 1999. Modern cluster bombs are small and very numerous since they
attempt to be effective as anti-personnel munitions. The video clearly shows explosions from larger bombs (e.g. mortars).

Here is some video of actual cluster bomb detonations:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Q0Ulciz6fE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ec4fiHL_wM4

The above clearly have little in common with the propaganda BS being spread by the terrorists and the NATO fake stream media.

Local, and unverified, news is he was one of ours, ex Ukrainian pilot who went with us during our revolution and was stationed at Belbek. I'll know for sure later this morning but looks to be true.

Isos wrote:

He was obviously flying CAS, which limited pilots to URO for most part in RuAF. So he had to fly low, he had no other option with what he was given.

They really need some reco pods. Even a simple camera with a zoom would be nice. The most advanced zoom in civilian market allow you to clearly zoom on the moon and see the details of it. Just see nikon coolpix p900.

Looking for targets with eyes from less than 1km height is stupid.

For fucks sakes, are you for real?

You are aware that the Su-25 is equipped with sights, no? You seriously think its all eye sight, really?

par far wrote:

eehnie wrote:

kvs wrote:I am a bit suspicious about the timing. There appear to have been Turk attempts to grab SAA held territory and the Turks
have shot down a Russian jet already.

It is logical.

There are good chances that this MANPAD came from the Kurds(the Kurds received a lot of the from the US.) The Kurds maybe mad at Russia for not helping them and they maybe did this through the terrorists(will they are all terrorists.)

Your hate to the Kurds begins to look totally irrational.

Obviously you know not the range of a MANPAD to say this. Roughly all are under 5 Km on altitude and 6 Km in the other two axis.

miketheterrible wrote:

Isos wrote:

He was obviously flying CAS, which limited pilots to URO for most part in RuAF. So he had to fly low, he had no other option with what he was given.

They really need some reco pods. Even a simple camera with a zoom would be nice. The most advanced zoom in civilian market allow you to clearly zoom on the moon and see the details of it. Just see nikon coolpix p900.

Looking for targets with eyes from less than 1km height is stupid.

For fucks sakes, are you for real?

You are aware that the Su-25 is equipped with sights, no? You seriously think its all eye sight, really?

Unfortunately only new Su-25SM3 got new SOLT-25 targeting sight with TV and FLIR channels. All other Su-25 have only Klen laser rangefinder and marker, so they depend on their own eyes or outside target informations. RuAF have UAVs there to find targets. Su-25SM should just drop bombs from high altitude, like they did at the beginning of campaign. For unguided rockets strikes SAA should use Grads, Uragans and Smerches.

For even more Fucks sakes, why the hell don't Su-25SMs have DIRCMs while Russian helicopters do?

You are aware that the Su-25 is equipped with sights, no? You seriously think its all eye sight, really?

They should be good  at finding tanks in an open area but doesn't look good enough at finding men in an urban environment. They clearly use their eyes, the sights gives them a better covrage because it is under the plane but doesn't really help them because it isn't advanced, if he had to fly so low.

For even more Fucks sakes, why the hell don't Su-25SMs have DIRCMs while Russian helicopters do?

They should have equiped and tested all those new protection systems on these planes in syria. Or send the newest version of the su 25 and upgrade all the other. With the su-24 it is the most used fighter in operation.

miketheterrible wrote:

eehnie wrote:

par far wrote:

kvs wrote:Russia needs to slaughter thousands of jihadis to send them the message.   They will feel it even if they dream of
f*cking 72 virgin goats in the afterlife.  

I am a bit suspicious about the timing.   There appear to have been Turk attempts to grab SAA held territory and the Turks
have shot down a Russian jet already.  

RIP to the pilot.

I don't think that Turkey would do something like this, they already are having a tough time against the Kurds and there are reports that the Turks tried to rescue the Russian pilot.

In Idlib, the the Russian Air Force should only use advance d fighters like the SU 30 or the SU 34 because the terrorists have MANPADS, the Syrian Air force has no business being there, just be on the safe side.

How did know the Turks it was a pilot to be rescued?

About the MANPADS, every aircraft can avoid the MANPADS by altitude. Even the L-39. The case of the helicopters is different, it depends of the model.

Unless you dispense flares, bomb, and fly out - you are open Target and easy takedown by manpads if you loitered the area. Unfortunately this looks like what happened.  You can't detect incoming IR/IIR missiles unless you have a camera that picks up the incoming object or UV sensors.  Neither which exists on current used jets.

Flying higher than manpad allows in engagement is only other tactic used.

Sad events that could been avoided if fly either higher or used flares and no loitering. Cost the pilot his life too.

Good thing is the Russians are flattening the area.

Syria has been until now one of the few present and future scenarios where Close Air Support fighting style was possible still, thanks to very low MANPAD density. Since now likely this fighting style will be used only in the pockets

Other tactics at higher higher altitude will be used. Every aircraft used in Syria for combat purposes In the frontlines of areas in contact with the borders need to be used with high altitude tactics. Including the Su-25 and the L-39.

KomissarBojanchev wrote:For even more Fucks sakes, why the hell don't Su-25SMs have DIRCMs while Russian helicopters do?

Price cuts of modernisation package.