Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #4

It gets really painful to read the retardation around here with obvious trolls being untouched despite breaking forum rules.

sepheronx wrote:

OminousSpudd wrote:GEEZ! Sepheronx, overreaction much?

France is hooking up with the Russian battlegroup, they'll be conducting what are probably token PR sorties in Syrian Airspace that is under complete jurisdiction of the VKS. They put a foot wrong, they even go a few degrees off their defined entry corridors, and they'll be told to get the hell out. They will not fly into an airspace that could be turned hostile, with no exit route, at the flick of a figurative switch, and attempt to conduct nefarious operations. That's just stupid. Hell they might even get a free friendly tour from the Su-30SMs.

You're talking like France has just been let off the leash to wreck havoc in Syria. Make no mistake, this whole thing is completely on Russian terms. And yes, as a formality I'd assume Assad has given temporary clearance to the French, not that that makes a speck of difference.

Call me cynical but this is how I see things after listening to my government mixed in with what I have seen the western powers do in Libya, Ukraine, Egypt, Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria over the years has made me see them as nothing more than rapists, liars, cheats and scoundrals.  Mixed in with how they are treating Russia, and How Russia is taking it, makes me think they will just lie, cheat, steal, rob and murder again, like they have done so many times before.  So I just see this as just another attempt and chance for the west remove Assad.

Ill be glad to eat my words here. But I am going to watch this without much hope.  I think Russians are going to regret this dicision like they did when Medvedev voted for the no fly zone that became france and US chance at murder.  I think this will be no different. Common denominator here is France.

Yeah, it's certainly an understandable position. But, really, Russia has nothing to lose in this situation, given they will probably be the ones even giving the intel to the French on what targets they can and can't hit. Also, a French carrier group essentially joining forces with the Russian Med Battle Group is a sure fire kick in the teeth for Uncle Sam in my opinion, given they're still trying to keep up the "hurr durr Russia=isolated" facade. I understand your cynicism, but from my point of view Russia is really winning this thing, and I don't just mean Syria and Ukraine, I mean the whole of Cold War 2.0. Even if Uncle Sam manages to achieve some sort of political maneuvering with the YPG when all is said and done, it'll still be pathetically minimal.

Also, there probably is a genuine hunger for revenge emanating from some of the French political elite. So let 'em at it I say. Once they run out of steam and start looking for targets of opportunity to force a NATO agenda within Syria, they can go home.

You people act as if Russia can do anything about it if France starts hitting Assad targets.  Best Russia can do is jam the aircrafts and ships with Karusah-4 and such.  Outside of that, france strike whomever they want and if Russia shoots one down, its war, world war.  And so they wont risk that.

Things could escalate in no time.
Russia now using a ridiculous amount of very expensive cruise missiles in Syria
with ridiculous amount of long range nuclear bombers..when they don't need to do that..
Sending 20x more soviet bombers armed with Kab-500 bombs can do the same and save a lot of money.  So is obvious that Russia is simply sending a message to US ,Turkey and ISrael alliance in the middle east   that Russia is ready to use nuclear weapons and that it could target them if they continue with their illegal war and sponsor of terrorist.

from another forum someone told nov 17 2015

Interesting developments during the weekend indeed :

1) Putin shares during the G20 that 40 countries fund ISIS inclusing members of G20.

2) Today, Russia, after two weeks, admit the A321 was brought down by a 1 kg bomb. Clearly timed the declaration to G20/after it, and clearly used G20 meeting to gather support to step up presence in ME and turn the table once and forall.

3) Today, Russia steps up its presence in Syria and all ME in the fight against terrorists, strategic bombers and Black Sea fleet involved in bombing targets.

4) Yesterday Russia bombs ISIS in Lebanon for the 1st time.

5) Today Putin attends the MOD meeting and give directions to the high command to jointly work with French Navy.


6) Today Putin says to his top leadership he is calling for UN article 50 that allows any country to self defend and attack the enemy and any of its supporters anywhere and everywhere (see video below min 4 onwards), very strong and direct message to Qatar, Turkey and KSA.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-sN2j3se-g

7) Today the US says that it has agreed (demanded mosre likely) to Turkey to close its border with Syria, US forces will jointly supervise it.

There is expectation for Russia to step up bombing terrorits in Egypt, Lebanon, Iraq and Syria, while maybe Yemen and Lybia could get into the list but have not heard anything about them yet , this will make Russia to rule the ME air.

attacks on Saudi Arabia or Qatar.. on discussion.
How many want to bet Saudis will get burned.. and their oil fields seems like a perfect
target. that will boost Russia economy.

https://twitter.com/BaFana3/status/666696435434463232

http://ria.ru/world/20151118/1323235621.html

In other words, France will agree to getting help from US carrier and Russia is in deep shit for giving an inch.  Give an inch, they will take a mile.

So, you guys still think this is a good idea?

sepheronx wrote:http://ria.ru/world/20151118/1323235621.html

In other words, France will agree to getting help from US carrier and Russia is in deep shit for giving an inch.  Give an inch, they will take a mile.

So, you guys still think this is a good idea?

You simply think Putin is an idiot.. thats what confuse you.. Russia will not abandon Syria
and will not Allow US to destroy it. neither US or France will dare to attack Syria because
will give a justification for Syria to fight back at them..and Russia will help them.

and there are not US aircraft carriers anywhere in the middle east.. i posted a map recently.
if  US or France declare war on Syria it will be the end of their free rides in Syria territory or airspace. just relax dude.. from the air you cannot win a war..

the only thing that can truly create problems is boots on the ground and that US and Turkey
send a ground force with hundred of thousand civilians behind them to take the north of Syria.
and create a buffer zone to block Russia from bombing thre..and use the Syrian civilians as human shields.. this is what they discussing now to do. But even if they do this it will not last long.. without air superiority and land superiority the chance of they holding any place for long is zero.

How will Russia help Syria? They cant shoot at french or americans without starting third world war.

Celebrating Christmas early.
Russian drop White Phosphorus munitions against "moderate" rebels in Idlib.

sepheronx wrote:How will Russia help Syria? They cant shoot at french or americans without starting third world war.

IF france shot at Russia airforce or at Syrian airforce they will be shot down back..
is a minor incident and will not create any world war.. only a pilot to eject that will be rescue.
lol  Relax dude..  as i told you.. this people in the military simulate wars millions of times..
and you ignore the steps that can be taken to keep things at a minimal level or some misunderstanding.

if we do this..what will happen next? is called RUles of engagement. IF france start the agression
on Syria ,Syria will complain at UN and give ultimatum to them.if they repeat the plane will be shot down and world opinion will be on Syria side.. and if they continue attacking Syria ,russia will help Syria.. is not personal is simply self defense.  Not even Israel who wants to destroy
Syria forever goes everyday and bomb Syria . If Israel goes and start a mass scale war on Syria
Syria will call for UN legitimate right to defend itself and start firing at Israel.. The important here
is not be seen as the agressor and have the legitimacy for their actions.

If US or France could bomb Assad without very negative consequences will have done it 5 years ago and not try to do it now. that the Russian airforce and warships are helping them dont you think? they cant. Because will be justifying Syria to fight back and close
the airspace permanently for them which they can do.. with their S300s or S-200s. start shooting down all NATO planes.

and as a matter of fact Syria have shot down Turkey and Israeli planes and no world war 3 happened. For world war 3 to happen a major full scale invasion on a nation will be needed.


The Israel war on lebanon on 2006 ,should be an example of what happens when you invade
a nation against internatinal laws and without international support. Israel was beaten and was forced by the international prssure of the int community to end the war in 30 days ,and they won nothing they have to leave without achieving any objective. you need a valid international reason to fight another nation. and so far France does not have any valid reason to fight Syria..hollande himself told Assad is not the enemy in public. so relax..what you see is games being played.. but that will not work. With Russia airforce there and without a strong army with boots on the ground is not possible to hold any territory for long for NATO. at best it will only delay things a bit but not much.

in reality im more worried about the Ukrainian front than anything.. US could get France support
back to restart the war there. and Russia cannot invade Ukraine for being a time bomb and later blamed on Russia anything bad that happens there.

You think Syria's airforce and ground defense forces would be capable? Cause evidence shows that isn't the case.  Syrian forces failed to take out a few Israeli jets that blows up their air defense systems with no repercussions.  Russia will not and cannot defend Assad's military with their airforce.  Only way Russia can bypass this issue is if they allow Syrian aircrafts at the Russian airforce base in Syria so that they can operate out of.  Same goes for air defense systems.  Because Russia would indeed retaliate if the US or France shot at Russian jets on the ground at the base or air defense systems.

If they are smart, then they wouldn't have let Gaddafi died like the way he did.  Russia allowed it and did nothing while condemned it from afar.  So I think they are Naive.  Especially if the US aircraft carrier stays.  It will now be within easy reach of the Tartus base, its supply lines and the airforce base.  So yes, this is a very stupid and dangerous game Russia is playing and I am 100% against it.

sepheronx wrote:You think Syria's airforce and ground defense forces would be capable? Cause evidence shows that isn't the case.  Syrian forces failed to take out a few Israeli jets that blows up their air defense systems with no repercussions.  .

yes.. Syria have S-300s that have not been using in the entire war..and holding for a major
special time of a full scale war..and now have been reinforced by Russia warship S-300 and many other air defenses including pantsirs. IF RUssia warns NATO to not attack Syria and invade its Airspace and bomb Syrian government troops, Russia will fire back.make no mistake. It will be self defense and nothing personal. their pilots rescue and demanded them to stop.  

and after that incident a major emergency will be declared at UN security counsil and the entire
international community will pressure the nations violating international laws to stop.
and the unrest France will face for fighting Russia could risk Hollande to lose the support of its people and being impeached.  Turkey is a different story but germany and most European nations will pressure turkey to stop any major agression they start against Syria or Russia.

again you cannot win wars with airforce alone .it tooks 4 months for NATO airforces with thousands of mercenaries to defeat qadaffi with an inferior army that Assad. and without Russia help.  There is no way for NATO to hold any invasion in Syria without defeating Russia by force and legitimizing Russia to fight back in self defense.

Vann, that is very naive of you to think that 1) Syria has S-300 (Prove it please, cause it is just pathetic rumors) and (2) Russia would shoot down NATO planes in Syria if they attack Syria.  Are you that naive to think they can and would do that?  Does Serbia conflict ring a bell to you?  Russia had forces in Prestina but they did nothing to help Serbia.  They were pretty useless.

Werewolf is correct.  You people are beyond help.  You live in fantasy land.  Those Russian ships and airplanes will do absolute F all.  Do you hear me? Should I repeat it?  Russia never once said it is protecting Assad or his military but itself and its endeavor against ISIS.  Hence why US and France are going to take great advantage of this.

I am just going to watch.  If anything happens, I am going to have fun.

sepheronx wrote:Vann, that is very naive of you to think that 1) Syria has S-300 (Prove it please, cause it is just pathetic rumors) and (2) Russia would shoot down NATO planes in Syria if they attack Syria.  Are you that naive to think they can and would do that?  Does Serbia conflict ring a bell to you?  Russia had forces in Prestina but they did nothing to help Serbia.  They were pretty useless.

Werewolf is correct.  You people are beyond help.  You live in fantasy land.  Those Russian ships and airplanes will do absolute F all.  Do you hear me? Should I repeat it?  Russia never once said it is protecting Assad or his military but itself and its endeavor against ISIS.  Hence why US and France are going to take great advantage of this.

Alright Seph just leave it that way.. i have been following the Syrian conflict since 2011 and know
what Syria have. and You don't need S-300s at all (that Syria also have) to show down planes ,S-200s with 400km range with upgraded avionics can do the same. According to Ziad they ahve s-300s and only stored for an emergency that is on the middle of a full scale NATO invasion ,to not allow Israel or NATO to pick its signal. you are understimating Putin.. if you think Putin will allow NATO to easily take Syria without giving them a good a fight you are mistaken.. specially after they shot down a Russian civilian plane. France will NOT fight Russia
and Russia will shut down any NATO plane that disrespect Russia and start a war against Syria.
their prestige as an ally will be on the table. One thing is provocative limited attacks and another is full No fly zone ,that will not happen in Syria as long Russia there. you really think
Putin is an idiot ..in politics but he is not. Everything Russia does ,it seeks local and international support because he understand the HUGE difference that international opinion and public support have in wars. If you don't have public support and start a war ,you risk losing control
of your own nation at the first plane shot down.. if you have full support of your people ,they will stand with you until the last man no matter what.. International support and public support is everything in conflicts and wars.and only Russia have that strong support.

A good open warning would be nice.  Stating something like "If you do this or that USA/France, we will be forced to jam your systems and potentially take you down".  So that you have already alerted the public so Russia doesn't get destroyed by PR for taking down a US or French jet for striking Syrian soldiers.

But they didn't, so I am assuming that they are given free access to do as they like in Syria and Russia wont do anything.  Treat French ships as allies? WTF is that bullshit?  French are nothing but a bunch of back stabbing assholes like Werewolf said, and open liars.  US equally the same.  So Putin is now putting himself in the same group?  Do you not see the problem in that Vann?  You are always condemning the US and their illegal activities and lies, so why now defend it?

Screw the French and Screw the Americans.  They have no right or reason to be in Syria.  They are the ones responsible in the first place for this mess.  Since their so called "bombings", ISIS grew larger.

US-Russia Cooperation Can Work if Moscow Admits Assad Problem - Bob Corker Read more: http://sputniknews.com/politics/20151118/1030296816/us-russia-cooperation-can-work.html#ixzz3rohHkxnA

And the US, with the assistance of the French, are sending an aircraft carrier to med to help France bomb Syria, all because Putin agreed to it.

coolieno99 wrote: Celebrating Christmas early.
Russian drop White Phosphorus munitions against "moderate" rebels in Idlib.

No. That might be RBK-250 carrying ZAB 2.5 incendiarysub munitions. That's based on Thermite, not WP.

sepheronx wrote:A good open warning would be nice.  Stating something like "If you do this or that USA/France, we will be forced to jam your systems and potentially take you down".  So that you have already alerted the public so Russia doesn't get destroyed by PR for taking down a US or French jet for striking Syrian soldiers.

But they didn't, so I am assuming that they are given free access to do as they like in Syria and Russia wont do anything.  Treat French ships as allies? WTF is that bullshit?  French are nothing but a bunch of back stabbing assholes like Werewolf said, and open liars.  US equally the same.  So Putin is now putting himself in the same group?  Do you not see the problem in that Vann?  You are always condemning the US and their illegal activities and lies, so why now defend it?

Screw the French and Screw the Americans.  They have no right or reason to be in Syria.  They are the ones responsible in the first place for this mess.  Since their so called "bombings", ISIS grew larger.

and you dont consider 20 nuclear capable bombers using cruise missiles in Syria as a warning
to NATO?  Again as i told you ,you cannot win and hold territory with airforce alone.. not in a million of years and in the ground Syria have the upper hand. and Syria also have the public opinion on their side too. same with Russia ,controls the airspace of Syria and is playing the diplomatic card.. (just like they did in Ukraine) And WORKED!. the objectives of defeating ISIS And ALqaeda and Syrian government retaking all those lands will be achieved
and NATO airforce will be unable to stop it.. with RUssia there.  because Syria is their ally.. get it? Russia will have never gone to Syria if they werent 100% sure they will defend it no matter what... RUssia will have never gone to Syria without studyying first all the things that can go wrong.. This is why US and Turkey is trying to create a human shield to block Russia from bombing northern syria. I failed to read any ultimatum of any NATO country to attack Russia if they do not leave did you? They do not have plans to fight Russia because knows the retaliation will really hurt. and the justification will be in their side. and they have to explain a lot why they attacked Russia. Public Opinion IS every thing dude.. is all. anyone who start an agression against a nation that have done nothing to them will have major unrest in their own land and major pressure with interational community.  Look at the Israel war in 2006 lebanon.. forced by UN to leave lebanon and without any objective achieved. NATO is busted.. and all they can do is delay Russia operations and make it more expensive their operations.

Hezbollah in a live firefight. Camera mounted on his helmet.

Vann7 that isn't about some numbers or systems S-300/S-500 or S-10.000 this is simple politics quite understandable for everyone. Russia would never use its Strategic nuclear arsenal against anyone even if tactical nukes would explode on russian soil that is why we see a build up of US in europe with more and more tactical nukes finding its way to US basis in Ramstein, Germany. That is why we see build up of ABM/IBM and throwing of cannon fodder of east europeans in true Barbarossa Russophobia against russia. Those warnings are not helping, because that is all but a bluff. When russia downs factually NATO airplanes and NATO will not have capability to do jackshit to russia except annihilate the few things that are in Syria then you can have a strong statement, but that is unlikely to happen. Russia won't should down french aircrafts even when they hit russian troops you can bet on that. If i had a say in anything i would jam the shit out of not just Syria but the entire fucking ME as far as i have the capability. If any non Syrian aircraft is seen even approaching or flying perimeters on close to Syrian air space, immidiate shot down. Let the western media whores bark, the super caravan moves on. If they send ships, send a shkval. You think US would start a nuclear war just because some worthless frogeater ship is sunk? Good luck with that before that happens russians get isolated which would be a great thing, left alone with the worlds richest and most resources, left alone from the insane civilized world.

Reality is much different than your sudden day dreams people. If i kill puppies and demand to kill more puppies after someone keeps all the puppies away from me and out of sudden i change my course and tell i love puppies would you trust me and give access to puppies?

You must live in a delusional world and i see everyday more resembelance between 1984 and humans in general. In George Orwells 1984 the regime also was cosntantly rewriting history untill it suited their needs and no one noticed in the population, they were conditioned to forget and use delstop to even dare to think otherwise.

Haven't you forgotten the Ebola, how it came and a pandemic terror was reigned on us by the civilized world and then from one day to another, nothing it is gone into the trash bin, vaporized. The same thing happened with your rationality to distrust liars and backstabbers, now you cheer for whatever hocus bogus is thrown at you. I thought idiocracy was in 26th century appearantly it is to arrived far to early.

Russian ground troops taking part in fighting?

5th battery of the 120th Guards Artillery Brigade - 6 x MSTA-B howitzers on the below screenshot from MOD presentation
click

Cyberspec wrote:Russian ground troops taking part in fighting?

5th battery of the 120th Guards Artillery Brigade - 6 x MSTA-B howitzers on the below screenshot from MOD presentation
click

If there happens to be Polite People^TM on the ground with the SAA, y'all need to quit yapping that Putin has betrayed Russia. The cruise missiles and strategic bombers that showed up yesterday also had the byproduct of sending NATO a very clear message about not trying anything in Syria. Not like Russia even needed to send that message. Look at Israel, striking the SAA before Russia came in and now cooperating with Russia by sharing intel and such. Now, there is no way that NATO would try to take out the SAA with the risk of hitting embedded Russian units on the ground.

Reports that a artillery battalion (divizion in Rus) of 18 guns is apparently engaged in Hama

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A bunch of tankers apparently hit by RuAF yesterday....almost a PR contest going on with the US, since they announced the destruction of over 100 tankers the day before..

Russian Tu-95 and Tu-160 launch missiles in Iranian aerospace near Iraq border. This is a very high level of trust between Iran and Russia.

This is from official grafics, that were showed by Russian Defense ministry
on video from 33s

ShahryarHedayatiSHBA wrote:Russian Tu-95 and Tu-160 launch missiles in Iranian aerospace near Iraq border. This is a very high level of trust between Iran and Russia.

I agree. Pretty obvious actually but people only see what they want too see.

Cyberspec wrote:

ShahryarHedayatiSHBA wrote:Russian Tu-95 and Tu-160 launch missiles in Iranian aerospace near Iraq border. This is a very high level of trust between Iran and Russia.

but people only see what they want too see.

Yes, This is so sad