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    Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

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    TR1
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  TR1 on Fri Jul 04, 2014 8:21 am

    The innovation of the US civilian market is multitudes more than anything the American military R&D produces.
    Russia on the other hands doesn't have that, not nearly to the same degree.
    Pogosayan can say that, and I would love to see actual proof of that sort of return. I have a feeling he is using some mental gymnastics and selective figure cherry-picking.
    I am not against military spending, but I don't believe for a second it is as productive to the economy as claimed.
    Look at the nuclear missile delivery systems Russia has- a crap ton, that all cost a bundle to develop, test, maintain and produce.
    Relative to that, far less funding to Roscomosos goes farther and in a far more relevant way.

    SAP should very much be a reflection of how the economy is doing. Realistically if it cut or raised 10% (random figure) does anything change? Will Russia be invaded or invade someone they otherwise would not?
    No not really. In any case the military wanted like 150% of the agreed upon SAP amount to fulfill what they saw as a minimum military overhaul. Listening to these guys would put Russia on the road to USSR 2.0.
    No thank you!

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:18 am

    My father worked for Sperry. Majority of civil products are based upon what NASA created or MiC. Most civil private enterprises do not have r&d and relied on release of mil products. My father worked on touch screen displays before it hit civil market. That is an example so you are wrong on that TR1.

    If sukhoi did not get the funding from sales of its military crafts, they would not have the funds and tech for its civil production. Same with Irkutsk. Now ssj is built and ms21 is being built. Both civil market. Those are just two examples. Uralmesh makes tracyors and construction vehicles, not just tanks. That is another example.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  TR1 on Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:27 am

    That's hard to believe. Do you have statistical proof that MOST (or even anywhere close to most) civilian products rely on mil R&D?
    I recall reading statistics that civilian RD worldwide was 10-15 times that of military.

    Sukhoi's civilian division is separate from military (though they use some facilities, with completely different and new tooling). They got massive government aid in setting up and continuing financing for the project. I don't see that as an example of MIC funding helping the economy in any meaningful way. Irkut is specifically talking about phasing out military fighter production this decade for more lucrative civilian projects.

    And we are specifically talking about R&D. The majority of the spending in the next decade will be on actual production and purchases. There the economic benefit of military spending rapidly tapers off past a certain order commitment.
    It is a simple formula. Having 10,000 Armatas and 1000 T-50s sitting around does not produce anything for the economy. Social spending and infrastructure does.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:39 am

    Besides pharma, majority of civil tech is derived from mic and nasa. Like I said, look up Sperry electronics.

    That said, gov helped build civil plant, but if they had no money to begin with, or production of composites for its military, the civil production would not exist. Lockheed as example designs a lot of tech for civil purposes and is used in mil as well. Russian radar companies develop for both civil and mil. To say that mil does not help in civil development, is a joke.

    As well, I am not talking about over production like thousand of armatas as i know smaller orders are better to keep production going, but having little funding to military is not smart. Your people are smarter than you think, because you guys were caught with your pants down during ww2. Your former countrymen need the mil equipment to protect its borders. You seem to want to ignore that there is the possibility of your countrymen going to war. But 888 war was not long ago and even if Russia finished it off quickly, they did not fair well. Do you want that same repeat?

    Simple fact is, they are doing the smart thing with SAP and getting defence enterprises into civil production. Even if that means large companies like Rostec eat them up.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  TR1 on Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:51 am

    1.) Gonna need some proof of the larger claim that mil spending boosts the economy and provides the backbone to civie tech. Nothing I have seen suggest that.
    2.) I am not saying military producing companies are a bad idea period. I am saying fueling the economy on the basis of military spending IS stupid and infective.
    3.) WW2, come on, that is irrelivant to Russia today. If you wanna talk about USSR, there is your good evidence of military spending gone amock.
    4.) 888? What? Georgia got routed, how could you possible construe THAT as proof Russia needs to fund the economy through military spending. Even with a smaller GVP Russia will be strong enough to militarily respond to any of its small neighbors.
    5.) We are not going to World War 3.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:58 am

    Here is about nasa: http://spinoff.nasa.gov/Spinoff2008/tech_benefits.html

    As well, if Russia can get the MiC into civil development, then the big funding can pay off. Rostec already produces for both mil and civil. So yes, funding does help the economy as they use a lot of their assets to up its civil and mil sales. Rostec is good example of it.

    To say WW3 never going to happen is a joke. I bet people didnt think Georgia would try anything or Ukraine wouldnt get to this point. But of course it can happen. Better be prepared than not. To say it wont is just hiding from reality.

    I agree that letting the spending run amok is bad on mil. But same can be said about civil, which is the current case in Russia. Too much inefficiencies not being solved, even thoigh money is being thrown at it.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  TR1 on Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:08 am

    The mil sector is just as riddled with inefficiency, corruption, and other issues though. And they are even harder to investigate.


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    Temporary MIC thread

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:16 am

    I would say that greatly depends on which sector and company. If we are talking aerospace, I disagree. If we are talking navy, i agree 100%. Then the question is, would it be better if Rostec took over or they became private? I mean, it would force the companies to make changes needed but may not solve the issue of corruption. Day to day life is trifed with corruption. It makese laugh knowing lockheed sits in on the pentagon. But that just seems to be life regardless where you go. Yes, MiC is much worst in that. But Russia put itself in this position since they relied on sales of military gear for so long and only recently started to demand civil production from them. Shoulved have asked for that decade ago.

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    the State of the Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  GarryB on Fri Jul 04, 2014 1:03 pm

    Discuss here please:


    _________________
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:14 pm

    http://milindcom.ru/eng/about/

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  TR1 on Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:41 pm

    TR1 wrote:The mil sector is just as riddled with inefficiency, corruption, and other issues though. And they are even harder to investigate.


    Downvoted? Hahaha, someone is butthurt their dream virtual reality is threatened by reality.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  Viktor on Fri Oct 03, 2014 6:20 pm

    Nice to see Russia machine tool industry receiving major boost because of sanctions

    A new look at domestic machine tool industry

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    Nice to see Russia machine tool industry receiving major boost because of sanctions

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Fri Oct 03, 2014 6:55 pm

    Viktor wrote:Nice to see Russia machine tool industry receiving major boost because of sanctions

    A new look at domestic machine tool industry

    That's right Viktor, as of now only 10% of domestic machine tools (truly pitiful consequence of the Yeltsin era) are in place in Russian factories/plants, by 2020 60% of machine tools in Russian factories and plants will be domestic, so nearly 2/3rd's of current machine tools will be replaced by superior, more modern and efficient domestic analogues. The remaining 1/3rd will in all likeliness be replaced by modern machine tools from friendly nations (aka non NATO countries) like China and India.  

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t1920p1005-vvs-news-photos#67881

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  Sujoy on Mon Oct 13, 2014 5:19 pm

    Kalashnikov Concern to undergo major modernization

    Almost 5 billion rubles ($126 million) is to be invested in modernizing the Kalashnikov Concern by 2017, according to Sergei Chemezov, head of state-run corporation Rostec, which includes Kalashnikov.

    According to the news agancy ITAR-TASS, Kalashnikov has already launched a modernization program at its factory in Izhevsk, Udmurtia, which is about 750 miles east of Moscow.

    Kalashnikov’s plans include updating its machine tools and converting to new technology, namely MIM (metal injection moulding) technology, which can produce complex parts. A balanced granulated mix of fine metal powders and polymeric binders are used as raw material for these parts, thanks to which the gun parts do not require further processing.

    These new technologies will boost labor productivity, reduce financial costs, and free up production space. As a result of modernizing, Kalashnikov plans to triple small arms production to 1.9 million guns per year, Rostec said.
    The technical upgrading program is the logical continuation of economic reforms at Kalashnikov. Rostec transferred 49 percent of the arms producer’s shares to private investors in 2013 in order to render its products more competitive. The plan has started to work – in the first half of 2014, small arms output more than doubled.

    The company anticipates more than 9 billion rubles ($226.7 million) in revenue in 2014, compared to over 2 billion rubles ($50.4 million) in 2013. In line with the development strategy for the small arms industry until 2020, which was jointly drafted by Rostec and the Russian Industry and Trade Ministry, revenue from small arms sales is slated to rise to 24 billion rubles ($604.6 million).


    Kalashnikov, which lost its traditional sales markets with the imposition of sanctions by the European Union and United States, will also change its export strategy with the introduction of new technology.

    The lion’s share of civilian weapons manufactured by Kalashnikov was bought by the U.S. and Germany, which are now closed to its products. Kalashnikov’s management is seeking out new sales markets to compensate for the losses it incurred from the sanctions.
    “For example, [Kalashnikov is looking at] Latin America and the Asian and African countries. The development of these markets will make it possible to distribute the freed-up volumes of finished product and retain previous financial and production indicators,” Alexei Krivoruchko, an investor in Kalashnikov, told journalists.

    For civilian markets, the concern is developing three new hunting rifle and shotgun models based on the Kalashnikov rifle: the Saiga-MK107, Saiga-9, and Saiga-12 Model 340, which will go into mass production this year.

    However, Kalashnikov has not forgotten about its traditional niche: military rifles. At the moment, the concern is developing the latest AK-12 chambered in 7.62x39mm, in the interests of the Russian Ministry of Defense.
    The Ministry of Defense is scheduled in October to make a final selection of the basic shooting kit that will form part of the standard Russian equipment package for the ‘soldier of the future’, named Ratnik (‘warrior’ in English). The ministry is to choose between the AK-12 and the AEK-71, the latter produced by the Degtyarev Kovrov Mechanical Plant.

    These rifles are a reflection of two different concepts for improving individual military arms, independent small arms expert Semyon Fedoseyev told RIR.

    Like its predecessors, the AK-12 is designed using a gas-operated long-stroke piston system. This scheme has a negative impact on shooting accuracy, although several measures have been adopted to improve the AK-12, including better ergonomics, a modified barrel, a receiver, action, and new protective coverings, all while keeping the comparatively low production cost down.
    Fedoseyev said the AEK-971 has a higher shooting accuracy but a more complex structure. Its moving parts are divided into two sections - the bolt carrier and the recoil-balancing mechanism – which are connected by a rack and pinion to synchronize movement.
    As a result, the pulses of movement of the carrier and recoil-balancing mechanism cancel each other out, and the shooter only feels the recoil momentum of the shot. The rifle shifts much less during recoil.
    Both assault rifles have a 5.45 mm carbine, so no colossal spending will be necessary to replace the arsenal of ammunition, said Fedoseyev.
    There is currently no consensus among Russian military experts regarding which rifle should be provided for the ‘soldier of the future’. This means Kalashnikov will try to survive a difficult period of uncertainty by orienting itself towards the civilian market to the greatest possible extent.

    http://in.rbth.com/economics/2014/10/13/kalashnikov_concern_to_undergo_major_modernization_38949.html

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Wed Oct 29, 2014 5:25 pm

    Putin takes control of national Military-Industrial Commission

    The Russian President has taken personal control of the body that assures cooperation between the military and the defense industry, days after ordering a major reform of the sector.

    Vladimir Putin also signed a decree on Wednesday giving presidential status to the Military Industrial Commission. The Deputy PM in charge of the weapons industry, Dmitry Rogozin, was appointed deputy chairman of the commission.

    Also on Wednesday Putin spoke with a group of top defense industry officials and told them that while Russia did not intend to artificially halt cooperation with foreign partners, the priorities lay in the ability to independently produce all critically important equipment, materials and devices. “We must do everything to ensure that national security is absolutely guaranteed,” the President said.

    Earlier this week Putin ordered the winding up of the Rosoboronzakaz and Rosoboronpostavka agencies which are responsible for placing and executing weapons orders for the military. Their functions will be transferred to the Defense Ministry, Finance Ministry and Audit Chamber.

    Russia is currently running a major program to rearm the military. It started in 2008 and will continue till 2020. By then 70 percent of all weapons in the military must be replaced by newer models. The state is allocating significant sums for the purpose – in 2014 the total defense budget amounted to 2.3 trillion rubles ($60 billion), compared to just 600 billion rubles ($15 billion) in 2003.

    The crisis in Ukraine has shown the need for even more reforms in the Russian defense sector. Facing the turmoil and hostility of the present Kiev regime, Russian authorities decided to cut ties with Ukrainian weapon makers and go for domestic production. President Putin discussed the plan with Deputy PM Rogozin in late July and said that the inevitable hardships and complications would eventually benefit the nation – new factories will appear in previously underdeveloped places, and old enterprises will be replaced with modern ones.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:43 am

    Kalashnikov to Launch New Brand, Reveal Development Strategy Tuesday

    On Tuesday Kalashnikov Concern will present its development strategy until 2020 and a new brand for the product line, a spokesperson for Russian state technologies corporation Rostec said.
    On November 10 the legendary AK-47 designer Mikhail Kalashnikov would celebrate his 95th birthday.

    MOSCOW, December 2 (Sputnik) — Russia's largest small arms manufacturer, Kalashnikov Concern, will present its new brand and reveal the company's corporate development strategy through the year 2020 on Tuesday.

    "On Tuesday, December 2, Kalashnikov Concern will present its development strategy until 2020 and a new brand for the product line," a spokesperson for Russian state technologies corporation Rostec told RIA Novosti.

    The event hosted by Rostec CEO Sergey Chemezov and Kalashnikov Concern CEO Alexey Krivoruchko will be held in Moscow's Central Telegraph.

    The representatives of Kalashnikov Concern explained the need for rebranding, saying, "It is impossible to compete with global arms industry leaders without a strong, recognizable brand."

    According to the company's press service, the company now has a number of product lines not related to one another. "As a result there is no system of brands and the customer does not get a feeling of unity."

    According to Rostec, "changes will affect the visual image of the concern's brand and the structure of the entire product line currently in production."

    The creation of the new brand was financed by the company from its own funds, without raising any money from the government.

    Kalashnikov Concern was created in 2013 on the basis of the Izhmash and Izhmekh plants. It is now Russia's largest producer of automatic and sniper rifles, guided artillery shells as well as a wide range of civilian products, including shotguns, sport rifles and machine tools. The products manufactured by the company are exported to 27 countries, including the United States, United Kingdom, Germany, Norway, Italy, Canada, Kazakhstan and Thailand. In November, Russian state arms exporter Rosoboronexport announced that it had signed a contract with Indonesia for the trial supply of the AK-100 Kalashnikov assault rifle.

    Recently the company submitted an application for its right to use 3D images of its AK-47, AK-74 and AKM assault rifles. After the registration is completed, the use of images of Kalashnikov rifles for souvenirs and in video games without the company's permission will be illegal.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:56 am

    Putin signs decree on status, responsibility of chief designers of armaments

    NOVO-OGARYOVO, January 20. /TASS/. Russian President Vladimir Putin has signed a decree on the status of the general designer of armaments. Speaking at a meeting of the Military-Industrial Commission on Tuesday Putin said that the list of general designers of military hardware will be very short - no more than 20 names - and the status and responsibility of such officials will grow.

    “A decree has been signed on the general designer for the development of armaments, military and special technologies,” Putin said. He recalled that the need for such a position was first mentioned last September.

    “The general designers will spearhead the efforts to create strategically important weapon systems and, respectively, they will be granted wide powers in terms of tapping the resources required,” Putin said.

    “There will be no more than 20 such designers. Each candidature will be considered by the Military Industrial Commission’s board and then authorized at the Commission’s full-scale meeting.”

    “The status and personal responsibility of each general designer will grow noticeably,” Putin said.

    He said he hopes that the introduction of such a position will contribute to more effective implementation of key projects in the sphere of national defense and security.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Sat Jan 24, 2015 11:00 pm

    Sergei Shoigu inspected enterprises of the military-industrial complex


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  Kyo on Mon Jan 26, 2015 8:55 pm

    Rogozin: Russian defense industry will emerge from the crisis stronger
    01.25.2015 (updated 26/01/2015)
    Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin said that the development of the military industrial complex of the country will help to overcome economic difficulties. According to him, "President manually control the military-industrial complex, understanding its importance both for defense and for the country as a whole."

    NOVOSIBIRSK, January 25 - RIA Novosti. Development of military-industrial complex of Russia will help Russia to overcome the difficulties associated with the global economic situation and emerge from the crisis stronger, said Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin.
    "What makes today the military-industrial complex, perhaps still underestimated by us, but it is the hope, especially in times of crisis, the survival of the country and on the transformation of the country. It (the country) out of the crisis will emerge stronger," - said he is in the program "Sunday Night with Vladimir Solovyov."
    According to Deputy Prime Minister, currently at the enterprises of the military-industrial complex employs about two million people. "But the truth is that any new job in aircraft or rocket creates eight to nine new jobs in related industries," - he said.
    Rogozin, answering the question of the leader, said that the President of the Russian Federation in the details versed in regard to the defense and security of the country.
    "In order to address the issues as soon as possible, especially in these difficult times, when we are being strangled by sanctions do not sell what we urgently need to create conditions in which we can not even return the money for what sold us. In this situation, in fact, we have several months switched to manual control in their respective industries, and the President manually controls the military-industrial complex, understanding its importance both for defense and for the country as a whole ", - concluded the deputy prime minister.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  Viktor on Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:26 pm

    WoW  thumbsup

    Shoigu: more than 450 ammunition storage facilities will be built in 2015

    More than 140 military camps planned to build in Russia this year

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    Kalashnikov Concern

    Post  Kyo on Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:37 pm

    CNN: Kalashnikov sales rose by a third worldwide, despite USA & EU sanctions

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:51 pm

    Modernization of the Russian Army: too ambitious task for the national defense industry

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:57 pm

    George1 wrote:Modernization of the Russian Army: too ambitious task for the national defense industry

    We offer our readers of our blog "otvetku" Polish "comrades" (or, as we now say, "partners") on the recent publication of CAST in the Polish press outlining Russian views on the current state and prospects rzvitiya defense industry in Poland. Author priodimoy below translated article Anna Maria Dyner (Anna Maria Dyner) is an employee of the Polish Institute of International Affairs ( Polski Instytut Spraw Mi ę dzynarodowych , PISM ) - one of the leading think tanks (Think tanks) Central Europe and specializes in research in the field of domestic and foreign policy Belarus and Russia's role in the former Soviet Union. The translation is done by the Center AST. wrote:

    The comments section is funny. Yes, butthurt Poland.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:05 pm

    Tactical Missiles Corporation will become the exclusive supplier for the Russian Navy torpedoes

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  flamming_python on Fri Apr 03, 2015 10:53 pm

    George1 wrote:Tactical Missiles Corporation will become the exclusive supplier for the Russian Navy torpedoes

    Yes because according to the article now it will include Dagdiesel and a bunch of other enterprises. Tactical Missiles Corporation is looking to become another UAC, United Shipbuilding Corporation, etc... type conglomerate.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

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