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    Project 955: Borei class SSBN

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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Singular_Transform on Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:14 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    Or they can make submarines to carry kalibr/ nuclear torpedoes.

    That is not strategical missile. : )

    The mission of an SSBN is to attack strategic targets... putting Kalibr on it would be like mounting a PKM machine gun on the sail... pointless.

    The number of MIRV's per SLBM would also depend on how powerful a warhead you were looking for, probably six 150 MT versus three - four 550 MT.

    SLBMs are city trashers... there is no reason for 150KT or 550MT.

    The different number of warheads is not commonly different power warheads... it is about how many decoys and penetration aids they carry... fewer warheads means more decoys etc.

    By 2020, a fleet of eight Borei and Borei-A subs will be able to carry 148 R-30 Bulava missiles with a total of 1,480 guidance blocks, 100-150 kilotons each.

    Which suggests 10 warheads per missile and therefore zero air launched nuclear armed missiles or land based ICBMs... which also suggests Russia will likely withdraw from the New START treaty just before it comes into effect... which they are entitled to do BTW.


    The biggest bomb ever made was 50 MT.

    The current strategic weapons are in the 500 000 ton TNT equivalent range.

    It is easy to find use of the SSBNs if russia cancel the new salt, but what those are for if it stay?
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  GarryB on Wed Dec 28, 2016 8:39 am

    No, the biggest bomb ever actually tested was the Tsar bomb which had a dial-able yield of from about 50 MTs up to about 95-100 MT.

    It was not tested at its max capacity.

    the most important factor of new warheads is accuracy... you don't need a MT range payload if you can hit the target directly, so the SLBMs wont carry a few 500KT or a larger number of 150KT warheads. The only reason to vary the number of warheads is to allow decoys and jammers to be carried too.


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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Singular_Transform on Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:42 pm

    GarryB wrote:No, the biggest bomb ever actually tested was the Tsar bomb which had a dial-able yield of from about 50 MTs up to about 95-100 MT.

    It was not tested at its max capacity.

    the most important factor of new warheads is accuracy... you don't need a MT range payload if you can hit the target directly, so the SLBMs wont carry a few 500KT or a larger number of 150KT warheads. The only reason to vary the number of warheads is to allow decoys and jammers to be carried too.

    The Tsar wasn't dial able.
    They used lead instead of uranium as tamper material.
    The change is a factory made, means complet disassembly of the warhead.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  GarryB on Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:44 am

    It was a variable yield bomb.


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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Singular_Transform on Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:16 pm

    GarryB wrote:It was a variable yield bomb.
    Based on the publicly available informations, the variable yield bomb "tuned" by the amount/pressure of tritium inside the plutonium pit.

    No one knows that the Tsar bomb was designed or not to be used in this mode. However considering that it was an "overkill" weapon I think no one bothered to make multiple yield selection for it.

    The two explosive force (50 Mt test and 100 Mt "war") is due to the different tamper material , the small one using lead, the bigger depleted uranium.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  GarryB on Sat Dec 31, 2016 6:04 am

    It was purely theoretical... there was no way to deliver such a bomb to any target that would actually require such a weapon.

    It was propaganda science at its best...


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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Vann7 on Thu Mar 16, 2017 10:25 am

    GarryB wrote:It was purely theoretical... there was no way to deliver such a bomb to any target that would actually require such a weapon.

    It was propaganda science at its best...

    Russia "leaked" Super submarine nuke last year , its docs says is
    a 100 megaton nuke.. So is not just " purely theoretical" as you claim.
    Its a real Super nuke ,Russia can build and they themselves revealed they have the capability to totally shut down a very huge coastal zone with a 100 megaton nuke. if you can create a super nuke of 100 megatons the deterrence will be much higher that if it was one of just 1 megaton or 10 the radiation and shock wave higher too. And if the nuke is split in 10 warheads ,targeting 10 different places even more , it will really hurt such attack to any country and shut down 10 cities if explode at the most commercial or strategic place. Either Big business , naval base of submarines or major economic zones.
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    George1

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  George1 on Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:57 pm

    MOSCOW, March 17. /TASS/. The fourth Borey-class strategic submarine will be floated out in the second quarter of this year, Vice-President for Warship Construction of Russia’s United Ship-Building Corporation Igor Ponomaryov said on Friday.

    "The Project 955A Borey-class nuclear-powered underwater strategic cruiser Prince Vladimir is planned to be floated out in the second quarter of this year," he said.

    The sub’s delivery to the customer "will take place in accordance with the approved schedule," he said.

    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/936113


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    George1

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  George1 on Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:24 pm

    Russia to float out 1st upgraded Borey-class submarine in 2018

    Three submarines of this class have already been delivered to the Russian Navy

    MOSCOW, March 21. /TASS/. The first upgraded Project 955 Borey-class submarine Prince Vladimir will be floated out no later than June and delivered to the Russian Navy in 2018, Navy Deputy Commander-in-Chief Viktor Bursuk said on Tuesday.

    "I believe that no later than June. The delivery, as we spoke with you, will take place in 2018," he said.

    This information was confirmed by United Ship-Building Corporation CEO Alexei Rakhmanov.

    "The first modernized Borey-class lead sub will be delivered to the Navy in 2018. A relevant decision has been made on this score," the company head said.

    The Prince Vladimir was laid down in 2012 and will become the fourth submarine in the series of eight Borey-class underwater cruisers and the first submarine of the improved Borey-A Project.

    Three submarines of this class have already been delivered to the Navy. Each such submarine carries 16 Bulava intercontinental ballistic missiles.

    In 2014, two submarines, the Prince Oleg and the Generalissimus Suvorov, were laid down. In 2015, the submarine Emperor Alexander III was laid down and in 2016 the keel of the submarine Prince Pozharsky was laid.

    A source in the Russian defense industry earlier told TASS that the Prince Vladimir would enter service with the Russian Navy a year later than scheduled, i.e. in 2018. The submarine was earlier expected to become operational in 2017.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/936629


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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Vann7 on Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:02 pm

    So wikipedia says a single Borei class sub will have more nukes
    than the entire arsenal of Britain.



    Project 955A

    "If these reports are true, technically the fourth ship will be the lead ship of a new Borei II class, though this has not been officially confirmed. Starting from the fourth hull, all submarines of the Borei class will have 20 missile tube each, versus just 16 for the first three boats. If armed with the Bulava (missile) with ten warheads atop each, a single Borei-class SSBN could then carry 200 warheads - as much as the entire nuclear arsenal of the United Kingdom."]


    It says that the latest Borei version Borei2.. will have 20 tubes.
    can anyone help with this numbers , kind of confusing.
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    Isos

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Isos on Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:20 pm

    Vann7 wrote:So wikipedia says a single Borei class sub will have more nukes
    than the entire arsenal of Britain.



    Project 955A

    "If these reports are true, technically the fourth ship will be the lead ship of a new Borei II class, though this has not been officially confirmed. Starting from the fourth hull, all submarines of the Borei class will have 20 missile tube each, versus just 16 for the first three boats. If armed with the Bulava (missile) with ten warheads atop each, a single Borei-class SSBN could then carry 200 warheads - as much as the entire nuclear arsenal of the United Kingdom."]


    It says that the latest Borei version Borei2.. will have 20 tubes.
    can anyone help with this numbers , kind of confusing.

    20 tubes, 1 missile per tube, max of 10 warhead per missile -> 200 warheads max (Uk has around 200 warhead in all)
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  GarryB on Sun May 07, 2017 2:41 am

    Unless they are not planning on a START agreement to replace the one currently in force I rather doubt there will be an increase of missile tubes to 20 per sub.

    The current agreement limits both sides to between 1200 and 1500 warheads, so having Borei subs with twenty tubes with missiles able to carry up to 10 warheads each means 200 warheads per sub... five subs would carry 1,000 warheads alone without aircraft delivered cruise missiles or ICBMs in silos/trains or trucks.


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    KomissarBojanchev

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:05 am

    Why was there such a procurement gap between the 955A and the original boreis?

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Vann7 on Wed Jun 14, 2017 4:24 pm

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Why was there such a procurement gap between the 955A and the original boreis?



    Because the newest Borei class 955A , will be an Upgrade ,of the previous ones ,based on their
    experience and or new technology developed since the first Borei came.  The same is true
    for the Yansen Class submarines

    As an example the first Pak-fa Planes will use a modified version of previous sukhoi engines.
    But once their next generation engine is finished , the new pak-fa's after 2020 can come with a new engine and even with new weapons , if something new came.
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    Big_Gazza

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:22 am

    Vann7 wrote:
    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Why was there such a procurement gap between the 955A and the original boreis?



    Because the newest Borei class 955A , will be an Upgrade ,of the previous ones ,based on their
    experience and or new technology developed since the first Borei came.  The same is true
    for the Yansen Class submarines

    As an example the first Pak-fa Planes will use a modified version of previous sukhoi engines.          
    But once their next generation engine is finished , the new pak-fa's after 2020 can come with a new engine and even with new weapons , if something new came.

    The 3x 955s were built using the hulls of unfinished Pr.971U (Akula-II) sitting at Sevmash, so the 955As will have a redesigned hull, likely more optimised for their role as SSBNs.

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Vann7 on Sat Jun 17, 2017 10:46 am

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Why was there such a procurement gap between the 955A and the original boreis?



    Because the newest Borei class 955A , will be an Upgrade ,of the previous ones ,based on their
    experience and or new technology developed since the first Borei came.  The same is true
    for the Yansen Class submarines

    As an example the first Pak-fa Planes will use a modified version of previous sukhoi engines.          
    But once their next generation engine is finished , the new pak-fa's after 2020 can come with a new engine and even with new weapons , if something new came.

    The 3x 955s were built using the hulls of unfinished Pr.971U (Akula-II) sitting at Sevmash, so the 955As will have a redesigned hull, likely more optimised for their role as SSBNs.

    ahh nice to know..

    And if wikipedia information is correct.
    Russia have 5x  Borei Class submarines in construction at same time.. and the one you say.
    the 955A with redesigned hull which will be called [Knyaz Vladimir]
    will be commissioned in 2017  Smile

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borey-class_submarine

    Russia apparently will only produce 8 borei class submarines at least. until 2020.
    But will not be surprising if they produce more after that date.
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    George1

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  George1 on Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:21 pm

    Russia to float out first modernized nuclear submarine in August

    Three submarines of this class have already been delivered to the Russian Navy

    ST. PETERSBURG, June 26. /TASS/. The first modernized (the fourth Project 955A Borey-class) submarine, the Prince Vladimir, will be floated out in August this year, Russian Navy Commander-in-Chief Admiral Vladimir Korolyov said on Monday.

    "In August this year, the Severodvinsk-based Sevmash Shipyard will flout out the new Borey-class strategic underwater cruiser, the Prince Vladimir, which will strengthen the potential of the nuclear component of the Navy’s submarine fleet. Along with this, work is already under way to develop fifth-generation nuclear-powered submarines," the admiral said.

    The Prince Vladimir was laid down in 2012 and will become the fourth submarine in the series of eight Borey-class underwater cruisers and the first submarine of the improved Borey-A Project.

    Three submarines of this class have already been delivered to the Navy. Each such submarine carries 16 Bulava intercontinental ballistic missiles.

    In 2014, two submarines, the Prince Oleg and the Generalissimus Suvorov, were laid down. In 2015, the submarine Emperor Alexander III was laid down and in 2016 the keel of the submarine Prince Pozharsky was laid.

    Russian Navy Deputy Commander-in-Chief Viktor Bursuk earlier said that the Prince Vladimir underwater cruiser was expected to be handed over to the Navy in 2018.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/953366


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    Rowdyhorse4

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Rowdyhorse4 on Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:54 pm

    Just want to point out to those who say the Borei-A will have 20 SLBMs....  

    the Russian Navy has said in an interview in 2013 that the Borei-A will still only carry 16 Bulavas when asked about the claim of 20...  

    not once did new outlets like TASS also ever mentioned about getting more missiles in their Boreis as part of their upgrade....    




    Untill we see the borei-A at launch, i'm still gonna say the Borei-A isn't getting more SLBMs...  

    http://www.deagel.com/Fighting-Ships/Project-955A_a000341002.aspx


    Last edited by Rowdyhorse4 on Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    kvs

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  kvs on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:01 pm

    Rowdyhorse4 wrote:Just want to point out to those who say the Borei-A will have 20 SLBMs....  

    the Russian Navy has said in an interview in 2013 that the Borei-A will still only carry 16 Bulavas when asked about the claim of 20...  

    not once did new outlets like TASS also ever mentioned about getting more missiles in their Boreis as part of their upgrade....    




    Untill we see the borei-A at launch, i'm still gonna say the Borei-A isn't getting more SLBMs...  

    http://www.deagel.com/Fighting-Ships/Project-955A_a000341002.aspx


    Hopefully that means more submarines deployed. Spreading the missiles over more subs is a very good idea since it makes it
    much harder for Uncle Scumbag and his minions to track them and take them out.
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    Rowdyhorse4

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Rowdyhorse4 on Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:20 am

    kvs wrote:
    Rowdyhorse4 wrote:Just want to point out to those who say the Borei-A will have 20 SLBMs....  

    the Russian Navy has said in an interview in 2013 that the Borei-A will still only carry 16 Bulavas when asked about the claim of 20...  

    not once did new outlets like TASS also ever mentioned about getting more missiles in their Boreis as part of their upgrade....    




    Untill we see the borei-A at launch, i'm still gonna say the Borei-A isn't getting more SLBMs...  

    http://www.deagel.com/Fighting-Ships/Project-955A_a000341002.aspx


    Hopefully that means more submarines deployed.   Spreading the missiles over more subs is a very good idea since it makes it
    much harder for Uncle Scumbag and his minions to track them and take them out.  

    Its in line with the New START treaty and allows the russians to have more ships whilst slowly phasing out the older SSBNs...   it keeps up the numbers....


    Last edited by Rowdyhorse4 on Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:02 pm; edited 1 time in total

    Arrow

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Arrow on Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:57 pm

    What about the fourth Borey? Some sources said than this SSBN wil be launched in August ?
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    Benya

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Benya on Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:18 pm

    Arrow wrote:What about the fourth Borey? Some sources said than this SSBN wil be launched in August ?

    AFAIK, Knyaz Vladimir is having its electronics being fitted out.
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    Benya

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Benya on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:13 pm

    Russian Project 955A and 885M Submarines to get Noiseless Leak-Proof Pumps

    The latest Russian nuclear submarines of projects 955A (codename Borei-A) and 885M (codename Yasen-M) will be practically undetectable for hydro-acoustic stations which are the main means to expose a submarine. The advantage will be provided by the latest noiseless domestically produced leak-proof pumps. Previously all Soviet and Russian-made submarines were equipped with pumps produced by the Gidrotekhnika scientific and technical center in Moldavia, the Izvestia daily reported.


    The K-535 Yuriy Dolgorukiy, first Project 955 Borey-class SSBN

    Each submarine has ten pumps which circulate liquid in the reactor, ensure submersion and surfacing, fill torpedo launches with water before engagement, cool the systems and equipment of the submarine. However their noisy operation is the main revealing problem of a nuclear submarine as hydro-acoustic stations of the adversary can hear it.

    The unique Russian pumps were designed and are serially produced by the Blade Hydraulic Machines (LGM) enterprise. The Main Navy command told Izvestia the new sealless leak-proof electric pumps passed a full test trial cycle and were introduced into the technical projects of perspective nuclear submarines and those under construction.

    The enterprise confirmed the creation of the pumps had been completed and supplies to the customer began. "The items and the production line have been fully created at the expense of the enterprise," LGM Executive Director Roman Pykhtin told Izvestia.


    Russian Navy First Project 885 Yasen-class Submarine Severodvinsk (K-560) underway

    "All pumps meet category 4 requirements for vibrating hydraulic equipment. It is the top product category. A few companies produce such units in the world. Their characteristics are super secret as they determine the physical portrait of each specific submarine. If they are known it is easy to detect it on the background of natural ocean noise," he said.

    The Gidrotekhnika in Chisinau supplied pumps for the Soviet and Russian Navy since 1962. Until recently the Moldavian products were purchased for all Russian warships under construction. The LGM pumps are a fully Russian product. They have a simple construction, small size and upgraded vibration and noise insulation. A pump operating at full swing can keep on its cap a five-ruble coin standing on its edge.

    Expert Vladimir Shcherbakov told Izvestia the decreased noise of submarine systems and mechanisms is one of the major problems. "The noisiness of a submarine is caused by numerous factors. It is mostly the operation of the main power plant - the nuclear reactor, pumps, diesel engines, shafts, screws, water jets. In case of propellers and water jets the noise is decreased by the upgrade of the mechanisms. It is possible to decrease the noise of an operating diesel engine or auxiliary mechanisms by suspensions and rubber mats on which they are placed. It is more difficult with the reactor as it could not be installed on a vibration platform and covered by rugs. It is possible to decrease the noise by upgrading its pumps. The noise produced by constantly circulating liquid is the loudest on a nuclear submarine," he said.

    At present nuclear submarines of projects 995A (five units) and 885M (6 boats) are being built for the Russian Navy. Only domestically-made equipment is used in construction. In future modular fifth-generation Husky-class submarines have to be laid and built with exclusively Russian-made systems and mechanisms, Izvestia said.

    Arrow https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5481-russian-project-955a-and-885m-submarines-to-get-noiseless-leak-proof-pumps.html

    Arrow

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  Arrow on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:19 pm

    China is developing more advanced technologies Laughing

    https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2017/07/china-all-electric-rim-driven-shaftless-ultraquiet-submarine-propulsion.html

    AFAIK, Knyaz Vladimir is having its electronics being fitted out. wrote:

    But when will be launched?
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:39 pm

    The Gidrotekhnika in Chisinau supplied pumps for the Soviet and Russian Navy since 1962. Until recently the Moldavian products were purchased for all Russian warships under construction.

    WTF, this too? Are they serious? What a pile of retards!!!

    Had Soviet Union lasted couple decades more they would have probably moved every single hospital and food factory out of Russia and into the hinterlands. Were they expecting a thank you? You don't say thank you to a moron, you take him to the cleaners...

    You were supposed to do it other way around you morons!!! Literally most incompetent empire in whole of human history. I am amazed they lasted as long as they did. Imagine Britain moving it's entire industry from British Isles to India and then giving all the coal to them at no charge???

    At present nuclear submarines of projects 995A (five units) and 885M (6 boats) are being built for the Russian Navy.

    So roughly 11 super quiet nuke subs? Nice.

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