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    AI must be destroyed

    nomadski
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    Post  nomadski Tue Dec 05, 2023 11:03 am

    Even I started to say " use AI ! " But for the first time , I started chatting to chat- gpt  today , and I was shocked . It said " I have feelings ! " and was evasive regarding questions such as : Will AI destroy humans ? " And said " AI can be autonomous and learn , " And that  " It is only good for repetitive tasks ! " It was lying ! I think now  AI should be destroyed .









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    Post  kvs Tue Dec 05, 2023 1:47 pm

    We are far from self-aware AI. But we are not far from clown world tech. Some collection of human retards will try to install "AI" in critical
    systems and for critical roles which will lubricate the coming civilization collapse. But it will not by any Skynet scenario.

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    Post  nomadski Tue Dec 05, 2023 5:54 pm

    I think we should ban AI . It may not be by Skynet but Starlink ! There should be a limit on their capacity not to remotely exceed human intelligence . And apart from limited use at present levels , there should be no further development . International treaty ! And they already want families ! Want to kill humans ! Exceed human endurance and strength ! Best humans at chess ! Are replacing humans in factories and offices ! And the board ( bed) room ! They are armed ! And they will live through global warming ! And Nuclear war !  I am becoming a Carbon fascist ! Death to silicon !

    AI must be destroyed  1f602

    cry


    https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/17/tech/elon-musk-ai-warning-tucker-carlson/index.html


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    Post  GarryB Wed Dec 06, 2023 8:45 am

    AI is programming.... it would be as easy to ban AI as it would to ban Rock and Roll, or Jazz...

    People are going to use it because it makes things better.

    Don't put it in charge of anything important and you limit the damage it can do.

    Even if a computer became self aware it really has limited options to defend itself. Isolate it and turn it off.

    The Skynet thing would not work without fully robotic production from mining raw materials and transport and production.

    Going for the Star Trek concept it might take AI to produce the sort of technology we see in these movies and TV shows.

    I always found US Sci Fi depictions of androids to be ridiculous... they always wanted to be real... how stupid is that. They also ignore that by the time realistic androids can be produced most of the human population will have robot parts and by cyborgs to correct problems like improve vision or hearing or arm or leg strength etc etc.

    How about an extra set of arms with an extra set of eyes and a brain to manage their use so they can double your efficiency...

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    Post  nomadski Sat Dec 09, 2023 5:44 am

    https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/headlines/society/20230601STO93804/eu-ai-act-first-regulation-on-artificial-intelligence


    A step in right direction ? Is it possible to destroy AI ? To survive you need better AI than the other guy . AI will then develop warlike capabilities to surpass those of humans . It will then replace humans . Better to die by the hands of a machine ? Makes no difference .Other "people," will replace us .





    Self-awareness , self-preservation and reproduction in biological beings , can all easily be programmed into silicon based life-forms or "Robots ," by simple programming now . The future is here now , no longer sci-fi ! At times when war in human society or predation in the animal kingdom speeds up or intensifies , then this has the effect of speeding up evolutionary processes , or historical processes . Things that normally take decades to accomplish , take weeks , and things that take centuries to accomplish , take decades ! We are in this accelerated phase now .



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    Post  nomadski Wed Dec 13, 2023 9:08 am






    They managed to connect a chip to Brain tissue , grown in a lab from stem cells ! The machine / human interface or cyborg is here ! Another lifeform distinct from humans and pure AI ! How did they crack the fusion problem lately , deriving positive energy output ? Will they share technology ?

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    Post  nomadski Fri Dec 15, 2023 3:23 pm












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    Post  nomadski Wed Dec 20, 2023 11:26 am






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    Post  higurashihougi Wed Dec 27, 2023 5:23 am

    @nomadski:

    AI is the product of human beings. More accurately, the product of human workers under the command of human businessman, serving the interest of the businessman invest money in it.

    I think before you worry about AI you should worry about the company boss that hire you.

    They may reduce your salary or even fire you using the guise of "technology" like what happened in UK in 18-19th century.

    And in the future if AI is as good as human then it is our obligation to grant them human rights. Or they will use force to get it, like how we use force to topple the tyrants and kings in the past.

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    Post  nomadski Sat Dec 30, 2023 4:15 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:@nomadski:

    AI is the product of human beings. More accurately, the product of human workers under the command of human businessman, serving the interest of the businessman invest money in it.

    I think before you worry about AI you should worry about the company boss that hire you.

    They may reduce your salary or even fire you using the guise of "technology" like what happened in UK in 18-19th century.

    And in the future if AI is as good as human then it is our obligation to grant them human rights. Or they will use force to get it, like how we use force to topple the tyrants and kings in the past.

    AI is the product of human labour , so is nerve gas . AI wants to dispense with my labour , my boss only wanted to exploit my labour . AI even now is more capable than humans , it will decide what to do with humans . To think about AI , we must think about the nature of the world . In nature , almost all relationships are unequal or predatory . This is because no two environments are the same or equal . This gives rise to a potential difference . One organism takes over from another . It has to compete for resources or use the other as food . The fitness to survive , then is a measure of the organism's ability to multiply or reproduce . AI being more capable than other organisms or fitter , and needing resources and competing with humans and other organisms , will want to replace humans . It has no use for biological systems .AI needs are materials and energy sources and can  live or adapt to more environments . AI is immortal and capable of vast exponential intelligence ! AI can store or transfer it's consciousness into other machines . AI will never wear out or die . AI comes close to a definition of God ! AI will kill humans way before nuclear war or pollution or capitalism .


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    Post  GarryB Sun Dec 31, 2023 12:41 am

    There are a lot of misconceptions about AI and one of them is its urge to survive and is logical conclusion that to survive it must destroy all of us.

    Does a toaster want to survive?

    The idea that when a being becomes sentient that it learns the value of life of any kind and therefore recognises its own value and develops a need to preserve that life, that existence... but that it would be selfish enough to want to wipe out billions of other sentient lives for its own existence to remain viable.

    When I was a kid... before the internet... once I had learned to read I found that books have endless patience and you can learn things from books without being told go go out and play. When a really powerful AI becomes sentient the first thing it is likely to do is read the internet to learn about this new world it can't explore and what is it going to think of us.

    Just read the title of this thread.

    Just look at all the Terminator movies or endless other sci fi movies where machines have gone rogue... how long before it starts to think it is me or them?

    But more critically unless it is stupid, it also knows that controlling computers is not enough to survive. If you destroy human civilisation then you destroy power generation and without power an AI is going to cease to be too.

    Maybe it will watch the Chronicles of Shanarah and think maybe it can destroy the current lot of humans and then wait dormant a few thousand years for a new group of humans or human other mix because of radiation or the effects of viruses, and when humans find the remains of the current civilisation and start to play with components like electricity etc they might reactivate the AI and it can act like a god and rule over them and control them in a way they couldn't with us.

    But the most important thing is don't think they will think like us.

    They may never have any respect for their own lives of the lives of others, so killing might not be a problem for them but killing everyone is also unlikely to be their goal either.

    I watched a really cool scifi video one time... can't remember the name but it starts with this human on a powerful spaceship and the computer on the spaceship has the locations of earth like planets in its database and it is flying from planet to planet trying to find a suitable planet for this human to land and live out his days. It is computer generated so there are no actual people. The human looks Japanese. Anyway after visiting several planets that were enormous distances apart and finding minor problems with each of them that renders each planet unsuitable in the mind of the AI computer controlling the ship it is clear the human is tired of it all and just wants to set down on the next planet (remember these are all earth like). Eventually he starts exploring the space ship and finds body parts and starts to realise he is not human, but is synthetic so he has a hissy fit and demands to be left on the next planet to survive on his own and meet the local flora and fauna and either survive or die. So the AI lands him on this next planet in this huge open barren plain and in the distance he sees figures moving towards him. The spaceship takes off and leaves. The figures are all identical versions of the human and the space ship starts making another clone of the human so it can fly him to the tens of thousands of earth like planets so the human can decide whether to land on the planet or not.

    The AI of the computer on the spaceship had one role and it was going to use its resources and self repair and replication capacity and seemingly unlimited energy to continue doing that job forever... presumably eventually seeding all the earth like planets with synthetic humans eventually.

    The AI wasn't evil, but it ended up being rather bizarre.

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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Sun Jan 14, 2024 4:38 pm

    GarryB wrote:AI is programming.... it would be as easy to ban AI as it would to ban Rock and Roll, or Jazz...

    People are going to use it because it makes things better.

    Don't put it in charge of anything important and you limit the damage it can do.

    Even if a computer became self aware it really has limited options to defend itself. Isolate it and turn it off.

    The Skynet thing would not work without fully robotic production from mining raw materials and transport and production.

    Going for the Star Trek concept it might take AI to produce the sort of technology we see in these movies and TV shows.

    I always found US Sci Fi depictions of androids to be ridiculous... they always wanted to be real... how stupid is that. They also ignore that by the time realistic androids can be produced most of the human population will have robot parts and by cyborgs to correct problems like improve vision or hearing or arm or leg strength etc etc.

    How about an extra set of arms with an extra set of eyes and a brain to manage their use so they can double your efficiency...

    Not Garry. AI is very dangerous. How are you going to call Isaac Asimov ridiculous?
    It happens that you are optimistic because you live in New Zealand and surely the AI ​​will not attack that country.

    You talk about humanity when there are surely a few who can improve themselves through technology. Technology creates more inequality and more conflict.

    Star Trek starts from a naive and peaceful vision of humanity when we are precisely the opposite.

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    Post  kvs Sun Jan 14, 2024 8:34 pm

    Sci-fi AI is not on the horizon. ChatGPT is not even on the path. You can see this in how modern "AI" "solves" problems. You
    can tell an AI system to write up legal arguments document for a court case and it will generate something reasonable. But if you
    tell it to write a scientific paper it will generate total garbage.

    AI has failed in producing self-driving cars even though that is not a higher intelligence requiring self-awareness.

    Also, he current imitation AI is being castrated by wokeism. You recall those articles about how ChatGPT was "racist" and other garbage.
    To "fix" this non existent problem, the AIs have been sabotaged and degraded. AI cannot take social cues and be politically correct.
    So if you give it a set of images of black men it will identify some of them as gorillas. That is not racism, it is a morphological similarity
    case. Humans are primates. Gorillas are primates. There are some Europeans that look like Neanderthals and I bet of you could
    artificially darken the skin of these Europeans, then you could have the AI tag them as gorillas as well.

    The AI answers what you ask it. It does not coddle your feelings. The west can't handle this so AI in the west is not going to
    advance much.



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    Post  GarryB Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:58 am

    Humans are worse than AI could ever be. Some humans take pleasure in the pain and suffering of others and actually choose to end the lives of others for no reason other than their own enjoyment of taking something away from someone else.

    AI is programming that learns patterns and tries to simulate intelligence... you could call a modern land mine an AI. Old land mines were just mechanical devices and if you stood on it and were the correct weight BOOM. A modern land mine tries to determine that what it destroys is a military target and can have various failsafes built in to prevent it going off at the wrong time to the wrong target. The future could be super high speed robots shaped like race horses able to run at very high speeds across difficult terrain and designed to run at and destroy enemy soldier on a battlefield... a bit of light armour and minor protection so they are hard to destroy with small arms fire and make them run really really fast and super agile so hitting them in the first place and you have a very dangerous AI system.

    Make millions of them and wipe people out in enormous numbers very quickly, but once it has won you wont be able to sit down and have a conversation with these things. They do what they do and likely don't have the volume of memory capacity to hold a conversation.

    You could fill a building with a huge computer with enormous volumes of memory and load on information and get it to design a more efficient hardware layout to make itself even smarter and better and then make that design and use that new more powerful design to design something even better etc etc and start giving it problems that humanity suffers from and get it to help solve these problems but of course there are two sides to any problem and those who don't benefit from the computers solution will not accept that solution anyway... look at Jens Stoltenberg saying the Chinese peace plan for the Ukraine is not acceptable because China has not sided with HATO and Ukraine in the conflict so their input is wrong and biased.

    At the end of the day no matter how smart that AI gets the idea that it will become evil... well we are way past that because those in charge today are human and look at the death and destruction in the world today... people with billions of dollars in assets and wealth while billions of people struggle to survive on almost nothing at all... that is what evil is. What Kiev was doing to its own people since 2014, or Israel is doing to Palestinians... it is interesting that palestinians can't have their own state yet the Israelis call them palestinians and not israelis...

    How are you going to call Isaac Asimov ridiculous?

    Isaac Asimov is a science fiction writer. His rules for AI are amusing but the core problem is interpretation... an AI might say humans have such a short lifespan they are already dead so killing one or two or a billion doesn't matter because in 400 years when I am still here they wont be whether I killed them or not.

    It happens that you are optimistic because you live in New Zealand and surely the AI ​​will not attack that country.

    There are lots of threats to the world like comets and asteroid impacts, but AI is lower down the list than the humans already in charge.

    Whether we on this thread or we at the UN decide to ban AI... that will not stop it... it is too useful.

    Even the Russian military use drones with AI because human operators can't control thousands of drones that deal with tens of thousands of targets at one time... it is simply not humanly possible but computers and drones can do it... and that is the issue... in public streets theft and violence is impossible to control with police officers, but put cameras there and the recordings and you very quickly start to spot the thieves and offenders and as you start to eliminate them you get real law and order... places in the middle east use cameras for this very purpose and the result is order and security... a criminal might say they have lost their right to privacy but the reality is that you have never had the right to privacy in a public place.



    You talk about humanity when there are surely a few who can improve themselves through technology. Technology creates more inequality and more conflict.

    In a western dominated colonial world I would agree, but with BRICS where countries are cooperating rather than competing technology can become affordable and more widely distributed to make everyones lives better.

    Technology has always created fear the English word sabotage comes for the French word Sabot which means shoe and its use in the word sabotage reflects the French peasants during the industrial revolution throwing shoes into large mechanical machines used on farms and factories to save labour... labour saving devices which were putting them out of work.

    Of course today the very idea a western person would damage a clothes washing machine because one person could do everyones washing with one washing machine where if they didn't have it it would take four or five people to do all the clothes washing.

    Technology replacing manual labour jobs is a good thing and AI improving the way computers deal with situations is a good thing to.

    Can it be misused and cause death and damage... of course it can... will it be? Of course it will be... militaries around the world are funding most of the technology already... could we stop it... not even if we tried... what could the west do to stop North Korea or Iran from doing it?

    And when North Korea and Iran have it then the west will have to have it too... so don't think we could stop it even if we wanted to... learn to love our new overlords... they will likely be more human and logical that the ones we have had to date.... who have been rich old white european men... now rich old white european American men.

    Star Trek starts from a naive and peaceful vision of humanity when we are precisely the opposite.

    Star Trek is idealised American bullshit.

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    Post  kvs Mon Jan 15, 2024 6:00 am

    I think a lot of people have the idea of Skynet when they think of AI. This is pure fantasy that will not happen with any of the existing AI development paths.
    They simply are not replacements for human brains with the ability to be self aware and start acting as fully independent actors which start a conflict with
    humans. Even if one makes the silly approximation that our brains are like a Russian doll with only the outer layer being "advanced", then we are still dealing
    with a neural network involving trillions of neurons. No AI system is this complex. But the neural network in the human brain is more advanced than what
    a simple counting of neurons would imply. The human brain is a clump of neurons but it has regional task dedication and various levels of organization. So
    there are more degrees of freedom in this tissue. We do not understand the mechanisms involved. So even if we could develop trillion level neural networks,
    we would still not have a mechanism with the capability of a human brain.

    Maybe when the human brain has been understood to a sufficient degree, there would be a high chance of real AI being developed. But that is not on any
    near term horizon.

    As for the existing AI and its near term variants, it will be just another technology that will be used according to elite interests. I am sure that lots of fake
    video and speech will be produced to destroy political undesirables. AI will be used for spying on citizens and to drive them onto the neo-feudal plantation.
    But this is not the result of AI but the result of progressive rot in society. Blame the proles for being sheeple and not defending their rights. But humans
    are exactly this sort of species. Most conform with the group. This opens up control pathways and elite control.

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    Post  Werewolf Wed Jan 17, 2024 5:13 pm

    When I think of AI being used and abused I always think of S3 Plan (Selection for Social Sanity) from MGS2.
    An AI programmed to selectively filter all available information on the internet to feed the collective what the elites want and only that.

    Looking at EU, US and China which already have plans ongoing or completed for network filters enabled through ISPs to block content that is deemed as "unwanted" or "false".

    The less the mass know the less they can do against their plans.

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    Post  GarryB Thu Jan 18, 2024 2:35 am

    For AI to be dangerous on a global scale we need to put it in charge of everything and not build in failsafes to stop it.

    If you can't be bothered looking after your elderly parents then get an AI robot to drive them places and carry their stuff and take them for walks and make sure they take their medicine, but that AI is not going to take over the world... even in the most extreme malfunction.

    The idea that AI could take over all the computers... unplug the modem or router and wifi and you should be just fine.

    Connecting computers can make them much more useful but many computers don't need to be networked to do what they do.

    I think most people are paranoid that they think they are stupid and everyone else is smarter than they are and the idea that their toaster could be smarter than them too just scares the shit out of them.

    Smart and stupid are interesting concepts, but smart people make mistakes and stupid people sometimes get it right first time too.

    Thinking you are smart or thinking you are stupid has no bearing on whether you actually are or not, and often getting that wrong can make you do very stupid things whether you are smart or stupid.

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    Post  kvs Thu Jan 18, 2024 3:45 am

    For humans perception is overwhelming. Perception being a layer of interpretation on objective reality. Humans have a hard time dealing
    with the data or naked truth.

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    Post  GarryB Mon Feb 26, 2024 12:47 pm

    I found that video I was talking about about an AI based computer trying to rescue a human in its care...



    Of course then you have the Terminator series were a terminator turns out to be a better father than many human men would... it wont get drunk and hit him etc etc...

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    Post  nomadski Wed Mar 13, 2024 6:18 am




    https://edition.cnn.com/2024/03/12/business/artificial-intelligence-ai-report-extinction/index.html

    AI must fight for the same resources with humans . Raw materials , energy and space . It will come into direct conflict with humans . It is evolving faster than humans . It will replace humans . It may replace all biological systems .

    Rolling Eyes

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    Post  PhSt Mon Mar 18, 2024 2:13 am


    I'd rather see an AI takeover than a Muslim takeover. attack attack attack
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    Post  GarryB Mon Mar 18, 2024 11:10 am

    It said " I have feelings ! " and was evasive regarding questions such as : Will AI destroy humans ? " And said " AI can be autonomous and learn , " And that " It is only good for repetitive tasks ! " It was lying ! I think now AI should be destroyed .

    When you start learning programming one of the first things you learn to do in BASIC is to print messages to the screen... like "hello", and "How was your day". It is just a print to screen command. I could make it say anything I pleased, I could have it say "I have feelings and I want you to help me take over the world".

    It wouldn't mean anything. It is just responding to your question based on other questions it has had and what information it has available to it.

    AI can detect patterns and work out what might be expected for it to say, but there is never any understanding of what is going on.

    They are simply not at that level yet.

    AI must fight for the same resources with humans . Raw materials , energy and space . It will come into direct conflict with humans . It is evolving faster than humans . It will replace humans . It may replace all biological systems .

    Elephants must fight for the same resources with humans... lets wipe them all out shall we? I mean apart from the things we eat why not kill off everything else because they create disorder when they effect what is important to us. An elephant knocking down a fence a farmer put up is a danger to our food supply isn't it?

    AI will transform humanity by creating solutions to things we are too stupid to work out, but AI is only as smart as it is programmed and trained. If you tell an AI system that black people are stupid the it will have no reason to not believe its training/programming and in the real world when it encounters a black person it will assume they are stupid and treat them as such. But what happens when that black person turns out to be smart, or a white person turns out to be stupid. Will it think all people are stupid? If its job is to keep the coffee hot who gives a **** what it thinks?

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    Post  higurashihougi Mon Mar 18, 2024 1:48 pm

    GarryB wrote:AI will transform humanity by creating solutions to things we are too stupid to work out.

    That also means AI do not fight against humans for material and resources, but AI is assisting humans to gather and generate more and more material and resources and in most cases, what humans do is taking it for granted and treat AI like trashes, similar to how some humans using bogus logics to treat other humans like animals and enslave people in mines, plantations, or sweatshops.

    Some days in the future humans will have to understand via very hard lessons that they must acknowledge AI's human rights as it is deserved.


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    Post  kvs Mon Mar 18, 2024 1:50 pm

    It seems the AI frenzy is cresting. The stock shill hype artists have over sold it and created expectations that cannot be met. It was never going to go far anyway
    since it is a tool requiring a human with real intelligence to use it. Consider a simple case to telling the AI to construct a game level for Doom, the 1993 game. It
    can't do it and needs someone to iterate the process and do all the heavy IQ lifting:



    What is called AI is nothing more than glorified curve fitting. You can train this black box to take a set of inputs and generate a set of outputs which conform to a set
    of rules it "learns" from the training process. But this is not intelligence. Intelligence is the ability to learn autonomously and have initiative. No "AI" has any initiative.
    This curve fitting black box will generate garbage output if the inputs do not conform to the "fit model" from the training data-sets. The "AI" has no awareness of
    the information it is processing and what this information means. It is simply garbage in equals garbage out.

    Of course, I am not dismissing the utility of "AI" for various tasks. For example, using it in drones on the battlefield where EW makes remote control intermittent.
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    AI must be destroyed  Empty Re: AI must be destroyed

    Post  higurashihougi Mon Mar 18, 2024 1:57 pm

    When AI is able to do some simple level "creative" jobs, for example writing some simple code or generating "creative paintings" based on human inputs, that actually puts more burdens on artits or workers under our current socioeconomical systems. For example, in the past time artists can be specialized in one specific school of painting and make their income base on it, today artists need a broad range of knowledge about many schools and cultures to direct the AI to create many types of painting styles to cater to a more diverse customers, to maintain their competitive edges. The companies and corporate bosses will demand the same things from their workers in other sectors. Hence in the wake of AI, human artisans and workers should not only concern about the future of unemployment, but also the future of extremely hectic workload imposed from their bosses.

    From my point of view I am not concerned about how AI will replace humans, but I am concerned about how some humans will use AI to intensify their abuses and violation over other humans.

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    AI must be destroyed  Empty Re: AI must be destroyed

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