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    Prigozhin mutiny thread

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    Karl Haushofer


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    Post  Karl Haushofer Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:13 am

    Podlodka77 wrote:Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:02]
    🇷🇺⚡Putin said that at night he spoke with the commanders of all directions: the troops are fighting heroically

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:04]
    🇷🇺 ❗Putin: I appeal to the Russians, the military and law enforcement agencies and to those who were pushed onto the path of armed rebellion by deceit and threats

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:04]
    🇷🇺⚡Putin called for unity, consolidation and responsibility.

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:05]
    🇷🇺⚡Any strife should be discarded during the period of the special operation, the fate of our people is now being decided - Putin

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:05]
    🇷🇺 ⚡Putin called actions to split the unity - apostasy

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:05]
    🇷🇺⚡What we are facing is betrayal - Putin

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:06]
    🇷🇺⚡The authorities will not let the split in Russia repeat, we will protect the people - Putin

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:06]
    🇷🇺⚡Everyone who deliberately embarked on the path of betrayal will suffer inevitable punishment, Putin said.

    The armed forces received the appropriate orders.

    Intel Slava Z, [24.6.2023. 09:06]
    🇷🇺⚡Actions will be taken to stabilize the situation in Rostov-on-Don - Putin

    I would have appreciated if Putin had expressed just a little bit of criticism of himself, the Kremlin and the command of the Russian armed forces.

    If the war in Ukraine had been carried out property none of this would be happening in Russia.

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    Lapain


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    Post  Lapain Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:18 am

    The thing that makes Prigo a dead man walking is the moment when he spoke of the Donbas conflict as some uninteresting sideshow brought in by the Kremlin, feeding right in the Nazi propaganda and becoming a permanent stain on all of Wagner's legacy.

    It's ok for Prigo trying to play modern day General Smedley "war is a racket" Butler, but it's delusional and right out treacherous for a man of his position to deny the existential nature of this conflict for the Russian federation.

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    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:19 am

    To KARL...

    There are always mistakes, that's inevitable. On the other hand, neither your nor my opinion is authoritative.
    Fifty PERCENT of this forum deserves to wear only a SKIRT !

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    Post  GarryB Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:21 am

    HIlarious... lots of "stock market crashing", PMC leader wanting a Coup, Putin incompetent, Shoigu incompetent... both must go...

    Honestly why?

    The orcs are sticking their dicks into a wood shredder... it is their choice... just STFU and let them continue...

    The west is essentially doing the same around the world telling the rest of the world to not worry about inflation and food and energy shortages... all they have to do is blame Russia for everything and send money and weapons and ammo to Kiev and everything will be find.

    The same west that hoarded all the medical equipment and vaccines during a global pandemic.

    No video of insurrection, no evidence except one picture showing stock prices coloured red... they just need to lose one ruble in value to be coloured red by the way...

    Wonder why all this shit and panic is happening, though we see the usual trolls come out of the wood word and demand new leadership because obviously hammering the hell out of the Ukrainian counter offensive is simply not good enough, but then that is only initial probing attacks, but they have been so suicidal it would be the sort of result most countries would change their plans over... but fortunately HATO is in charge clearly and they are idiots who couldn't organise a blow job in a whore house.


    I would have appreciated if Putin had expressed just a little bit of criticism of himself, the Kremlin and the command of the Russian armed forces.

    Putin signed the Minsk agreements which should have made this conflict totally unnecessary, why blame Putin for Kiev and London and Washington and Paris and Berlins war?

    It's ok for Prigo trying to play modern day General Smedley "war is a racket" Butler, but it's delusional and right out treacherous for a man of his position to deny the existential nature of this conflict for the Russian federation.

    Exactly... that is Navalny level bullshit... and you notice Navalny disappeared from western media... because he would be invading Kiev too if he was in Putins position.... anyone would that is not a sellout to the west.

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:22 am

    Lapain wrote:The thing that makes Prigo a dead man walking is the moment when he spoke of the Donbas conflict as some uninteresting sideshow brought in by the Kremlin, feeding right in the Nazi propaganda and becoming a permanent stain on all of Wagner's legacy.

    It's ok for Prigo trying to play modern day General Smedley "war is a racket" Butler, but it's delusional and right out treacherous for a man of his position to deny the existential nature of this conflict for the Russian federation.  

    Still that leaves an open question, why he was allowed to do that - if we consider now that he was serious.
    As I said several times, time will tell if that was a show or a shitshow.
    Seems it was the other, so the question what more was sacrificed to calm the internal situation is valid. scratch
    Let's wait and watch.

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    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:27 am

    Garry, why do YOU ​​tolerate the trolls you mentioned ? Suspect

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    Karl Haushofer


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    Post  Karl Haushofer Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:27 am

    Podlodka77 wrote:To KARL...

    There are always mistakes, that's inevitable. On the other hand, neither your nor my opinion is authoritative.
    Fifty PERCENT of this forum deserves to wear only a SKIRT !

    Putin and the Kremlin just made too many mistakes.

    The way they conducted the "SMO" from the start.

    They should have gone after and annihilated the Ukrainian leadership at the beginning.

    Instead they pussyfooted and let the West arm Ukraine.

    And here we are...

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:31 am

    In Rostow guys are having a lunch break.

    https://t.me/c/1638135777/16711

    So ordering some hamburgers at Vkusno i tochka.
    Yeah, I would call that a country wide revolution that will smash Putin any second now.

    Especially looking at how the Rostov looks like. Shocking.

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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:32 am

    To KARL...

    Putin and the Kremlin probably made some mistakes, but Putin and the Kremlin are not in conflict only against Ukroshitstan.
    As you can see, the West does not give up its support for Ukroshitstan, and you and I do not know if all this is just a postponement of some bigger conflict - right ?
    I don't think that everything is as simple as you wrote and I think that there is always something that we don't see and that we don't know.


    And I'll add this so I don't open a new post….




    The full text of Vladimir Putin's address to the citizens of Russia:


    I appeal to the citizens of Russia, to the personnel of the Armed Forces, law enforcement agencies and special services, to the soldiers and commanders who are now fighting at their battle positions, repelling the enemy's attacks and doing so heroically—I know, I spoke again tonight with the commanders of all directions. I am also addressing those who have been lured into this criminal enterprise and pushed onto the path of the gravest crime—armed mutiny—through deceit or threats.

    Russia today is fighting an uphill battle for its future, repelling the aggression of the neo-Nazis and their masters. Virtually the entire military, economic and information machine of the West is directed against us. We are fighting for the lives and security of our people, for our sovereignty and independence. For the right to be and remain Russia—a state with a thousand-year history.

    This battle, when the fate of our people is being decided, requires the unity of all forces, unity, consolidation, and responsibility. When everything that weakens us, any kind of discord, which our external enemies can and do use to undermine us from inside, must be put aside.

    And so the actions that split our unity are, in essence, an apostasy from our people, from our comrades-in-arms who are now fighting on the frontlines. It is a stab in the back of our country and our people.

    This is exactly the blow that was dealt to Russia in 1917, when the country fought the First World War. But the victory was stolen from her. Intrigues, squabbles, politicking behind the backs of the army and the people resulted in the greatest shock, the destruction of the army and the disintegration of the state, the loss of vast territories. The result was the tragedy of the civil war.

    The Russians killed the Russians, the brothers killed their brothers, and the lucrative interests were reaped by all kinds of political adventurers and foreign forces who divided the country and tore it apart.

    We will not allow this to happen again. We will protect both our people and our statehood against all threats. Including internal treachery.

    And what we have faced is precisely betrayal. Excessive ambitions and vested interests have led to treason. Betrayal of their country, their people, and the cause for which the fighters and commanders of Wagner fought and died alongside our other units. The heroes who liberated Soledar and Artemovsk, towns and villages of Donbass, fought and gave their lives for Novorossiya, for the unity of the Russian world. Their name and glory have also been betrayed by those who are trying to organise rebellion, pushing the country towards anarchy and fratricide. To defeat, ultimately, and capitulation.

    I repeat, any internal turmoil is a mortal threat to our statehood, to us as a nation. It is a blow to Russia, to our people. And our actions to defend the Fatherland against such a threat will be tough. Everyone who deliberately chose the path of betrayal, who prepared an armed insurrection, who chose the path of blackmail and terrorist methods, will suffer an inevitable punishment, they will be held accountable both before the law and before our people.

    The Armed Forces and other government agencies have received the necessary orders, and additional anti-terrorist measures are being introduced in Moscow, the Moscow region, and a number of other regions. Decisive action will also be taken to stabilise the situation in Rostov-on-Don. It remains complex, with the work of the civilian and military authorities effectively blocked.

    As the President of Russia and Commander-in-Chief, as a citizen of Russia, I will do my utmost to defend the country, to protect the constitutional order, the lives, security, and freedom of its citizens.
    https://t.me/Slavyangrad/51991

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:37 am

    This entire thing has two main caues I guess.
    The main one being lack of proper law regulations concerning PMC on the Russia territory, that forced some ad hoc solutions to be applied. Not all of them perfect, not all of them on time, and not all of them satisfying the owner of this business.
    The other was calming every rage between PMC owner and the MoD, to avoid unnecessary noise around. That made the problems grow with both time and numbers, effecting some kind of explosion.

    Anyway, Prigozin is a dead man walking, as already said.

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    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:40 am

    Perhaps the result of all this in a short time will be what the majority wishes, that is, the SMO will be replaced with a declaration of war.

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:46 am

    The thing is much hyped for obvious reasons.
    Entire "Wagner march on Moscow" consist of some 50 vehicles, that makes a few hundred people at most. A tank, and Grad.
    No idea why they need a Grad for, other than showing themselves Laughing
    Traffic police will give them tickets for speeding, and that will be the end of a whole revolution as the drivers will need to get some cash at ATMs.

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    Post  Mir Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:51 am

    That is what happens when you believe that the world revolves around you...

    Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) is a personality disorder characterized by a life-long pattern of exaggerated feelings of self-importance, an excessive need for admiration and a delusional sense of status, diminished ability or unwillingness to empathize with others' feelings, and interpersonally exploitative behavior. Narcissistic personality disorder is one of the sub-types of the broader category known as personality disorders. It is often comorbid with other mental disorders and associated with significant functional impairment and psychosocial disability.

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    Post  Backman Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:03 am

    flamming_python wrote:
    Serberus wrote:

    Anyway, Putin about to address the nation, lets see what the soft cock has to say about this..
    https://t.me/rtnews/43372

    Well as Sherlock Holmes would say - when you've eliminated the impossible..

    And yes, Prigozhin in all seriousness trying to overthrow Putin, or Shoigu or whatever, we can effectively consider as impossible

    As for being willing to sabotage Russia on multiple levels in return for the far from assured battlefield benefits or successful misdirection of the NATO military leadership - yes I'm quite puzzled myself as to why it was judged as worth it. We'll find out soon enough.

    The same thing is always said about ppl who take up the cause of the US. How was anything that the Kiev regime done since 2014 worth it ?

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    Post  Backman Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:09 am

    ALAMO wrote:
    Anyway, Prigozin is a dead man walking, as already said.

    He has never looked more calm than the videos of him in Rostov now. He's insane.

    Why doesn't one of his guys just shoot him
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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:17 am

    He looks insane indeed if you ask me.
    Have you watched how he behave at the meeting with vice minister?

    And just watch the incoming films from Rostov - people are gathering around the Wagnerites. They will disarm them with bare hands soon, people seem pissed.

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    Post  GarryB Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:24 am

    Still that leaves an open question, why he was allowed to do that - if we consider now that he was serious.

    A strange question from someone I would normally think was smart enough to not ask such a stupid question.

    Do you think this dick runs his posts and his videos for Putin and Shoigu before he posts them?

    Do you think Putin and Shoigu get to veto any videos and posts on social media before they are allowed to be posted?

    In a democracy, how would Putin stop this guy from posting his own thoughts and beliefs and in a real democracy why would they want to stop him?

    The only thing you said there that I respect was lets wait and see, which is certainly more sensible than wild speculation.

    Garry, why do YOU ​​tolerate the trolls you mentioned ?

    This is a forum... no member agreed to think what I think or agree with everything I believe to be true.

    How do you censor people to make them right?

    How do you censor people to make them smart or sensible?

    If I banned every idiot claiming the sky is falling or repeating western propaganda verbatim it would only be a matter of time before someone else got pissed off and stepped up and took their place and forum clown.

    No point chasing your tail.

    No point ignoring the idiots because if you do they get together and fester and circlejerk themselves to the point where they do something stupid.

    People can act like teenagers... banning them does not help... banning them sends them to their room where they only hear their own stupid voice and their own stupid opinions and it makes them even more certain they are right and Putin is wrong.

    Occasionally telling them to be quite while the adults in the room discuss or just wait for real confirmation so you can separate the fast news from Kiev and Washington robots, from the truth... which gets out eventually.

    They should have gone after and annihilated the Ukrainian leadership at the beginning.

    Which would have created a lot of sympathy for those nazis in the hope that whoever replaced them was as incompetent as they were... that is a huge risk and it pretty much tells most Ukrainians that they are worthless in the eyes of Russia... much the way more and more are seeing the regime in Kiev and the west right now.

    Instead they pussyfooted and let the West arm Ukraine.

    Stop drinking the western kool aide... going in guns blazing didn't help the US anywhere, most of the world view them as colonial war criminals... no respect... just fear and loathing.

    And here we are...

    And here we are... western countries are bankrupting themselves trying to fund weapons for Kiev... and that is ignoring all the weapons and ammo stores of their own they will have to spend money on to replace, and of course western sanctions are cutting western oligarchs and western countries from income and property they owned in Russia and were making good money on, not to mention their cut of Russian trade with the rest of the world, or simply Russia using the Euro and US dollar for international trade like everyone else used to, but are now stepping away from that.

    This conflict is the best thing that could happen for Russia because Russia needed to break away from the west and the west is doing that for them.

    There will be minor problems, but also advantages and great opportunities.... Russia is now actively looking for trade ties with countries outside of the west, and their response is excellent from countries sick of the BS they get from the west.

    You think Putin should have been going harder... but the reality is that when you play chicken with a fucking moron you don't start with playing games like Russian roulette .... especially what I would called western roulette which is played with an automatic pistol with one round in the magazine.

    Perhaps the result of all this in a short time will be what the majority wishes, that is, the SMO will be replaced with a declaration of war.

    Why do you think that would make things better?

    It wont make things faster, it will just increase the number of Russians killed and reduce Russian industry and its economy their capacity to get things done.

    Sending men to war wont build airliners and ships and subs for that matter, or all the other things they would be better doing.

    That is what happens when you believe that the world revolves around you...

    Reminds me of the jokes, how many men does it take to screw in a light bulb... none he would rather screw a milk bottle, but then that really didn't work here as most lightbulbs are of the bayonet type rather than threaded screw type... but then the other joke is how many misogynist men does it take to screw in a light bulb... one... he just holds it and the world revolves around him.

    Of course the obvious next question is how many femenists does it take to screw in a light bulb... two... one to do it and another to tell her she did it so much better than any man could.

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    Post  George1 Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:34 am

    sould we made a seperate topic about Prigozin rebellion?

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    Post  Sprut-B Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:39 am



    This isn't a pro-Russian channel, but even they've got to acknowledge the dedication of Russian people to their respective jobs.
    Even amidst uncertainty, people are doing their jobs diligently. No one is slacking.
    This is what a highly civilised country looks like.
    We often hear about Japanese discipline and dedication to their work, but Russians are not far behind,
    and unlike Japanese or Korean society, there's no pressure put on them; they do it on their own.
     
    You would never see it happen anywhere in the collective West, be it Berlin, Paris, London, New York, or Washington, D.C.

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    Post  nomadski Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:40 am



    Good jokes Garry ! I have one : How many psychiatrists does it take to change a lightbulb ? Only one ! But the lightbulb must really want to change ! And let's look at the problem now , either this Pirigozin malarkey is a ruse or it is not . If it is a ruse , to draw out the Orcs , then it should have suitable theatrics . This could include " Wagner " units withdrawing from the front , with grainy and shaky YouTube video and some being arrested en-route to Moscow and others columns being bombed from the air ! And if it is not a ruse ! The same thing !

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:41 am

    GarryB wrote:
    A strange question from someone I would normally think was smart enough to not ask such a stupid question.

    You have missed the point.
    Sure nobody could have forbidden him from recording and airing these materials.
    Yet he did that not once, not twice, but multiple times.
    And that my friend leaves a question valid.
    We considered that as some act of maskirovka, I was repeatedly saying that no idea if that is a show or a shit show.
    But things are way too far now, so we can easily assume that it was a shit show from the beginning.
    Soooo ...his head should roll down after the first attempt to destabilize the chain of command.
    It hasn't. Why?
    Was that sacrifice made for calming the situation, and not to interrupt the successful Soledar/Artemovsk operation? And Popasna previously? scratch
    Was the last call from MoD to register all the Wagner units last nail to the coffin?
    Was that deliberate? Or even provoked, in a way?
    As nobody could allow a 40k-strong private army to station in Peter, what Prigozin seemed not to absorb?
    Is the escalation made now, as they are not much needed anymore?
    And the myth of how they are successful - created by both the media and stupid hurray patriotic Rus bloggers - fades away with next and next wave of Ukroisis being smashed at the defensive positions?

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    Post  Karl Haushofer Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:46 am

    It was Putin's weakness and his endless "6d chess games" that led to this.

    I said this already in 2014 when Putin stopped the DPR/LPR forces (after listening to threats from Merkel) from decimating Ukrainian military (when it was soundly defeated) with those foolish Minsk protocols. Later even Merkel herself admitted that the only reason the Minsk protocols were signed was to give Kiev time to rebuild its military to take back Crimea.

    And when Russia finally started its "SMO" after eight years of shelling of Donbass it was not done in a proper way. The Ukrainian leadership should have been decimated in day 1 with a barrage of missile strikes to Kiev decision making centers. The same way the West wages its wars.

    Instead Russia chose the "soft approach" because Putin still considered Ukrainians as brotherly people. This led to thousands and thousands of dead Russian soldiers and a long stalemate in the front. Russia has already lost more soldiers in Ukraine than the Americans did in Vietnam.

    The war also relieved a wide spread incompetence among the Russian military.

    The Wagner PMC emerged as the only really capable fighting force among the Russian troops.

    I don't know what the motives of this coup attempt are. Are they purely selfish from Prigozhin's part or does he really has the best interest of Russia in mind?

    But what I do know that none of this would have happened if Russia had a better and more competent leadership and military.

    Now we have Russians fighting against other Russians over the control of major Russian cities. Who would have seen this happening before Russia started its "SMO"?



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    Post  Regular Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:47 am

    Well you can’t really blame UA or US for what Prigozhin is doing now. He was from inner Putins circle and he was always backed by Russian intelligence agencies in the past, his leadership core is ex-RU military. 

    It looks like similar when woman buys a baby pit bull, feeds him and trains him, takes pictures with him and then he mauls her without a warming.

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    Airbornewolf
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    Post  Airbornewolf Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:50 am

    ALAMO wrote:He looks insane indeed if you ask me.
    Have you watched how he behave at the meeting with vice minister?

    And just watch the incoming films from Rostov - people are gathering around the Wagnerites. They will disarm them with bare hands soon, people seem pissed.

    imagine how pissed the average RF soldier fighting in Ukraine must be.
    You are out there fighting for your life sending Nazi scum one a one-way ticket to Bandera.
    you know?, these guys:



    And this joker back home think's it is now the perfect time to try to pull off a coup.

    one word, Treason.


    Last edited by Airbornewolf on Sat Jun 24, 2023 11:00 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Serberus Sat Jun 24, 2023 10:52 am

    Fighting reported in Voronezh , probably true considering the governors statement

    🇷🇺 The governor of the Voronezh region said that security forces are carrying out operational and combat activities in the region as part of the CTO regime introduced this morning.

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