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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18

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    Ned86


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    Post  Ned86 Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:10 pm

    Vann7 wrote:

    What all war experts agree on russia performance ,is that is highly inadequate , the airforce role in russia , have been a colossal failure , this is what pro russian sources are saying. No air superiority at all , the only planes they risk sending are su-25 and not for close air support , but for throwing unguided rockets , from stand off position ,from far distances.. so how they can know the mission was success if they don't have visual confirmation/video recorded of the destruction of the target?
     
    You keep repeating same shit over and over again. Russian air force has full air supremacy over Ukraine. As soon as Ukraine fighter takes off, it is getting destroyed (either by SAM or Su-35).

    Vann7 wrote:
    No air superiority at all , the only planes they risk sending are su-25 and not for close air support , but for throwing unguided rockets ,
     
    They send all sorts of planes, depends on a mission. From Tu-160 for long range strikes, Tu-22M3 for carpet bombing when needed, Su-35 for air superiority, Su-34 for ground attack with large caliber missiles (Kh-31, Kh-59) and Su-25 for everything else.
    Again, Ka-52 are being used extensively with bunch of videos.
    Stop repeating your imagination about Russian air force inccopetence.

    Vann7 wrote:
    The internet is full of destruction of russian positions by guide artillery and drones flying day and night all the time over russian soldiers zones..
     

    Internet is full of Ukr propaganda. Majority of videos published by Ukraine Defense ministry was either fake (older videos from military exercises or other conflicts), videos from games or even videos showing destruction of UKR army with modified captions claiming that it was Russians being knock out.
    Put like this, Ukraine had 50+ all mighty Bayraktars and we saw few videos only. Ask yourself is that enough if you have a fleet of 50 drones ? You can't find more than 10 videos of successful use of Bayraktar even though Drone itself is remotely controlled and everything is being recorded. And yet you claim that Russia air defense is not effective.


    Vann7 wrote:
    3) failure in using spy planes ,to stop artillery positions.

    4)failure in integrating air and ground operations , between airforce ,drones and land forces.

    5)failure with electronic warfare ,in keeping enemy drones blind , not providing intel to their artillery.
     


    Only failure is your ability to accept the fact that everything you counted is being extensively and sucefully used.

    Vann7 wrote:
    7) another colossal failure of russian military is in the documentation of their victories , not showing
    how they destroy those long convoys of ukie armor from above , when they move , or it is because the airforce is not bombing ukros convoys at all?  
     

    Russia is winning the war and that is their main documentation.

    How much video evidences did US show in Iraq or Afghanistan ?
    Try to find videos of A-10s or Ah-64 in action in Iraq ? You will find at least 10 times more videos of Russian HW in Ukraine.
    Simply, they are not busy to with Twitter war.

    Vann7 wrote:
    basically NATO have proven beyond any doubts, that they can make very  near obsolete the russian airforce.. since in ukraine , most of the combat is done by land forces artillery and cruise missiles that is very limited the damage they can do , across an entire battlefield , you can't win wars with cruise missiles alone.. airforce needs to be the one that leads the army  not the other way.
     


    You can't win the war with Caliber and Iskander missiles for sure, but you can send your enemy back to the stone age in a few hours. If this was real war, where aim was to destroy Ukraine, Russia could knock out all power station in a first day of combat and then we will see how much of those UKR propaganda videos would be uploaded to the internet.

    Same goes for Drones, they are simply nice toys to have but they can't change the outcome much.
    Don't forget that each caliber brings 300-500kg of explosive and Iskander 500-700kg.

    Bayraktar and those fancy drones carry micro munition, 22kg warhead in total, which is indeed "Micro".
    I mean, what you can do with 22kg warhead except to make good video ?


    Vann7 wrote:
    -Russia also needs better bombs..smart bombs , loitering munition with tv camera and artificial intelligence and glide bombs..
     

    They do have everything for the last 20-30 years.


    Vann7 wrote:
    Putin attempts to impress  the west with "olympics bullshit" , cost the nation up to 100 billions dollars , from 2010 to 2018 , in shinny new roads , trains , hotels , olympic avenues ,stadiums of football, money he could have better used to properly equip its military ,specially its very weak airforce ,that is the reason ,they facing so much problems in ukraine. and it will only get worse in a 10x time fold or more , when the day comes for them to fight a major power in the west.  if israel airforce was aiding ukraine army there , the story will have been totally different ,and russia forces pushed all the way back to moscow , if the war was only using conventional weapons..  the only thing russia have ,to keep nato away of russian land ,is their nuclear weapons , because their conventional forces are not good enough ,to face a major conflict with NATO today.    
     


    Pure BS.
    Only one not good enough to face a mayor conflict is NATO not Russia.

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    Post  limb Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:17 pm

    Why hasn't the derivatsiya been used against quadcopter drones?
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    Post  Singular_Transform Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:30 pm

    Vann7 wrote:
    What all war experts agree on russia performance ,is that is highly inadequate , the airforce role in russia , have been a colossal failure , this is what pro russian sources are saying. No air superiority at all , the only planes they risk sending are su-25 and not for close air support , but for throwing unguided rockets , from stand off position ,from far distances.. so how they can know the mission was success if they don't have visual confirmation/video recorded of the destruction o

     

    Interesting, by your definiton what was the NATO situation in Serbia?

    If the current Russian air force perfomance "colossal failure" then how you define the situation in Serbia?

    Russia destroyed the IADS of Ukraine, the whole NATO hasn't managed this feat regards of the smaller, less capable and not NATO supported Serbia.In three month time.

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    Post  Podlodka77 Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:32 pm

    limb wrote:Why hasn't the derivatsiya been used against quadcopter drones?

    You could probably check for yourself that this system is not in series production. The plan is to complete all tests this year.
    2S38 Derivatsiya-PVO is not in serial production and then how can it be used ?

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    diabetus


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    Post  diabetus Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:34 pm

    I hope they are very careful about neutralizing all AT weapons where t-62s will be used
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    Post  limb Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:37 pm

    Podlodka77 wrote:
    limb wrote:Why hasn't the derivatsiya been used against quadcopter drones?

    You could probably check for yourself that this system is not in series production. The plan is to complete all tests this year.
    2S38 Derivatsiya-PVO is not in serial production and then how can it be used ?


    Because it's needed, it's all domestic, and uses matured components. It's bullshit that it's not being mass produced.

    Same for Hermes.

    Same for the drel glide bombs.


    But most of all, derivatsiya. I want the Russian army to be ble to give 100% of quadcopters a lifespan of minutes, and I don't want any Ukrainian Twitter accounts posting footage from their drones.
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    Post  Podlodka77 Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:43 pm

    diabetus wrote:I hope they are very careful about neutralizing all AT weapons where t-62s will be used

    I have to ask you, would you rather be protected by T-62 tank armor or would you rather be in the German "Boxer" armored personnel carrier, the American "Bradley" or "Marder", etc.?
    It is a tank, maybe partially obsolete, but it is still "universe" in terms of armored protection in relation to armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles + that you have a large caliber cannon.




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    Post  Sujoy Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:55 pm

    EW complex Palantin in action

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    Post  Podlodka77 Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:57 pm

    limb wrote:
    Podlodka77 wrote:
    limb wrote:Why hasn't the derivatsiya been used against quadcopter drones?

    You could probably check for yourself that this system is not in series production. The plan is to complete all tests this year.
    2S38 Derivatsiya-PVO is not in serial production and then how can it be used ?


    Because it's needed, it's all domestic, and uses matured components. It's bullshit that it's not being mass produced.

    Same for Hermes.

    Same for the drel glide bombs.


    But most of all, derivatsiya. I want the Russian army to be ble to give 100% of quadcopters a lifespan of minutes, and I don't want any Ukrainian Twitter accounts posting footage from their drones.


    You are not up to date because DREL bombs are in service from 2021. https://lenta.ru/news/2021/05/09/drel/
    As for the "Hermes" missile, that system has not officially reached operational status.
    The first debut of 2S38 "Derivatsiya" was in January 2018, and it is obvious that a certain system needs to be perfected. I have already written that all examinations are expected to be completed this year. And what do Ukrainians write, do you care? I don't care, for example.




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    Post  Sujoy Sun Jun 05, 2022 9:01 pm

    Isos wrote:I highly doubt it was a su-57 that launched it.
    Yes it is indeed doubtful.

    Su 57 is a hunter killer, designed right from the outset to detect and destroy enemy stealth aircraft. Why un necessarily use it against Ukrainian s whose Air Force and SAM systems have already been destroyed.

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    Post  diabetus Sun Jun 05, 2022 9:15 pm

    Backman wrote:
    Ispan wrote:Alleged to be from Kherson, T-62 tanks marching to the front, notice, five wheels

    https://t.me/swodki/110426?single

    now there are videos and photos of the arrival of Russian tanks in the Kherson region.

    Tanks are moving both in the direction of Nikolaev and Krivoy Rog. It is difficult to estimate their number, but armored vehicles have not stopped moving for the third day and day and night, most likely Russian troops are preparing something large.

    Comment: Either after destroying the Ukrainian "counteroffensive" the Russians send reinforcements to advance to Nikolayev, or they are just reinforcements to repel new Ukrozombie attacks. A Russian offensive towards Odessa seems premature to me, but still they have seen that the Ukrainian forces are weakened and there is an opportunity.

    It would make sense to send the T-62s there if the Ukros are so weakened that they have no tanks left. Although I personally expected to see them on the Donbass front.

    The second biggest army in NATO has 1500+ M-60 Patton tanks in service with some deployed to Syria right now.

    So the whole muh T-62 thing was a Western media con job

    In all fairness though, those M60s are more advanced than any T-62M.

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    Isos
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    Post  Isos Sun Jun 05, 2022 9:21 pm

    In all fairness though, those M60s are more advanced than any T-62M.

    They were modernized to modern standards. Russian t-62M were in reserve the last 30 years.

    But Syrian war showed that t-55 and t-62 have a very good survivability rate in modern conflicts.

    However against system like Kornet all the tanks are the same. They will get penetrated. Then either you are dumb and you loaded it with shells at full capacity or you are smart and you use few round and protect them well.

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    Vann7


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    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 05, 2022 9:38 pm

    Singular_Transform wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    What all war experts agree on russia performance ,is that is highly inadequate , the airforce role in russia , have been a colossal failure , this is what pro russian sources are saying. No air superiority at all , the only planes they risk sending are su-25 and not for close air support , but for throwing unguided rockets , from stand off position ,from far distances.. so how they can know the mission was success if they don't have visual confirmation/video recorded of the destruction o

     

    Interesting, by your definiton what was the NATO situation in Serbia?

    If the current Russian air force perfomance "colossal failure" then how you define the situation in Serbia?

    Russia destroyed the IADS of Ukraine, the whole NATO hasn't managed this feat regards of the smaller, less capable and not NATO supported Serbia.In three month time.


    Even if the performance of NATO was mediocre vs Serbia 30 years ago!!! , that doesn't change anything at all , to the failure of Russia ,to achieve any kind of air superiority in ukraine after 70 days of war..

    look at the following picture.. notice what is russia doing.. throwing thousands of artillery strikes
    at the ukies..  in order to take a few dozens of artillery pieces .  

    What is the message of the next picture to learn ?

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18 - Page 2 FUfaOV2X0AIAsVR?format=jpg&name=medium

    When you have no control over enemies airspace , your airforce can't be sent there to do precision bomb strikes , close air support. and so this is why russian army is soooo incredibly slow , have to be weeks striking with artillery , blind fighting , instead of precision strikes bombing.. is an extremely inefficient way of fighting in 21 century of modern warfare.   No

    What this shows to the west ,is russian army major weakness in knowing ukros mobile forces in realtime ,with precision bombing, they can't do it in  ukraine , specially when they can't fly freely anywhere above enemies airspace and can't provide true close
    air support on a 24 hours continues support.

    This is why the russian army performance in ukraine is so unimpressive , because the russian airforce potential , have been significantly limited by ukraine air defenses , and massive drone support.  go and watch any video of russian airforce , is just throwing missiles from high altitude in stand off position and quickly do a 180 degress rotation to escape ukraine airspace. No

    i have seen attack hellicopters , launching unguided rockets from far distances and then return..
    same with su-25.. this is clear evidence russia don't have any air superiority at all , russian airforce rarely do any laser precision strikes from their airforce  , is not even like syria . where russian airfoce could fly anywhere ,but only from high altitude,  in ukraine the russian airforce have no go zones , that they simply turn around to avoid them.. and fire missile or even unguided rockets without having any visual confirmation of the target..    so russian airforce performance versus moving ukrainian convoys is zero. a colossal failure.  This is the whole point of russia cruise missiles strikes.
    because ukraine have created a defacto no fly zones inside their airspace , then russian airforce role in the war ,have been seriously reduced , to the point of russian airforce becoming close to irrelevant in the entire conflict. No

    Wish i was wrong ,but this is what russia own military released videos shows..
    about its airforce.

    1) no close air support at all , only far air limited support ,with su-25s using unguided rockets. Suspect

    2) No heavy bombing from russian airforce anywhere,  the most important targets are always
    attacked by cruise misisles.

    3) very little video recording of russian airforce strikes.. either manned planes or drones.
      the minister of russia , only says.. we "Destroyed" x number of weapons ,we destroyed s-300s , we strike foreign mercenaries (as if russian airforce could distinquist nationalities from  thousands of kilometers away . Rolling Eyes  and you have to take their word for it.

    4) very unimpressive use of strike and kamikazi drones . they uploaded a video of an attempt to strike m777 artillery ,but that failed the drone to hit the intended target by a dozen of meters.
    so it failed to hit the artillery and any operator of it.

    Russian airforce is the biggest problem with russian army , in ukraine , have been significantly blocked ,from close air support.. what they doing is Far air bombing limited support, stand off firing of missiles,  i have yet to see a single video of russian airforce striking any ukranian artillery position with precision.


    Last edited by Vann7 on Sun Jun 05, 2022 9:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 05, 2022 9:48 pm

    limb wrote:
    Because it's needed, it's all domestic, and uses matured components. It's bullshit that it's not being mass produced.

    Same for Hermes.

    Same for the drel glide bombs.


    But most of all, derivatsiya. I want the Russian army to be ble to give 100% of quadcopters a lifespan of minutes, and I don't want any Ukrainian Twitter accounts posting footage from their drones.

    yep, russian army have been caught with pants down in ukraine ,and they had 8 fucking years to prepare for that fight. None of this bullshit 24 hours a day of artillery strikes with hundreds of thousands shells , would be done , if russia had true airspace superiority (at least) how their combat
    planes could do in syria.. that could fly over any city ,, but in ukraine is more like no go zones ,
    that they need to turn around and airforce role is next to zero in the conflict.. russian army basically
    wants to win the war ,with unguided artillery duels ,and throwing a ton of cruise misisles, all day and night alone. No

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    Post  Mir Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:00 pm

    diabetus wrote:

    In all fairness though, those M60s are more advanced than any T-62M.

    Not entirely true >>

    The smooth-bore 115mm gun on the T-62 is quite powerful compared to the 105mm and in the right circumstances proved quite deadly.

    In the Iran–Iraq War, Iraqi T-62s performed well against the Iranian tanks, including the M60A1s and Chieftains. In Operation Nasr, the biggest tank battle of the war, Iran lost 214 Chieftain and M60A1 tanks, while Iraq lost 45 T-62s. Approximately 200 T-62s were lost in the entire war. Chieftains were armed with a very powerful 120mm rifled gun.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-62#Service_history

    Many upgrades on the T-62's were offered for export - for example the Ukrainian T-62AG with a 125mm gun and much improved armour protection and FCS.

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    Post  limb Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:05 pm

    Podlodka77 wrote:
    limb wrote:
    Podlodka77 wrote:
    limb wrote:Why hasn't the derivatsiya been used against quadcopter drones?

    You could probably check for yourself that this system is not in series production. The plan is to complete all tests this year.
    2S38 Derivatsiya-PVO is not in serial production and then how can it be used ?


    Because it's needed, it's all domestic, and uses matured components. It's bullshit that it's not being mass produced.

    Same for Hermes.

    Same for the drel glide bombs.


    But most of all, derivatsiya. I want the Russian army to be ble to give 100% of quadcopters a lifespan of minutes, and I don't want any Ukrainian Twitter accounts posting footage from their drones.


    You are not up to date because DREL bombs are in service from 2021. https://lenta.ru/news/2021/05/09/drel/
    As for the "Hermes" missile, that system has not officially reached operational status.
    The first debut of 2S38 "Derivatsiya" was in January 2018, and it is obvious that a certain system needs to be perfected. I have already written that all examinations are expected to be completed this year. And what do Ukrainians write, do you care? I don't care, for example.





    This is concerning. The hermes is taking far to long to be put into service, so much so that the ukrainians have truck mounted brimstones, but russians have 0 truck mounted small surface to surface missiles. the israelis also have had spike NLOS since the 2010s. What made these missiles be put into service and mass produced unlike the hermes, given that russians have far superior missile technology?

    This war should be a proving ground for Russian prototype weapons. You cant perfect  a system effectively without real combat.

    The bottom line is that ukrainians have brimstones. Russians have 0 hermes.
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    Post  Isos Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:11 pm

    @Vann Dumbass, using air launched bombs and missiles is more expensive than guided shells from artillery guns. If they want to be that fast and precise they would be using krasnopol (ten thousands of dollars) instead of kh missile which cost a couple hundred of thousands of dollars.

    Russia isn't hurrying to end this war. They are making it long for a reason.

    If they use their air force it would be too quick and the world would forget it. Now they are destroying military capabilities of european countries that send their stocks with no replacement and the global crisis is destroying western economy. Meanwhile ukrainians are sending all their nazi on the front which keep being destroyed. This war isn't only against Ukraine but against western system.

    Also Russia is worried about not hurting civilians. If it wasn't, su-24 would be launching carpets of bombs on every city. One hundred fab-500 would decimate any small/medium city's buildings easily and everything inside.

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    Post  Ispan Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:13 pm

    Today's briefing

    https://guerraenucrania.wordpress.com/2022/06/05/parte-de-guerra-05-06-2022/

    I thought about the T-62 and if indeed they are sending them to the front it makes sense it's to the south front. Something big brewing there.

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    Post  Isos Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:13 pm

    Mir wrote:
    diabetus wrote:

    In all fairness though, those M60s are more advanced than any T-62M.

    Not entirely true >>

    The smooth-bore 115mm gun on the T-62 is quite powerful compared to the 105mm and in the right circumstances proved quite deadly.

    In the Iran–Iraq War, Iraqi T-62s performed well against the Iranian tanks, including the M60A1s and Chieftains. In Operation Nasr, the biggest tank battle of the war, Iran lost 214 Chieftain and M60A1 tanks, while Iraq lost 45 T-62s. Approximately 200 T-62s were lost in the entire war. Chieftains were armed with a very powerful 120mm rifled gun.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-62#Service_history

    Many upgrades on the T-62's were offered for export - for example the Ukrainian T-62AG with a 125mm gun and much improved armour protection and FCS.


    Turkey upgraded them with 120mm guns if I remember correctly and with modern optics and fire computers.

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    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:19 pm



    Claims of first su-57 strike in ukraine..
    A factory in kiev that had many tanks received by the west.




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    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:20 pm

    Claims of first su-57 strike in ukraine..
    A factory in kiev that had many tanks received by the west.




    finally some tv camera weapons usage . Smile

    they need to do more of this. This is another area ,russia have been failing ,
    in documenting their destruction of ukro army.. that can help in demoralizing them ,to stop fighting.
    And showing their airforce is doing something.




    Last edited by Vann7 on Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18 - Page 2 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18

    Post  JohninMK Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:21 pm

    Ispan wrote:Today's briefing

    https://guerraenucrania.wordpress.com/2022/06/05/parte-de-guerra-05-06-2022/

    I thought about the T-62 and if indeed they are sending them to the front it makes sense it's to the south front. Something big brewing there.

    Part of war 05/06/2022
    5 June, 2022 Zhukov

    Today the report is brief for lack of news: there must be operations in progress or in preparation and censorship has become stricter.

    Brief preliminary summary of the day from what I understand from various sources.

    TODAY 05 June

    Northern Front - Kharkov

    The Ukrainian counterattack north of Kharkov has failed, and the shelling of the Russian artillery reaches the outskirts of Kharkov. By the east they still have a bridgehead on the other side of the Pecheneg reservoir

    The Ukrainians took out a Tochka-U missile launcher to the city ring road and fired at the Russians.

    Comment: They have to be very desperate to spend the few missiles they have left to shoot at Russian troops and not kill civilians as is their custom.

    Eastern Front - Severodonetsk

    There was no counterattack in Severdonetsk and if there was it was repulsed, the Ukros are still in the industrial zone

    The Russians have deployed 240mm Tyyulpan mortars and special "Snake Gorynych" rocket launchers for the assault on Lisichansk. UR-77 and UR-83. These systems, designed for the cleaning of minefields, throw a hose of plastic explosive. The resistance in Rubezhnoye, ended after 17 launches of these weapons against the fortified positions.

    East – South Front of Lisichansk

    To the south, the fence is tightened on the Zolotoye bag, I copy:

    Offensive on Lisichansk from the south: operational situation according to my sources.

    Kamyshevakha is under the control of Russian and PRL troops. The fighting was intense, but now the enemy has been driven out of the village.

    -Note: This village was considered taken except the northern outskirts, three days ago, on June 02, it is clear that there were Ukrainian counterattacks, and that at last the whole village has been taken and the enemy has been driven back to Vubrokva, see below.

    The Ukrainian Armed Forces are retreating along the entire front line.

    Some Ukrainian units were forced to immediately retreat 20 kilometers to the rear, in the area of the village of Nagorne. There are fights for Vrubovka.



    Often, the enemy does not have ready reserve positions, so he is forced to dig urgently, under fire from the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation and the PRL.

    Our air reconnaissance is working hard, recognizing such defensive activities, after which the artillery works. This is the reason for such a deep withdrawal of many units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

    There are new Ukrainian prisoners. And they provide very interesting information about the contingent with which the armies of Russia and the LDNR are fighting in this area. On this point, all the details will be published in a separate post in the coming days

    Central Front - Artemovsk

    The Artemovsk-Lisichansk highway is under fire, and supplies are passing with difficulty, they have no trucks left, and they have to go by a detour along Seversk and secondary roads. That is why to the northwest of Severodonetsk the Ukros counterattack to prevent the Russians from advancing further and cutting the road, for now they contain the Russian bridgehead in Privolye, but now in summer the Seversky Donetsk River has decreased in flow and is fordable at several points.

    Approximate map of the front line in this sector

    https://t.me/boris_rozhin/52396



    In Avdeyevka, the Novorussians have taken a line of trenches north of the city, which indicates that the encirclement is tightening, although it is also reported that the enemy is sending reinforcements to Avdeyevka for a counterattack.



    At the Svitlodarsk reservoir, the Novorussians have taken Dolomitnoye but the Ukrainians are holding out at the thermal power plant next to the reservoir in Novoluganskoe. That is, they control the villages south and north of the shores of the lake. Map at the link

    https://t.me/boris_rozhin/52396



    Southern Front – Kherson



    A Telegram channel of Kherson has uploaded photos of T-62 with awnings and grilles that go to the front, it is identified by the detail that they have only five wheels. There is no way to verify if it is true or not, but from previous discussions it would make sense to employ these old carts.

    According to local sources:

    Tanks are moving in the direction of Nikolaev and Krivoy Rog. It is difficult to estimate their number, but armored vehicles do not stop moving for the third day, both day and night, most likely, the Russian troops are preparing something big.

    Comment: Either after destroying the Ukrainian "counteroffensive" the Russians send reinforcements to advance to Nikolayev, or they are just reinforcements to repel new Ukros attacks. A Russian offensive towards Odessa seems premature to me, but still they have seen that the Ukrainian forces are weakened and there is an opportunity.

    It would make sense to send the T-62s there if the Ukros are so weakened that they have no tanks left. Although I personally hoped to see them on the Donbass front.

    If it is confirmed that they are being taken to the front, and there is nothing confirmed yet, they would be used as mobile artillery, to cannonade enemy infantry positions in direct fire. Come to think of it, it would make more sense to employ them in the open steppe terrain on the southern front than in Donbass, so they can cannonade at pleasure from a distance out of the reach of portable anti-tank weapons. And I don't think the Javelins will achieve much either.

    Another report indicates that heavy artillery is being moved south. See photos in link

    https://t.me/Ugolok_Sitha/6726

    It is likely that the new Russian offensive will be towards Nikolayev soon.

    Summary of the day - Boris Rozhin – 22:30 hours

    1.
    Fighting continues in the area of the industrial zone of the Azot plant. The enemy also maintains communication with Lisichansk through one of the damaged bridges: heavy equipment passes there with great difficulty, but vehicles pass.
    2.
    The transfer of reinforcements from Lysychansk to Severodonetsk after the Ukrainian Armed Forces surrendered almost the entire city allowed them to stay in the Azot area and start fighting in the adjacent residential area, while the Ukrainian sources themselves admit that there are no ambitions to retake Severodonetsk.
    In consequence, the battle will continue in the Promka (industrial area), and part of Severodonetsk soon become an analogue of Mariupol in terms of destruction of high-rise buildings and other residential buildings, taking into account the booms of artillery enemy from Severodonetsk.
    3.
    It is unlikely that the command of the Russian Armed Forces plans to storm Lysychansk head-on after seizing the Severodonetsk industrial zone. The real assault on Lisichansk will take place when they break through the Ukrainian positions on Privolye and Ustinovka, advancing to the outskirts of the city, regardless of what happens on the Promka.
    4.
    The key to all these battles is the struggle for the Artemivsk-Lisichansk highway, since control over it devalues any efforts of the Ukrainian Forces to hold Lisichansk and Severodonetsk, unless, of course, there is a plan to sacrifice the entire Ukrainian army group as well as all foreign mercenaries who were sent to hold the Azot industrial zone.
    5.
    So far, the Russian forces have achieved full control of the fire on the highway, which has already affected the supply of Severodonetsk and Lisichansk. But there is not yet a complete blockade on the road, so cars and individual groups are still passing, but a full supply can no longer be provided, which was possible in the first half of May, despite all efforts to move Russian Forces away from the Belogorovka and Berestovoye area. The current task of the Russian army in this direction is to grind the enemy's reserves in the coming battles and pass over the Artemovsk—Lisichansk highway.
    6.
    Naturally, the activity of Russian Forces in the direction of Seversk is also expected, since the seizure under fire control (which is not yet available) of the Artemovsk—Seversk—Lisichansk route will lead to the notorious operational encirclement of the Severodonetsk group, which will simply lose its supply capabilities through Artemovsk, and any withdrawal will be fraught with serious losses.
    7.
    Therefore, in the near future, on the one hand, we will observe positional battles in the area of the Severodonetsk industrial zone and high-intensity battles north of Soledar.

    Other reports:

    Major General Roman Kutuzov, who was in command of the First Army Corps (Korpus) of the Donetsk People's Republic, was killed in combat near the Artemivsk-Lisichansk highway. He is the fourth Russian general killed during the hostilities. A few days ago a retired aviation general who was piloting Sukhoi 25 died in his 60s (!),

    The Armed Forces of Ukraine complain that conducting tactical reconnaissance with the help of unmanned aerial vehicles has become significantly complicated due to the operation of Russian electronic warfare systems, which block mobile communication centers and Internet sources at enemy command posts and render reconnaissance drones absolutely useless.

    https://topwar.ru/197283-teper-na-bespilotniki-ne-polozhitsja-v-vsu-zhalujutsja-na-massovoe-razvertyvanie-vs-rf-sredstv-rjeb-na-fronte.html



    The global war, beyond Ukraine

    Aleksandr Dugin refers to the great struggle that Russia is giving against the Atlanticist elite, globalism Sovereign alternative forces from all over the planet are watching. This went beyond the right vs left logic. A new paradigm has begun its consolidation.

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18 - Page 2 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18

    Post  11E Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:22 pm

    Vann7 wrote:
    Singular_Transform wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    No air superiority at all , the only planes they risk sending are su-25 and not for close air support , but for throwing unguided rockets , from stand off position
     

    Russia destroyed the IADS of Ukraine, .

    i have seen attack hellicopters , launching unguided rockets from far distances and then return..
    same with su-25.. this is clear evidence russia don't have any air superiority at all , russian airforce rarely do any laser precision strikes from their airforce  , is not even like syria . where russian airfoce could fly anywhere ,but only from high altitude,  in ukraine the russian airforce have no go zones , that they simply turn around to avoid them.. and fire missile or even unguided rockets without having any visual confirmation of the target..    so russian airforce performance versus moving ukrainian convoys is zero. a colossal failure.  This is the whole point of russia cruise missiles strikes.
    because ukraine have created a defacto no fly zones inside their airspace , then russian airforce role in the war ,have been seriously reduced , to the point of russian airforce becoming close to irrelevant in the entire conflict. No

    1) no close air support at all , only far air limited support ,with su-25s using unguided rockets. Suspect

    2) No heavy bombing from russian airforce anywhere,  the most important targets are always
    attacked by cruise misisles.


    First the definition of air superiority

    air superiority
    noun
    A dominance in the air power of one side's air forces over the other side's during a military campaign. It is defined in the NATO Glossary as "That degree of dominance in the air battle of one force over another that permits the conduct of operations by the former and its related land, sea, and air forces at a given time and place without prohibitive interference by the opposing force."

    I think this is impossible to achieve for Russia in Ukraine but also for NATO to achieve this against a peer or near pear opponent. This because you can destroy the IADS (integrated Air Defence Systems), this is what Russia achieved in Ukraine, no doubt. But this leaves you with tens or even hundreds of single vehicles like Osa or Strela or Buk which can (although limited and not integrated) fire at aircraft as single vehicle with their on board radar or optical tracking system. Above this come hundreds or thousands MANPADs. So you can never achieve the that permits the conduct of operations by the former and its related land, sea, and air forces at a given time and place without prohibitive interference by the opposing force part of air superiority. NATO can't do it neither in this scenario.

    So the best thing to do is go low on the deck, very low, tree top level. This is what NATO would do in a cold war Warsaw Pact versus NATO scenario back in the eighties. Otherwise they didn't survive against all the air defense.

    Since this is a limited operation and not a full scale war, why would you take any risks and let the opponent destroys your valuable aircraft when you can safely launch rockets at areas were they are. Unguided rockets are quit effective against personnel I know from experience in Afghanistan. No need to expend expensive laser guided weapons you maybe need when things escalate.

    Now, and I'am no expert on this, I always was teached that the Russian armed forces relied more on rockets, tactical ballistic missiles and artillery to get the same job done were NATO uses its air force for.

    I think one of the strong points of this thought is that tactical ballistic missiles, cruise missiles and artillery are much less dependent of the weather and much more available.

    A CAS block (a time were you had aircraft supporting you) was a very rare thing during my time in the army. Most of the times the aircraft did things far away for higher levels and as brigade you maybe had 2 hrs of CAS.

    Afghanistan was different because there was above 5000 mtr absolutely no threat and half the NATO air force were waiting in the air to drop bombs on anything that popped up. In a full scale war against a modern opponent this was not possible.

    About he visual confirmation. In NATO you have to have eyes on target or visual confirmation. At least for artillery, the Russian Army (IIRC) doesn't need visual confirmation, they can fire at a grid without forward observers confirmation if they want. Maybe this is the case for the air force too, different doctrines?

    About the absence of bombing by aircraft, if you have the missiles, why send people and an expensive aircraft. You may need them if things escalate.

    I think the Russian air force is very relevant, as part of the integrated air defence of Russia, which is at the moment not needed as the Ukrainian Air Force is not operating in Russian Airspace and as one of the pillars of nuclear deterrence. I see some telegram posts of Su-25s and I think they do a good job and certainly are effective. I remember a telegram message of an Ukrainian telling the worst thing he experienced was the constant air threat .

    This is my biased western bad guy opinion russia

    Sincerely,
    Lesley

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18 - Page 2 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18

    Post  VARGR198 Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:04 pm

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18 - Page 2 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #18

    Post  diabetus Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:07 pm

    Isos wrote:
    In all fairness though, those M60s are more advanced than any T-62M.

    They were modernized to modern standards. Russian t-62M were in reserve the last 30 years.

    But Syrian war showed that t-55 and t-62 have a very good survivability rate in modern conflicts.

    However against system like Kornet all the tanks are the same. They will get penetrated. Then either you are dumb and you loaded it with shells at full capacity or you are smart and you use few round and protect them well.

    They have thermal optics and updates FCS. T-62M, not so much.

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