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Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL

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Post n°551

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Thu Dec 15, 2022 2:53 pm

@Podlodka77

The Project 949A (Antey) multi-purpose nuclear submarine of the Pacific Fleet "Tomsk" is undergoing repairs and modernization at one of the enterprises of the Far Eastern Shipbuilding and Ship Repair Center (DTSSS). This was reported to TASS by a source in the shipbuilding industry.

The interlocutor of the agency did not specify the scope of work, but it is known that two submarines of this type are being repaired and upgraded to project 949AM at the Far Eastern Plant (DVZ) Zvezda - Irkutsk and Chelyabinsk.

This is logical, if you want to increase the number of submarines in the Pacific fleet you cannot decommission the submarines, you have to keep the ones you already have in operation while you receive new submarines that increase the total number

Of course the Pacific Fleet will receive at least 5 Borey's and 5 Yasen's
However , in Pacific Fleet there are not enough Akulas left to make a Sub Division with just them, you need to add several 949AMs to cover the gap while the new SSNs arrive in the next decade.

At least 3 Akulas will still be in the Pacific Fleet when restored, maybe even 4
Therefore several 949AM will have to remain in service, from 2 to 4.

There is also the possibility that the Tomsk will become a twin of Belgorod and be converted to carry Poseidon.

Anyway the Irkutsk should be in operation soon, should be in trials and enter in service in 2023 and Chelyabisnk in 2025 as much

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ALAMO

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Post n°552

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

ALAMO Thu Dec 15, 2022 3:56 pm

What is interesting, the real operational advantages of those subs is getting less and less relevant, as 949 and 971 will both be Zircon carriers after the modernization. What brings the attack perimeter up to 1000+ km. Those subs can operate under full cover of shore aviation and own ASW means, just fire the missiles. That is well enough to keep any potential strike group well away from the Russkie shores. Far enough to make the dec aviation useless, and Tomahawks exposed for interception for a very long time.

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Podlodka77

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Post n°553

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Podlodka77 Thu Dec 15, 2022 5:00 pm

To AMCXXL

I think the next 971 "Schchuka-B" submarines will be in service for some time in Pacific ;
1. K-331 "Ex-Magadan" (14.03.1991 included in the PF) ; this submarine is currently being overhauled. That submarine will likely receive an operational life extension.
2. K-419 "Kuzbass" (30.01.1993) ; it has been operational since March 2016 after the overhaul and partial modernization was completed. This means that the submarine will certainly remain operational until 2026. After that, an overhaul that would extend the life of the submarine for another year is not excluded, but modernization to the 971M project is certainly not under consideration.
3. K-295 "Samara" (29.12.1995); Project 971M submarine, modernization underway.
4. K-152 "Nerpa" (29.12.2009) ; there is currently no information about the further fate of this submarine, which is the last submarine of project 971 ever built in the "Amur" shipyard. It is the youngest 971 submarine and has been operational since 2009.

I would not like to guess what will be the final number of 885M "Yasen-M" submarines built because no one knows that, just as no one knows the final number of "Yasen-M" and "Borei-A" submarines in the NF and PF.
I'm not really sure that "Tomsk" will be converted into the 09852 project, that is, on the model of "Belgorod", because it would certainly take too long.

To Arrow

I think it's still 48 missiles in total. I think that is more than enough for a submarine project that is certainly not new.

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AMCXXL

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Post n°554

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Thu Dec 15, 2022 5:38 pm

@Podlodka77

1. K-331 "Ex-Magadan" (14.03.1991 included in the PF) ; this submarine is currently being overhauled. That submarine will likely receive an operational life extension.
2. K-419 "Kuzbass" (30.01.1993) ; it has been operational since March 2016 after the overhaul and partial modernization was completed. This means that the submarine will certainly remain operational until 2026. After that, an overhaul that would extend the life of the submarine for another year is not excluded, but modernization to the 971M project is certainly not under consideration.
3. K-295 "Samara" (29.12.1995); Project 971M submarine, modernization underway.
4. K-152 "Nerpa" (29.12.2009) ; there is currently no information about the further fate of this submarine, which is the last submarine of project 971 ever built in the "Amur" shipyard. It is the youngest 971 submarine and has been operational since 2009.

I would not like to guess what will be the final number of 885M "Yasen-M" submarines built because no one knows that, just as no one knows the final number of "Yasen-M" and "Borei-A" submarines in the NF and PF.
I'm not really sure that "Tomsk" will be converted into the 09852 project, that is, on the model of "Belgorod", because it would certainly take too long.

K-295 Kuzbass was upgraded to 971U, the K-331 will be also 971U
However Kuzbass have been more years in service while K-331 and K-295 have been a lot of years in reserve waiting overhaul

About Nerpa, deepstorm.ru said the Russian goverment refused extend the hire of the submarine , probably they want Nerpa for Russian Navy, and for that the Bratsk was decommisioned

The total number of Yasen or Boreis are not well know, but anyway, Pacific will have a Submarine Division of at least 5 Borey´s and one Submarine Division of at least 5 Yasen´s, these are the words of Pacific Fleet Admiral
In fact in december of 2023 Pacific Fleet will receive its 5th Borey

There is not much difference between whether the 12 Borey's are divided 6+6 between the Northern Fleet and the Pacific Fleet or the distribution is 7+5, although I bet for the last

The 3rd Submarine Division of the Pacific Fleet will be formed with a mix of Akulas and 949AM, I frankly hope it will be 4 Akulas and 4 949AM, to be replaced by 8 new SSN's in the future

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Big_Gazza

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Post n°555

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Big_Gazza Fri Dec 16, 2022 3:16 am

Belgorod will most likely be unique, one-of-a-kind, built partly as a full-scale testbed, & partly as a special services boat for GUGI activities. IMHO the future Poseidon-carriers will be Khabarovsk-class Project 09851.

Kharbarovsk fits the mould for Poseidon utilised for counterforce strategic (or other?) duties, but Belgorod is an odd fish, and nuke doomsday super-torps don't seem to mesh well with her role as a mothership for deep diving manned spysubs? Thats why i suspect that Belgorods Poseidons are intended to be conventionally-armed variants for use in survellaince or tactical engagements. Belgorod might be intended to launch and recover Poseidons for activities like spy missions or trials for using heavy autonomous UUVs to hunt and kill carriers. It would be a great advantage to be able to carry a deep-diving recovery submersible like a X-Ray when testing Poseidons. A failed test article can be recovered from depth rather than abandoned on the seabed to run the risk of theiving sea-gypsies (aka NATOstani pirates) of making off with it.

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owais.usmani

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Post n°556

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

owais.usmani Thu Mar 02, 2023 4:31 pm

https://twitter.com/Saturnax1/status/1631215070410678275

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AMCXXL

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Post n°557

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Fri Sep 15, 2023 9:41 am

Mr. Shoigu in Zvezda
Inside the plant there are one 949A in modernization, probably CHelyabisnk
The other you can see in satellite images should be the Irkutsk and modernization should be near completion

"Sergei Shoigu checked the execution of the state defense order at the Zvezda plant in Primorye. An Izd.23380 floating dock for nuclear submarines. Progress of repairs and modernization of nuclear submarines Izd.949AM"

https://x.com/La_souris_DA/status/1702577937088700902?s=20

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caveat emptor

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Post n°558

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

caveat emptor Fri Sep 15, 2023 4:25 pm

Does anyone knows why upgrades are taking this long? Irkutsk has been out of service for over 10 years.

ALAMO

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Post n°559

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

ALAMO Fri Sep 15, 2023 4:35 pm

Waiting for new missiles would be my very first guess.

AMCXXL

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Post n°560

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Fri Sep 15, 2023 6:19 pm

caveat emptor wrote:Does anyone knows why upgrades are taking this long? Irkutsk has been out of service for over 10 years.

there are not any upgrade for ten years. The subnarines were in reserve . Overhaul started 2019 or 2020 in the first

The pace of work will depend on the number of workers available.
Zvezda is overloaded with work and Soviet submarines have not been a priority until now.

The Pacific fleet will receive 5 Borei and 5 Yasen. The rest necessary will be to keep half a dozen Soviet submarines in operation until a replacement arrives.

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Arrow

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Post n°561

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Arrow Sun Jan 14, 2024 9:26 am

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AMCXXL

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Post n°562

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Wed Feb 07, 2024 5:35 pm

https://x.com/MrFrantarelli/status/1755143856239050866?s=20

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AMCXXL

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Post n°563

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Wed Jun 26, 2024 10:16 am

https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/21201781

source reported that the Irkutsk nuclear submarine has entered sea trials after repairs

It is assumed that "the submarine will conduct test launches of the Tsirkon hypersonic missile from the surface and underwater positions," another source of the agency reported earlier

KRONSTADT, June 26. /TASS/. The Irkutsk nuclear submarine (NPS) of Project 949AM of the Pacific Fleet (PF) has entered factory sea trials after repairs and modernization. This was reported to TASS by a source in the shipbuilding industry on the sidelines of the International Maritime Defense Show (IMDS) "Fleet-2024".

"The repair and modernization of the Irkutsk submarine at the Zvezda shipyard in Primorye is almost complete. The submarine has entered the factory sea trials," he said.

Earlier, another source told TASS that the Irkutsk submarine was supposed to enter sea trials approximately in June. According to another TASS source, "in 2024, it is planned to take the Irkutsk submarine out to sea for all types of tests; it is assumed that during the state tests, the submarine will perform test launches of the Tsirkon hypersonic missile from the surface and underwater positions."

https://x.com/MrFrantarelli/status/1805854598680150260

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ALAMO

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Post n°564

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

ALAMO Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:21 pm

One ship of this class can sing a whole of Royal Navy, without reloading.
This firepower is shocking.

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Arrow

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Post n°565

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Arrow Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:25 pm

How much can the ship carry? 3M22 and Oniks o Kalibr. I came across information about 48 pieces and even 72 missile.

Mir

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Post n°566

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Mir Wed Jun 26, 2024 1:29 pm

Earmarked for the next visit to the Caribbean Smile

@Arrow
Load-out probably depends on the missile types.

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AMCXXL

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Post n°567

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

AMCXXL Wed Jun 26, 2024 1:58 pm

Mir wrote:Earmarked for the next visit to the Caribbean

@Arrow
Load-out probably depends on the missile types.

Irkutsk is part of Pacific Fleet, the visit will be to Honululu or San Francisco

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Arrow

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Post n°568

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Arrow Wed Jun 26, 2024 2:17 pm

Assuming that Tsirkon can be armed with a nuclear warhead of about 100kT, which weighs about 100kg or even less about 50 kg . Cirkon's range may increase to 1,500-2,000 km. This can shock the West Coast. This submarine can perform both tactical and strategic strikes.

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Mir

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Post n°569

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Mir Wed Jun 26, 2024 2:18 pm

AMCXXL wrote:
Irkutsk is part of Pacific Fleet, the visit will be to Honululu or San Francisco

Maybe they will do a around the world trip just to show off Wink

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ALAMO

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Post n°570

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

ALAMO Wed Jun 26, 2024 2:28 pm

Yup, but remember that this boat has six torpedo tubes with about 30 weapons storage. All that can be "calibrated" bringing the number of ordnance in a range of 100 pcs.
Imagine a salvo of this size, including both Onix and anti-ship version of Kalibr ... Technological gap is even bigger than it used to be with 24 Granit salvo ...

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Mir

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Post n°571

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Mir Wed Jun 26, 2024 2:31 pm

Oh yes this is a totally different beast - same goes for the Nakhimov Smile

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Arrow

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Post n°572

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Arrow Wed Jun 26, 2024 3:07 pm

Oh yes this is a totally different beast - same goes for the Nakhimov Smile LIKEDISLIKE wrote:

However, a submarine is much more difficult to detect and sink than a colossus like the Nahimov. You can sail unnoticed to the US coast or to a group of aircraft carriers, all you need is to be 1000 km away from them. However, the submarine gives you a big advantage.

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Mir

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Post n°573

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Mir Wed Jun 26, 2024 3:59 pm

Yes in a state of war the submarine would be the principle naval war machine. The Nakhimov is an excellent bargaining tool during peace time.

Last week's visit to Cuba was a great demonstration of Russian naval projection and the Americans took note for sure. They would have been hysterical if it included the Nakhimov, and the whole of Brittan would be drowning in shit.

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Tsavo Lion

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Post n°574

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

Tsavo Lion Thu Jun 27, 2024 3:12 am

Arrow wrote:However, a submarine is much more difficult to detect and sink than a colossus like the Nahimov. You can sail unnoticed to the US coast or to a group of aircraft carriers, all you need is to be 1000 km away from them. However, the submarine gives you a big advantage.

the Oscars r noisy compared to newer subs; I bet the USN subs & MPA will be shadowing them as soon as they leave base. Hitting a moving CSG from that far will need help with up to date target designation by other ships/subs/UAVs/sats or MPA. So, most likely they'll operate with other forces to ensure effectiveness.

Maybe they will do a around the world trip just to show off

why spend & waste so much nuclear fuel? the N.Fleet will also have such upgraded subs; the NATO intel will know they r on patrol since they'll not be that hard to detect.
https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/21201781

TMA1

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Post n°575

Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

TMA1 Thu Jun 27, 2024 7:30 am

The second stage oscars of the 90s were known to be quiet vessels on par with the later akulas. The old akulas are fairly silent even now. The 949AM will certainly not be noisy.

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