Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


+56
Krepost
Mir
ALAMO
LMFS
lancelot
Dorfmeister
kvs
AMCXXL
lyle6
Arrow
flamming_python
walle83
The-thing-next-door
mnztr
owais.usmani
Luq man
JohninMK
ult
dino00
Hole
Labrador
verkhoturye51
Tsavo Lion
KiloGolf
Peŕrier
TheArmenian
hoom
Singular_Transform
Big_Gazza
Benya
PapaDragon
GunshipDemocracy
Isos
George1
A1RMAN
gaurav
Flanky
SeigSoloyvov
franco
Backinblack
runaway
sepheronx
max steel
chicken
Mike E
Morpheus Eberhardt
magnumcromagnon
zg18
CaptainPakistan
TR1
Cyberspec
Stealthflanker
GarryB
Viktor
Mindstorm
Austin
60 posters

    Project 949A: Oscar-II

    AMCXXL
    AMCXXL


    Posts : 995
    Points : 995
    Join date : 2017-08-08

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  AMCXXL Thu Dec 15, 2022 1:53 pm

    @Podlodka77

    The Project 949A (Antey) multi-purpose nuclear submarine of the Pacific Fleet "Tomsk" is undergoing repairs and modernization at one of the enterprises of the Far Eastern Shipbuilding and Ship Repair Center (DTSSS). This was reported to TASS by a source in the shipbuilding industry.

    The interlocutor of the agency did not specify the scope of work, but it is known that two submarines of this type are being repaired and upgraded to project 949AM at the Far Eastern Plant (DVZ) Zvezda - Irkutsk and Chelyabinsk.

    This is logical, if you want to increase the number of submarines in the Pacific fleet you cannot decommission the submarines, you have to keep the ones you already have in operation while you receive new submarines that increase the total number

    Of course the Pacific Fleet will receive at least 5 Borey's and 5 Yasen's
    However , in Pacific Fleet there are not enough Akulas left to make a Sub Division with just them, you need to add several 949AMs to cover the gap while the new SSNs arrive in the next decade.

    At least 3 Akulas will still be in the Pacific Fleet when restored, maybe even 4
    Therefore several 949AM will have to remain in service, from 2 to 4.

    There is also the possibility that the Tomsk will become a twin of Belgorod and be converted to carry Poseidon.

    Anyway the Irkutsk should be in operation soon, should be in trials and enter in service in 2023 and Chelyabisnk in 2025 as much

    Hole, Arkanghelsk and Podlodka77 like this post

    avatar
    ALAMO


    Posts : 6945
    Points : 7037
    Join date : 2014-11-25

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  ALAMO Thu Dec 15, 2022 2:56 pm

    What is interesting, the real operational advantages of those subs is getting less and less relevant, as 949 and 971 will both be Zircon carriers after the modernization. What brings the attack perimeter up to 1000+ km. Those subs can operate under full cover of shore aviation and own ASW means, just fire the missiles. That is well enough to keep any potential strike group well away from the Russkie shores. Far enough to make the dec aviation useless, and Tomahawks exposed for interception for a very long time.

    GarryB, Big_Gazza, AMCXXL, Hole, lancelot, Arkanghelsk and Podlodka77 like this post

    Podlodka77
    Podlodka77


    Posts : 2589
    Points : 2591
    Join date : 2022-01-06
    Location : Z

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  Podlodka77 Thu Dec 15, 2022 4:00 pm

    To AMCXXL

    I think the next 971 "Schchuka-B" submarines will be in service for some time in Pacific ;
    1. K-331 "Ex-Magadan" (14.03.1991 included in the PF) ; this submarine is currently being overhauled. That submarine will likely receive an operational life extension.
    2. K-419 "Kuzbass" (30.01.1993) ; it has been operational since March 2016 after the overhaul and partial modernization was completed. This means that the submarine will certainly remain operational until 2026. After that, an overhaul that would extend the life of the submarine for another year is not excluded, but modernization to the 971M project is certainly not under consideration.
    3. K-295 "Samara" (29.12.1995); Project 971M submarine, modernization underway.
    4. K-152 "Nerpa" (29.12.2009) ; there is currently no information about the further fate of this submarine, which is the last submarine of project 971 ever built in the "Amur" shipyard. It is the youngest 971 submarine and has been operational since 2009.

    I would not like to guess what will be the final number of 885M "Yasen-M" submarines built because no one knows that, just as no one knows the final number of "Yasen-M" and "Borei-A" submarines in the NF and PF.
    I'm not really sure that "Tomsk" will be converted into the 09852 project, that is, on the model of "Belgorod", because it would certainly take too long.



    To Arrow

    I think it's still 48 missiles in total. I think that is more than enough for a submarine project that is certainly not new.

    Hole and Arkanghelsk like this post

    AMCXXL
    AMCXXL


    Posts : 995
    Points : 995
    Join date : 2017-08-08

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  AMCXXL Thu Dec 15, 2022 4:38 pm

    @Podlodka77

    1. K-331 "Ex-Magadan" (14.03.1991 included in the PF) ; this submarine is currently being overhauled. That submarine will likely receive an operational life extension.
    2. K-419 "Kuzbass" (30.01.1993) ; it has been operational since March 2016 after the overhaul and partial modernization was completed. This means that the submarine will certainly remain operational until 2026. After that, an overhaul that would extend the life of the submarine for another year is not excluded, but modernization to the 971M project is certainly not under consideration.
    3. K-295 "Samara" (29.12.1995); Project 971M submarine, modernization underway.
    4. K-152 "Nerpa" (29.12.2009) ; there is currently no information about the further fate of this submarine, which is the last submarine of project 971 ever built in the "Amur" shipyard. It is the youngest 971 submarine and has been operational since 2009.

    I would not like to guess what will be the final number of 885M "Yasen-M" submarines built because no one knows that, just as no one knows the final number of "Yasen-M" and "Borei-A" submarines in the NF and PF.
    I'm not really sure that "Tomsk" will be converted into the 09852 project, that is, on the model of "Belgorod", because it would certainly take too long.

    K-295 Kuzbass was upgraded to 971U, the K-331 will be also 971U
    However Kuzbass have been more years in service while K-331 and K-295 have been a lot of years in reserve waiting overhaul

    About Nerpa, deepstorm.ru said the Russian goverment refused extend the hire of the submarine , probably they want Nerpa for Russian Navy, and for that the Bratsk was decommisioned

    The total number of Yasen or Boreis are not well know, but anyway, Pacific will have a Submarine Division of at least 5 Borey´s and one Submarine Division of at least 5 Yasen´s, these are the words of Pacific Fleet Admiral
    In fact in december of 2023 Pacific Fleet will receive its 5th Borey

    There is not much difference between whether the 12 Borey's are divided 6+6 between the Northern Fleet and the Pacific Fleet or the distribution is 7+5, although I bet for the last

    The 3rd Submarine Division of the Pacific Fleet will be formed with a mix of Akulas and 949AM, I frankly hope it will be 4 Akulas and 4 949AM, to be replaced by 8 new SSN's in the future

    GunshipDemocracy and Hole like this post

    Big_Gazza
    Big_Gazza


    Posts : 4708
    Points : 4700
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  Big_Gazza Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:16 am

    Belgorod will most likely be unique, one-of-a-kind, built partly as a full-scale testbed, & partly as a special services boat for GUGI activities.  IMHO the future Poseidon-carriers will be Khabarovsk-class Project 09851.

    Kharbarovsk fits the mould for Poseidon utilised for counterforce strategic (or other?) duties, but Belgorod is an odd fish, and nuke doomsday super-torps don't seem to mesh well with her role as a mothership for deep diving manned spysubs? Thats why i suspect that Belgorods Poseidons are intended to be conventionally-armed variants for use in survellaince or tactical engagements.  Belgorod might be intended to launch and recover Poseidons for activities like spy missions or trials for using heavy autonomous UUVs to hunt and kill carriers.  It would be a great advantage to be able to carry a deep-diving recovery submersible like a X-Ray when testing Poseidons.  A failed test article can be recovered from depth rather than abandoned on the seabed to run the risk of theiving sea-gypsies (aka NATOstani pirates) of making off with it.

    Hole and Broski like this post

    avatar
    owais.usmani


    Posts : 1794
    Points : 1790
    Join date : 2019-03-27
    Age : 38

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  owais.usmani Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:31 pm

    GarryB, George1 and Hole like this post

    AMCXXL
    AMCXXL


    Posts : 995
    Points : 995
    Join date : 2017-08-08

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  AMCXXL Fri Sep 15, 2023 7:41 am

    Mr. Shoigu in Zvezda
    Inside the plant there are one 949A in modernization, probably CHelyabisnk
    The other you can see in satellite images should be the Irkutsk and modernization should be near completion

    "Sergei Shoigu checked the execution of the state defense order at the Zvezda plant in Primorye. An Izd.23380 floating dock for nuclear submarines. Progress of repairs and modernization of nuclear submarines Izd.949AM"

    GarryB, George1, GunshipDemocracy and Hole like this post

    caveat emptor
    caveat emptor


    Posts : 1802
    Points : 1802
    Join date : 2022-02-02
    Location : Murrica

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  caveat emptor Fri Sep 15, 2023 2:25 pm

    Does anyone knows why upgrades are taking this long? Irkutsk has been out of service for over 10 years.
    avatar
    ALAMO


    Posts : 6945
    Points : 7037
    Join date : 2014-11-25

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  ALAMO Fri Sep 15, 2023 2:35 pm

    Waiting for new missiles would be my very first guess.
    AMCXXL
    AMCXXL


    Posts : 995
    Points : 995
    Join date : 2017-08-08

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  AMCXXL Fri Sep 15, 2023 4:19 pm

    caveat emptor wrote:Does anyone knows why upgrades are taking this long? Irkutsk has been out of service for over 10 years.

    there are not any upgrade for ten years. The subnarines were in reserve . Overhaul started 2019 or 2020 in the first

    The pace of work will depend on the number of workers available.
    Zvezda is overloaded with work and Soviet submarines have not been a priority until now.

    The Pacific fleet will receive 5 Borei and 5 Yasen. The rest necessary will be to keep half a dozen Soviet submarines in operation until a replacement arrives.

    GarryB and lancelot like this post

    avatar
    Arrow


    Posts : 2843
    Points : 2835
    Join date : 2012-02-12

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  Arrow Sun Jan 14, 2024 8:26 am

    GarryB and Hole like this post

    AMCXXL
    AMCXXL


    Posts : 995
    Points : 995
    Join date : 2017-08-08

    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  AMCXXL Wed Feb 07, 2024 4:35 pm

    GarryB, Big_Gazza, LMFS, Hole, owais.usmani, lancelot and Arkanghelsk like this post


    Sponsored content


    Project 949A: Oscar-II - Page 23 Empty Re: Project 949A: Oscar-II

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Fri Jun 14, 2024 7:38 pm