Russian Assault Rifles/Carbines/Machine Guns Thread: #1

IMO russia should stop with the spetznaz fetishism and modernize their equipment after the regular mechanized troops do. There should be less focus on producing superspecialised weapons and immediately focus on weapons used for mass conventional warfare(shmel-M, Ak-12, ORSIS T-5000 instead of VKS or AS val), while any new assault rifle or ratnik suit should be given to regulars.

Asf wrote:

IMO russia should stop with the spetznaz fetishism and modernize their equipment after the regular mechanized troops do. There should be less focus on producing superspecialised weapons and immediately focus on weapons used for mass conventional warfare(shmel-M, Ak-12, ORSIS T-5000 instead of VKS or AS val), while any new assault rifle or ratnik suit should be given to regulars.

VKS and Val are used by regular recon units of regular mechanized troops, for example.
Ratnik is designed for regular combat troops.

Asf wrote:

IMO russia should stop with the spetznaz fetishism and modernize their equipment after the regular mechanized troops do. There should be less focus on producing superspecialised weapons and immediately focus on weapons used for mass conventional warfare(shmel-M, Ak-12, ORSIS T-5000 instead of VKS or AS val), while any new assault rifle or ratnik suit should be given to regulars.

VKS and Val are used by regular recon units of regular mechanized troops, for example.
Ratnik is designed for regular combat troops.

Regular wrote:

Asf wrote:

IMO russia should stop with the spetznaz fetishism and modernize their equipment after the regular mechanized troops do. There should be less focus on producing superspecialised weapons and immediately focus on weapons used for mass conventional warfare(shmel-M, Ak-12, ORSIS T-5000 instead of VKS or AS val), while any new assault rifle or ratnik suit should be given to regulars.

VKS and Val are used by regular recon units of regular mechanized troops, for example.
Ratnik is designed for regular combat troops.

Yes, SF will be getting 4 types of uniforms/equipment too. Legioner, Centurion, Sherp, Gladiator. Ratnik will only be used by SF attached to army.



They look heavy as fuck, but knowing that those guys operate as bullet and grenade magnets, their operations are usually end quick so it's understandable. Maska helmets were heavy too.

magnumcromagnon wrote:

What evidence are you basing how heavy those uniforms on? Is these claims simply based off of the 'eye test'?

Regular wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

What evidence are you basing how heavy those uniforms on? Is these claims simply based off of the 'eye test'?

Yes, I said look. They might be using different materials but still I would never compare to Ratnik 2. It's not as clumpy for a reason.

Evidence? I only have personal experience.
Plates do weight. Usually it's 18 kg at best. That's why some soldiers like to slack off and take them out in training. Shoulder armor not only adds weight but it hampers movement. Crotch protector is the worst thing You want to have in the field. Add the weight of backpack. Equipment and etc. Add the weight of the shield if operator is using it.
Neck protection doesn't help you to cheek wield the gun too, thats why sp3mp has second butstock placement.


By the way all that weight makes You breathing heavy and stops proper bloodflow. No matter how comfortable they are eventually You will start to feel it when breathing. It makes you disbalanced and shooting with armor is different than shooting without it. I might sound dramatic, but those things will keep You in one piece, it will save lives so it's worth it.
What info do You want to know? Everything was posted by other members before, just go back few pages. There isn't much known about them yet.

GarryB wrote:The spike bayonet suggests Chinese AKs in yuor second photo.

MOSCOW, December 10 - RIA Novosti. The machine, which will be a major small arms in the Russian military outfit "future soldier" "Warrior", will be available in two versions caliber - 5.45 and 7.62 mm, said Tuesday the deputy chairman of the board of the Military -Industrial Commission (MIC) of the Russian Federation Oleg Bochkarev.

"Caliber will be two - 5.45 and 7.62 mm. This is a classic. Different objectives, so we do not deviate from this plan," - said Bochkarev in the "National Defense" on the radio station "CAPITAL FM" .

He recalled that at the present time the Ministry of Defense completes the state tests, the results of which will make their choice in favor of a particular machine.

"We compare two types of automatic weapons - AEK-971 (concern" Kalashnikov ") and AK-12 (Degtyarev Plant), machines about the same level. But it is important that the weapon was simple, at a price cheaper and more suited for mass production" - said the deputy chairman of the board of MIC.

According to him, "if we compare these characteristics, but they will be very important to make a decision that will go in the series, the AK-12 is preferable." However, the decision - for the military, emphasized Bochkarev. "A technique for exactly the same machines," - he said.

http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20141210/1037425974.html

You can see that folded AKM is only 655mm, that is shorter than most of the bullpups in this world. Therefore, Russia and Germany do not invest much in the bullpup design because they already have foldable buttstock.

When you fold the buttstock, you cannot lean the rifle to your body to make a proper aim, but the soliders will be train to fold the buttstock only when they don't need to aim.

Personally I would like to see a bullpup which reaches the legendary level of compactness, like the TKB-022PM. The buttstock and the receiver of  TKB-022PM are completely fused toghether, therefore its lenght is only 525 mm.

Regular wrote:

Personally I would like to see a bullpup which reaches the legendary level of compactness, like the TKB-022PM. The buttstock and the receiver of  TKB-022PM are completely fused toghether, therefore its lenght is only 525 mm.

But why? There are plenty of SMGs that are quite short and they would work even better than midget assault rifle. But similar one exists actually.

Regular wrote:I personally would love something bit bigger and conventional. I have never shot bullpup rifle in my life so I can't say anything bad or good.

Regular wrote:G36 without optics is finest weapon I've ever handled, bullpups for me don't look natural.

GarryB wrote:Short is handy but is there really any advantage in carrying one of those stupid little short barrel carbine versions of assault rifles?

In the AK line the AKS-74U is really a SMG with more powerful ammo but nothing near assault rifle accuracy at combat ranges.

I personally like fitting suppressors to my rifles as it makes them quieter... it also increases length which is not really a problem.

GarryB wrote:The alternative to angled buttstock is raised sights... which seems to work OK too. the problem with an angled stock is increased separation of the barrel thrust line with the support offered by the shoulder leading to an upward kick effect.