Iraqi Army

iraqidabab wrote:I doubt it's RPG, hitting a helicopter with that is extremely hard, in no video ( and there are many ) has the MI-35 been seen hovering, it has been on the move and in high altitude in every video. That leaves Igla and Strela, ISIS has captured many from Syria.

The defense upgrades are needed, let's see whether MoD will understand, perhaps Russia-Iraq will speak about the downing of this MI-35 and they will be told about the upgrades.

WASHINGTON, Oct. 5, 2014 – U.S. military forces continued to attack ISIL terrorists in Syria yesterday and today, using fighter aircraft to conduct three airstrikes.
Separately, in Iraq U.S. military forces used helicopters and attack, bomber, and fighter aircraft to conduct six airstrikes against ISIL in Iraq.
In Syria, one strike northwest of Al Mayadin destroyed an ISIL bulldozer, two ISIL tanks and destroyed another ISIL vehicle. Two strikes northwest of Ar Raqqah struck a large ISIL unit and destroyed six ISIL firing positions. To conduct these strikes, the U.S. employed fighter aircraft deployed to the U.S. Central Command area of operations. All aircraft departed the strike areas safely.
In Iraq, four strikes northeast of Fallujah struck two mortar teams, a large ISIL unit and two small ISIL units. One strike southeast of Hit destroyed two ISIL Humvees. One strike northeast of Sinjar destroyed an ISIL Humvee. To conduct these strikes, the U.S. employed helicopters and attack, bomber, fighter aircraft deployed to the U.S. Central Command area of operations. All aircraft departed the strike areas safely.
The U.S. strikes were conducted as part of President Barack Obama's comprehensive strategy to degrade and destroy ISIL. The destruction and degradation of ISIL targets in Syria and Iraq further limits the terrorist group's ability to lead, control, project power and conduct operations.

iraqidabab wrote:^^ you can't see personnel and MANPADS when flying over cities, it's easy in the open desert though.

the US is now flying Apaches in Anbar from Baghdad airport, wonder what protection they have against Strela/Igla, though quite sure they operate it at night to make it hard for the terrorists.

http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=123346

WASHINGTON, Oct. 5, 2014 – U.S. military forces continued to attack ISIL terrorists in Syria yesterday and today, using fighter aircraft to conduct three airstrikes.
Separately, in Iraq U.S. military forces used helicopters and attack, bomber, and fighter aircraft to conduct six airstrikes against ISIL in Iraq.
In Syria, one strike northwest of Al Mayadin destroyed an ISIL bulldozer, two ISIL tanks and destroyed another ISIL vehicle. Two strikes northwest of Ar Raqqah struck a large ISIL unit and destroyed six ISIL firing positions. To conduct these strikes, the U.S. employed fighter aircraft deployed to the U.S. Central Command area of operations. All aircraft departed the strike areas safely.
In Iraq, four strikes northeast of Fallujah struck two mortar teams, a large ISIL unit and two small ISIL units. One strike southeast of Hit destroyed two ISIL Humvees. One strike northeast of Sinjar destroyed an ISIL Humvee. To conduct these strikes, the U.S. employed helicopters and attack, bomber, fighter aircraft deployed to the U.S. Central Command area of operations. All aircraft departed the strike areas safely.
The U.S. strikes were conducted as part of President Barack Obama's comprehensive strategy to degrade and destroy ISIL. The destruction and degradation of ISIL targets in Syria and Iraq further limits the terrorist group's ability to lead, control, project power and conduct operations.

Werewolf wrote:

iraqidabab wrote:^^ you can't see personnel and MANPADS when flying over cities, it's easy in the open desert though.

the US is now flying Apaches in Anbar from Baghdad airport, wonder what protection they have against Strela/Igla, though quite sure they operate it at night to make it hard for the terrorists.

http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=123346

WASHINGTON, Oct. 5, 2014 – U.S. military forces continued to attack ISIL terrorists in Syria yesterday and today, using fighter aircraft to conduct three airstrikes.
Separately, in Iraq U.S. military forces used helicopters and attack, bomber, and fighter aircraft to conduct six airstrikes against ISIL in Iraq.
In Syria, one strike northwest of Al Mayadin destroyed an ISIL bulldozer, two ISIL tanks and destroyed another ISIL vehicle. Two strikes northwest of Ar Raqqah struck a large ISIL unit and destroyed six ISIL firing positions. To conduct these strikes, the U.S. employed fighter aircraft deployed to the U.S. Central Command area of operations. All aircraft departed the strike areas safely.
In Iraq, four strikes northeast of Fallujah struck two mortar teams, a large ISIL unit and two small ISIL units. One strike southeast of Hit destroyed two ISIL Humvees. One strike northeast of Sinjar destroyed an ISIL Humvee. To conduct these strikes, the U.S. employed helicopters and attack, bomber, fighter aircraft deployed to the U.S. Central Command area of operations. All aircraft departed the strike areas safely.
The U.S. strikes were conducted as part of President Barack Obama's comprehensive strategy to degrade and destroy ISIL. The destruction and degradation of ISIL targets in Syria and Iraq further limits the terrorist group's ability to lead, control, project power and conduct operations.

The funny thing about US and their Apaches is they are all without MAWS which are necessary to track incoming MANPADS, there are only around 90 AMASE pods of which only a low percentage have DIRCMs and only 4 out of 16 RF squadrons have MAW sensors installed via AMASE pods, that leaves them to usually fly missions at night like you said.

magnumcromagnon wrote:
Lets not even talk about the the windows on the Apache aren't even rated to stop 7.62 x 39 mm AKM fire!

iraqidabab wrote:I doubt it's RPG, hitting a helicopter with that is extremely hard, in no video ( and there are many ) has the MI-35 been seen hovering, it has been on the move and in high altitude in every video. That leaves Igla and Strela, ISIS has captured many from Syria.

iraqidabab wrote:

This Iraqi MI-17.. so they decide to put MAWS on a MI-17 while they don't on combat helos MI-35 and MI-28 WTH!!!!!!!! HOW STUPID

sheytanelkebir wrote:http://bigstory.ap.org/article/6f1dc7c6438c4323a75cd5b8e49d0335/islamic-state-group-downs-another-iraqi-helicopter


well yesterday an IA-407 was shot down over Baiji (same place where the Mi35M was lost last week).

The IA-407 (like Iraq's Mi17, EC-635, UH-1, Cessna 208, KingAir-350, C130J-30) is equipped with MAWS.

In fact the Mi35M and Mi28NE not having MAWS was definitely a short term issue that they should have solved, but I guess the desperation to get them into battle meant they delayed and delayed the installations... In the meantime the Mi35M always flew in a "tag team" with an IA-407 (Iraq has 28 IA-407s - same number as Mi35M ordered), but I dont think the MAWS of the IA-407 would be able to warn the MI35M of SAMs unless the IA-407 itself is targetted.


This double shootdown in this one week confirms that IS now have a powerful air defence capability that they can use to target Iraqi aircraft at low altitude even ones with modern MAWS.

medo wrote:To be honest MAWS wouldn't change much for Mi-35M. It already have chaff and flare dispenser and IR jammer, so even if Mi-35M have MAWS, it will only turn on IR jammer and launch flares, what Mi-35 already use in combat mission. problem could be, if Mi-35 is too long in combat area and run out of flares. And than missile could easily lock and hit helicopter.

sheytanelkebir wrote:The mi35m is now confirmed to have been downed by a chinese fn-6 manpads probably from the "free Syrian army" that got it supplied by Qatar...

All the Iraqi helos (except mi35m/mi28ne) do indeed have automatic flare dispersal system with the maws. Didn't help every time though.

iraqidabab wrote:Looks more like US Apache then MI-28

Werewolf wrote:

iraqidabab wrote:Looks more like US Apache then MI-28

Hard to tell.

Mike E wrote:

Werewolf wrote:

iraqidabab wrote:Looks more like US Apache then MI-28

Hard to tell.

Yep, but its wide tail is reminiscent of the Apache...

Werewolf wrote:

Mike E wrote:

Werewolf wrote:

iraqidabab wrote:Looks more like US Apache then MI-28

Hard to tell.

Yep, but its wide tail is reminiscent of the Apache...

Iraq would be wise to equip their Mi-28/35's first with President-S or at least equip them with MAWS integrated to automatic flare dispensing before risking more helicopters and soldiers and not to rush into battle.