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Turkish Stream pipeline construction project suspended — Russia’s Energy Minister
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Turkish Stream pipeline: News
George1- Posts : 18400
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kvs- Posts : 15480
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George1 wrote:Turkish Stream pipeline construction project suspended — Russia’s Energy Minister
Good riddance. Turkey was not a reliable partner and started demanding major gas price discounts as soon as the project was announced.
They can all eat LNG cake now, the twits.
A Different Voice- Posts : 70
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kvs wrote:George1 wrote:Turkish Stream pipeline construction project suspended — Russia’s Energy Minister
Good riddance. Turkey was not a reliable partner and started demanding major gas price discounts as soon as the project was announced.
They can all eat LNG cake now, the twits.
Things between Russia and Turkey will eventually blow over and there will be a reconciliation. It may take a while but Turkish Stream isn't dead forever. The Turks already realize they miscalculated in handling the shoot down of that SU-24. They have too much at stake economically to make Russia a real enemy. They are already at the beginning stages of quietly begging Russia not to impose overly harsh sanctions.
GarryB- Posts : 39672
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And it is not in Russias long term interests to cut itself off from Turkey... both countries could make a lot of money from trade, and I think the power control of one entry into the EU of Russian gas would give turkey at the table with EU nations... maybe even get them a seat at the EU table if that is what they desire, is really worth rather more to them than they let on...
Regarding the Discounts... that is perfectly normal for very long term deals involving significant investment in infrastructure.. the customer has to be really happy with the deal so they wont just wait till everythings built and then try to renegotiate the deal for a better return or simply walk out of the deal now that you have spent all that money on pipes and pumping stations etc etc.
Regarding the Discounts... that is perfectly normal for very long term deals involving significant investment in infrastructure.. the customer has to be really happy with the deal so they wont just wait till everythings built and then try to renegotiate the deal for a better return or simply walk out of the deal now that you have spent all that money on pipes and pumping stations etc etc.
A Different Voice- Posts : 70
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Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu is making noise about imposing retaliatory sanctions on Russia. Related reports make it obvious Turkey:
1. wants to avoid Russia implementing serious sanctions;
2. wants to negotiate and ease tensions with Russia; and
3. is threatening "counter sanctions" against Russia only as a means to aid in convincing Russia to go easy on its Turkey sanctions.
Turkish PM threatens sanctions
I expect it will take a bit of time for things to cool down between Turkey and Russia. Should be interesting to watch how this progresses and how quickly talks regarding Turkish Stream resume.
1. wants to avoid Russia implementing serious sanctions;
2. wants to negotiate and ease tensions with Russia; and
3. is threatening "counter sanctions" against Russia only as a means to aid in convincing Russia to go easy on its Turkey sanctions.
Turkish PM threatens sanctions
I expect it will take a bit of time for things to cool down between Turkey and Russia. Should be interesting to watch how this progresses and how quickly talks regarding Turkish Stream resume.
KoTeMoRe- Posts : 4212
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The problem however is two-folds.
1. Turkey has handled the offence pretty badly. They have been lying about nearly everything. Whatever they have done that 23rd of November, it was either half-assed, either badly planned.
a. Non ID of the plane.
b. Duration of the 'air trespassing'
c. The images "leaked" to the press, along with the "audio", they now say isn't the right one.
2. This leads to the impossibility, for Russia (at least Putin) to get on the same page as Turkey, because.
a. Lying so badly, is the sign they don't GAF about what they did, and they will do it again.
b. The steps taken by Turkey, asking about de-escalation, are non-existent. NON-Existent. They talk sweet, keep their turns on the Syrian border.
c. The economic bounty might be good, but this isn't Ukraine. Turkey will be having some tough times as much of its economy, IS smoke and mirrors and profited a lot from the Iran backroll due to sanctions.
What is "needed" isn't the 30bln total trade with Turkey...although they're good. But one has barely 60 bln USd trade with...CHINA. The Russians trade with their "partners" is dismal. Iran can cut back a lot of that Turkish Tomato sauce. This should help Russia seek better ties with people they can have far more beneficial relations with. Like Greece. Russians need to take over a huge chunk of Greek coast. It's very profitable and the people aren't worse than Turks. Russia can have a lot of success down the road by targeting areas in disarray in Europe. Portugal is such an untaped potential. Italy is good too.
1. Turkey has handled the offence pretty badly. They have been lying about nearly everything. Whatever they have done that 23rd of November, it was either half-assed, either badly planned.
a. Non ID of the plane.
b. Duration of the 'air trespassing'
c. The images "leaked" to the press, along with the "audio", they now say isn't the right one.
2. This leads to the impossibility, for Russia (at least Putin) to get on the same page as Turkey, because.
a. Lying so badly, is the sign they don't GAF about what they did, and they will do it again.
b. The steps taken by Turkey, asking about de-escalation, are non-existent. NON-Existent. They talk sweet, keep their turns on the Syrian border.
c. The economic bounty might be good, but this isn't Ukraine. Turkey will be having some tough times as much of its economy, IS smoke and mirrors and profited a lot from the Iran backroll due to sanctions.
What is "needed" isn't the 30bln total trade with Turkey...although they're good. But one has barely 60 bln USd trade with...CHINA. The Russians trade with their "partners" is dismal. Iran can cut back a lot of that Turkish Tomato sauce. This should help Russia seek better ties with people they can have far more beneficial relations with. Like Greece. Russians need to take over a huge chunk of Greek coast. It's very profitable and the people aren't worse than Turks. Russia can have a lot of success down the road by targeting areas in disarray in Europe. Portugal is such an untaped potential. Italy is good too.
kvs- Posts : 15480
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GarryB wrote:And it is not in Russias long term interests to cut itself off from Turkey... both countries could make a lot of money from trade, and I think the power control of one entry into the EU of Russian gas would give turkey at the table with EU nations... maybe even get them a seat at the EU table if that is what they desire, is really worth rather more to them than they let on...
Regarding the Discounts... that is perfectly normal for very long term deals involving significant investment in infrastructure.. the customer has to be really happy with the deal so they wont just wait till everythings built and then try to renegotiate the deal for a better return or simply walk out of the deal now that you have spent all that money on pipes and pumping stations etc etc.
If only Turkey was run by governments who were not hosting terrorist training camps for North Caucuses destabilization.
When that day comes, sometime long into the future, then perhaps reconciliation will happen. The fall out with Turkey
is not due to the Su-24 shoot down alone.
GarryB- Posts : 39672
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The fall out with Turkey
is not due to the Su-24 shoot down alone.
Sadly I tend to agree... I think good business relations is always the best solution but in this case (and with other similar situations like Russia and Pakistan/Saudi arabia/Quatar etc) I think the shoot down is just the symptom that reveals the presence of underlying disease.
These countries with ideologies to spread have to decide whether they want the rest of the world to be like them, or whether they just want to trade and live in the world as it is without manipulating the other players... ironically Russia has been there with communism, but it was hardly active in converting democracies into socialist states... I suspect China and to a much lessor extent Albania/Yugoslavia made them realise that just because a country is communist or socialist does not make them best buddies.
Of course Yugoslavia and China proved for some time that it was possible to be communist AND friends with the west as long as you weren't a threat and could be "used" against a threat to the west (ie Soviet Union) then there was plenty of room for cooperation.
A Different Voice- Posts : 70
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[These countries with ideologies to spread have to decide whether they want the rest of the world to be like them, or whether they just want to trade and live in the world as it is without manipulating the other players... ironically Russia has been there with communism, but it was hardly active in converting democracies into socialist states...[/quote]
Really dude?
Regardless, I agree with your larger point. Countries have a choice with respect to their foreign policy. They can try and export their ideology to other countries by various means or they decide to trade and stay out of the affairs of others.
Really dude?
Regardless, I agree with your larger point. Countries have a choice with respect to their foreign policy. They can try and export their ideology to other countries by various means or they decide to trade and stay out of the affairs of others.
KoTeMoRe- Posts : 4212
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A Different Voice wrote:[These countries with ideologies to spread have to decide whether they want the rest of the world to be like them, or whether they just want to trade and live in the world as it is without manipulating the other players... ironically Russia has been there with communism, but it was hardly active in converting democracies into socialist states...
Really dude?
Regardless, I agree with your larger point. Countries have a choice with respect to their foreign policy. They can try and export their ideology to other countries by various means or they decide to trade and stay out of the affairs of others.[/quote]
I would like you to offer me a democracy turned Socialist by Russia. Soviet Union is different and even that, not exactly going out their ways making democratic regimes "crumble". Interwar Baltic Nations do not qualify as "democracies". And basically no one in Europe was this great beacon of democracy during interwar period.
GarryB- Posts : 39672
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The Soviets actively tried to gain influence and "convert" democracies to their way of thinking... Russia on the other hand has existed as a separate entity before 1917 and after 1991 has not directly done so.
George1- Posts : 18400
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Russia to own Turkish Stream’s seabed section, Turkey — its land section, ministry says
On Monday, the Russian and Turkish energy ministers signed an intergovernmental agreement on the construction of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline
ISTANBUL, October 10. /TASS/. Russia will own the seabed section of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline and Turkey will own its mainland section, the Russian Energy Ministry said on Monday citing Minister Alexander Novak after talks with Turkey.
"As Alexander Novak said, the agreement envisages that the land section of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline will be owned by a Turkish company, while its seabed section will be owned by a Russian company," the ministry said.
Earlier on Monday, Russian Minister of Energy Alexander Novak and Turkish Minister of Energy and Natural Resources Berat Albayrak signed an intergovernmental agreement on the construction of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline. The agreement was signed in the presence of the two countries’ presidents, Vladimir Putin of Russia and Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey.
After Russia abandoned the South Stream project in 2014 over the European Union’s insistence on its compliance with the so-called Third Energy Package, it was decided to launch an alternative project — the Turkish Stream. It was initially planned to build four threads of the pipeline with a capacity of 15.75 billion cubic meters each. However, talks on the project were soon suspended over a chill in Russia-Turkey bilateral relations.
After the two countries resumed full-format relations, the work on the Turkish Stream project was continued. The sides set up a working group and drafted a roadmap.
The project provides for the construction of a gas pipeline across the Black Sea bed to Turkey’s European part, with further extension to the border with Greece. The seabed section is about 910 kilometers and the mainland section in Turkey — 180 kilometers. The project cost was earlier estimated at 11.4 billion euros. It is planned that the first thread will be meant entirely for supplies of gas to the Turkish market.
More:
http://tass.com/economy/905524?_ga=1.164346751.1337049799.1447427261
On Monday, the Russian and Turkish energy ministers signed an intergovernmental agreement on the construction of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline
ISTANBUL, October 10. /TASS/. Russia will own the seabed section of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline and Turkey will own its mainland section, the Russian Energy Ministry said on Monday citing Minister Alexander Novak after talks with Turkey.
"As Alexander Novak said, the agreement envisages that the land section of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline will be owned by a Turkish company, while its seabed section will be owned by a Russian company," the ministry said.
Earlier on Monday, Russian Minister of Energy Alexander Novak and Turkish Minister of Energy and Natural Resources Berat Albayrak signed an intergovernmental agreement on the construction of the Turkish Stream gas pipeline. The agreement was signed in the presence of the two countries’ presidents, Vladimir Putin of Russia and Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey.
After Russia abandoned the South Stream project in 2014 over the European Union’s insistence on its compliance with the so-called Third Energy Package, it was decided to launch an alternative project — the Turkish Stream. It was initially planned to build four threads of the pipeline with a capacity of 15.75 billion cubic meters each. However, talks on the project were soon suspended over a chill in Russia-Turkey bilateral relations.
After the two countries resumed full-format relations, the work on the Turkish Stream project was continued. The sides set up a working group and drafted a roadmap.
The project provides for the construction of a gas pipeline across the Black Sea bed to Turkey’s European part, with further extension to the border with Greece. The seabed section is about 910 kilometers and the mainland section in Turkey — 180 kilometers. The project cost was earlier estimated at 11.4 billion euros. It is planned that the first thread will be meant entirely for supplies of gas to the Turkish market.
More:
http://tass.com/economy/905524?_ga=1.164346751.1337049799.1447427261
George1- Posts : 18400
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Gazprom inks agreement on land-based section of TurkStream gas pipeline
Gazprom and Botas inked an agreement on conditions and parameters for the section construction
ST. PETERSBURG, May 26. /TASS/. Russia’s state-run gas giant Gazprom and Turkey signed a protocol on Saturday on a land-based part of the transit leg of the TurkStream gas pipeline, due to supply Russian gas to European customers, Gazprom said.
In addition to the protocol, Gazprom and Botas inked an agreement on conditions and parameters for the section construction, which would enable the sides to take practical steps in the project. The TurkAkim Gaz Tasima A. S. joint venture will be set up to build the land-based part of the pipeline.
In September last year, Gazprom's Management Committee approved creating a joint project with Turkish Botas for the construction of the overland section of the TurkStream gas pipeline.
Gazprom acquiring of 50 shares in the joint project company TurkAkim Gaz Tasima A.S. with a total value of 50,000 Turkish lira was also approved, which is 50% of the authorized capital of the joint company.
Gazprom said earlier that the joint venture is being created on a parity basis for the implementation of the Turkish section of the second line of TurkStream within the framework of the intergovernmental agreement between Russia and Turkey.
Gazprom estimates the cost of construction of the TurkStream gas pipeline at 7bln euro.
In May 2017, Gazprom began construction of the offshore section of the TurkStream near the Russian Black Sea coast. The project involved construction of the gas pipeline through the Black Sea to the European part of Turkey and further to the border with Greece. The length of the sea part of the pipe is expected at around 930 km, the overland part on the Turkish territory - 180 km.
The first line will be intended for the Turkish market, the second - for gas supply to the countries of South and South-Eastern Europe. The capacity of each line reaches 15.75 bln cubic meters of gas per year.
The first gas supplies are planned for the end of 2019. Construction of a sea section of the gas pipeline is carried out by South Stream Transport B.V. (100% subsidiary of Gazprom).
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More:
http://tass.com/economy/1006710
George1- Posts : 18400
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Documents on Serbia’s participation in TurkStream can be signed in January 2019
More:
http://tass.com/economy/1030169
More:
http://tass.com/economy/1030169
George1- Posts : 18400
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Gas deliveries to Hungary via TurkStream to begin in late 2021 — foreign minister
More:
http://tass.com/economy/1049939
More:
http://tass.com/economy/1049939
George1- Posts : 18400
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Gas-in started for first line of TurkStream
Construction work at the receiving terminal in Turkey is currently in its final stage
MOSCOW, October 18. /TASS/. Gas-in has started for the first line of the TurkStream natural gas pipeline, the project company South Stream Transport, a subsidiary of the Russian gas holding Gazprom, said on Friday.
This is a closing step in the gas pipeline commissioning, the company noted. Commissioning of the subsea segment was initiated after DNV-GL certified both lines, it said.
"Introducing gas to the pipeline system is a significant step towards the start of actual gas deliveries to Turkey and South-Eastern Europe through the newly developed offshore pipeline system. Commercial gas flow through TurkStream is planned to start by the end of 2019," South Stream transport says.
Gas-in for the second line of the TurkStream will begin after loading of the first line is completed.
Construction work at the receiving terminal in Turkey is currently in its final stage, the company said. "Turkish gas transmission operator BOTAS is working in parallel on building the first onshore pipeline to connect TurkStream to the Turkish gas network, while a Gazprom-BOTAS partnership is developing the second onshore line to carry gas to Turkey’s borders with Europe," the company reported.
TurkStream is a gas pipeline that is being constructed under the Black Sea to the European part of Turkey and further on to the border with Greece, bypassing Ukraine. The first line is intended for the Turkish market, the second branch is going to supply the countries of Southern and Southeastern Europe. Gazprom considers Greece, Italy, Bulgaria, Serbia and Hungary as potential markets. The capacity of each line is 15.75 bln cubic meters of gas per year.
https://tass.com/economy/1083994
George1- Posts : 18400
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Turkish Stream infrastructure in Bulgaria to be built in H1
https://tass.com/economy/1084548
https://tass.com/economy/1084548
George1- Posts : 18400
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Bulgaria starts receiving Russian gas via TurkStream pipeline
Executive Director of Bulgaria’s Bulgartransgaz operator said that the country will get 2.9 bln cubic meters of gas annually
SOFIA, January 1. /TASS/. Bulgaria has begun to receive Russian gas via the TurkStream gas pipeline, Executive Director of Bulgaria’s Bulgartransgaz operator Vladimir Malinov announced on Wednesday.
"Bulgartransgaz and Russia’s Gazprom Export company finalized talks in the last days of 2019 and today, Bulgaria began to receive Russian gas via Turkey instead of Ukraine," Bulgarian National Radio quoted Malinov as saying. According to him, Bulgaria will get 2.9 bln cubic meters of gas annually. Malinov added that the country’s gas infrastructure facilities were ready to absorb that amount of gas.
Bulgartransgaz executive director added that Bulgaria would be able to reduce the payment of transit fees by about 70 mln lev (35 mln euro) and gas prices would go down by five percent.
https://tass.com/economy/1105309
Executive Director of Bulgaria’s Bulgartransgaz operator said that the country will get 2.9 bln cubic meters of gas annually
SOFIA, January 1. /TASS/. Bulgaria has begun to receive Russian gas via the TurkStream gas pipeline, Executive Director of Bulgaria’s Bulgartransgaz operator Vladimir Malinov announced on Wednesday.
"Bulgartransgaz and Russia’s Gazprom Export company finalized talks in the last days of 2019 and today, Bulgaria began to receive Russian gas via Turkey instead of Ukraine," Bulgarian National Radio quoted Malinov as saying. According to him, Bulgaria will get 2.9 bln cubic meters of gas annually. Malinov added that the country’s gas infrastructure facilities were ready to absorb that amount of gas.
Bulgartransgaz executive director added that Bulgaria would be able to reduce the payment of transit fees by about 70 mln lev (35 mln euro) and gas prices would go down by five percent.
https://tass.com/economy/1105309