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    Strategic Rocket Forces (RVSN): Discussion & News

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    pavi


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    Strategic Rocket Forces (RVSN): Discussion & News - Page 18 Empty To Arrow: Failed Sarmat?

    Post  pavi Wed Apr 19, 2023 8:00 pm

    Do you have any source that missile fired at March was Sarmat and launch was failure? Sources that I've seen was in MSM trying to downplay russians success in several fronts of the war. Every time when russians are advancing, Putin have a cancer, missiles are running out, ammunition is low and casualties are enormous. If I hear or see credible evidence from Russia, not from "unnamed" sources from pentagram, I can take these claims seriously.

    You obviously don't understand, that such missile tests are scheduled months prior and quite a lot preparations must be done  starting from manufacturing a very complex missile. Second launch , confirmed to be Sarmat, happened a couple a weeks ago and was successful. Why would they risk to build second missile ready, if results of the first test is not known and failure mechanism is not studied and things re-engineered and fixed? Please, enlighten me?

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    franco
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    Post  franco Fri May 19, 2023 12:46 pm


    The Bologovskaya Missile Division will complete re-equipment with new missile systems this year. This was stated by the commander of the Strategic Missile Forces Sergei Karakaev at a meeting of the military council of the Strategic Missile Forces, where the results of the winter period of training were summed up.

    “Re-equipment of the Bologovsky missile formation (Tver region) will be completed before the end of the year,” he stressed.

    Karakaev added that the Kozelskaya, Yasnenskaya and Uzhurskaya missile divisions are also being re-equipped with new equipment. The commander of the Strategic Missile Forces noted that in the first half of the year, the Strategic Missile Forces conducted more than 200 tactical training events.

    Earlier it was reported that the re-equipment of the Bologovskaya division with the Yars mobile ground missile system has been underway since 2016.

    PC-24 "Yars" is a Russian strategic missile system with a mobile and silo-based solid-propellant intercontinental ballistic missile with a multiple reentry vehicle.

    "Yars" can be placed on mobile mobile launchers or in well-protected underground mines. The missiles are equipped with multi-unit maneuvering nuclear warheads.

    Each block has its own guidance system and can overcome any missile defense system. Mobile complexes can move along dirt roads. The launch weight of the rocket is 50 tons.

    https://tvzvezda-ru.translate.goog/news/20235191117-CO8hV.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-GB&_x_tr_pto=nui&_x_tr_hist=true

    NOTE:
    - Bologovskaya is the last unit converting to the mobile Yars ICBM
    - Kozelskaya is converting to silo based Yars ICBM
    - Yasnenskaya is converting to Avangard system
    - Uzhurskaya is starting to convert to the Sarmat ICBM

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    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Fri May 19, 2023 1:47 pm

    IIRC all the mobile ICBMs were supposed to complete upgrade to Yars this year. So this is confirmation of that.
    From what I get the Topol-M was replaced with Yars and the Topol was replaced with Yars-S.
    Yars and Yars-S are basically modernized MIRVed versions of those missiles.

    It will take longer to finish conversion of the silo based Topol-M launchers to Yars.

    As for Sarmat, while the first stage seems to work just fine, they seem to be having trouble with the last stage of the launcher. So I doubt it will enter service any time soon. It is quite likely there will be issues. It is supposed to replace the R-36 which used to be made in Ukraine. Makeyev still retains experience in the liquid SLBMs however. So I guess it is just a matter of scaling them up. The R-36 first stage engines were always designed in Russia by Energomash I think. But design of the second stage engine and all engine production used to be in Ukraine.

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    Post  George1 Wed Dec 06, 2023 4:21 pm

    SS-25 Topol missiles to be retired in 2023

    The Strategic Rocket Forces appear to be set to complete the retirement of SS-25 Topol-M mobile missiles. According to the account of the 22 July 2023 meeting of the RVSN military council, the rearmament of the Bologoye division (Vypolzovo in START) will be completed by the end of 2023. The 7th Guards Missile Division in Bologoye was the last SS-25 Topol division.

    Topol-based command missiles in Yur'ya have also been replaced by Yars-based Signal-M missiles.

    The same account reports that the rearmament of the divisions in Kozelsk (silo Yars), Yasnyy/Dombarovskyy (Avangard), and Uzhur (Sarmat) will continue.

    https://russianforces.org/blog/2023/07/ss-25_topol_missiles_to_be_ret.shtml

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    The-thing-next-door
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    Post  The-thing-next-door Wed Dec 06, 2023 5:04 pm

    What are the chances that they will keep the R36M2's and refurbish them in addition to introducing the Sarmat in order to increase missile numbers?
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    Post  Hole Wed Dec 06, 2023 9:56 pm

    My guess: each Sarmat will replace one R-36M2.
    After all are replaced it´s a political decision to produce more.

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    Post  Arrow Wed Dec 06, 2023 10:01 pm

    After all are replaced it´s a political decision to produce more. wrote:

    The question is how many additional silos do they have after the R-36M2? Russia had about 52 R-36M2. The advantage is that Sarmat has partly already ready silo infrastructure after the R-36M2. Russia had a lot of silos left by the R-36MUTTTH. The question is what condition they are in, etc.

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    franco
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    Post  franco Wed Dec 06, 2023 10:36 pm

    A reminder that the R36M2 is being replaced by both the Avangard (Yasnyy) and Sarmat (Uzhur) plus with all good things there is a shelf life. Also this replacement is going to take up to 10 years. Expect the rockets will be utilized in launching satellites.

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    Big_Gazza
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    Post  Big_Gazza Wed Dec 06, 2023 11:50 pm

    The-thing-next-door wrote:What are the chances that they will keep the R36M2's and refurbish them in addition to introducing the Sarmat in order to increase missile numbers?

    I suspect they will refurbish the withdrawn R-36M2's as space launchers in a similar as the Dnepr vehicle. This time however it will be an all-Russian project with no Ukrainian components.

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Thu Dec 07, 2023 12:21 pm

    Or put 8,8 tons of explosvies on top and use a few on some dudes around Kiev and Lviv. attack

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Dec 08, 2023 12:12 am

    If it is only going on such a short trip they could probably double the payload...

    But at the speeds it will be reentering using explosives is a bit of a waste... the west assures us that DU is safe so how about 8 tons of DU material on Lviv?

    Use an air burst charge that explodes about 5km up in the air so the material gets scattered around the place nice and wide.

    Then we will hear about what a WMD DU really is...
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    Post  franco Sat Dec 16, 2023 4:58 pm

    In the Orenburg region, on the eve of Rocket Forces Day, work was completed to re-equip the Yasnensky formation of the Strategic Missile Forces (RVSN) of the Russian Federation with the Avangard missile system. On December 16, the Russian Ministry of Defense presented a video of how this happens.

    An intercontinental ballistic missile is loaded into a silo launcher using a special transport and loading unit. The most complex technological operations last several hours. The infrastructure of the position area is ready for the deployment of the next missile regiment on combat duty, including facilities for preparing duty shifts, combat duty and personnel rest.

    As the ministry clarified, the Avangard missile system with a hypersonic unit will effectively complement the weapons systems of the Strategic Missile Forces, and will also expand the capabilities of the missile force group.

    The day before, Izvestia showed how in the Bologovsky formation of the Strategic Missile Forces in the Tver region there was a ceremony for the entry into combat duty of the next missile regiment, rearmed with the Yars mobile ground missile system.

    In October, another regiment with the Avangard silo-based missile system took up combat duty in the Orenburg region

    https://iz-ru.translate.goog/1621485/2023-12-16/mo-pokazalo-perevooruzhenie-iasnenskogo-soedineniia-rvsn-na-raketnyi-kompleks-avangard?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp

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    franco
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    Post  franco Tue Jan 02, 2024 6:18 pm


    MOSCOW, January 2 – RIA Novosti. The Strategic Missile Forces (Strategic Missile Forces) have completed the re-equipment of their mobile group from Topol mobile ground-based missile systems to the latest Yars, the Ministry of Defense reported.

    “The re-equipment of the mobile group of the Strategic Missile Forces has been completed by re-equipping the last missile regiment of the Bologovsky missile formation in the Tver region from the Topol PGRK to the Yars,” the statement said.

    As the department noted, the mobile group still includes regiments armed with the modern Topol-M mobile complex with sufficient operational life.
    Topol-M is a strategic missile system developed in the late 1980s and early 1990s. The silo-based version was put into service in 2000.
    It is clarified that the re-equipment of these formations is planned to begin after 2025.

    "Yars" (RS-24) is a mobile and silo-based solid-fuel intercontinental ballistic missile with a multiple warhead. Its caliber is 1.86 meters, length - 17.8 meters, launch weight - 46 tons. The declared payload is 1250 kilograms.

    https://ria-ru.translate.goog/20240102/voyska-1919499990.html?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp

    NOTE: There are 2 regiments of Topol-M mobile launchers (18 ICBM) and 6 regiments of Topol-M silo launchers (60 ICBM)

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    Post  Hole Tue Jan 02, 2024 9:34 pm

    Topol-M is a strategic missile system developed in the late 1980s and early 1990s.
    Topol was put into service in the 1980s.
    Topol-M at the end of the 1990s.
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    Post  Arrow Tue Jan 02, 2024 9:37 pm

    Topol-M at the end of the 1990s. wrote:

    Not completely. Topol-M was developed as a Universal missile in the late 1980s. In the 1990s it was Russified to Topol M.

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    Post  Arrow Sat Jun 29, 2024 10:23 am

    It now seems likely that Russia wants to put IRBM's back into production. That should seriously strengthen the anti-war sentiment in Europe. wrote:


    Russia can already flood Europe with ALCM, SLCM does not require IRBM.

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    Post  lancelot Sat Jun 29, 2024 11:21 am

    Mir wrote:It now seems likely that Russia wants to put IRBM's back into production. That should seriously strengthen the anti-war sentiment in Europe. It should be at the top of the priority list.
    The factories which make the Yars and Bulava are now probably running at extremely reduced speed. The upgrade from Topol to Yars is basically done. This means they are available for making an IRBM like Rubezh.

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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Sat Jun 29, 2024 11:36 am

    Mir wrote:It now seems likely that Russia wants to put IRBM's back into production. That should seriously strengthen the anti-war sentiment in Europe.
    It should be at the top of the priority list.
    Those two idiots of Gorbachev and Shevardnadze cancelled the RSD-10 Pioneer IRBM in exchange of empty promises, basically completely disregarding all military and scientific upper echelons in USSR.

    Putin did not want to renege first that stupid agreement which was only beneficial to US, but luckily America cancelled it first (since it only covered Russia and US, but did not limit China, Iran or North Korea).

    Now Russia will be able to put back in service a modern equivalent to the pioneer, which is not considered a strategic missile, but could still hit the west (Pacific) coast of the US (Seattle, San Francisco, and possibly even Los Angeles and San Diego) from the Russian regions of Chukotka oder Kamkatchka.

    And also cover the entirety of Europe, North Africa and middle east from Kaliningrad or Crimea.

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    Post  Mir Sat Jun 29, 2024 11:46 am

    One of the few "good" things Trump did - without even knowing it! Laughing

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Jun 29, 2024 12:12 pm

    lancelot wrote:
    Mir wrote:It now seems likely that Russia wants to put IRBM's back into production. That should seriously strengthen the anti-war sentiment in Europe. It should be at the top of the priority list.
    The factories which make the Yars and Bulava are now probably running at extremely reduced speed. The upgrade from Topol to Yars is basically done. This means they are available for making an IRBM like Rubezh.

    Back in the 80s, when the anti IRBM/cruise missiles campaign succeeded, there were still many people around in and out of power that had personal experience of war. That, along with the limited number of militaries that had then, had a big impact on the decisions then but its a situation that no longer exists. 

    Indeed, as those missiles are now fairly commonplace around the World I don't see any possibility of an agreement between a limited number of countries banning them. 

    As to their nuclear weapon carrying capability, they are no longer special and to the populace in general they are just another weapon that can.

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Jun 29, 2024 12:41 pm

    Rodion_Romanovic wrote:Those two idiots of Gorbachev and Shevardnadze cancelled the RSD-10 Pioneer IRBM in exchange of empty promises, basically completely disregarding all military and scientific upper echelons in USSR.

    Putin did not want to renege first that stupid agreement which was only beneficial to US, but luckily America cancelled it first (since it only covered Russia and US, but did not limit China, Iran or North Korea).

    Hold on, Russia 'benefited' too. The US nuclear cruise missiles and Pershings were removed.
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    Post  lyle6 Sat Jun 29, 2024 12:57 pm

    JohninMK wrote:

    Hold on, Russia 'benefited' too. The US nuclear cruise missiles and Pershings were removed.

    The USSR has just invested billions of Rubles in a state of the art IADS network.

    That's like the pope banning crossbows after you bought a nice suit of plate armor.

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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Sat Jun 29, 2024 3:12 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    Rodion_Romanovic wrote:Those two idiots of Gorbachev and Shevardnadze cancelled the RSD-10 Pioneer IRBM in exchange of empty promises, basically completely disregarding all military and scientific upper echelons in USSR.

    Putin did not want to renege first that stupid agreement which was only beneficial to US, but luckily America cancelled it first (since it only covered Russia and US, but did not limit China, Iran or North Korea).

    Hold on, Russia 'benefited' too. The US nuclear cruise missiles and Pershings were removed.

    Pershing missiles were much much worse than the RSD-10 Pioneer. They should not even be considered in the same category.

    It is almost like comparing early rifles from the 15th century with a modern assault rifle.
    Furthermore America had still a lot of long range cruise missiles in their cruisers and destroyers, while at that time Russia had mainly antiship missiles in their larger vessels. Yes they were good missiles and much faster than the American ones, and could also be used, if needed against land targets, but their range was much shorter than the Tomahawks.

    Furthermore soviet union had a lot less ships capable of launching cruise missiles in comparison to the US.
    Of course when they accepted the treaty, those two idiots (Gorbachev and Shevardnadze) forgot to demand to include ship based cruise missiles with range longer than 500 km in the banned weapons.

    This, naturally changed after October 2015, after US saw that Russia had hit idlib with kalibr cruise missiles launched by small ships based in the Caspian sea, proving range capabilities superior to 1500km.
    Now the US was not anymore the only country which could "partially" disregard the IRBM treaty, as Russia also had naval cruise missiles comparable or even superior to the tomahawks.

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    Post  lancelot Sat Jun 29, 2024 4:36 pm

    The notion the Soviets did not have long range naval cruise missiles is an often stated misconception.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RK-55

    i.e. the S-10 Granat with 2400km range. All the Project 971 submarines had the capability to launch it.

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    Post  Mir Sat Jun 29, 2024 5:20 pm

    The real f***up was the destruction of the Oka missiles. It was well within the required range limit but Gorby thought it was a great idea!
    Bush Sr. is probably still chuckling in his grave Laughing

    I guess the up-side of this stupidity was the development of the Iskander-M/K.

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