Austin wrote:Why not buy IL-96-400 instead it would be pity if they bankrolled Boeing instead
Boeing will cut them a really good deal as it will allow them to keep a very profitable line going. Plus its a very good way for Russia to dump some more US$.
Clearly sanctions don't apply to US companies
This^
Prices are definitely crazy low, this will probably be the best deal on 747 in the history of the model. I would buy couple of extra if I were them just to have them in storage.
And I don't think that Il-96-400 is in active production. It will be used as basis for new model but right now it's not really available.
Something does not add up. Any price, low or high, is about 100% more for Russia compared to 2014. The prices are in dollars.
Austin wrote:Why not buy IL-96-400 instead it would be pity if they bankrolled Boeing instead
Boeing will cut them a really good deal as it will allow them to keep a very profitable line going. Plus its a very good way for Russia to dump some more US$.
Clearly sanctions don't apply to US companies
This^
Prices are definitely crazy low, this will probably be the best deal on 747 in the history of the model. I would buy couple of extra if I were them just to have them in storage.
And I don't think that Il-96-400 is in active production. It will be used as basis for new model but right now it's not really available.
Something does not add up. Any price, low or high, is about 100% more for Russia compared to 2014. The prices are in dollars.
In this case customer has Boeing by the short ones. Prices will be lower than ever.
Meanwhile Boeing is profiteering on the proliferation of ABM's in Eastern Europe...but don't tell the jackass liberasts this, because they'll ignore it either way:
magnumcromagnon wrote:Meanwhile Boeing is profiteering on the proliferation of ABM's in Eastern Europe...but don't tell the jackass liberasts this, because they'll ignore it either way:
Russia and China have signed an agreement for Wide Body Aircraft and Civil Heavy Helicopter
http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/79513/
Russia and China signed an agreement on joint implementation of programs widebody long-haul aircraft, and on cooperation in the program of creation of civil heavy helicopter.
The sides signed an intergovernmental agreement on the joint implementation of the program widebody long-haul aircraft. The liner with a capacity of 250-300 passengers have to compete with Airbus and Boeing aircraft, and will take a significant market share not only in Russia and China, but also in other countries.
Just signed a cooperation agreement on the program of creation of a civil perspective heavy helicopter AHL. Its development will deal with Chinese state company AVICOPTER with the assistance of "Helicopters of Russia"
The demand for a new car in China can make more than 200 helicopters by 2040. Takeoff weight AHL could reach 38 tons. The helicopter will be adapted for around the clock operation in hot climates, in high mountains and in all weather conditions.
Volga-Dnepr at Farnborough signed a deal for 20 Boeing 747 freighters over the next 6 years. The list value of such a deal has been put at around $7,5 billion.
Lessons are simply not being learnt. Bizarre. This road has been travelled before, and it is very disappointing.
It's high time the Russian government slapped massive taxes on stuff like this in the face of US sanctions. Couple it with tax breaks for ordering a platform such as the Il-96 freighter. This will make the Boeing 747 the most numerous type in Volga-Dnepr's inventory...almost half the fleet If Russian companies are not going to support Russian aerospace firms, then what is the point?
wilhelm wrote:Volga-Dnepr at Farnborough signed a deal for 20 Boeing 747 freighters over the next 6 years. The list value of such a deal has been put at around $7,5 billion.
Lessons are simply not being learnt. Bizarre. This road has been travelled before, and it is very disappointing.
It's high time the Russian government slapped massive taxes on stuff like this in the face of US sanctions. Couple it with tax breaks for ordering a platform such as the Il-96 freighter. This will make the Boeing 747 the most numerous type in Volga-Dnepr's inventory...almost half the fleet If Russian companies are not going to support Russian aerospace firms, then what is the point?
Ruslan fleet is almost worn out. What they should do, tell me pls?
I think Russia is still not in the position to replace larger sized passenger planes with their own homemade models. they have only started to produce local regional planes like the superjet and now ms-21. maybe in the future when the il-96 replacement is ready for production we will see a gradual decline in the purchase of American heavy civilian aircrafts
wilhelm wrote:Volga-Dnepr at Farnborough signed a deal for 20 Boeing 747 freighters over the next 6 years. The list value of such a deal has been put at around $7,5 billion.
Lessons are simply not being learnt. Bizarre. This road has been travelled before, and it is very disappointing.
It's high time the Russian government slapped massive taxes on stuff like this in the face of US sanctions. Couple it with tax breaks for ordering a platform such as the Il-96 freighter. This will make the Boeing 747 the most numerous type in Volga-Dnepr's inventory...almost half the fleet If Russian companies are not going to support Russian aerospace firms, then what is the point?
Read above comments... Dumping greenbacks, keeping technical support simple, and super duper cheap deal.
All it needs are high-bypass turbofan engines. The current ones it has are ancient designs that guzzle aviation fuel like there is no tomorrow.
The PS-90 is a high-bypass turbofan, its design isn't the most modern but there are still many Western aircraft flying with contemporary or even older engines (RB211, V2500, GE90, PW4000, CFM56). It isn't a gas guzzler either, not like the NK-86 that powered the Il-86.
All it needs are high-bypass turbofan engines. The current ones it has are ancient designs that guzzle aviation fuel like there is no tomorrow.
The PS-90 is a high-bypass turbofan, its design isn't the most modern but there are still many Western aircraft flying with contemporary or even older engines (RB211, V2500, GE90, PW4000, CFM56). It isn't a gas guzzler either, not like the NK-86 that powered the Il-86.
By its shape it looked like an old design. But you are right, it is a high bypass engine from 1992 and twice as efficient as the older engines. The bypass ratio is 4.4 so it is not all that great. For the PD-14 the bypass ratio will be about 8.
PS-90A development did not remain constant but keep upgrading to A1/A2/A-76 and A-3 with improvement in Maintenance hour and Operational availability
http://avid.ru/en/avia/?id=5
Even today PS-90 variants are very competitive barring the PD-14/PW1400/LEAP variants.
The idea of IL-96-400M remains very sound it can carry like 430 passenger out to 13000 km and likely with PD-14M those figures are bound to improve , So its great for mass transportation within Russia which is a huge land mass.
It is good that are continuing further development of IL-96-400M with funding of $750 million provided for the same.
Other than that it helps keep the capability/technical manpower gainfully employed as Wide Body Manufacturing is just limited to US and EU.
Even the Russian-Chinese Wide Body Jet with capacity of 280 seater would be manufactured in China , so that leaves only the IL-96 to be manufactured in Russia for long time to come. UAC and Comac Work on Budget for New Widebody Program
Found a very recent video of IL-96-300 , its a nice 8 mins video from take off to touch down , liked the way spoilers worked post landing , The guy who took the video of this flight also did a review which I am posting
Published on Sep 15, 2015
Ilyushin’s long range IL-96-300 has always had a hard life. After the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russian airlines rather took cheap and old western aircraft. The once as new flagship designed airliner in the end only flew a few years for Domodedovo Airlines and Kras Air in larger numbers and only at Aeroflot actually took over the role as leading aircraft type. Today, only Cubana operates this airliner, all the others are gone. And it was the last summer of Ilyushin IL-96 ops with Aeroflot, when this wonderful piece of Russian engineering made its way to Sochi.
The IL-96 is a way better aircraft than one would expect from flying on older Tupolevs and Ilyushins. The cabin with Aeroflot was modern but lacked an inflight entertainment system. But hey, Russians like to read anyway. During start- up and in flight the airliner showed qualities unsought of. The fly by wire not only allowed a stable and smooth flight through turbulence, like on the A380, but the cabin was extremely silent and comfortable. With only nine abreast seats installed, Ilyushin’s widebody offers more space than a typical ten abreast B777.
The huge lower deck galley was used for preparing a great meal, and for a three hour flight, lot’s of non alcoholic drinks were served. Besides the high degree of service aboard Aeroflot, the classic Ilyushin “goodies” are fun to play with, for example the individual fans for every seat, or the LED lights.
Generally speaking it’s a shame these airliners sold so bad and are gone already, since they are at least as good if not better than comparable Airbus or Boeing airliners. Unfortunately it’s PS-90 engines burn a bit more fuel per passenger than a B767, and since nowadays each and every gram of fuel saved counts, the destiny of this great airliner was clear…
But never the less it was a great flying experience and something nobody should have missed!
Austin wrote:PS-90A development did not remain constant but keep upgrading to A1/A2/A-76 and A-3 with improvement in Maintenance hour and Operational availability
http://avid.ru/en/avia/?id=5
Even today PS-90 variants are very competitive barring the PD-14/PW1400/LEAP variants.
The idea of IL-96-400M remains very sound it can carry like 430 passenger out to 13000 km and likely with PD-14M those figures are bound to improve , So its great for mass transportation within Russia which is a huge land mass.
It is good that are continuing further development of IL-96-400M with funding of $750 million provided for the same.
Other than that it helps keep the capability/technical manpower gainfully employed as Wide Body Manufacturing is just limited to US and EU.
Even the Russian-Chinese Wide Body Jet with capacity of 280 seater would be manufactured in China , so that leaves only the IL-96 to be manufactured in Russia for long time to come. UAC and Comac Work on Budget for New Widebody Program
Is it just final assembly ie the cheap stuff thats done in China? Or will advanced manufacturing be done at the Zhukovsky plant or elsewhere in Russia?
If Russia is contributing 50% on development and ofcourse the vast majority of expertise, why does there appear to be a limited role in the final assembly?
Perhaps Russia will build its own wide body in Russia? Something similar to how it jointly develops Brahmos with India, but has Zircon missiles for itself. Likewise with the Pak-fa and the separate Indo-Russian stealth fighter.
I'm glad Russia is finally getting stuff done again on civil aviation. Its the only country that could have produced a viable supersonic jet. Its IL-96 would be a super plane. And the KR-860 would have beaten the A-380 Airbus hands done, and many years before.
Austin wrote:PS-90A development did not remain constant but keep upgrading to A1/A2/A-76 and A-3 with improvement in Maintenance hour and Operational availability
http://avid.ru/en/avia/?id=5
Even today PS-90 variants are very competitive barring the PD-14/PW1400/LEAP variants.
The idea of IL-96-400M remains very sound it can carry like 430 passenger out to 13000 km and likely with PD-14M those figures are bound to improve , So its great for mass transportation within Russia which is a huge land mass.
It is good that are continuing further development of IL-96-400M with funding of $750 million provided for the same.
Other than that it helps keep the capability/technical manpower gainfully employed as Wide Body Manufacturing is just limited to US and EU.
Even the Russian-Chinese Wide Body Jet with capacity of 280 seater would be manufactured in China , so that leaves only the IL-96 to be manufactured in Russia for long time to come. UAC and Comac Work on Budget for New Widebody Program
Austin wrote:PS-90A development did not remain constant but keep upgrading to A1/A2/A-76 and A-3 with improvement in Maintenance hour and Operational availability
http://avid.ru/en/avia/?id=5
Even today PS-90 variants are very competitive barring the PD-14/PW1400/LEAP variants.
The idea of IL-96-400M remains very sound it can carry like 430 passenger out to 13000 km and likely with PD-14M those figures are bound to improve , So its great for mass transportation within Russia which is a huge land mass.
It is good that are continuing further development of IL-96-400M with funding of $750 million provided for the same.
Other than that it helps keep the capability/technical manpower gainfully employed as Wide Body Manufacturing is just limited to US and EU.
Even the Russian-Chinese Wide Body Jet with capacity of 280 seater would be manufactured in China , so that leaves only the IL-96 to be manufactured in Russia for long time to come. UAC and Comac Work on Budget for New Widebody Program
The PS-90 is still a 4.4 bypass ratio engine as is evident from its geometry. It does not compete with the PD-14 at all in this regard.
No one every disputed that fact , PD-14 is 15 % more fuel efficient compared to PS-90 but PS-90 today has millions of hours of work time to its credit and established maintenance , parts etc and will be in service for the next 25-30 years in various types in service
Austin wrote:PS-90A development did not remain constant but keep upgrading to A1/A2/A-76 and A-3 with improvement in Maintenance hour and Operational availability
http://avid.ru/en/avia/?id=5
Even today PS-90 variants are very competitive barring the PD-14/PW1400/LEAP variants.
The idea of IL-96-400M remains very sound it can carry like 430 passenger out to 13000 km and likely with PD-14M those figures are bound to improve , So its great for mass transportation within Russia which is a huge land mass.
It is good that are continuing further development of IL-96-400M with funding of $750 million provided for the same.
Other than that it helps keep the capability/technical manpower gainfully employed as Wide Body Manufacturing is just limited to US and EU.
Even the Russian-Chinese Wide Body Jet with capacity of 280 seater would be manufactured in China , so that leaves only the IL-96 to be manufactured in Russia for long time to come. UAC and Comac Work on Budget for New Widebody Program
The PS-90 is still a 4.4 bypass ratio engine as is evident from its geometry. It does not compete with the PD-14 at all in this regard.
No one every disputed that fact , PD-14 is 15 % more fuel efficient compared to PS-90 but PS-90 today has millions of hours of work time to its credit and established maintenance , parts etc and will be in service for the next 25-30 years in various types in service
You are the one that changed the subject from extending the range of the IL-96 to the performance of the PS-90.
The PS-90 will not enable the range of the IL-96 to be extended. The PD-14 will.
In 2019 at the facilities of the Voronezh Aircraft Construction Company (VASO) will collect the first prototype passenger aircraft IL-96-400M. In an interview with TV channel "Vesti-Voronezh" said CEO Dmitry VASO Prishvin.
IL-96-400M - passenger version of the elongated IL-96. About the upcoming launch of the new modification in late May, the newspaper "Vedomosti", which referred to the representative of the Industry and Trade Ministry. Plans have been associated with the approval of the country's leadership development program widebody long-haul aircraft, which up to 2021 from the budget is going to allocate 50 billion rubles.
It is assumed that the capacity of IL-96-400M, which is almost 10 meters longer than the baseline IL-96-300, is approximately 400 pass. The industry discussed the option to install a new modification of the engine TD-14M - version is not yet certified PD-14 to MS-21 . They need to replace engines PS-90A-1 mounted on the IL-96-400T.
According Prishvina, from 2020 to 2023, five new aircraft should adopt a State Transport Leasing Company (GTLK). It is expected that they will be operated on routes between Moscow and Vladivostok to Khabarovsk.
Until recently, the IL-96-400 existed only in the cargo version of the four sides were built in the interests of the airline "Polet". After its bankruptcy two aircraft were transferred to the conversion of tankers into one remade into the air Il-96-400VPU control point for the FSB, another - in the VVIP-version for the Ministry of Defence.
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