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    Prigozhin mutiny thread

    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Thu Jun 29, 2023 4:29 am

    Erk wrote:The way I figure it so far was that.
    Prigozhin's main source of revenue was the Wagner Group, and catering business both funded by the MoD.

    For some reason the MoD cancelled those contracts (perhaps because of Prigozhin's public remarks)...

    This is the point at which he should have been disposed of and Wagner disbanded (it never should have existed in the first place)


    Erk wrote:...Suddenly he has lost his main source income, and is really angry as a result.

    The "coup", and vitriol towards certain individuals, would be his over reaction to the loss of income.

    Treason and terrorism is not overreaction, it's simply treason and terrorism




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    Post  GarryB Thu Jun 29, 2023 6:54 am

    Wagner is a mercenary but strongly nationalist organization. They are not going to betray Russia to benefit the Ukrainian whores or the Yankees. It was all planned to discover deserters and traitors in the government and in the army.

    Nationalists are not above treason... most Trump supporters are likely nationalists and would happily murder Biden if given a chance because they think their country would be better off with Trump in charge.

    Equally most Biden supporters have demonised Trump so much that most would be happy to see him killed just so he can't beat Biden in an election again... just the same as Democrats will kill a bill that is good for Americans if it is a Republican created bill, and Republicans would kill a democrat created bill whether it helps Americans or not just because it is a democrat bill.

    The people who think all of Americas problems are Bidens fault or Trumps fault are both right but their anger is misdirected... it is democrat and republican infighting that has exacerbated their problems and led them to a place and a mentality where working together doesn't work any more.

    Ironically this event has led to Russians working together rather more and buckling down together to deal with very very serious issues facing them now... which is ironic the numbers of wars the US has started or is a party to they would be expected to be the most unified country on the planet.

    Wagner will continue to recruit because it has business all over the world, though some countries might want to deal with different companies in future because of this charade... Prigozhin has really shot himself in the foot here... both feet in fact... he is rich so he should be fine, but lots of well trained ex military that wont be happy and without income... Hopefully they will sign contracts with the Russian military and kill some more nazis.

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    Post  ArgentinaGuard Thu Jun 29, 2023 10:30 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Wagner is a mercenary but strongly nationalist organization. They are not going to betray Russia to benefit the Ukrainian whores or the Yankees. It was all planned to discover deserters and traitors in the government and in the army.

    Nationalists are not above treason... most Trump supporters are likely nationalists and would happily murder Biden if given a chance because they think their country would be better off with Trump in charge.

    Equally most Biden supporters have demonised Trump  so much that most would be happy to see him killed just so he can't beat Biden in an election again... just the same as Democrats will kill a bill that is good for Americans if it is a Republican created bill, and Republicans would kill a democrat created bill whether it helps Americans or not just because it is a democrat bill.

    The people who think all of Americas problems are Bidens fault or Trumps fault are both right but their anger is misdirected... it is democrat and republican infighting that has exacerbated their problems and led them to a place and a mentality where working together doesn't work any more.

    Ironically this event has led to Russians working together rather more and buckling down together to deal with very very serious issues facing them now... which is ironic the numbers of wars the US has started or is a party to they would be expected to be the most unified country on the planet.

    Wagner will continue to recruit because it has business all over the world, though some countries might want to deal with different companies in future because of this charade... Prigozhin has really shot himself in the foot here... both feet in fact... he is rich so he should be fine, but lots of well trained ex military that wont be happy and without income... Hopefully they will sign contracts with the Russian military and kill some more nazis.

    They are different cases, no Russian receives Putin as an anti-Russian agent. No real nationalist is going to betray him in the middle of a war for national existence. Biden, by contrast, is a globalist force foreign to the true USA American. Biden is a pedophile at the service of multicultural globalism. If the trumpists stab him, it is because they understand that he is a threat to the country itself.
    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:27 pm

    Heard Rumors Priozi was planning to capture Shoigu and Gerasimov, but someone tipped off the MOD and because of that Prozi was forced to speed up his plans resulting in the shit show that occurred

    Regardless if was clear what Prozi did was real and not a psy-op, if you defend him you are quite literally defending treason against your beloved Russia

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    Werewolf
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    Post  Werewolf Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:46 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Heard Rumors Priozi was planning to capture Shoigu and Gerasimov, but someone tipped off the MOD and because of that Prozi was forced to speed up his plans resulting in the shit show that occurred

    Regardless if was clear what Prozi did was real and not a psy-op, if you defend him you are quite literally defending treason against your beloved Russia

    Anything that is "coming out" right now is nothing else but smoke and has little of value.

    You simply do not understand societal norms and what the structure is in Russia or anywhere if you believe that a coup like this could be in any way or form a success.

    If this would be a real coup then they would not try to overthrow Putin with nonsense like this. He is Russian with a Russian family and would get smoked if he actually attempted anything.

    This is a PSYOP and question remains if it's a dirty one or not.

    It has definitely something to do with Poland's troops dressed as Ukrops in the Kokainian mainland. Belarus will be forced in it and that is the reason why they relocated under a weird way of trying to attract attention from the preperations taking place.

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Thu Jun 29, 2023 3:10 pm

    Werewolf wrote:[
    Anything that is "coming out" right now is nothing else but smoke and has little of value.

    You simply do not understand societal norms and what the structure is in Russia or anywhere if you believe that a coup like this could be in any way or form a success.

    If this would be a real coup then they would not try to overthrow Putin with nonsense like this. He is Russian with a Russian family and would get smoked if he actually attempted anything.

    This is a PSYOP and question remains if it's a dirty one or not.

    It has definitely something to do with Poland's troops dressed as Ukrops in the Kokainian mainland. Belarus will be forced in it and that is the reason why they relocated under a weird way of trying to attract attention from the preperations taking place.

    We should start with the fact, that army mutinies has long lasting and vibrant tradition in Russia, no matter if it is tsardom, bolshevik or imperial rule.
    This is the very first issue people lacking to know to make any further arguing.
    In sole period of civil unrests 1905-1906, the number of army - not civil - mutinies totaled at least 400.
    FOUR HUNDRED.
    Potemkin, Kronshtad, Sveaborg ... Decabristi mutiny ... we can go on and on.
    The entire Russian army contingent to the western front mutined in France Laughing
    Russkie have some nostalgia towards romantic and senseless mutinies, the difference is that now there is hardly any ground for that.
    So there is no need to deal with them in a way they dealt earlier Twisted Evil

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    Post  par far Thu Jun 29, 2023 6:54 pm

    Prigozhin owned a company that supplied food to schools and the army, apparently  this was coming to an end and that is one of the reasons, he did what he did. This contract was worth $1 billion US (don't know how true this is). Another reason is that Wagner was going to be absorbed into the Russian Military.




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    Post  zare Thu Jun 29, 2023 11:23 pm

    ALAMO wrote:We should start with the fact, that army mutinies has long lasting and vibrant tradition in Russia, no matter if it is tsardom, bolshevik or imperial rule.

    IMO too much generalization, if you don't include Yeltsin's duma attack as 'army mutiny' which you shouldn't, such things haven't happened in 100 years.

    The army did not mutiny even when they were in camps on open fields when USSR collapsed and all troops needed to be pulled back. It lasted for years, afaik the last troops came in in 1994, and most of the army men were in 'refugee camp' conditions meanwhile.[/quote]

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    Post  ALAMO Fri Jun 30, 2023 8:23 am

    zare wrote:

    IMO too much generalization, if you don't include Yeltsin's duma attack as 'army mutiny' which you shouldn't, such things haven't happened in 100 years.

    The army did not mutiny even when they were in camps on open fields when USSR collapsed and all troops needed to be pulled back. It lasted for years, afaik the last troops came in in 1994, and most of the army men were in 'refugee camp' conditions meanwhile.
    [/quote]

    And that is the second part I wrote.
    For a while now, the need for armed mutinies lowered significantly, and those hardly will get any support from the population.
    So we have an age with no mutinies, with a single case in 1993. I will remind you, that the mutineers were treated mildly back then, too. Even if an overall death tool was quite high.

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    Post  GarryB Fri Jun 30, 2023 9:04 am

    They are different cases, no Russian receives Putin as an anti-Russian agent. No real nationalist is going to betray him in the middle of a war for national existence. Biden, by contrast, is a globalist force foreign to the true USA American. Biden is a pedophile at the service of multicultural globalism. If the trumpists stab him, it is because they understand that he is a threat to the country itself.

    Most of the members here who don't like Putin think he is weak or just too soft and not hard line enough and they think that is somehow damaging Russia and Russians and their future because it makes the west more aggressive and bold... assuming the west will become passive and weak if Putin was more like Stalin... which the west essentially portray him as being despite him being rather reasonable and sensible even to his enemies.

    The point is that it would be no great leap for Prigozhin to decide that Putin is too weak to win this war and that Russia would be better off with him or someone like him in charge... nationalists can be psychos too...

    The Presidents the US has had the last few decades have been destroying America... I am not a huge fan of a British actor called Sacha Baron Cohen but...

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    Post  kvs Fri Jun 30, 2023 10:30 pm


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    Post  GarryB Sun Jul 02, 2023 12:02 pm

    This will at first seem to be way off topic but pay attention to the details and I think we have learned what Prigozhin will be doing now...

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    Post  Hole Sun Jul 02, 2023 12:29 pm

    Prigozhin mutiny thread - Page 23 Fz-d9-10

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    Post  Dr.Snufflebug Sun Jul 02, 2023 8:56 pm

    I experienced this little thing first-hand, and am still undecided on what was actually going on.
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    Post  Kiko Tue Jul 04, 2023 10:25 am

    A Matryoshka of Psyops: And Why General Armageddon Is Not Going Anywhere, by Pepe Escobar for Strategic Culture Foundation. 07.04.2023.

    The secret of a perfect psyop is that no one really understands it.

    A perfect psyop accomplishes two tasks: it renders the enemy dazed and confused while achieving a set of very important goals.

    It goes without saying that sooner rather than later we should see the real goals emerging out of the strategic play in Russia I described as The Longest Day.

    The Longest Day may or may not have been a larger than life psyop.

    To clear the fog, let’s start with a roundup of the usual “winner” suspects.

    First one is undoubtedly Belarus. Due to the priceless mediation of Old Man Luka, Minsk is now gifted with the most experienced army in the world: the Wagner musicians, masters of conventional (Libya, Ukraine) and non-conventional (Syria, Central African Republic) war.

    That is already inflicting the Fear of Hell in NATO, which is suddenly facing in its eastern flank a super pro army, very well equipped, and de facto uncontrollable, and on top of it hosted by a nation now equipped with nuclear weapons.

    Simultaneously, Russia props up dissuasion on its western front. Like clockwork that is leading NATOstan to invest in ballooning military budgets (with funds it doesn’t have). That process happens to be a key plank of Russian strategy since at least March 2018.

    And as an extra bonus Russia creates a 24/7 threat to the whole of Kiev’s northern front.

    Not bad for a “mutiny”.

    The Dance of the Oligarchs

    Way more complex is Russia’s internal dynamics. Putin’s current and subsequent difficult decisions may entail loss of popularity coupled with loss of internal stability -depending on the manner Kremlin-defined strategic victories are presented to Russian public opinion.

    Whatever 24/7 NATOstan mainstream media spin may come up with, the Kremlin’s official explanation for June 24 boils down to a Prighozin demonstration: he was just trying to shake things up.

    It’s way more complicated than that. There were strategic gains, of course, and Prighozin seems to have followed a very risky script that in the end favors Moscow. But it’s still too early to tell.

    A key sub-plot is how the Dance of the Oligarchs will proceed. Independent Russian media was already expecting some – treasonous – players, including state functionaries, to buy their one-way ticket when the going got tough (or to say they were “ill”, or refuse to answer important calls). The Duma – fed by Bortnikov’s FSB – is already working on a hefty list.

    The Russian system – and Russian society as well – see people like these as supremely toxic: in fact much more dangerous than the demshiza (a term that mixes “democracy” and “schizophrenia”, applied to globalist neoliberals).

    On the military front, it gets even more complicated. Putin has charged Defense Minister Shoigu to compile the list of Generals to be promoted after The Longest Day. To put it mildly, for quite a few people, from many different persuasions, Shoigu has become a toxic element in Russian politics.

    Wagner – rebranded, and under new management – will continue to serve Russia’s interests via Minsk, including in Africa.

    Old Man Luka, wily as ever, has already firmly stated there won’t be any provocations against NATO via Wagner. Wagner recruiting bureaus will not be opened in Belarus. Belarussians may join Wagner directly. As it stands, most of Wagner fighters are still in Lugansk.

    For all practical purposes, from now on the Russian government won’t have anything to do, militarily and financially, with Wagner.

    Additionally, there are no heavy weapons to be confiscated. Already on Monday, June 26, Wagner had moved their heavy weapons to Belarus. What remains – and had not been moved during The Longest Day – was returned to the Ministry of Defence (MoD).

    The Dance of the Generals

    A clear winner in the whole process is Russian public opinion: they made that graphically clear in Rostov. Everyone was supporting Putin, Russian soldiers, Wagner and Prighozin – at the same time. The overall objective was to improve the Russian army to win the war. It’s as straightforward as that.

    The purge inside the MoD will be tough. Under the pretext of repression or “rebellion”, operetta Generals” (as defined by Putin himself) that did not train their soldiers properly, did not organize the mobilization properly, or were incompetent in battle, will definitely be axed.

    The problem is that they’re all part of Gerasimov’s circle. To put it diplomatically, he needs to answer a lot of serious questions.

    And that’s what brings us to the “General Armageddon has been arrested” monster fake news gleefully parroted by the whole of the NATOstan info universe.

    General Surovikin did receive Prighozin in Rostov – but he was never an accomplice to the “rebellion”. Vice-Minister of Defense Yevkurov was also at the HQ in Rostov, and received Prighozin alongside Surovikin. Yevkurov may have played the role of strategically-placed observer.

    The Prighozin rebellion soap opera de facto started back in February – and nothing was done to stop it. Regardless whether one shares the official narrative – or not.

    What this implies is that the Russian state saw it coming. Does that make The Longest Day the Mother of All Maskirovskas?

    Once again: it’s complicated. Unlike the collective West, Russia does not practice or enforce cancel culture. Wagner was protected via martial law. Any insult against a “musician” fighting neo-nazi Banderistan would be met by as much as a 15-year jail term. Each Wagner fighter is officially a Hero of Russia – something Putin himself always stressed.

    On the maskirovka front, there’s no question the simmering tensions in Russian military circles before The Longest Day were manipulated, fog of war-style, to disorient the enemy. It worked like a charm. On the fateful June 24 itself, Surovikin was running a war, and not spending the day drinking brandy with Prighozin.

    The NATOstan axis is really clutching at straws. It took just a Surovikin-related rumor to send them into rapture – proving once again how deeply they fear General Armageddon.

    A key vector is how Surovikin is regarded by public opinion compared to the surviving “operetta Generals”.

    He built the now legendary three-layered defense which is already burying the “counter-offensive”. He introduced the wildly successful Shahed-136 Iranian drones in the battlefield. And he organized the meat grinder devastation in Bakhmut/Artemyovsk – which has already entered the military annals.

    Way back in the Autumn of 2022, it was General Armageddon who told Putin that Russian forces were not ready for a large-scale offensive.

    So whatever the 5th columnists fabricate, General Armadeggon is not going anywhere – except to win a war. And Russia is not “leaving” Africa. On the contrary: a rebranded Wagner is there to stay, and remains on speed dial in several latitudes.

    The trend, short term, seems to point to a – convoluted – draining of the Russian military swamp. The Longest Day seems to have galvanized Russians of all stripes into identifying who the real enemy is – and how to defeat it, whatever it takes.

    “Nothing happens by chance”

    Historian Andrei Fursov, reviving Roosevelt, observed that “in politics, nothing happens by chance. If it happens, you bet it was foreseen.”

    Well, maskirovska rides again.

    Yet the main problem faced by Russia is not the Hegemon and NATO: it’s domestic.

    Based on conversations with Russian analysts, and their impressions from very sharp people who lived in Russia, Ukraine and in the West, it would be possible to identify basically four main groups trying to impose their idea of Russia.

    1.The “Back to the USSR” gang. Includes, of course, some former KGB. Have some kind of support from the general population. A lot of educated specialists (old school pros, mostly pension age). This project suggests a revolution – a 1917 on steroids. But where is Lenin?

    2. The “Back to the Tsar” people. That would imply Russia as the “Third Rome” and a prominent role for the Orthodox Church. Hefty funds behind it. A big question mark is how much popular support, especially in “deep” Russia, they really have. This group has nothing to do with the Vatican – which is sold to The Great Reset.

    3. The Plunderers – as in robbing Russia blind in favor of the Hegemon. Congregates 5th columnists, and all manner of “totalitarian neoliberals” worshipping the “values” of the collective West. The remaining ones will soon get a knock on the door by the FSB. Their money is already blocked.

    4. The Eurasianists. This is the most feasible project – in close collaboration with China, and aiming towards a multipolar world. There’s no place for Russian oligarchs here. Yet the degree of collaboration with China is still highly debatable. The real burning question: how to really integrate, in practice, the Belt and Road Initiative with the Greater Eurasia Partnership?

    This is just a sketch – open for discussion. The first three projects may hardly work – for a series of complex reasons. And the fourth still has not gathered enough steam in Russia.

    What is certain is that all of them are fighting each other. May the current draining of the military swamp also serve to clear the political skies.

    https://www.unz.com/pescobar/a-matryoshka-of-psyops-and-why-general-armageddon-is-not-going-anywhere/

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    Post  franco Tue Jul 04, 2023 12:22 pm

    Images appeared on the Web, presumably, of one of the three bases of the Wagner PMC, located near the town of Osipovichi in the Mogilev region of Belarus. The photographs, allegedly taken by local residents, show the process of setting up a field (tent) camp.


    M-30 army frame tents made of tarpaulin and PVC installed in rows are demonstrated. Inside, there is a wooden floor (flooring) and a kind of bed - bunk special bunk beds of a unified type. There are ventilation windows. Rope braces (kapron halyards) are attached to the ground with reliable stakes in the form of a steel corner. It is clear from the situation that work is in full swing at this facility. But, apparently, they are being conducted very quickly.

    FULL ARTICLE (mostly photos): https://topcor-ru.translate.goog/36856-stali-izvestny-detali-sozdanija-bazy-chvk-vagner-v-belarusi.html?utm_source=warfiles.ru&_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en

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    Post  Sprut-B Thu Jul 06, 2023 3:00 pm

    Belarus president outlines deal with Wagner

    Wagner troops could be used to defend Belarus after they relocate from Russia, where they took part in a failed revolt last month, President Alexander Lukashenko has said.

    Military personnel attached to Evgeny Prigozhin’s private military company are being transferred to the country subject to “certain conditions,” including that they can be deployed instantly if they’re needed to “defend the state,” he explained.

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    Post  Hole Thu Jul 06, 2023 5:50 pm

    Prigozhin mutiny thread - Page 23 F0xsyv10
    lol1 lol1 lol1 lol1 lol1 lol1

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    Post  ALAMO Thu Jul 06, 2023 6:04 pm

    A bit affraid to see her sister ...😱

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    Post  franco Wed Jul 19, 2023 9:14 pm



    Over 30 thousand "Wagnerites" signed contracts with the Russian Ministry of Defense . This was announced in an interview with NSN by a State Duma deputy, ex-commander of the Airborne Forces, Colonel General Vladimir Shamanov .

    According to my information, approximately 32-33 thousand Wagnerites signed contracts with the Ministry of Defense, and from 7 to 10 thousand are with Prigozhin. This creates ground for reflection for the leadership of the country and the Armed Forces,” Shamanov said.

    He added that he supports the return of Wagner PMC fighters to participate in a special operation in Ukraine . The parliamentarian also called the relocation of the Wagnerites to Belarus a "positive moment" .

    On July 16, the Office of the Prime Minister of Poland announced the arrival of hundreds of "Wagnerites" in Belarus. Stanislav Zharin, deputy coordinator of the Polish special services, noted that he is monitoring the situation to find out how many Russian PMC fighters will eventually enter the territory of the republic.

    Earlier, the Ministry of Defense of Belarus reported that the fighters of the Wagner PMC conducted a briefing for the territorial defense units of the republic.

    https://www-gazeta-ru.translate.goog/army/news/2023/07/19/20906786.shtml?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en

    NOTE: like any other news will need some confirming

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    Post  GarryB Thu Jul 20, 2023 4:43 am

    Hahahaha... look out people... George Cloony is on the offensive... he thinks Wagner are evil... not for killing innocent Ukrainian babies... but because of their success in Africa when compared with the utter failure of white Europe in Africa, and he wants action to get Wagner out of Africa to save the Africans from independence and freedom, and move them into the arms of the US to sell weapons and ammo they don't even have to sell at the moment...

    They want Wagner dismantled because of the terrible damage it is doing to the world... which of course is terribly ironic coming from an American white rich guy.

    https://www.rt.com/news/579953-clooney-prendergast-wagner-group/

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    Post  flamming_python Thu Jul 20, 2023 3:24 pm

    He's saying he wants the USA to take on Wagner on like they dealt with ISIS and Al-Qaeda

    So he means he wants the US to fund and train them and provide them air support then? What a Face

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    Post  Mir Thu Jul 20, 2023 4:38 pm

    Always like George Cloony and he produced a couple of excellent movies but when he married the deep state lawyer things changed.
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    Post  kvs Thu Jul 20, 2023 7:24 pm

    Hollywood actors have to sell their souls to the Devil to have their jobs.

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    Post  d_taddei2 Thu Jul 20, 2023 8:02 pm

    Tell that idiot Clooney that Ukraine are looking for volunteers still plenty of Wagner in Ukraine he can try and attack them see how he gets on. He will soon realise this isn't a film set lol! Oh wait he's a rich 💩 he's too good for such better let someone else do the dirty work.

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