Taliban takeover of Afghanistan

Isos wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Remind you of anywhere?

Yuri Lyamin
@imp_navigator
·
14m
It turns out that the Afghan Super Tucano in reality collided with the Uzbekistan MiG-29 and both aircraft crashed.. Overall 22 military aircraft and 24 military helicopters with 585 armed servicemen flew from Afghanistan to Uzbekistan on August 14-15.

Uzbekistan scored a bonanza (minus its own crashed MiG-29 ofc)

15 Super Tucanos. That's a respectable fleet

[ebed]https://twitter.com/BabakTaghvaee/status/1427213409829937152[/embed]

Also at least some Black Hawks

[ebed]https://twitter.com/200_zoka/status/1427319618016890882[/embed]

46 aircraft in total

Meanwhile Tajikistan didn't do so bad either  

[]https://twitter.com/PSFAERO/status/1427205322696011776[/embed]

Totally useless since no spare parts. They could fly for few hours before running out of special oil. Thry may sell them back with origine country agreement.

USA will either say they are the true owners of the aircraft as it bought them, or say u can have them then charge them very high costs for parts etc. Unless they try to use it to sneak in and try to takeover procurement process and get Uzbek to dump Russian made equipment for their own stuff, but I highly doubt the latter scenario, Uzbek had too much Soviet systems to dump Russia, but USA is known to make dumb moves

You know where the problems begin if you have an "expert" like Mike Maloof who claimed on RT that the americans tried to build an army in Afghanistan while Afghanistan never had an army...

Back in the 70´s and 80´s Afghanistan had a 300.000 men strong army with thousands of armoured vehicles and hundreds of planes/helicpoters. Strong enough to fight the Taliban or Mujahedingens or whatever they were called back then for nearly 3,5 years. Without support from the outside.

Some word about the C-17 story and the 650 people on board. The plane is designed to carry 150 full equipped soldiers. In seats. Carrying 650 half nacked people on the floor isn´t a great achievment.

d_taddei2 wrote:

Isos wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Remind you of anywhere?

Yuri Lyamin
@imp_navigator
·
14m
It turns out that the Afghan Super Tucano in reality collided with the Uzbekistan MiG-29 and both aircraft crashed.. Overall 22 military aircraft and 24 military helicopters with 585 armed servicemen flew from Afghanistan to Uzbekistan on August 14-15.

Uzbekistan scored a bonanza (minus its own crashed MiG-29 ofc)

15 Super Tucanos. That's a respectable fleet

[ebed]https://twitter.com/BabakTaghvaee/status/1427213409829937152[/embed]

Also at least some Black Hawks

[ebed]https://twitter.com/200_zoka/status/1427319618016890882[/embed]

46 aircraft in total

Meanwhile Tajikistan didn't do so bad either  

[]https://twitter.com/PSFAERO/status/1427205322696011776[/embed]

Totally useless since no spare parts. They could fly for few hours before running out of special oil. Thry may sell them back with origine country agreement.

USA will either say they are the true owners of the aircraft as it bought them, or say u can have them then charge them very high costs for parts etc. Unless they try to use it to sneak in and try to takeover procurement process and get Uzbek to dump Russian made equipment for their own stuff, but I highly doubt the latter scenario, Uzbek had too much Soviet systems to dump Russia, but USA is known to make dumb moves

Well, one thing, the pilots used them to escape.

GarryB wrote:It is pointless to try to blame Trump or Biden for the ultimate result... when the US first went in there and decided to not include the Taleban in talks for the future of the country the future was set in stone... either the US had to destroy the Taleban completely, or the west was eventually going to lose patience and leave the country to the Taleban.

That is not to say that the current chaos is not Bidens fault, this was terrible, the way they left Afghanistan the way they went into Iraq... no obvious plan to protect the people... just protect that oil.

Funny there was a lot of interest in the west in the early 2000s regarding Soviet experience in Afghanistan... trying to learn something about the place to save a few lives... should really have paid more attention to the withdrawal...

I thought of this quote yesterday: 'Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.'

The quote is most likely due to writer and philosopher George Santayana, and in its original form it read, "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

flamming_python wrote:Not the most well-thought through plan to escape Kabul

https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1427545109831192585

At least now I know how the magic-carpet ride ended.

I saw it too pass around on Pakistani groups about how "evil" the american pilots where for this and cheering on the Taliban.
But Pakistan will reap the consequences somewhere.....




I am still watching in amazement how absolutely moronic our western politicians are.
"lets evacuate 10.000's of afghans"
"make demands to Taliban".
With morons like this,we rightfully deserve any defeat we get.

Seriously, this would be a pretty good time for dumb politicians to shut up, tell your troops to pack up and get out of there.

You got pushed back to ONE airfield in the middle of Afghanistan.
6000 of your men are surrounded by an country full of taliban. NO support to speak off.
Only armed with light infantry weapons.
Its an flat airfield, what defensive positions are there?.

Not to mention you need heavy, slow aircraft that take off and land.
We lost, the war is over. Don't go test out the patience of your enemy.
They are still kind of miffed about us waging war on them for the last 20 years.

They might be Taliban.
But respect the fact they don't attack your aircraft, as they sure as hell have the capacity to do so, and let you go.
Things could have been worse, FAR worse for the NATO presence still on Kabul Airport.
Things can always change on a moments notice, never waste precious time you are given.

Uzbekistan can always sign a contract with Embraer for spares

Those aircraft are not America's, they're the property of Afghanistan.

In practice they'll be impounded for the time being, and the Taliban once they've finished setting up their government will doubtlessly ask for them back. At that stage it's up to Uzbekistan whether they want to establish relations with Taliban Afghanistan or not. If not, then finders keepers.

flamming_python wrote:Uzbekistan can always sign a contract with Embraer for spares

Those aircraft are not America's, they're the property of Afghanistan.

In practice they'll be impounded for the time being, and the Taliban once they've finished setting up their government will doubtlessly ask for them back. At that stage it's up to Uzbekistan whether they want to establish relations with Taliban Afghanistan or not. If not, then finders keepers.

Technically, there is no more Afghanistan, just Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan which was born in 2001.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Emirate_of_Afghanistan

WARNING GRAPHIC CONTENT

Also pictures of French and Spanish soldiers


Form an orderly queue: Kabul airport chaos is finally contained as Afghans and diplomats line up to board evacuation flights out of Afghanistan while video emerges of 'desperate man fleeing Taliban killed after getting caught in landing gear

Hundreds of Afghanis fleeing the Taliban were forced to line up behind barbed wire at Kabul airport today

Under the guns of Afghan guards and US Apache helicopters, they waited to board flights out of the country

It was a far cry from pandemonium at the airport on Monday as thousands of people rushed on to the runway

One man was crushed to death in the landing gear of a US transport plane - with horrific video appearing to show his body dangling from the side of the aircraft mid-flight - while three others fell to their deaths

Joe Biden has been slammed for the chaotic retreat which critics said had 'humiliated' the US, while drawing comparisons with the evacuation of Saigon and the Suez Canal crisis

WARNING GRAPHIC CONTENT



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9900537/Taliban-Afghanistan-Evacuation-flights-Kabul-resume.html

In case you can't watch the interview in Russian, I will make a shortcut.

An ambassador states, what is the most important part, that the Taliban was expected by the city inhabitants, and ... welcomed quite warmly.
The mess we are witnessing is going on at the airport only, and we talk about people ho collaborated with occupant forces mostly, unsure their fate.
The remaining part of Kabul is perfectly quiet. Shops are open, schools are open, including the ones for women.
Taliban entered the city unarmed, requesting the security forces to lay down the weapon and go home.
There were some unrests in the meantime when security forces disappeared, and the Taliban didn't enter yet, but they made it perfectly clear that the rage is over at once.
They entered the city in mass when the previous regime has already left. They implied a curfew from 10 pm, all the lootings and unrests ceased. They know how to deal with looters and thieves, and it is mostly a very short treatment
The night was the calmest one ambassador can remember, with no shots fired, no explosions that were the usual thing daily.
The embassy is well protected by the Taliban forces, they contacted officially immediately, established communication, and arranged a meeting to discuss the cooperation spot on.
People are getting phones to get in touch with new authorities, and being told that if anything bad happens, they should call at once, and they will take care of that.
Unbelievable

Still fighting on: Afghan vice president and the son of a dead legendary military commander rally anti-Taliban forces in last stronghold less than 100 miles from Kabul
Amrullah Saleh has said he will not surrender to the Taliban, vowed to fight back
Rallying troops with son of dead anti-Taliban commander Ahmad Shah Massoud
The pair reported to have met in Panjshir on Monday to plan a counter offensive
Panjshir is the only area not under the Taliban and has never fallen to the group
Afghanistan's vice president and the son of a dead military commander are rallying anti-Taliban forces in the last stronghold less than 100 miles from Kabul.

Vice President Amrullah Saleh and Ahmad Massoud, the son of his former mentor and famed anti-Taliban fighter Ahmed Shah Massoud, are putting together a guerilla movement in the Panjshir Valley - the only region not controlled by the Taliban.

It comes after the Taliban swept to power with a lightning conquest of Afghanistan culminating on Sunday when the group overran the capital Kabul, sparking widespread panic as thousands tried to flee.
Saleh fled on Sunday to the valley, a mountainous redoubt tucked into the Hindu Kush that never fell to the Taliban during the civil war of the 1990s or was conquered by the Soviets a decade earlier.

He has vowed not to surrender to the extremist group, writing on Twitter on Sunday: 'I won't dis-appoint millions who listened to me. I will never be under one ceiling with Taliban. NEVER'.

He has not posted on the site since, but is reportedly regrouping with fighters in the Panjshir Valley, where Massoud commands a militia force, and is preparing to launch a counter offensive against the Taliban.

'We will not allow the Taliban to enter Panjshir and will resist with all our might and power, and fight them,' one resident told AFP on condition of anonymity.

Other reports said Panjshir residents had raised the flag of the Northern Alliance - a united military front that fought a defensive war against the Taliban between 1996 and 2001.

Unconfirmed reports added thousands of Afghans from neighbouring provinces had fled to the valley, which is famed for its natural defences.



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9901029/Still-fighting-Afghan-vice-president-rally-anti-Taliban-forces-Panjshir.html




George Bush, former first lady issue statement on Afghanistan with message to US troops, veterans

The war in Afghanistan began under Bush after the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks
George Bush, the former president, and his wife Laura Bush, the former first lady, issued a statement late Monday about the unfolding crisis in Afghanistan with a message to U.S. troops, veterans, diplomats and the intelligence community who have served in the country over the past two decades.

"Many of you deal with wounds of war, both visible and invisible," the statement read. "And some of your brothers and sisters in arms made the ultimate sacrifice in the war on terror. Each day, we have been humbled by your commitment and your courage. You took out a brutal enemy and denied Al Qaeda a safe haven while building schools, sending supplies, and providing medical care. You kept America safe from further terror attacks, provided two decades of security and opportunity for millions, and made America proud. We thank you from the bottom of our hearts and will always honor your contributions."
Bush, who criticized the withdrawal of U.S. and NATO troops from Afghanistan in July, said he watched the tragic events unfolding with "deep sadness." He pointed out that President Biden promised to evacuate the Afghans who have been at the "forefront of progress inside their nation."

"The United States government has the legal authority to cut the red tape for refugees during urgent humanitarian crises. And we have the responsibility and the resources to secure safe passage for them now, without bureaucratic delay," his statement read.

He also expressed optimism about Afghanistan.
"Like our country, Afghanistan is also made up of resilient, vibrant people. Nearly 65 percent of the population is under twenty-five years old. The choices they will make for opportunity, education, and liberty will also determine Afghanistan’s future," the statement read.


Last month, the former president told Deutsche Welle that a troop withdrawal would have tremendous consequences in the country, especially for women and girls.

"This is a mistake," Bush said. "They’re just going to be left behind to be slaughtered by these very brutal people, and it breaks my heart."


https://www.foxnews.com/politics/george-bush-former-first-lady-issue-statement-on-afghanistan-with-message-to-us-troops-veterans

Mashallah!

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/uk-will-engage-with-the-taliban-in-attempt-to-stop-terror-attacks-in-the-west/ar-AANpncY?ocid=entnewsntp

UK will engage with the Taliban in attempt to stop terror attacks in the West

The UK will engage with the Taliban to stop terror attacks being launched against the West, Dominic Raab has said.

a group of people standing around a table: Taliban fighters in Kabul's presidential palace on Sunday - Zabi Karimi /Associated Press Zabi Karimi /Associated Press Taliban fighters in Kabul's presidential palace on Sunday - Zabi Karimi /Associated Press
The Foreign Secretary said the Government would take a “pragmatic” approach to dealing with the group, which overran Kabul and seized power in Afghanistan on Sunday.

The UK may impose sanctions on the country, but will also increase overseas development aid there by around 10 per cent in an attempt to prevent terror threats developing, Mr Raab said.

Ken McCallum, the head of MI5, has warned ministers that the Taliban’s control of Afghanistan could produce a “ricochet effect” and creates new threats against the West.

Ministers are drawing up a package of measures to persuade the Taliban to protect the UK’s security interests.

“We will use all the levers that we've got, whether it's economic tools, sanctions, the diplomatic leverage,” Mr Raab told Sky News.

“I think we're going to have to be pragmatic as the UK policy has always been.

“We're going to need to be able to send clear messages, and our message is going to be this: Afghanistan must never be used to launch terrorist attacks against the West.”

In a separate interview with the BBC on Tuesday, Mr Raab said he planned to increase aid to the country “probably by 10 per cent,” following a large cut to the Afghan development budget earlier this year.

The aid will be delivered in the form of humanitarian relief, rather than direct payments to the Taliban, he said.


Video: US concerned about Taliban advances (Sky News Australia)

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US concerned about Taliban advances
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Sanctions that could be imposed on Afghanistan include asset freezes to Afghans based in the West, or bans on the import or export of goods.

Asked whether he thought the Taliban were a “ragtag bunch of thugs”, Mr Raab replied: “I am not going to dissent from that view, but they are now in power and we now need to deal with that reality.”

Tobias Ellwood, the Conservative chair of Parliament’s defence select committee, said economic measures would be insufficient.

“This will not prevent a civil war - nor deter the Taliban from imposing a ruthless interpretation of Sharia law,” he said.

Mr Raab’s comments came as Stephen Kinnock, a shadow Foreign Office minister, suggested the UK will need to support tens of thousands of refugees from Afghanistan.

Speaking about Government plans for a bespoke resettlement scheme for vulnerable Afghans, Mr Kinnock told BBC Radio 4's Today programme that "it needs to be a bold and ambitious and generous offer".

Asked if 20,000 people would be a good number of people to bring to the UK, he said: "We need to see an offer that is also backed up with the capacity to process it.

"As you pointed out, the situation on the ground there is so difficult at the moment that we have got to ensure that we don't open up an offer that we can't actually deliver on.

“So we need to see the detail of the plan from the Government, but it is absolutely right that we make an ambitious and bold offer."

Asked if that means tens of thousands of people rather than a few thousand, he said: "I would have thought so, yes, yes - we, of course, need to see the detail, but I think this needs to be a significant offer."

Boris Johnson is expected to announce a plan for refugees later on Tuesday.

Isos wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Remind you of anywhere?

Yuri Lyamin
@imp_navigator
·
14m
It turns out that the Afghan Super Tucano in reality collided with the Uzbekistan MiG-29 and both aircraft crashed.. Overall 22 military aircraft and 24 military helicopters with 585 armed servicemen flew from Afghanistan to Uzbekistan on August 14-15.

Uzbekistan scored a bonanza (minus its own crashed MiG-29 ofc)

15 Super Tucanos. That's a respectable fleet

[ebed]https://twitter.com/BabakTaghvaee/status/1427213409829937152[/embed]

Also at least some Black Hawks

[ebed]https://twitter.com/200_zoka/status/1427319618016890882[/embed]

46 aircraft in total

Meanwhile Tajikistan didn't do so bad either  

[]https://twitter.com/PSFAERO/status/1427205322696011776[/embed]

Totally useless since no spare parts. They could fly for few hours before running out of special oil. Thry may sell them back with origine country agreement.

Oil for these engines is available on the civilan market. These are not bleeding edge aircraft. But they can probably come up with an agreement to sell these back to some US ally.

flamming_python wrote:Not the most well-thought through plan to escape Kabul

https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1427545109831192585

Dunno what made him think this was a viable idea. He paid the ultimate price for his mistake. As if the pilots are expected to know some guy is holding on to the gear.

Ditched. Can understand why though. They don't know who they can trust



And also this

Looks like Dostum fled with all his medals

Mir wrote:Looks like Dostum fled with all his medals

Of course, they were solid gold.

Finty wrote:

JohninMK wrote:

Airbornewolf wrote:Meanwhile on Kabul Airport......
I am wondering how Blinken and the White house are going to weasle their way from this sort of footage.
And keep sticking to "this is not saigon"

Easy peasy.

Get your mates at Youtube to delete it. Then it never happened. It will be Twitter videos next.

Then it will have been a totally peaceful exit with rose petals covering the US heroes pulling out, courtesy some CGI.

Sure enough all the videos are gone.

I wonder if that Osprey is from the squadron detached to Al Jaber Air base in Kuwait, it would seem logical.

Now back on Youtube Published all over the place so no point to hide them.

miketheterrible wrote:Query about how much US seized of Afghani assets.

Mike I think you put a question like that up thread buy I can't find it. Here is an answer

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/us-treasury-freezes-billions-afghan-reserves-depriving-taliban-cash

JohninMK wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:Query about how much US seized of Afghani assets.

Mike I think you put a question like that up thread buy I can't find it. Here is an answer

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/us-treasury-freezes-billions-afghan-reserves-depriving-taliban-cash

I do recall asking this.

Thanks for the link.

And this theft is only part of it. The amount they extracted from Afghanistan over the decades is gotta be massive. Not to mention the human lives they wasted especially with that whole Opium issue too.

Muslim Shirzad
@MuslimShirzad
·
6h
Shocking from Yesterday!
It’s not “Mission Impossible” movie, it’s our countrymen situation






from twitter

Steve Herman
@W7VOA
·
3h
Hamid Karzai International Airport "is open and flights are able to land and depart, including on the civilian side," according to a
@WhiteHouse
official.


Steve Herman
@W7VOA
·
3h
Security at Kabul airport includes assistance from 500 to 600 ANDSF troops, according to Maj. Gen. Taylor.


Steve Herman
@W7VOA
·
3h
"The Turks remain absolutely linked to the security mission" at #HKIA, confirms Maj. Gen. Taylor.

[quote="flamming_python"]Ditched. Can understand why though. They don't know who they can trust



Besides the complete incompetence of western governments to react in time.
This, sadly is the truth in warzones when things start to unravel.

They propably phoned home the Taliban where in the city.
And got told the only ones around with guns that could offer any protection where the americans.
There is not time to think or consider everyone.

With enemy intention's unclear and the situation being uncertain of what happens next.
Its important you reach the airport before the rest of the crowd. And with as few people as possible.

Whatever airlift capacity might be present or is on the way, it might not be enough.
The scenes of the airport being over-run by civilians rushing the C-17 with 640 afghan's in its cargo hold was not "a show of mercy"
They rushed the aircraft before troops could reach them, its crew tried to shut the ramp but they where to late.
You can't get them out, what are you going to do?. shoot them?.
I understand the crew made the decision to just go for take-off.

the events that happened are exactly the reason you need to be at the evac-site first, and with an small group of people as possible.
People that complain now about this have not one clue about how these situations are.

Even now when the Taliban gave an September 11 deadline, there is still an major logistical problem.
There is no more fuel left on Kabul Airport. American keep flying Tanker's back and forth so they at least can make an round trip.
For those that dont know, NATO aircraft now fly from qatar/dubai and need to fly around Iran.
Then cross pakistan's southern border and then most of the stretch trough afghan Airspace towards Kabul located in the north-east of Afghanistan.
It is an long way around.

Some people go "uh, manufacturer says it has an range of xxx miles/kilometers"
Yes, ...on paper. Do you get the mileage out of your car?.

Same for millitary aircraft, when they are empty?. propably near what it said by the manufacturer in optimal weather conditions.
An fully loaded C-17 is using most of its fuel for an one way trip from kabul to Dubai trough the NATO air corridor.
They burn more fuel than usual by taking off from Afghanistan because Afghanistan is 2KM above sea-level and climb faster because it is an warzone after all. So they want to get to cruise altitude quicker.

Its why now the U.S keeps flying tankers back and forth into Afghanistan at this moment.
Its also why it seems its mostly aircraft that are capable of mid-air refueling that are heading towards Kabul.
A400's, C-130's and C-17's, and the tanker's themselves.
If the logistic's on the ground are not restored to Kabul Airfield, say goodbye to Evacuating any civilians.
The U.S/NATO will have an hard time already finding their own citizens and getting them out with flights that are limited to the logistics NATO can achieve with tanker aircraft.
the NATO tanker fleet is not infinite, and at some point these also need to stay on the ground for maintenance.

Again, Time and Resources is  something NATO does not have at this moment to execute the humanitarian whims of politicians that still live in an bubble back home.

Most funny is that some still believe US can protect Taiwan or Ukraine against China or Russia yet they again lost against a guerilla.

Isos wrote:Most funny is that some still believe US can protect Taiwan or Ukraine against China or Russia yet they again lost against a guerilla.

I came to post this.

Hopefully other countries say what happened here. With Russia you proably aren't safe in the US.

Russian missiles probably hit you before you land anywhere.

Is this for real?

flamming_python wrote:Is this for real?

https://twitter.com/colonelhomsi/status/1427710458560188417

It is for real dude, RT1 just emitted films those Ukrainians were taking on the spot.