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57 posters

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    JohninMK
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  JohninMK Fri Aug 26, 2022 11:57 pm

    I am sure that this was an S-400 system in the mountains, not S-300.

    Interesting that it is OK to bring it through the Bosporus in a merchant ship. So the Syrian Express (Merchant Marine) branch continues Very Happy

    Emanuel (Mannie) Fabian
    @manniefabian
    ·
    5h
    Private Israeli intelligence firm @ImageSatIntl
    publishes satellite images showing that Russia has apparently moved its S-300 system out of Syria back to Russia.


    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 FbGnNQOWQAA28l9?format=jpg&name=medium

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 FbGnQq-WQAA4gRU?format=jpg&name=large

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 FbGnOYJXoAAoMTL?format=jpg&name=medium

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    crod
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  crod Sat Aug 27, 2022 2:02 am

    Do they get rotated out for maintenance or is it off to bolster Crimea defence? Wonder if they're planning on putting something back.

    Livemap posted a new deployment of radar in the Crimea region a few hours ago - unsure if it's part of the 300 system or not though.

    israel were active in the area yesterday: Syrian state media says at 19:15 Israel launched airstrikes from over the Mediterranean southwest of Tartus, targeting several sites in the Hama area, wounding two civilians and causing material damage.
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    SolidarityWithRussia


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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  SolidarityWithRussia Tue Aug 30, 2022 9:12 am

    Hello. I am looking for a timeline that explains the Syrian conflict 2011-2022 thoroughly from a trustworthy source (i.e. free from Western propaganda). I do not even trust Wikipedia as a source, because they may mix reality with Western narratives.
    George1
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  George1 Fri Sep 09, 2022 9:24 pm

    Katibat al Tawhid wal Jihad terrorist group’s leader killed by Russian forces in Syria

    https://tass.com/defense/1505653

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    JohninMK
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  JohninMK Mon Sep 19, 2022 9:37 pm

    More interesting news from Syria:

    Russian attack on IDLIB
    https://readovka.news/news/112331

    "The Russian Aerospace Forces launched a massive attack on the base of the Jabhat al-Nusra terrorist group (banned in Russia) in the Syrian province of Idlib, field commanders Bilal Saeed and Abu Dujan al-Diri were killed . This is reported by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation."

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    Hole
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  Hole Sun Oct 09, 2022 11:49 am

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Fenu3x10
    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Fenu8n10
    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Fenu2210
    Some meeting in the desert. One side is there legaly.  angel

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    ALAMO


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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  ALAMO Sun Oct 09, 2022 12:37 pm

    Those pics are quite interesting, I mean the ones you have not forwarded Laughing
    Folks seem to have a real good time together. And that lady, too Very Happy
    Does not look like a hostile meeting, I would say the opposite ...

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    T-47


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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Syrian S-300

    Post  T-47 Sun Dec 11, 2022 2:59 pm

    Came back after long time to ask about S-300.

    Are those completely moved back to Russia? If yes then why? I thought they were Syrian only under Russian supervision. What was the point of giving it to them then?
    nomadski
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  nomadski Sun Dec 11, 2022 4:40 pm

    Defence is expensive and not always  reliable . Expensive for the defender and cheap for the attacker . Russian lives were not being lost in Israeli attacks as much as Syrian lives . Russia also wanted cosy relations with Israel , for domestic reasons and also Israel is a nuke power . If these SAM are being permanently removed , it is not because Israel has stopped attacks . But more because they are needed elsewhere . This leaves Syrians more vulnerable , yet more free also to respond offensively against Israel . Iran provided SRBM . I am sure Syria can up domestic production , if Russia was absent and did not object . The Hezb-Allah in Lebanon , has production capability too . Israel is very scared by this , and has not attacked them . Syria can even do better than this . Offence is cheaper than defence .
    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Sun Dec 11, 2022 6:43 pm

    Also likely due to an increasing number of Iranian SAMs supplied to the SAA, that do not have the Russian restrictions placed on them.

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    nomadski
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    Post  nomadski Sun Dec 11, 2022 7:26 pm


    I think there was talk of supplying Iranian SAM . Not just to cover the West Syria , but to cover Road from from Iran to Iraq to Syria . Someone worked out that for Syria portion of Road , they needed three Battalions ? If I am right . But also that Syria was not able to pay for them ? And there is also the question of Iranian production capacity . Can they even produce enough to deter yank attack for Iran airspace ? I remember looking into SAM effectiveness , under electronic battle conditions . All this before Ukraine war , and Russia ability to take out their SAM . The probability was less than 30% . I would say now in retrospect ( of Ukraine war ) that , in reality it is much less . So taking this into account , Syria and Iran best move away from air defence model . Into model of using drones and missiles against AD . Iran and Syria can not afford a defensive war , nor are they limited by domestic policy against attacking Israel .
    GarryB
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  GarryB Mon Dec 12, 2022 12:07 am

    Hello. I am looking for a timeline that explains the Syrian conflict 2011-2022 thoroughly from a trustworthy source (i.e. free from Western propaganda). I do not even trust Wikipedia as a source, because they may mix reality with Western narratives.

    Hard to say, most sources are biased sadly, but I would think pro Assad or Russian sources would be less inclined to embellish the truth than western sources, because the Russian forces and Syrian forces essentially generally played by international law whereas the western forces did all sorts of things they would have seriously condemned Syria or Russia for doing.

    Does not look like a hostile meeting, I would say the opposite ...

    There are a few hard core soldier types that give in to hate and really hate all prospective foes, but there are just as many who consider it a profession and recognise the other guys are just the same as them really, just on different teams.

    Your average soldier probably has more in common with his enemy than with his command, because it is about power and money and status and most of the top political and military figures wouldn't... well they couldn't mix with the squaddies... except for PR photo shoots.

    Are those completely moved back to Russia? If yes then why? I thought they were Syrian only under Russian supervision. What was the point of giving it to them then?

    The purpose was a smack on the nose for Israel, and I think they got the point. John mentions the increased availability of Iranian and perhaps even Chinese systems with less restrictions sounds like a reasonable explanation... the S-300 was technically under Syrian control but the fact that it never seemed to fire at anything suggests it was actually under Russian management to prevent an incident, which would explain why it is no longer needed... I mean if you can't use it...

    The Russian S-400 is still there so it is not like they are open and exposed if they actually want to shoot things down.

    Defence is expensive and not always reliable . Expensive for the defender and cheap for the attacker .

    That is true, but if I went to war you can bet anything you like that wearing a helmet and body armour would be a priority... no matter how heavy they were.

    HATO is enormously vulnerable right now because they are aircraft and attack based... the war in the Ukraine shows how vulnerable aircraft are in a modern conflict... a HATO fanboy might say Russia has inferior aircraft, but a Russian fanboy could reply their losses are not crippling and that Russian weapons have been very effective so far... both in attack and defence. The orcs have had a couple of successes, but over the time period they equate to pinprick attacks that could be largely ignored in the overall scheme of things, and while the Russians showed serious restraint their attacking missiles and aircraft appear to be getting to and destroying their targets.

    It is all bad news for HATO because they use aircraft for both attack and defence, so every operation on the attack or in defence is going to cost them aircraft... weakening their effectiveness with every contact.

    Russian lives were not being lost in Israeli attacks as much as Syrian lives . Russia also wanted cosy relations with Israel , for domestic reasons and also Israel is a nuke power .

    Not cosy, Israel can negotiate and be reasoned with, unlike the US or EU and so talking with the various groups in the region that are open to talks makes sense... certain aspects need to be sorted at the negotiating table rather than in battle.

    Being reasonable with Israel and also Turkey and even Iran, means a lasting solution is more likely to be found eventually.

    Expanding relationships later on could result eventually better relations and a real peace that everyone can accept and observe.

    If these SAM are being permanently removed , it is not because Israel has stopped attacks . But more because they are needed elsewhere . This leaves Syrians more vulnerable , yet more free also to respond offensively against Israel .

    Russia has a lot of S-300 systems and is currently producing S-350 systems with better performance and more ready to fire longer ranged higher performing missiles, as well as S-400s which were also part of the replacements.

    The Russian IADS in Syria is still operational, but removing the S-300s from the Syrian control does not remove their IADS which is linked to the Russian IADS.

    An IADS is a command and control network with sensors and weapons attached to it. Remove some weapons and replace them with different ones and the system overall is still effective... much more effective than sensors and weapons placed geographically but all working on their own, perhaps with radio or phone warning systems in place.

    Offence is cheaper than defence .

    But both are important... there is no value in stabbing an opponent to death if you do not bother to block their blows and by the time you have ensured your enemies wounds are fatal he has managed to inflict enough damage to you for that to be fatal too.

    Remember Israel has nukes and the US and west blindly supporting them so they can use them if they want with likely little international sanction or action against them... it will be self defence the US president will say.

    All this before Ukraine war , and Russia ability to take out their SAM . The probability was less than 30% . I would say now in retrospect ( of Ukraine war ) that , in reality it is much less . So taking this into account , Syria and Iran best move away from air defence model . Into model of using drones and missiles against AD . Iran and Syria can not afford a defensive war , nor are they limited by domestic policy against attacking Israel .

    Drones and missiles would be serious degraded in performance against an enemy with air defence... most Ukrainian aircraft and weapons fired at Russian forces were defeated by SAMs and aircraft etc etc... if you just try to absorb the damage they inflict then you need to be sure they are using their fingernails to scratch your skin and don't have a knife or larger bladed weapon to cut you into small chunks.

    Iran has the SAM capacity to have an excellent defence, and having them integrated in an IADS means you can operate some radar and keep others off meaning the enemy wont know where you SAMs are until you start launching missiles, which makes flying around very very dangerous... which is what Iran wants.

    Weapons like TOR and Pantsir can reach 15km plus which makes them very mobile and very effective... both can now even fire on the move and shoot down threats fired at them to try to eliminate them.

    You can't defend everything and any enemy will find gaps, but most of the time that will be civilian targets that are embarrassing but not critical to the conflict...

    Think of it like a sky scraper building with thousands of windows... in a working building many windows will be open at different times of the day, and for other times they will be shut... from a burglars point of view you can watch for days and weeks and months and watch for patterns and make a plan to get into the building without going through the front door. From a security perspective you have to monitor every single window and make sure is it not being compromised right now.

    Obviously the easiest solution is to make the windows so they can't be opened and just have air conditioning and heating managed by the infrastructure, but a lot of people would object to that...

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    Kiko
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #14

    Post  Kiko Wed Dec 28, 2022 9:57 pm

    Russia hosts high-level Türkiye-Syria meeting, 12.28.2022.

    Ankara and Damascus held talks involving defense chiefs, reportedly for the first time in over a decade.

    Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu met with his Turkish and Syrian counterparts in Moscow on Wednesday. Türkiye’s defense minister held negotiations with Syria’s defense head, reportedly for the first time since 2011.

    Hulusi Akar and Ali Mahmud Abbas, representing Ankara and Damascus, respectively, discussed “ways to resolve the Syrian crisis” and “joint efforts to combat extremist groups in Syria,” as well as possible solutions to the refugee problem, the Russian Defense Ministry said in a statement after the meeting. 

    Both sides said the format was “constructive” and stressed they were interested in continuing the discussions for the sake of stabilizing Syria and the region as a whole, Moscow said.

    The agenda was confirmed in a statement issued by the defense ministry in Ankara. Turkish media also noted that this was the first meeting at this level between the neighboring countries since the Syrian conflict began 11 years ago.

    Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan severed diplomatic relations with Syria in March 2012. In October of last year, the foreign ministers of the two countries met at the Non-Aligned Movement summit in Serbia, where it was revealed that their respective intelligence agencies had resumed communications.

    The Moscow meeting comes just days after Akar revealed he had been negotiating with Moscow over the use of Syrian airspace for Türkiye’s ‘Operation Claw-Sword,’ a campaign of air and artillery strikes on the Kurdish militias in northern Syria.

    Ankara considers the US-backed Kurdish militants to be terrorists allied with the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK), which it blamed for the mid-November suicide bombing in Istanbul that killed six people and wounded 81 more.

    A much bigger bone of contention between the neighboring countries is Türkiye’s backing for Syrian rebels that have sought to overthrow the government in Damascus. The remnants of the rebellion, largely defeated by the Syrian Army with Russia’s support, have fallen back to the province of Idlib in Syria’s northwest.

    https://www.rt.com/news/569064-turkiye-syria-talks-moscow/

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Sat Dec 31, 2022 10:44 am

    Ankara agrees to withdraw its troops from Syria after meeting of ministers in Moscow, 12.31.2022.

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) — Ankara has agreed to withdraw its troops from Syrian territory following a meeting of the defense ministers of Türkiye, Syria and Russia in Moscow, Al Watan newspaper reported, citing a Damascus source.

    According to the source, one of the results of the ministerial meeting of the three countries in Moscow was Türkiye's agreement to completely withdraw from the territories it occupied in northern Syria.

    He noted that the two sides also discussed the implementation of the 2020 agreement in relation to the M4 highway in northern Syria.

    The parties, the source said, stressed that the formations of the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK), banned in Türkiye, "are agents of Israel and the United States and represent the greatest danger for Türkiye and Syria."

    The Russian Defense Ministry said earlier that the defense ministers of Syria, Türkiye and Russia held trilateral talks in Moscow this week to discuss ways to resolve the Syrian crisis.

    The body stated that, "at the end of the meeting, the parties noted the constructive nature of the dialogue held in this format and the need to continue it for the sake of further stabilization of the situation in the Arab republic and in the region as a whole."

    According to the Hurriyet daily, they were the first official negotiations between Ankara and Damascus in the last 11 years.

    Syria has been experiencing a conflict since March 2011 in which government forces are facing armed opposition groups and terrorist organizations.

    The settlement of the conflict is being sought on two platforms, that of Geneva (Switzerland), under the auspices of the UN (the United Nations Organization), and that of Astana with the mediation of Russia, Türkiye and Iran.

    Yandex Translate from Spanish

    https://sputniknews.lat/20221231/ankara-acepta-retirar-sus-tropas-de-siria-tras-reunion-de-ministros-en-moscu-1134216854.html

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    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Sat Jan 14, 2023 4:32 pm

    Pelusium OSINT 🇮🇷
    @PelusiumCap
    ·
    7h
    Russia’s S-300 units being retired from Syria, Iran’s Bavar AD system moving in.

    Its Sayyad-4B interceptors can cover an area of 300km and an altitude of 120km.

    During its deployment time the largely symbolic S-300 units shot down 0 of the intruding Israeli jets.

    Followed by

    Sprintero
    @Sprinter20000
    ·
    37m
    Acc my source in Syria, this AD sistem not deployed

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