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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #28

    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:25 pm

    Not from my understanding. Liberalism is mostly a western Russia thing and most youth are like that till they become old enough to realize it's shit.

    Thankfully patriot education is now being pusheded as of 2021 jan.

    Also, you may not have read the news but military schools are the most popular in Russia for obvious reasons. And lgbt shit isn't part of it.

    I'm pretty sure you were a libtards in your youth. We all were.  Then we grew up.

    Same shit with most. Some decide to stay stupid though.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #28 - Page 23 Empty I Agree

    Post  calripson Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:51 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I mostly agree FP but the Russian youth seem to be becoming more nationalist than anything hence they were more in favor of voting LDPR from what is a growing trend.

    Dunno how good that will be.

    The neolib youth are ones mostly living abroad or on Twitter like most neolibs.

    Nope, you already have entire classes in schools in St. Petersburg and even Ekaterinburg that are rebelling against the prohibition of the LGBT flag among minors and so on

    Major problem in the making.

    Russian youth tend to like pretending to be progressive and so on; being gay or having blue hair or whatever is trendy. But when it comes to migrants, the xenophobia quickly shows its face.
    So being cool with people advertising weirdo sexualities on the streets is A-OK but having to go to Russia to get a job and feed your family is not?

    Anyway I wouldn't call it nationalism though. Because nationalism, despite its negative sides, implies a degree of loyalty to Russia too - but the present youth have none. They are just standard Eastern European liberals; pro-LGBT, closet racist and eager to emigrate to a richer country where they believe they can live on easy street. Any votes for LDPR is either because Zhirinovsky is a clown and some still see it as a protest vote, or because they don't like Muslim seasonal workers.

    Actual nationalism, or rather patriotism was trendy amongst the youth 10-15 years ago, not now. Now it's just a growing bunch of Navalny-bots

    The key is that young people are subject to the same social media manipulation as in the West. It has been very well studied for decades in the US and UK with the same dedication and eagerness as the Manhattan Project. Latest polls show only 15% of Russians believe that Navalny was poisoned by the Russian government. Unfortunately, the percentage of under 30 year old educated inner city Moscow and Saint Petersburg percentage is more like 30%. That begins to be a problem.
    kvs
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    Post  kvs Thu Dec 24, 2020 11:16 pm

    It would be nice to have a link to those opinion polls. I bet it is the Levada Center. This liberast clown outfit had engaged
    in manipulated polling on a regular basis. It asks loaded questions and then spins the answers. Nothing about Crap-valny
    makes him a natural leader for Russia's youth. So 30% of them are not go to follow this grifter like lemmings. At the same
    time it is routine for human youth to "rebel" against their parents and the "system". So they are "agreeing" with the notion
    that Crap-valny was poisoned to stir shit up. This does not mean that they will be blowing NATzO's cock tomorrow.

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    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Dec 25, 2020 10:06 am

    kvs wrote:It would be nice to have a link to those opinion polls.   I bet it is the Levada Center.   This liberast clown outfit had engaged
    in manipulated polling on a regular basis.   It asks loaded questions and then spins the answers.   Nothing about Crap-valny
    makes him a natural leader for Russia's youth.   So 30% of them are not go to follow this grifter like lemmings.   At the same
    time it is routine for human youth to "rebel" against their parents and the "system".   So they are "agreeing" with the notion
    that Crap-valny was poisoned to stir shit up.    This does not mean that they will be blowing NATzO's cock tomorrow.  


    yeah, it was levada center

    https://www.rt.com/russia/510640-navalny-poisoning-fake-poll

    it is so badly written this article they make it sound like that 34% of youth in Russia see it as legit.  So 15% of respondents believe that Government is involved in his poisoning.  Of that 15% total respondents, it is 34% of the people below age 25 that believe he was poisoned by the government.  That means the youth still majority dont believe he was poisoned by the authorities but possible staged or poisoned by someone else.

    But 15% of total respondent is rather high.  But we got to take into account the people who were asked and in which areas.

    Because, if we now look at popularity of Navalny it isn't very high.

    https://www.rt.com/russia/510521-putin-politician-2020-poll/

    Well, he is 2% higher now than before sitting at 4%.  Which I find funny seeing as while it is an increase, its an increase of 2% so he went through a whole barrage of what would possibly cost billions in information warfare against the Russian government, and barely scratched the surface.

    Give it a bit of time, like a year or two and his popularity will drop back down to 2% or 1%.  But it really shows something here, that the neolibs have nothing.  Navalny is dead and gone politically now as he will face charges in Russia and their alternative, Yasin, is getting nothing and nowhere.

    As I said, as of Jan 1 they are to move to a "patriotic" education system. I am still trying to find the link I read. But essentially it is further to push out the US funded neolibs from the education system.

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    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Fri Dec 25, 2020 11:38 am

    miketheterrible wrote:
    Well, he is 2% higher now than before sitting at 4%.  Which I find funny seeing as while it is an increase, its an increase of 2% so he went through a whole barrage of what would possibly cost billions in information warfare against the Russian government, and barely scratched the surface.

    That's a doubling in his support. Worth every penny Laughing Laughing
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    Post  franco Fri Dec 25, 2020 11:45 am

    Read an article where the Germans were puzzled that apparently 12 million Russians read Navalny's blog about interviewing the FSB agent and there was zero reaction.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Dec 25, 2020 11:59 am

    franco wrote:Read an article where the Germans were puzzled that apparently 12 million Russians read Navalny's blog about interviewing the FSB agent and there was zero reaction.

    Cause 12M Russians have more of a brain than majority of Germany it seems.

    Essentially, due to the lack of pro-navalny protests, it kinda shows that his support is pathetically low. When Nemtsov was gunned down, there were tens of thousands protesting. This? lol.
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:56 pm

    Bellend Cat is starting to hyperventilate.

    Bellingcat disrupts MH17 trial

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    Post  kvs Fri Dec 25, 2020 8:49 pm

    @miketheterrible

    So it was Crap-vada. I would not trust their sampling whatsoever. One can engineer support levels by cherry picking samples
    and choosing the right neighbourhoods to canvass with telephone questions. That is why they say lies, damned lies and statistics.
    In a perverse paraphrasing of Archimedes, give me a polling company rotten enough and I can give you any result you want.

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    Post  kvs Fri Dec 25, 2020 8:52 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:Bellend Cat is starting to hyperventilate.

    Bellingcat disrupts MH17 trial

    Russia is not officially participating in any Dutch MH17 investigation.   It was judged to be guilty from day one and
    the actual perps, the Banderite rgime, which destroyed the ATC tapes, was given full status as an objective
    participant.    Maybe Holland should start putting the defendants in the judge's seat at their own trial.
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:08 pm

    kvs wrote:@miketheterrible

    So it was Crap-vada.   I would not trust their sampling whatsoever.   One can engineer support levels by cherry picking samples
    and choosing the right neighbourhoods to canvass with telephone questions.   That is why they say lies, damned lies and statistics.
    In a perverse paraphrasing of Archimedes, give me a polling company rotten enough and I can give you any result you want.


    Plus they can play with the questions that may confuse the responder.
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    Post  GarryB Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:47 am

    The hilarious thing about that trial was that Russia was not allowed to be part of the investigation because they were a party to the case somehow, yet the Ukraine was part of it from the beginning...

    The story they came up with was that a Russian unit sent a BUK launch vehicle outside of Russian territory to a disputed area where it could have been captured by pro Kiev forces of course, and launched a missile bringing down a civilian airliner and then made it back to Russian territory.

    In comparison, the Ukraine controlled the airspace where the plane was shot down and had BUK systems in the area of the type claimed to have been used.

    Which was a type no longer used in Russia.

    The trial has no credibility... they are not interested in the truth just another witch hunt against Russia.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:26 pm

    The whole MH17 kangaroo investigations are nothing more than hate spew. Shooting down a civilian aircraft over the
    Donbass has no value for both Russia and the local defenders. The only ones who could benefit from it would be
    the Khuiv regime with the assistance of the NATzO propaganda juggernaut. All those cheesy images of Putin painted
    as the Devil in western magazines demonstrates who were the real perps in this case. It was a way to spread more
    hate against Russia.

    The same sort of brain dead propaganda as the claimed chemical attacks by the Syrian army under Assad. Utterly
    useless and pointless attacks that only serve to stoke hate propaganda against the alleged "perps". But NATzO
    loves its terrorists and was giving humanitarian prizes to the phony White Helmet jihadis and their propaganda
    theater such as people standing around in a Sarin attack point without any protection and in flop-flops. The
    same goes for Banderastan where their quisling Khuiv regime and its death squad paramilitaries are the ones
    engaging in crimes against humanity.

    For some resident trolls, gas was used during WWII on a routine basis not just a few times over the span of
    several years. The claimed incidents in Syria have no value as any sort of mass terror campaign since more
    civilians died from shelling by the jihadis with their barrel "mortars" than from the alleged chemical attacks.
    People living through such a war are not going to be scared into submission with such attacks. And the timing
    of these supposed attacks is always convenient for some move by the US and its minions at the UN. Just
    like with the "atrocity" in Racak in 1999 where the KLA assembled its own dead fighters in a pit and claimed
    they were civilians. The profile of the victims was basically all males of fighting age with a couple of token
    females thrown in. This was not any sort of civilian population distribution. There was no blood in the pit
    which proves that the victims were moved there for a staged scene.

    The desire of the NATzO fake stream media to believe every cheesy staged atrocity story is grotesque and
    clearly self serving. When the junta death squads slaughtered over 800 villagers in El Mozote in El Salvador
    in 1981, this fake stream media tried to pretend it was a hoax. El Mozote is what a real massacre looks like.



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    Backman
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    Post  Backman Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:42 pm

    The shortage of water in Crimea is getting worse apparently.
    Does anyone know where the location is that the kiev regime damed off the waterway ? I just wonder if there is a military solution to it. Because this is unacceptable. Russia should send in special operations forces to blow up this dam. Even if it is just to let some water in temporarily.

    This water blockade is a war time kind of move. Another thing Russia could do is warn kiev that if water isn't flowing in a month's time , Russia will close up tight , all the gas supply. Just in time for February
    Rodion_Romanovic
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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:30 pm

    Backman wrote:The shortage of water in Crimea is getting worse apparently.
    Does anyone know where the  location is that the kiev regime damed off the waterway ? I just wonder if there is a military solution to it. Because this is unacceptable. Russia should send in special operations forces to blow up this dam. Even if it is just to let some water in  temporarily.

    This water blockade is a war time kind of move. Another thing Russia could do is warn kiev that if water isn't flowing in a month's time , Russia will close up tight , all the gas supply. Just in time for February

    It starts near the town of Tavriysk in the Kherson oblast

    Note: the first image is from the idiotic euromaidan press, for that reason they write territories occupied by Russia.
    I included it here because it is one of the first available when you do a Google search and it has also the secondary channels in it. The second image is from Wikipedia

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #28 - Page 23 Word-image-15


    The Situation in the Ukraine. #28 - Page 23 Nord-Krim-Kanal

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:33 pm

    Backman wrote:The shortage of water in Crimea is getting worse apparently.
    Does anyone know where the  location is that the kiev regime damed off the waterway ? I just wonder if there is a military solution to it. Because this is unacceptable. Russia should send in special operations forces to blow up this dam. Even if it is just to let some water in  temporarily.

    This water blockade is a war time kind of move. Another thing Russia could do is warn kiev that if water isn't flowing in a month's time , Russia will close up tight , all the gas supply. Just in time for February

    Russia is avoiding any such flash moves since that is what NATzO wants. The NATzO propaganda chorus media will make it look like Russia is
    the aggressor and not Banderastan. Funny how in the case of Israel, it is OK for Israel to enforce access to water on Lebanese territory
    through military means including the routine use of threats, but Russia just has to abide by a gross violation of international law by the Khuiv
    regime.

    I agree that Banderastan needs to be punished. But it is already punishing itself through its own idiocy and Russia has technical solutions
    such as desalination plants. The agriculture in Crimea has already transitioned to a low water use regime. So more grape vine plantations,
    etc. Crimea does not need to grow potatoes. It should specialize in arid zone agriculture.

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    Post  miketheterrible Sat Dec 26, 2020 8:58 pm

    kvs wrote:
    Backman wrote:The shortage of water in Crimea is getting worse apparently.
    Does anyone know where the  location is that the kiev regime damed off the waterway ? I just wonder if there is a military solution to it. Because this is unacceptable. Russia should send in special operations forces to blow up this dam. Even if it is just to let some water in  temporarily.

    This water blockade is a war time kind of move. Another thing Russia could do is warn kiev that if water isn't flowing in a month's time , Russia will close up tight , all the gas supply. Just in time for February

    Russia is avoiding any such flash moves since that is what NATzO wants.    The NATzO propaganda chorus media will make it look like Russia is
    the aggressor and not Banderastan.   Funny how in the case of Israel, it is OK for Israel to enforce access to water on Lebanese territory
    through military means including the routine use of threats, but Russia just has to abide by a gross violation of international law by the Khuiv
    regime.  

    I agree that Banderastan needs to be punished.   But it is already punishing itself through its own idiocy and Russia has technical solutions
    such as desalination plants.   The agriculture in Crimea has already transitioned to a low water use regime.   So more grape vine plantations,
    etc.  Crimea does not need to grow potatoes.   It should specialize in arid zone agriculture.  


    I believe they also have built and building more water pipelines.

    Next option are water towers.

    And desalination plant.

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    Post  GarryB Sun Dec 27, 2020 10:13 am

    Perhaps a mobile desalination plant related to their floating nuclear power stations...

    Most places that need electrical power could also do with fresh water supplies.... they could bundle the features in one that could be sent to island nations to provide fresh water and electrical power.

    It would be a valuable thing in the Pacific Islands where diesel generators are the current alternative, but with fresh water generation facilities it would also be useful in arid areas like Australia and India and the Middle East...

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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:31 am

    They already announced that they want to build desalination plants.
    https://meduza.io/en/news/2020/10/20/russia-to-spend-106-million-on-constructing-desalination-plants-in-crimea

    Apparently they should be ready in 2023.

    By that time is even possible that the Novorossians will have expanded until Kerch or more (after some ill conceived attack from the Ukrainians)... if so the channel could be reopened.

    The plant will be useful anyway.

    In the meanwhile the Ukrainians are trying to pursue nazi tactics again...
    https://112.international/politics/ukraine-intends-to-prevent-construction-of-water-desalination-plants-in-crimea-57637.html

    I do not understand how they could prevent it. It is not like Russia need foreign countries to build those plants for them.


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    Post  miketheterrible Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:54 am

    The pigmy state of Ukraine said they will prevent every program in Crimea. Bridge, Artak, bases, etc.

    Ukraine is so damn mighty it prevented every program Russia launched in Crimea. At least in their head.

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    Post  medo Sun Dec 27, 2020 12:49 pm

    Don't worry, Russia is already solving water problems with new water pipelines to reduce water losses, new water sources and soon with building desalinating plant. Ukraine could do nothing about it.
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Sun Dec 27, 2020 4:38 pm

    The best solution is to pair desalination plants with nuclear power plants (because desalination is energy intensive). There is a problem that it takes more than a decade to build NPP's, so instead they should utilize the small mobile NPP's in a group to power the desalination plant. 20 or so of these mobile NPP's should be sufficient to power the desalination plant.

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    Post  kvs Sun Dec 27, 2020 5:00 pm

    The mobile nuclear power plant combined with desalination plant is a great idea. Such a product will have a foreign market as well.
    It should take less than five years to build such a system.

    As for Khuiv regime dreams of sticking it to Russia, they are only sticking it to themselves. I think all the dick stroking in Khuiv
    is related to Bidet's "win". It is evident that the meddler faction of the US elite is invested in Bidet and the D. Party.

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    Post  franco Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:56 pm

    The final divorce of the LDNR and Ukraine - it's time for those who disagree to leave

    It's time for Donetsk and Lugansk to speed up the process of parting with Ukraine. It doesn't hurt to talk about the Minsk agreements.

    Eternal Minsk

    Still - not to interfere. If nothing but talking actually happens. Unless, of course, we do not count several exchanges of prisoners of war, a sluggish imitation of the withdrawal of troops and attempts to open new checkpoints, which clearly did not come at the right time. All these evolutions (and talk about them) can be continued for another seven years.

    At the same time, the most significant points of the Minsk agreements - peace on the front line, broad autonomy for Donbass and Ukraine's fulfillment of social obligations - are being fulfilled only conditionally. At the front, they are shooting again, and with the use of mortars.

    All autonomy fit into the senseless and incapacitated "Law on Special Status", and social obligations were limited to pensions for those who passed verification on time.

    The further course towards integration with Russia, the rejection of the Ukrainian language, the formation of an ideological apparatus and many other achievements do not contradict Minsk at all. And it was necessary to deal with all these matters back in 2014–2015.

    Instead, as usual, they played with spillikins and created Potemkin villages - they walked in formation with patriotic songs on their lips, waved flags, built "socialism", etc. As a result, practically nothing was achieved neither in the economy, nor in the social sphere, nor in culture.

    Worse, they were unable to create a coherent and ergonomic explanation of where and why the republics are going. Explanations available to every student and proletarian, and not fostered in classrooms specifically for other classrooms.

    Now, it seems, they woke up. At least, they announced the creation of the doctrine of the Russian Donbass. What will come of this is still unclear (optimism, alas, has long been exhausted). But at least we got under way. And that's already good.

    Without Ukraine forever

    Of course, it is not only the ideology that will be discussed on TV screens that is important and then safely forgotten, having released, for the sake of order, a couple of monographs and textbooks (and sawing a hefty jackpot for this program). It is important to remind people that they began to forget - why did they fight at all? On the values ​​of 2014 - the Russian language, adherence to Orthodoxy, the unacceptability of Western cultural Marxism, the values ​​of the traditional family, etc. Because in the trenches they died not for a well-fed life, but for something much more important.

    Today, unfortunately, a completely different paradigm is heard - as if the Donbass rebelled for a full belly and the shit of some particularly prosperous life. Well, there were those who fought for the belly. But they were in the minority.

    People began to forget that everything that happens in the LPNR is a deliberate choice of the majority, who voted in the referendum "for" their way of life and "against" Ukraine.

    They began to forget that even if the Minsk Agreements were ever fulfilled, the Donbass would become part of Ukraine only formally - administratively and, partially, economically. But the return to Ukraine of the times of 2013 and, especially, close integration with today's Ukraine is nonsense.

    And for those who want to live with Kiev in the same space-time, it is better to immediately pack their bags and move towards the demarcation line. Moreover, it is best to cross it once and for all.

    With this vicious practice, when people live in Ukraine, and go to the republics only for some of their selfish affairs, it is high time to end. You cannot serve two gods - either European integration, BLM, Russophobia and LGBT, or the Russian world.

    You will not be full of doctrine

    At the same time, it is clear that internal contradictions cannot be resolved by ideology alone - it is also necessary to normalize the economic situation and raise the standard of living. And here the LDNR are faced with conceptual problems. Moreover, as in Crimea, first of all, due to the incompetence and inability to normal work (within the legal framework) of local officials.

    On the one hand, today it is extremely difficult to find a more or less sane manager in order to head a structural unit, not to mention a ministry or city government. On the other hand, you can't spare fools and thieves on this matter? Moreover, when corruption and incompetence are prevalent, a normal person will not go to work in such a terrarium - they will still be eaten.

    Unfortunately, to integrate into Russian reality, when the law somehow works, the government sometimes hears civil society, and the man in the street occasionally manages to punish the mighty of this world - not only officials, but also the population are not ready.

    Everything that happens is more like an unshakable Ukrainian quagmire than developing republics. There is a problem with the payment of salaries to miners - they are paid with a delay of two or three, and sometimes even four months. It would seem that the relevant minister should already dry the crackers, the government should admonish the ferocious miners, and the mine administration should fight off prosecutors in panic ...

    But no. Miners calmly go to work. Only a few have contacted the prosecutor's office. And those, having received formal replies, immediately waved their hand and calmed down. The officials sit quietly in their places, and in the most important offices of the republics they simply pretend that nothing is happening.

    And all because they got used to the situation since Ukrainian times. As a result, looking at this absurdity, you understand that ideology in the LPNR, no doubt, is needed. But maybe it would be worth starting with repression?

    Donbass (and Crimea) will take a long time to get rid of the Ukrainian legacy. And, unfortunately, local elites and ordinary people cannot master this process on their own - the inertia is too great. Especially in a situation where people freely travel to Ukraine and back. And Ukrainian propagandists openly walk around Donetsk and Lugansk.

    There is no way to do without Russia - otherwise the “elites” will continue to fight for power, spending resources either on an internal struggle or on their own enrichment. And the townsfolk, who served in 2014 somewhere in Zhitomir or in the Crimea, will go to Mariupol for cheap household chemicals.

    It will take a long time to drive out pernicious Ukrainian remnants and format - and estates, and public consciousness, and civil society and much, much more.

    PS photo sent in by a reader


    Heavy Ukrainian heritage: in the very center of the city, in an underground passage, for 15 years, a roof has been leaking in dozens of places. Neither the population, nor the administration of the transition, nor the leadership of the city or republic, this disgrace, in the most crowded place of Lugansk, does not care.

    Probably everyone is waiting for the "hand of Moscow" to reach out and fix everything?

    And you say - doctrine!

    Author: Egor Makhov
    LMFS
    LMFS

    Posts : 3917
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #28 - Page 23 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #28

    Post  LMFS Tue Dec 29, 2020 3:26 pm

    I've been already some weeks reading a lot of crap from Ukrainian officials, they can barely hold themselves at the prospects of Bribem being inaugurated as US president. It is increasingly likely that they will do something really stupid which will again help Russia.

    https://en.topwar.ru/178609-ukrainskij-ministr-zajavil-o-tom-chto-v-kieve-ischut-variant-plana-b-po-donbassu.html
    https://en.topwar.ru/178638-ukrainskij-ministr-zajavil-chto-znaet-strategiju-rossii-v-vooruzhennom-konflikte-s-ukrainoj.html

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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #28 - Page 23 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #28

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