Sweden and Finland accession to NATO

walle83 wrote:

Isos wrote:One thing they haven't realized is that Russia doesn't want nato forces next to its vital bases. Finland is at artillery range from Northern fleet's naval bases where half of russian SSBN are... which mens nato could wipe out half of russian naval ballistic missiles with two or three nuclear armed rockets.

That means Russia will need to strike first and no lightly. Those two countries could not exist anymore as soon as they join that alliance.

If they are having problems with even the Ukrains i suggest they dont mess with the nordic countries.

The alternative is a nuclear strike, and then we are all fucked.

lyle6 wrote:

walle83 wrote:

If they are having problems with even the Ukrains i suggest they dont mess with the nordic countries.

The alternative is a nuclear strike, and then we are all fucked.

The Ukrainians are brothers. If the Russians invade you there'd be no kid gloves - they'd turn you into Iraq with snow.

flamming_python wrote:

walle83 wrote:

No-one cares about Finland and Sweden, the conflict is not about Finland and Sweden, but about the Ukraine and the attempt to solidify the ultra-nationalist regime there with NATO assistance and in the future membership.

And the stakes have been raised so high in the Ukraine that you better hope the West does not lose the battle there. Otherwise there could end up being no NATO in the future. Similarly if Russia loses it, there could be no Russia.

GarryB wrote:More like Putins warning to HATO falls on deaf ears as usual and they stumble on this land mine like a deaf and blind person might who didn't know they were in a mine field.

The difference is that Putin clearly said we are not happy and this is why, and these are the things we are upset about and the US said I am bullet proof and I don't care what you think... minions... slowly keep walking forward with plan meatshield, and not only is the EU following that command but other countries not part of HATO are signing up.

Signing up to HATO is a sign of weakness for Sweden and Finland because it massively diminishes their independence and puts them in even more danger while providing the US with more of a meatshield.

If the US cared about human rights and democracy and freedom of speech how could they possibly allow the nazification of the Ukraine... how could they stand by and let Kiev ban a language... what would happen in the US if anyone tried to ban any language at all... whether it is Russian or Chinese or Mexican...

Finland and Sweden jumping into bed with the US is totally their choice, but I would wonder what they expect to get out of it?

Higher defence spending that will result in rather more Russian fire power being based on their border... wow... just as well you joined HATO.... look at how aggressive Russia is responding to you joining an anti Russian organisation like HATO...

Finland and Sweden have every right to join HATO, but Russia has every right to adjust its defence posture and trade relations with hostile countries... sounds like any trade in the future will be in rubles because they are both becoming hostile nations, but then the goal was always to kill trade with Russia... which is also OK.

Europe does not seem to understand they are only a small portion of the worlds population and despite being the richer parts of the world they never pay top dollar for anything... they often demand discounts and special treatment resulting in them often never paying retail price for anything... such a low margin customer makes them worse than a poor customer who pays full price.

Both countries are shadow HATO allies anyway... declarations would make little practical difference in terms of defence except to make you actual targets that can be targeted with tactical nukes.

Going from a neighbour to a threat does not make you safer, no matter what the US claims.

Pacense wrote:Except for a tiny part up with Norway (that really noone even cared about (too icy)) and the Baltic States, Russia almost had no border with Nato countries. If I stand correct it was like 6% of its frontier. And if you take kaliningrad away should had been like 2%.

So entrace of Finland and Sweden are not an issue for Putin?

Isos wrote:It's the fact that eastern countries are good place for tomahawk like missiles to be put. Eventhough they don't share a border they are close enough to put smaller missile for a first strike on Moscow and on a big part of russian nuclear missiles.